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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is my first post on these forums and I'm just realizing that I may be submissive and in a D/s relationship.
Here is my story:


I have never had any "daddy issues". I have a very normal, standard relationship with my father. I have always felt that he loved me and supported me.

I am a successful, young talented conservatory trained musician and very independent, strong willed, smart, caring, wise for my age. I am 21. And I am a classic INFJ. Which is why I am overanalyzing and freaking out! lol.

I have been in a few relationships. I have always found older men attractive. I had a secret relationship with a teacher like figure when i was 18, he was 31. I never felt in love with him or dependent on him emotionally though. We were mostly very good friends. I think it honestly was me trying to do something "bad" and adventurous.

My second relationship was for 2 years and very serious. First love. Same age. He was a very domineering manipulative insecure guy. Immature. Very jealous. I would categorize him as a misogynist. Sadly, probably due to his upbringing :(
It was a very damaging relationship that happened during a time period when I was struggling with depression and anxiety. It held me back from growing and getting better. I broke up with him and reclaimed my life.

Now, I have met who I think may be the love of my life. He is 27. Seven years older than me, also a musician. We have equality in our relationship and he ferociously supports my dreams. We have a very deep, meaningful and fulfilling relationship together. He is an inspiration and I respect him very much. I feel that he guides me to be the best me I can be by showing I can be that person. Like a mirror.
I would say we have a very healthy, beautiful relationship based on mutual respect and communication. Maturity wise I feel we are on the same level although we had a large age difference. He does have wisdom and experience in the music world which I find helpful and very attractive. His age and wisdom lends itself to being a guiding force in my life. But, I would like to say that I take care of him just as much as he takes care of me.
Also, We pretty much live together.
And he is wonderful to me. We have not been together for a long time but we have both said and feel very strongly that we would like to be together forever.

My main topic of question****

In bed, I am quite submissive with him. TMI, i know, but I call him Daddy. And he calls me princess. That is the general dynamic with us when it comes to sex. We love eachother very much and that's the way we show it.

Outside the bedroom, I tend to him very much, he IS latino so he does prefer a very attached loving caring girlfriend. Which I am naturally.

He treats me like his equal and respects me as a woman and as a person and as a musician. He treats me the best a man could treat a woman. A great listener, and very loyal.

it's just that

I LOVE to please him. Sexually, and in everyday life. And he LOVES taking care of me.

I'm just wondering, is this all ok? Is it ok to have a relationship like this?
Is it healthy for me?
Can we maintain equality and have a healthy balance of power with this sexual dynamic?
Is this just a kinky sexual thing?
Could it be about me needing to relinquish my control?
How does this relate to my grounded, strong independent spirit?
Can any of you INFJ ladies out there relate to me??
Please let me know what you think!!
 

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Are you familiar with the concept of a "little?" Short answer is it's basically someone who is a child at heart and prefers to behave in that manner -- coloring books, cutesy things, and alike. Being a "daddy's girl" doesn't necessarily mean you're a little, but sometimes they interrelate.

If it wasn't obvious, I've explored that avenue (being a "daddy") in the past as well and it's usually not something you exactly plan out. We all have this energy about us and most have described mine to be rather fatherly or paternal -- stability, protective, coddling, comforting, reassuring, able to take charge. These aren't terribly uncommon traits for a guy though. When I first experienced the daddy element in a relationship I was honestly a bit unsure in a way and I'm usually no holds barred when it comes to intimacy or intense closeness, but it does grow on you. Truthfully, I think many relationships share in that daddy + daughter dynamic, but most people are uncomfortable with the terminology used. That said potato potatoe, it's the same idea no matter what you call your lover.

Now, I think what you always want to ask yourself is whether this is just a sexual kink or something that extends to more elements of your relationship? If you're the latter where you're effectively going to be coddled, spoiled, punished, and whatever else that entails then it can be quite the lifestyle change. Either can be healthy.

In any case, in all dom/sub dynamics it can be particularly dangerous when it comes to dependency and entitlement elements. Doms basically get everything they want and have the final say whereas the sub is usually the perpetual people pleaser. 1+1 there on possible challenges, but usually if that respect element is there and remains, then you're a-ok to do as you please.

