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My best friend brought up today about how she is looking for answers about anxiety and depression but, her problem is, everything she find doesn't really describe her way of feeling and thinking. I can see this is frustrating her. She is 100% an INTJ (tortured her by taking many tests lol)

Anyways, to help her out, I've been trying to seek INTJ articles to maybe give her a better understanding but, not having much luck. So, I figured the next route is to ask other INTJs if they know anything. Mainly articles describing or explaining INTJs version of anxiety and depression and how they view it and handle it.

Thank you, for your time!
 

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Tell her to come onto the forums, if she can. We could handle her from there.
Otherwise, you'll have to be the Patti to Death the Kid, if you pardon my Anime. Rather than mentioning failures, bring up successes and optimism when she gets that way. But, listen to her whens he speaks.
 

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I have a feeling that CBT works best for INTJs. I feel like that's what I do for myself all the time. But idk if any INTJs with diagnosed illnesses like depression and anxiety have done it and found it helpful.

What I do know from talking with those who have anxiety/depression, especially the anxiety piece- is that it is not very rational and I think that can really mess with an INTJ because we try to deal with things rationally.

That's probably just not helpful..my blathering thoughts on the topic :) sorry lol
hopefully others have better insight and ideas.

I also agree with @Broomhead that getting them here on the boards where they can personally describe and ask their exact questions may be best.
 
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I have a feeling that CBT works best for INTJs.
I completely agree. Naming your fear and talking yourself through the logic of why it makes you afraid is extremely helpful for me.

Almost always I find out that there is no logical reason to be afraid. And that helps me move forward.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
She is not big on being social unless she absolutely has to, getting her on this forums would be rough. Most I could possibly do is get her to read the conversation. It's hard to explain our odd unique friendship. We are opposite and the same. We're both introverts but, together, I am the chatty one, she is more reserved. In public, she does all the talking (I have social anxiety) but when someone steps out of line and I sense someone is becoming a threat towards her, my defensive side takes over and she just lets me do my thing lol.

With other people I'm close with, when something is up, I can sense it right away and usually can get information easily, with my INTJ, I have to be cautious and pay attention to my limit (I know I can be annoying if I nag too much). I usually don't bother her to open up unless I know it's something serious, which she will. Everything else, I can just tell is not a big deal, she gets irritated (not hot headed though) by lots of things and those topics she will rant about if the right conversation is brought up.
She has opened up to me a few years ago about her having depression and she has no idea why and I'm pretty sure I am the only person she talks about it with, only because after 14 years of friendship, there is no ounce of negative judgement between us.
She is a thinker, I am a feeler (ISFJ) so we both view this differently. She feels she is selfish or possibly "faking without knowing" (rash thinking). I've expressed to her many times I can tell she is not faking or being selfish but, understand her paranoia because BOTH of us hate bringing attention upon ourselves.

I'll bring up CBT and look more into it, thank you. :)
 

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As others have said, tell her to visit the forums :happy:. Personally, I can definitely relate to the self-doubt, mood-swings, and depression (mostly associated with academia :frustrating:). That being said, I think our members would be more specific in their help if we knew the reason for depression and anxiety, if she's willing to share some of that personal detail with us.
 
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My best friend brought up today about how she is looking for answers about anxiety and depression but, her problem is, everything she find doesn't really describe her way of feeling and thinking. I can see this is frustrating her. She is 100% an INTJ

....
Classic challenge for INTJ: Do not let Thinking block Feeling. Some-- maybe even most-- INTJs succeed. I know at least two. But, others run into real problems.

INTJ relationship difficulties are nearly a legend on this forum. Well, if someone routinely blocks feelings/emotions, of course he or she is going to have a rough time with friendships and romance.

(Yes, if you don't block feelings you will have problems, too; everyone does. But, at least, you will be 'in the game'.
)

Being a robot can become depressing and a reason for anxiety. My suggestion for your friend is that she determine to Feel more and Think less. Watch feeling-packed movies and TV-- sad, happy, funny, and dramatic-- and experience Feeling. And, when considering emotions, consider them emotionally more than intellectually. If she has no pets, then, getting one could be a big help.

