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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
In my "how do you define it?" thread collection, I ask you ISFPs your own definition of introverted feeling. And if you know a little bit more, can you please set up some key differences between Fi and Fe?

This came after a thread of Fi vs. Fe in the ENFJ forum.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
You don't need to be an expert of cognitive functions to explain, it's your own appreciation to see a common ground and define Fi. So feel free to explain what you have on your head!
 

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You don't need to be an expert of cognitive functions to explain, it's your own appreciation to see a common ground and define Fi. So feel free to explain what you have on your head!
Huh, Ok I started to feel bad... so you guilted me into posting...

Im not really all that intelligent when it comes to cognitive functions, but heres how I see us Fi dominants. Although I dont think this to be true of all ISFPs, in my case, although I can be very emotional and sensitive, I find it very difficult to express these emotions. I do not like to talk about feelings with others, and I never really say how I feel about certain situations. This of course lead people to think that I dont really have much depth. I seem kinda like that guy who is kinda strange and doesnt really talk about anything important. Because our feelings and feelings about stuff (like politics, rules, the environment etc.) is introverted we have an internal value system that we basically go by. In other words we dislike things not because others dislike them but because we believe them to be wrong and vice versa. Because of this we are not very subject to conformity. I suppose a quick example of our value system can be seen here.

Fe I believe is seemingly the opposite. Easily can talk about feelings, and does things based on the environment i.e. conformity.

Please correct me if Im wrong...
 

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Also check out what I said here.

lol I really liked how I phrased it XD
my creative side going to work...
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Mmm, well. Fe doms aren't necesarily loud in their emotions. They don't necessarily talk about their feelings, they may be have their mouth quite shut sometimes or even appear cold, or in a more exact word... neutral. I'm like this and I see Fe doms who aren't that expressive of their feelings. But we are talkative a lot, and somewhat sensitive due to our harmony oriented decision making.

And yes, Fe is like Fi but with an outward focus. The desire for harmony of feelers now bases to the external objects and people, everything they do, say and everything that happens matters to the Fe dom. They will want to have clear understanding of the role a person have, how it affects others and its environment.

We want to understand how everything is connected and we make our decisions based on a reunion of all of that, so we keep a harmonious place, and following our desires. Note that it doesn't mean total submission or just "going with the flow". It means an active participation where the Fe dom moves and makes others act and behave in the ways that are appreciated to us and the people present. If that means conflict, then we can be able to do so.

Fi, as far as I collected information, is based on an internal set of standards, thoughts and expectatives towards themselves and others, so you build up your own system for dealing and understanding the world. Whatever you choose to believe can make you extremely different people, from total belligerance to understanding and compassion, whatever you think it is worth living for and to judge others on that. But it's not ONLY about values, am I right?
 

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Ok so in a nutshell Fe is about keeping external harmony. (and of course Im not saying your type is like some conformist who cant make their own decisions. We all have those inferior functions that kick in too and I guess Fe doesnt necessarily mean conformity. Plus its the ESFJs that Im not so fond of when it comes to this. They are the ones with Fe and Si... lol tradition and conformity XD jk)

Fi and Fe kinda work together to keep the other from screwing up... or thats how I see it anyways...

As for not being only about values... I have no idea XD
I feel like there may be a little more to both than whats above...
 

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I agree with a lot of what has been said, but I'd like to mention that I can't just produce my values if someone asks what they are. I have to be in the moment and experience something before I know how I'm going to react to it or feel about it. That may be partly Se, but I'm not sure.

Fi is something that has governed my whole life. Sometimes even if I really want to like a certain person or activity (for whatever reason, maybe because it's something society deems I "should" like, or someone who truly needs help), I just can't because they go against my values. I might be able to appreciate certain aspects of them in this instance, but I have trouble accepting them as a whole.

Although Fi is an introverted function, I have been known to stand up for my beliefs on rare occasion. It can happen if someone really crosses the line or offends something close to the core of my being. Really, I should try to do it more often but it takes a lot out of me and I feel quite rattled after. I may appear to be neutral on many issues, but that couldn't be further from the truth.
 

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I agree with a lot of what has been said, but I'd like to mention that I can't just produce my values if someone asks what they are. I have to be in the moment and experience something before I know how I'm going to react to it or feel about it. That may be partly Se, but I'm not sure.

Fi is something that has governed my whole life. Sometimes even if I really want to like a certain person or activity (for whatever reason, maybe because it's something society deems I "should" like, or someone who truly needs help), I just can't because they go against my values. I might be able to appreciate certain aspects of them in this instance, but I have trouble accepting them as a whole.

Although Fi is an introverted function, I have been known to stand up for my beliefs on rare occasion. It can happen if someone really crosses the line or offends something close to the core of my being. Really, I should try to do it more often but it takes a lot out of me and I feel quite rattled after. I may appear to be neutral on many issues, but that couldn't be further from the truth.
This exactly. I couldn't have said it any better myself especially the last paragraph.