I'll tell you which personality you most often want to watch out for in these sort of dynamics. It's anyone that's the director type. Basically, they always want the perfect shot (clean thoughts) or a specific scene in their mind to unfold right before them. They're highly anally retentive, complain about the most insignificant of things, and controlling to lengths that are typically beyond kinky.
 

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A lot of ENFP & INTJ s relationships fall into dom/sub dynamics . I have watched my uncle and his wife over the years and their relationship is unhealthy one. She does what he says, thinks of her as dumb blond.

All in all, for God's sake you are a woman (i know it will raise some eyebrows) but majority of relationships fall into that category. I am curious though, because your very first sexual experience was with a man almost twice of your age, what led to it. Why you chose someone older over someone of your age. Obviously, as INFJs we crave for people who are intelligent and at a younger age there could be not many matches . So, was it more of mental connection with that man that attracted you to him the most or physical one?
ps.
6 year difference is alright i think. Anything beyond that and you will be pushing it. I say this, because if age gap is too big , then there is a higher chance of people growing apart as they grow themselves if it makes sense.
-Ob.
 

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A lot of ENFP & INTJ s relationships fall into dom/sub dynamics . I have watched my uncle and his wife over the years and their relationship is unhealthy one. She does what he says, thinks of her as dumb blond.

All in all, for God's sake you are a woman (i know it will raise some eyebrows) but majority of relationships fall into that category. I am curious though, because your very first sexual experience was with a man almost twice of your age, what led to it. Why you chose someone older over someone of your age. Obviously, as INFJs we crave for people who are intelligent and at a younger age there could be not many matches . So, was it more of mental connection with that man that attracted you to him the most or physical one?
ps.
6 year difference is alright i think. Anything beyond that and you will be pushing it. I say this, because if age gap is too big , then there is a higher chance of people growing apart as they grow themselves if it makes sense.
-Ob.
I am curious. If your uncle an INTJ and aunt ENFP? I notice that INTJs (men) seem to have an autocratic way about relationship. They have a model that they follow. The mate would have to be very convincing in her argument for an INTJ mate to modify that model. Am I right? If a mate isn't strong enough, she can easily be dominated like a dummy, to fit that model.
 

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I am curious. If your uncle an INTJ and aunt ENFP? I notice that INTJs (men) seem to have an autocratic way about relationship. They have a model that they follow. The mate would have to be very convincing in her argument for an INTJ mate to modify that model. Am I right? If a mate isn't strong enough, she can easily be dominated like a dummy, to fit that model.
Pretty much. I feel bad for her though. I am telling you, if it wasn't for the child she would have left him ages ago but she just puts up with his BS. You know how moody INTJs can be, well, i don't have patience for that anymore. Someone else can deal with that. I don't even visit them now. I don't want to see that kind of behaviour period.. Constantly putting her down etc. I find it depressing.
-Ob.
 
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Pretty much. I feel bad for her though. I am telling you, if it wasn't for the child she would have left him ages ago but she just puts up with his BS. You know how moody INTJs can be, well, i don't have patience for that anymore. Someone else can deal with that.
-Ob.
It is hard to have to remind a rigid husband that he's getting controlling. Also, if an INTJ man doesn't mature, he can be very hard to deal with (same with ISTJs).

Yeah, the moods of an INTJ guy. My friend just dumped me because he'd rather deal with work than dealing with my "demand". All I wanted was a text once a week and for him to answer me when I ask if I could call him (once a month). This was the bare minimum I needed to stay in a LDR. He's all apologetic and sorry about not being in contact but he blamed everything to work being busy. Instead of resolving the issue (keeping bare minimum contact to pacify me), he chose to get rid of me. There's no negotiation or argument, he simply stated the reason (work being busy) and his action plan (you look for someone else to date).

