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Discussion Starter #1
Seems many of the INTP type enjoy to express their thoughts in words. I agree and love to do this also :)

In school, I enjoy math, history, science, ect. This is prevalent in most INTP. When it comes to english, I'm great at reading a book and understand what they are telling me, but when it comes to essays, I'm lacking power.

It's not all essays... I'm great in research papers on science and personal ideas. I'm also good with philosophy papers. But when given a prompt, I start falling, especially when it's it's asking for a narrative. I'm also bad with persuasives, due to the fact I like staying in the middle, not making a decision.

I'm curious to what other INTPs feel about this. Any tips on how to deal with it would also be extremely helpful :)
 

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I don't know, there's just a flood of BS that I let loose whenever I'm near a keyboard. The sad part is I type less than half of what I think of to type.

I don't even know if I agree with myself, most of the time, though. I think the key to learning to write is not to worry about whether what you're writing is 100% accurate, or whether you subscribe to your own assertions, and just practice following any old train of thought in different directions. After a while, it becomes second nature, and eventually you find you can articulate your actual thoughts pretty well on cue.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Like I said, I'm good with thoughts for fun... but other's not so well. The problem is when I'm supposed to write a paper about the the biases of the U.S. high school history books. This doesn't necessarily interest me. I know there are a ton of biases, but for some reason, I have a hard time describing specifics in a flowing way.

Another thing is when I write, I like to be direct. I rather not write "the dog plowed through the snow, while leading the owner on a wild goose chase". I rather write "the owner chased the dog through the snow".
 

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Like I said, I'm good with thoughts for fun... but other's not so well. The problem is when I'm supposed to write a paper about the the biases of the U.S. high school history books. This doesn't necessarily interest me. I know there are a ton of biases, but for some reason, I have a hard time describing specifics in a flowing way.

Another thing is when I write, I like to be direct. I rather not write "the dog plowed through the snow, while leading the owner on a wild goose chase". I rather write "the owner chased the dog through the snow".
It's better not to use the passive voice especially in expository writing.

The way I'd write a paper about biases in history books would be 1) read a couple of actual high school history books, 2) identify any themes that recur, 3) look for assertions that aren't backed up by evidence or any subjective views that are presented as if they are self-evident and thus don't warrant justification, and then 4) line them all up and knock em down in an essay.
 

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Another thing is when I write, I like to be direct. I rather not write "the dog plowed through the snow, while leading the owner on a wild goose chase". I rather write "the owner chased the dog through the snow".
I thought this directness in writing was good?
 

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Apparently, not to the teacher :/ Making things as "vivid" as possible by using words like "plow" and other metaphors are the proper way to write... I guess it is supposed to makes it more enjoyable.

Honestly, I'd like to write an essay with only bullet points :p
 

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Discussion Starter #8
  • Native Americans made it to europe before europeans made it to america
  • Chances are Asians and Africans made it to america before Columbus
  • Text books describing the good in presidents but leave out the bad
  • Only shows hawks side of vietnam war... not doves
  • Talks about U.S. soldier's problems, but leaves out the vietnam people's
 

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Apparently, not to the teacher :/ Making things as "vivid" as possible by using words like "plow" and other metaphors are the proper way to write... I guess it is supposed to makes it more enjoyable.
And your teacher applies this criterion even to expository (as opposed to persuasive/narrative) essays? Because "the biases of U.S. high school history books" sure sounds like an expository essay prompt to me. None of my high school honors/AP English teachers - let alone my college professors/TAs - appreciated flowery metaphorical fluff in the expository essays they had me write, and rightfully so. An expository essay is above all an explanation of ideas organized and connected by logical reasoning; "vivid metaphors" and all that imagery crap are going to hinder rather than help readers follow said logical organization. I'd be very worried if your teacher isn't aware of that basic fact.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Agreed... there is a chance he didn't say exactly what he meant, or maybe I just took it the wrong way. None the less, he wants us to create the basic fact in the sentence, then add more to it to make it enjoyable to read. I can understand making the whole thing flow, but adding more to facts seems to muddy up the facts. I can also understand inserting quotes, for that gives your essay authority. But by inserting words to make your essay "more enjoyable" isn't what I like doing lol. I enjoy pleasing people, but I prefer to do it with actually helping them, rather than being forced to making it fun to read my essay. I want to get facts out there :p Supporting those facts with quotes helps... makes it more reliable... but adding pathos to is isn't what I like.
 

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I can hardly contain myself when writing essays. I do amazing when I have freedom and space to be creative and rational; research papers are the easiest and creative essays are my favorite. When given strict formats to follow, I suck. I always interpret one part of the format to mean something other than it does, and I never ask for help, which leads me to do badly. But once I figure out how I should frame the discussion, I do well. Schools condition students to follow certain low-level formats at the beginning of their English classes, and then want you to change your ways of analysis to other literary theories, which suck at first, but once you get the hang of the format and how to proceed, then it's relatively easy.
 