Get outside for nature walks and other Se-building activities, too. Her Se can support Feeling in the competition with prideful Thinking.
 

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Mindfulness is chalking up a pretty good track record on treating depression and anxiety. AND it's great for introverts because even when you practice with a group, most of the time everyone is sitting still, in silence, with their eyes closed. What's for an introvert not to like?!

I don't know where you live, but there are several ways for your friend to get started. There is a program called Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) developed at the U of Mass Medical Center and offered by trained facilitators all over the country. There are also practice groups in most major cities (check for meetups or google terms like mindfulness, vipassana, or insight meditation). And there are online resources like the excellent free book "Mindfulness in Plain English" (when you find the website, scroll down to the free version). Finally, there are guided meditation tapes availalble from places like Sounds True.

Ask me and I will be happy to help in any way I can.
 

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The rough time with friendships and relationships is no joke. Even we hated each other when we first met because she is so sarcastic and blunt, she comes off super cocky. Fate pretty much forced us to become as close as we are. She is currently in a relationship but, she has always kept that part mostly hidden, even from me. I mean, I know about him and she shares photos and stories but, that's as far as it goes. She makes her time for her bf, friends and family all separately. Quiet interesting, actually. When she had an issue with an ex years back and I tried to be the good friend and butt in, we ended up not talking for two years. Once we got over it, though, we picked up like nothing ever happened. It's not that I have to walk around egg shells or anything, I just learned my limit.

I don't think she is depressed to the point she is in the danger zone or anything, I know for a fact she WILL seek professional help if it got too much to handle but, going to a group or anything is something she has to want. She is not scared of doing what she wants to do, something I actually admire. It's more of the anxiety part she has issues grasping but saying it might be because she isn't getting a complete grasp on her feelings actually makes a lot of sense. I'm starting to feel like a jerk talking about her like this haha. I will have to force her to read this later to justify my guilt lol.

"Being a robot can become depressing and a reason for anxiety"
I like that quote, a lot!
 

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Classic challenge for INTJ: Do not let Thinking block Feeling. Some-- maybe even most-- INTJs succeed. I know at least two. But, others run into real problems.

INTJ relationship difficulties are nearly a legend on this forum. Well, if someone routinely blocks feelings/emotions, of course he or she is going to have a rough time with friendships and romance.

(Yes, if you don't block feelings you will have problems, too; everyone does. But, at least, you will be 'in the game'.
)

Being a robot can become depressing and a reason for anxiety. My suggestion for your friend is that she determine to Feel more and Think less. Watch feeling-packed movies and TV-- sad, happy, funny, and dramatic-- and experience Feeling. And, when considering emotions, consider them emotionally more than intellectually. If she has no pets, then, getting one could be a big help.

Get outside for nature walks and other Se-building activities, too. Her Se can support Feeling in the competition with prideful Thinking.
If I were depressed and anxious and someone told me to "feel more, think less", I'd kick em in the shins. Pretty sure at that point I'm "feeling" plenty. Maybe that's just me tho.
 

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Maybe someday, I could convince her to reach out in forums like this on her own and have brought it up but, as I already stated she doesn't do what she doesn't want to do unless she absolutely has to. Right now, just seeking articles or stories to read on her own before interacting. Baby steps :)

I've joked the James Cameron quote best describes her, I just change it to her name: "James Cameron doesn't do what James Cameron does for James Cameron. James Cameron does what James Cameron does because James Cameron is.... James Cameron!"
 

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Try the book 'overcoming your childhood emotional neglect' - absence of feelings can be because your parent never named to you what you were feeling, and there are ways to overcome that feeling of something missing...the book has some ways to put new ideas into practice and break a negative cycle.
 
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If I were depressed and anxious and someone told me to "feel more, think less", I'd kick em in the shins. Pretty sure at that point I'm "feeling" plenty. Maybe that's just me tho.
Would try not to make that suggestion unless you were actually depressed, in which case you would be more likely to 'get it'.