The reason why I said it's hard because he's 41 and had admitted to me that he'd done this to ppl. So there's a pattern. It's a model that works for him whenever life gets chaotic. To minimize the other party's outrage, he always assumed all the blame ("it's all my fault" was what he said to me 3, 4 times). Very clever, isn't it?
 

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It is hard to have to remind a rigid husband that he's getting controlling. Also, if an INTJ man doesn't mature, he can be very hard to deal with (same with ISTJs).

Yeah, the moods of an INTJ guy. My friend just dumped me because he'd rather deal with work than dealing with my "demand". All I wanted was a text once a week and for him to answer me when I ask if I could call him (once a month). This was the bare minimum I needed to stay in a LDR. He's all apologetic and sorry about not being in contact but he blamed everything to work being busy. Instead of resolving the issue (keeping bare minimum contact to pacify me), he chose to get rid of me. There's no negotiation or argument, he simply stated the reason (work being busy) and his action plan (you look for someone else to date).

The reason why I said it's hard because he's 41 and had admitted to me that he'd done this to ppl. So there's a pattern. It's a model that works for him whenever life gets chaotic. To minimize the other party's outrage, he always assumed all the blame ("it's all my fault" was what he said to me 3, 4 times). Very clever, isn't it?
You only realised that? Very selfish people. I have been telling that since i joined the site. That's how many of them are . Sorry, but i am over it.
As i said, someone else can deal with it but it won't be me.
-Ob.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Are you familiar with the concept of a "little?" Short answer is it's basically someone who is a child at heart and prefers to behave in that manner -- coloring books, cutesy things, and alike. Being a "daddy's girl" doesn't necessarily mean you're a little, but sometimes they interrelate.

If it wasn't obvious, I've explored that avenue (being a "daddy") in the past as well and it's usually not something you exactly plan out. We all have this energy about us and most have described mine to be rather fatherly or paternal -- stability, protective, coddling, comforting, reassuring, able to take charge. These aren't terribly uncommon traits for a guy though. When I first experienced the daddy element in a relationship I was honestly a bit unsure in a way and I'm usually no holds barred when it comes to intimacy or intense closeness, but it does grow on you. Truthfully, I think many relationships share in that daddy + daughter dynamic, but most people are uncomfortable with the terminology used. That said potato potatoe, it's the same idea no matter what you call your lover.

Now, I think what you always want to ask yourself is whether this is just a sexual kink or something that extends to more elements of your relationship? If you're the latter where you're effectively going to be coddled, spoiled, punished, and whatever else that entails then it can be quite the lifestyle change. Either can be healthy.

In any case, in all dom/sub dynamics it can be particularly dangerous when it comes to dependency and entitlement elements. Doms basically get everything they want and have the final say whereas the sub is usually the perpetual people pleaser. 1+1 there on possible challenges, but usually if that respect element is there and remains, then you're a-ok to do as you please.

I'll tell you which personality you most often want to watch out for in these sort of dynamics. It's anyone that's the director type. Basically, they always want the perfect shot (clean thoughts) or a specific scene in their mind to unfold right before them. They're highly anally retentive, complain about the most insignificant of things, and controlling to lengths that are typically beyond kinky.
Thank you for your reply! I can definitely say that after some research, i am not in a dd/lg relationship. In no way am I childlike or put on a little girl act for my man. I am also not interested in a drastic lifestyle change in any way like including punishments or spoiling in our day to day relationship. no no no. I would like to have a healthy, equal relationship and he agrees. I guess I am just a little confused and just trying to understand more about our sexual roles and if they play a part in our daily relationship. I respect him and look up to him and appreciate his guidance in my life. But I also want to make sure that our relationship is balanced. Maybe it is a kink thing?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
A lot of ENFP & INTJ s relationships fall into dom/sub dynamics . I have watched my uncle and his wife over the years and their relationship is unhealthy one. She does what he says, thinks of her as dumb blond.