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Hmm, when it comes to my state's standardized testing for writing persuasively, I score a 12 (which is considered perfect). It might have something to do with the fact that I've been writing about online high schools, introversion/extraversion, and other topics that I've researched.
I'm usually quite direct in my writing as well. I have a wide variety of word choice, but a common formula.
I can't write very quickly either. Typing is much faster, but if I'm writing something more "emotional" such as a poem or a song, I prefer to write it by hand.
I hate prompts. They're so... Constricting.
I'm also pretty decent at history papers and science papers... They're quite formulaic.
 

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I'm not that great with persuasions either, I would much rather present the pro's and con's of a decision - what I do in those cases is leave out the cons even if I write them down.

But in general? I'm not a fan of essays... I'm apparently good enough at them to get good grades, but I'm never fully satisfied with what I've gotten down as my final product. I'm fine with researching a topic... I can do that without a problem, it's putting it into an essay that gets me.
 

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Agreed... there is a chance he didn't say exactly what he meant, or maybe I just took it the wrong way. None the less, he wants us to create the basic fact in the sentence, then add more to it to make it enjoyable to read. I can understand making the whole thing flow, but adding more to facts seems to muddy up the facts. I can also understand inserting quotes, for that gives your essay authority. But by inserting words to make your essay "more enjoyable" isn't what I like doing lol. I enjoy pleasing people, but I prefer to do it with actually helping them, rather than being forced to making it fun to read my essay. I want to get facts out there :p Supporting those facts with quotes helps... makes it more reliable... but adding pathos to is isn't what I like.
When in doubt, go to the text you're discussing, pick a sentence, quote it, and analyze it to death.

Works if you're a philosophy major, if you get stuck...
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I hate prompts. They're so... Constricting.
I'm never fully satisfied with what I've gotten down as my final product. I'm fine with researching a topic... I can do that without a problem, it's putting it into an essay that gets me.
^ agreed

I may just be procrastinating by being in this thread rather than doing the essay though lol
 

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^ agreed

I may just be procrastinating by being in this thread rather than doing the essay though lol
You're not alone.. I'm doing the same thing ><
 

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when it comes to essays, I'm lacking power.

It's not all essays... I'm great in research papers on science and personal ideas. I'm also good with philosophy papers. But when given a prompt, I start falling, especially when it's it's asking for a narrative. I'm also bad with persuasives, due to the fact I like staying in the middle, not making a decision.
I thought I was the only one like this. I can sit at the computer watching the cursor blink for hours and just come up with a paragraph or two. This usually happens when I'm given a topic that I have no interest in. If I'm assigned something on philosophy, then it's writing non-stop!
 

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I don't like writing essays over a boring topic. In my writing it's obvious I don't care, but luckily the poor writing skill of my classmates who don't try don't overshine my naturally strong writing skills so I still make good marks.

I also hate writing essays where I have to sell myself, like a scholarship essay. It sounds too cheery and fake.

But an essay over a topic of my choosing? Yes, please. Just don't make me turn in outlines or multiple rough drafts and we're good!
 

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Hmm, when it comes to my state's standardized testing for writing persuasively, I score a 12 (which is considered perfect). It might have something to do with the fact that I've been writing about online high schools, introversion/extraversion, and other topics that I've researched.
I'm usually quite direct in my writing as well. I have a wide variety of word choice, but a common formula.
I can't write very quickly either. Typing is much faster, but if I'm writing something more "emotional" such as a poem or a song, I prefer to write it by hand.
I hate prompts. They're so... Constricting.
I'm also pretty decent at history papers and science papers... They're quite formulaic.
Not to be a stalker, but are you by chance in Washington State? Our testing is also scored as an essay out of 12 (and I also typically get 12s on the assessments).

I've been told by quite a few teachers that my writing is good (largely due I believe to my vocabulary and analytical grasp of the contents). My Achilles heel is organization. While my ideas always flow perfectly logically in my own mind, I struggle (and I hate) to sort them into the rigid forms teachers set for essays, and admittedly other people likely don't really get where I'm coming from. I actually love writing essays when I get into them, but getting in to them is a multi-day process for me (that infuriates my parents and teachers). I find this time is longer the more content there is, but also the stricter the organizational expectations are.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Same when it comes to the organization thing... and multi-day. I think our state exam was out of 12 too (Illinois). I took this test to test essays and it says I wrote something a 3rd grader would write (structurally) but a college student could understand (content).
 
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