As you may recall from your last experience with depression, depression is not just some feeling or emotion. If it were, it would be fairly easy to dispel-- e.g. do something that makes you feel happy, glad, engaged.

Instead, depression is a remarkably sterile intellectual situation where 'feelings'/emotions are blocked. Consider it a kind of Ni-Te loop. The depressed person understands, quite logically, the futility of experiencing 'useless' emotions even as he/she remains in a vague state of discomfort and unhappiness.

Often, breaking that bind is not especially easy.
 

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I have a feeling that CBT works best for INTJs. I feel like that's what I do for myself all the time. But idk if any INTJs with diagnosed illnesses like depression and anxiety have done it and found it helpful.
I can imagine that it would be good in theory. My experience with it was that the person administering it has a lot to do with its effectiveness in practice. For me, it was totally useless because I thought my therapist was a complete idiot. He seemed like he was using a lot of Si/Fe based reasoning to try to make me feel better. That kind of thinking doesn't work for me at all. False reassurance without any backing, and the 'evidence' he tried to present to defend his arguments was pretty pathetic.

The problem is that I need someone to be able to spot the flaw in my logic so that I understand that I don't need to be anxious/depressed about an issue. But when I am 'winning' the argument with a therapist, effectively it's reinforcing the fact that I'm right about feeling negatively, even though he/she may think they are using good reasoning.

The best person for me to talk to when I get anxious is my INTP best friend. When I feel unable to reason through a situation, he can totally help me look at things from a purely rational perspective. He is the polar opposite of neurotic, which helps.
 

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INTJs' version of anxiety and depression and how they view it and handle it.
For us, anxiety is often caused by what we see as injustices in the systematic functioning of society, such as gross negligence and nihilism being enabled or rewarded or simply a complete lack of respect paid to upholding the Golden Rule. Also, when we're publicly berated (typically at work) over something trivial and we're not allowed to defend our position and we're told to "just let it go." It's like the system of things (aka "status quo") is set up specifically to enable the exploitative whores of society (aka "parasites") to leach off the life force of the lowly but diligent peons (the very people who keep civilization functioning). In a workplace scenario (the sector of society in which the greatest injustices typically occur), those "exploitative whores" (who typically have a schoolyard bully mentality even though they're adults and can be of any generation) typically worm their way into middle management positions where they go about afflicting lowly peons with anxiety via psychological and emotional oppression.

Thank you, for your time!
Rogue comma detected! <-(Old habits die hard.)

Being a robot can become depressing
Tell that to these two!
:kitteh:


Feel more and Think less.
That sounds a bit too Qui-Gon. How about both in equal measure? Letting the heart rule the head usually leads to mayhem.

Watch feeling-packed movies
Including but not limited to WALL-E, Inside Out, and The Princess Bride!
:proud:
For an introverted intuitive, I recommend a bunneh!
:kitteh:


Not necessarilty a giant breed like this one.
:tongue:
Get outside for nature walks and other Se-building activities
I can vouch for this. This is exactly the technique that I use most often. I love to watch moths, butterflies, bumble bees, beetles, and pillbugs go about their everyday lives.
:proud:


Her Se can support Feeling in the competition with prideful Thinking.
I've never thought of thinking as necessarily being the seat of pride, especially if it's genuinely objective thinking. Pride (assuming we're talking about arrogance rather than healthy self-respect) is always subjective, and therefore, is always an enemy of objectivity. Objective thinking and judiciousness are necessary for maintaining Justice in all sectors of society.
 
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Maybe someday, I could convince her to reach out in forums like this on her own and have brought it up but, as I already stated she doesn't do what she doesn't want to do unless she absolutely has to. Right now, just seeking articles or stories to read on her own before interacting. Baby steps :)
She wouldn't have to join or interact if she didn't want to. I lurked on the forums for well over a year (probably closer to two years) before I ever joined. I still got plenty out of just lurking.