All in all, for God's sake you are a woman (i know it will raise some eyebrows) but majority of relationships fall into that category. I am curious though, because your very first sexual experience was with a man almost twice of your age, what led to it. Why you chose someone older over someone of your age. Obviously, as INFJs we crave for people who are intelligent and at a younger age there could be not many matches . So, was it more of mental connection with that man that attracted you to him the most or physical one?
ps.
6 year difference is alright i think. Anything beyond that and you will be pushing it. I say this, because if age gap is too big , then there is a higher chance of people growing apart as they grow themselves if it makes sense.
-Ob.
Hi! Thank you for your response! To answer your question, I was led to my first partner because of the mental connection. Of course I found him physically attractive, but I think a big part of it was due to the fact that I am well beyond my years and I was not attracted to 18 year olds. And I am also still not attracted to guys my age. I am very mature and look for meaningful fulfilling relationships. I find that most guys my age do not have the tools or life experience to be in that kind of relationship. (As I learned from partner no. 2 and many male friends! lol) I am so drawn to and so in love with my partner now, we will call him A, and I feel that we are on the same page. I'm just trying to understand more about the sexual roles that we have naturally slipped into and what that means for me as a woman.
 

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@sunflowercosmos

Sorry we derailed your thread for a bit.

You and your beau are young. There's a long life in front. Daily life has a way of getting a relationship out of balance if you don't watch out. As long as you are asserted enough to voice concern and if he's mature enough to hear you out and both of you find ways to adjust to new roles and demands from life, you should do OK.

Good luck and best wishes!
 

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Hi! Thank you for your response! To answer your question, I was led to my first partner because of the mental connection. Of course I found him physically attractive, but I think a big part of it was due to the fact that I am well beyond my years and I was not attracted to 18 year olds. And I am also still not attracted to guys my age. I am very mature and look for meaningful fulfilling relationships. I find that most guys my age do not have the tools or life experience to be in that kind of relationship. (As I learned from partner no. 2 and many male friends! lol) I am so drawn to and so in love with my partner now, we will call him A, and I feel that we are on the same page. I'm just trying to understand more about the sexual roles that we have naturally slipped into and what that means for me as a woman.
I think you are in good place atm. as long as you stay true to yourself and have your say and listened to you two should be fine.
-Ob.
 

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If it works for you and you're both happy with the set up as it is? I don't see any problem with it. It'd not at all be my cup of tea, but... if works for you, then... good for you.

@_Observer_ & @chanteuse...

Yes, INTJs can be rigid... we tend to be creatures of habit and switching up our routines, especially without any warning, is distressful. We like order, damn it!

Moody? I'm never moody. I only know two INTJs in real life (one male/one female), neither are moody. I have exactly two moods... the mood I'm in 99% of the time and pissed off. That's it.

As far as controlling and all that goes... it can come from anywhere and any type. I booted one to the curb because of constant controlling, manipulative and passive aggressive behavior... which manifested itself in constant fights (usually created from thin air), dragging me through the mud via social media (never telling me anything, just "venting" on social media... where it was known I would see it, etc.), demanding that I attempt to squish myself into their view of how I should be... despite accepting me for who I was... blah, blah, blah...

INTJs aren't the only ones that can be controlling assholes, is what I'm saying. Those people need their submissives, their doormats, their codependents, their acquiescers... and they usually find them, eventually.
 

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If it works for you and you're both happy with the set up as it is? I don't see any problem with it. It'd not at all be my cup of tea, but... if works for you, then... good for you.

@_Observer_ & @chanteuse...

Yes, INTJs can be rigid... we tend to be creatures of habit and switching up our routines, especially without any warning, is distressful. We like order, damn it!

Moody? I'm never moody. I only know two INTJs in real life (one male/one female), neither are moody. I have exactly two moods... the mood I'm in 99% of the time and pissed off. That's it.

As far as controlling and all that goes... it can come from anywhere and any type. I booted one to the curb because of constant controlling, manipulative and passive aggressive behavior... which manifested itself in constant fights (usually created from thin air), dragging me through the mud via social media (never telling me anything, just "venting" on social media... where it was known I would see it, etc.), demanding that I attempt to squish myself into their view of how I should be... despite accepting me for who I was... blah, blah, blah...

INTJs aren't the only ones that can be controlling assholes, is what I'm saying. Those people need their submissives, their doormats, their codependents, their acquiescers... and they usually find them, eventually.
I agree with you on the mood part. My friend is never moody. He gets a bit frizzled if he's pulled in several directions but not moody.

However, dumping someone without finding a way to compromise first isn't very smart. The part of assuming fault to pacify the dumpee is passive aggressive IMO.

Anyhow, most likely he's not that into me therefore I am a dispensable element. In such a case, it's not that type related.
 
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I agree with you on the mood part. My friend is never moody. He gets a bit frizzled if he's pulled in several directions but not moody.

However, dumping someone without finding a way to compromise first isn't very smart. The part of assuming fault to pacify the dumpee is passive aggressive IMO.

Anyhow, most likely he's not that into me therefore I am a dispensable element.
Well, no... but as you said, he's likely not that into you if that's the route he's taken. Which sucks, but at least you know and you're not wasting your time, right?

Assuming fault... well... yeah, maybe. It depends. In this case, perhaps. (I don't know I wasn't there!) I did a lot of that back then, but I was constantly being told it was all my fault. Since I know I'm not very good with the whole relationship stuff, I just assumed they were right and I was the fuck up. As it turns out... no... that wasn't the case. It just took me a very long time to figure that out. Prior to that I spent a lot of time apologizing... (sometimes for stuff I actually even did, lol.)

Ok. I think we've derailed quite enough!

Sorry OP. :unsure:
 

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Well, no... but as you said, he's likely not that into you if that's the route he's taken. Which sucks, but at least you know and you're not wasting your time, right?

Assuming fault... well... yeah, maybe. It depends. In this case, perhaps. (I don't know I wasn't there!) I did a lot of that back then, but I was constantly being told it was all my fault. Since I know I'm not very good with the whole relationship stuff, I just assumed they were right and I was the fuck up. As it turns out... no... that wasn't the case. It just took me a very long time to figure that out. Prior to that I spent a lot of time apologizing... (sometimes for stuff I actually even did, lol.)

Ok. I think we've derailed quite enough!

Sorry OP. :unsure:
We certainly derail her thread :-(

My friend assumed fault whenever he's confronted with why he's MIA. Sounds like an INTJ who doesn't know how to express emotion therefore taking the safe route to say sorry first.

Saying sorry is only a bandaid, not a solution to an issue. If the issue is not addressed (his penchant for not keeping in contact), the bandaid would be ripped out again and again, each time less able to mask the cut.

This is the 3 time he cut me off followed by MIA. His apology is no longer working to pacify my hurt. I didn't even bother to reply his break up email because there's no more to say when I write someone off for good (OMG, a door slam!).
 
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Stop worrying so much, fellow INFJ. If you're happy, then surely none of that matters?

I must admit, calling someone I was with in such a way 'daddy' would be way to weird for me but to each their own. Love doesnt always fit the box people think it's supposed to go in. Be happy and enjoy your time together.
 

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I suppose for a female INFJ submissive is on target. Sorry, I don't mean to sound misogynist or anything, I believe in equal rights. I just find femininity so very attractive in a woman and femininity kinda intersects in my mind with a bit of submissive attitude. I am drawn to the model of a classic woman, one that is strong enough to take care of herself but does enjoy being protected and taken care of (I'm not referring to the sugardaddy concept, or the likes, that's exactly what I'm not trying to imply).

To answer your question, go ahead with the attitude of being submissive as long as you're comfortable and he's comfortable, who cares?

Myself, as a male INFJ, I rather be the one leading in life, I accept an equal as well, but in bed I rather mix things up, to keep things creative and new, so I'd turn the scales every now and then.
 

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This is my first post on these forums and I'm just realizing that I may be submissive and in a D/s relationship.
Here is my story:


I have never had any "daddy issues". I have a very normal, standard relationship with my father. I have always felt that he loved me and supported me.

I am a successful, young talented conservatory trained musician and very independent, strong willed, smart, caring, wise for my age. I am 21. And I am a classic INFJ. Which is why I am overanalyzing and freaking out! lol.