As for the original question, writing in a journal or having a trusted pen pal helped me a lot to sort out specific things that were causing me stress. I don't really suffer from anxiety that much, other than getting anxious when I'm in someone's way (like physically in the way, at a store or something) or if I'm in small spaces full of people that I can't get away from (like a small crowded shop or bar). The vast majority of my depression has be the result of life stress that is beyond my control so in order to cope with not wanting to feel negative feelings, I learned to numb myself. The problem with numbing is that there is no selective numbing; it's all or nothing. After a while, not feeling anything and not giving a shit about anything sucks more than feeling the pain. In many cases, once I was able to isolate the thing or things that were bothering me, I was better able to cope with the negative feelings associated with those things and the depression lifted on its own. It's not enough to just suck it up feel the pain; I needed to understand the cause of the pain. Also, it might sounds lame, but getting enough sleep and sticking to a consistent sleep schedule was extremely important for me to self-regulate my emotional state. Also, grounding techniques may help with anxiety when she starts to feel anxious. The trick with those is to practice them when she isn't anxious so that she can do them when she is anxious. It might take trying a few different techniques to find one that works for her. A lot of the grounding techniques are geared toward people with PTSD, but they can help with anxiety as well.
 
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I find forums to be the best for online social networking. I tried the usual social media platforms and just couldn't feel comfortable or maintain interest - just too much ego promotion and external validation seeking. Forums bring together people who are passionate about the same things, whether it's guinea pig raising or spelunking, without trying to bring attention to themselves. That's why most profiles are brief without photos, the main attraction is the common interest no matter who you are.

Mindfulness is chalking up a pretty good track record on treating depression and anxiety. AND it's great for introverts because even when you practice with a group, most of the time everyone is sitting still, in silence, with their eyes closed. What's for an introvert not to like?!

I don't know where you live, but there are several ways for your friend to get started. There is a program called Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) developed at the U of Mass Medical Center and offered by trained facilitators all over the country. There are also practice groups in most major cities (check for meetups or google terms like mindfulness, vipassana, or insight meditation). And there are online resources like the excellent free book "Mindfulness in Plain English" (when you find the website, scroll down to the free version). Finally, there are guided meditation tapes availalble from places like Sounds True.

Ask me and I will be happy to help in any way I can.
I also practice mindfulness meditation. It's easier than you think and you get better at it the more you practice. It's something everyone can benefit from, regardless of your personality type. It actually re-wires the brain to be in a natural state of being. Overthinking and being stuck in our heads is an epidemic in modern society (and those social media platforms aren't helping either).
 

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My best friend brought up today about how she is looking for answers about anxiety and depression but, her problem is, everything she find doesn't really describe her way of feeling and thinking. I can see this is frustrating her. She is 100% an INTJ (tortured her by taking many tests lol)

Anyways, to help her out, I've been trying to seek INTJ articles to maybe give her a better understanding but, not having much luck. So, I figured the next route is to ask other INTJs if they know anything. Mainly articles describing or explaining INTJs version of anxiety and depression and how they view it and handle it.

Thank you, for your time!
Are there any specific questions you had about the matter?

I mean, I've suffered from both anxiety and depression, but I'm not sure what you're looking for precisely. My depression was often existential in a lot of ways and I tended to become overly philosophical about my appalling circumstances. I lived in my head for the most part and was very distanced from people. I was very cynical about the world and about people, and despite wanting desperately to have close relationships with others, I usually assumed the worst about them. As for anxiety, I've been very oversensitive to various stimuli (noise, light, etc.), anxious in social settings, and overly concerned about the intentions and thoughts of others. I also had/have a really anxious attachment style. What helped me was finding a very solid, trustworthy and secure relationship for support. After that, exposing myself socially to people through work helped me become more comfortable and I felt more in-control of my life and less depressed when I began to direct my attention towards pragmatic matters (like work, education, or immediate goals) as opposed to the cosmic existential theorizing I'd do in isolation.
 
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