I have been in a few relationships. I have always found older men attractive. I had a secret relationship with a teacher like figure when i was 18, he was 31. I never felt in love with him or dependent on him emotionally though. We were mostly very good friends. I think it honestly was me trying to do something "bad" and adventurous.

My second relationship was for 2 years and very serious. First love. Same age. He was a very domineering manipulative insecure guy. Immature. Very jealous. I would categorize him as a misogynist. Sadly, probably due to his upbringing :(
It was a very damaging relationship that happened during a time period when I was struggling with depression and anxiety. It held me back from growing and getting better. I broke up with him and reclaimed my life.

Now, I have met who I think may be the love of my life. He is 27. Seven years older than me, also a musician. We have equality in our relationship and he ferociously supports my dreams. We have a very deep, meaningful and fulfilling relationship together. He is an inspiration and I respect him very much. I feel that he guides me to be the best me I can be by showing I can be that person. Like a mirror.
I would say we have a very healthy, beautiful relationship based on mutual respect and communication. Maturity wise I feel we are on the same level although we had a large age difference. He does have wisdom and experience in the music world which I find helpful and very attractive. His age and wisdom lends itself to being a guiding force in my life. But, I would like to say that I take care of him just as much as he takes care of me.
Also, We pretty much live together.
And he is wonderful to me. We have not been together for a long time but we have both said and feel very strongly that we would like to be together forever.

My main topic of question****

In bed, I am quite submissive with him. TMI, i know, but I call him Daddy. And he calls me princess. That is the general dynamic with us when it comes to sex. We love eachother very much and that's the way we show it.

Outside the bedroom, I tend to him very much, he IS latino so he does prefer a very attached loving caring girlfriend. Which I am naturally.

He treats me like his equal and respects me as a woman and as a person and as a musician. He treats me the best a man could treat a woman. A great listener, and very loyal.

it's just that

I LOVE to please him. Sexually, and in everyday life. And he LOVES taking care of me.

I'm just wondering, is this all ok? Is it ok to have a relationship like this?
Is it healthy for me?
Can we maintain equality and have a healthy balance of power with this sexual dynamic?
Is this just a kinky sexual thing?
Could it be about me needing to relinquish my control?
How does this relate to my grounded, strong independent spirit?
Can any of you INFJ ladies out there relate to me??
Please let me know what you think!!
My thoughts in reading your first post, as a fellow woman here they are:

- I can relate to wanting to date people at my level maturity wise so age difference can happen based on that. That is what I assumed when you wrote about your first relationship being with an older man and you confirmed it in a later post here.
- my second thought was, if you can, see if you want to check out forums online with people who are exploring healthy sexuality practices. i'm thinking of the work of Dan Savage and other pro-sex movements / groups who are working out how people are able to have healthy sex lives today.

- North American society (i can only speak to that one) does not have women's sexuality figured out AT ALL. When I read your post I thought to myself, yeah, by which standards do we use now for what is healthy and ok in our sexual relationships?

I think women question it now when they enjoy making someone else feel good. The pendulum, which I will be the first to say, had to swing, has swung pretty far now and we've got to help each other out with this. Betty Draper wasn't allowed any real pleasure for other reasons, and its not 1958 anymore, but we don't want to stay here either, we've got more road to cover as women. Your post is part of that journey that we are on together. In my opinion.

there are several theories floating around about women's sexuality. We're not in the grips of Freud's projections onto us anymore but we're not in settled territory either in regards to female sexuality.

In my view, its very possible that you turns you on sexually is all fine and dandy and does not mean anything negative at all for your grounded strong independent spirit and that we've absorbed some crap from the culture and that your preferences in the bedroom are akin to all the other preferences you have, and that we just dissect the ones in the bedroom because of our cultural milieu as it were. Like I could ponder whether my favorite colour and my politics are incongruent and what to do about it.

However, this being about a relationship, it is good of you to be reflective. I agree with everyone else here in that if there are power and control issues outside the bedroom, that is different and something to be aware of. You don't want to be taken advantage of, by a man or by a woman.
 
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