I get in trouble from the two people who understand how upset I get when I don't defend or assert my beliefs or wants. To everyone else they see it as me being nice and not having any preference over the matter when in fact I do. It sounds stupid but to put it simply, I let other people have their way because I don't want people to get mad at me. :unsure:

It's a lot easier to please everyone else than have to deal with the possibility of a conflict situation. :blushed:
 

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But it's not ONLY about values, am I right?
Hmm... you asked this and after pondering it a while I suppose its not.

Im not one to brag, but ISFPs are typically known to be very kind. I think we are very well known as the animal and nature lovers. XD In a way we are the "nice guys" (who never get girlfriends/boyfriends.) I think I even remember once reading that we were possibly the nicest of all types (of course take that with a grain of salt... I dont think we are always all that accepting of some people.) We genuinely care about other people and dont like to be hurt or see other people hurt. We dont like to be controlled or have any need to control others. For the most part we just like to be, and make other people, happy. :)

I mean, of course we do have our faults, but at our best Id like to think the above describes us... (I hope so...)

Is this what you meant??
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Alright so. When I asked that I wanted to know if when you use Fi, you also try to understand everything that's inside you and everything the place and the people you are surrounded is affecting you. Not only what it is considered valued or worth-living for, but also their knowledge, their impact on others. What they are capable, what they are not. The social power and the management of the world. How they have come across with such points of view, the cultural, geographical and more reasons to get to know them, which will make you understand them more and judge them accordingly. But it seems that's more of your information gathering function, in this case Se.

NekoNinja, what you have answered had not so much to do, but maybe this good boy attitude helps you to understand people better, and maybe it is a behavior that is coherent with what you consider valuable. Am I right? RyRyMini, you mean that you can't talk about your values if asked? Like, you have them in your mind but the only way to see them clearly is acting accodingly to it when there's a situation that demands it?

In my case of Fe using, we want to know not only the person's values, but also their personality, the social and cultural background, their capacities. While we won't make a deep research in facebook and twitter to get to know this person (lol bad joke xD), we will try to grasp inmediately how this person thinks and why, in a very inmediate fashin, maybe that's Ni at work.
 

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ok so i'm moving and my new housemate said i could drop off some boxes before the first of the month. she said i could move in slowly before the first, and i was appreciative. that was going to be a big help since i have a very small car, and for other reasons i won't go into.

then my new roommate changed her mind. she said i can't move anything in yet. so i'm going to be late getting out of my old place. it's very inconvenient. it sucks.

did i get in her face? no. did i bitch about her in 25 different ways to 17 different people? no. how do i feel? did i tell her it's annoying, disappointing, stressful? no. and this is a lifelong pattern.

in the moment, i don't say emotional things. i'm super nice. usually :wink:

instead of moving my boxes, i may go on a little adventure with a friend who's been ill. actually she's fighting cancer and kicking it in the ass. she wants to do this trip today. it was her idea.

we may take the train into the city. we might see an art exhibit, or go to the ocean, or have lunch, or stop in a store known for colorful fabric. i'm excited to see who's on the train, what everyone is wearing, what the art is like, what the food is like, what the whole vibe is like, how refreshing the ocean will be, etc. and of course i'm delighted to be with my friend.

but what feeling words do i use to say about all this? even to myself i will say it's exciting. i'm looking forward to it. i hope she will be well enough to do the trip today. i enjoy spending time with her.

i tell her i care about her, but i don't say it so often that it's mushy or unreal or a conversation filler. and i tell her she inspires me. but frankly, i just really enjoy her company. i tell her i will help her with anything she needs, and then i do it, i show up and help with errands. and if she wants to talk, i listen. i will show up for people and will listen to them almost forever.

wow i just read that. i very rarely tell anyone about this side of me :blushed:

what comes natural to me is to use feeling words like exciting, refreshing, enjoyable, relaxing, hopeful. and words like electrifying, surprising, playful, etc., and anything that describes the body and sensations.

when things go wrong, i don't like it. it sucks and it hurts. i experience it like physical pain, like an ache, or a skin burn.

when bad things happen, talking about feelings doesn't help much, unless someone has a suggestion about how to change the situation that caused the ache in the first place, or if someone knows a workaround to the actual circumstance being faced. i really appreciate people who speak practically, and from experience, and with kindness.

it can be hard to find that in people! it's so rare. so i deal by doing something fun, or helping people, or making something creative.

having said all that, in the past few years i've tried to grow and talk about feelings more. it's been an eye-opening experience. first, i realize i have always known what i feel, i just don't use a lot of sentences other people use, and i don't say everything out loud.

second, i've learned that when other people talk about their feelings, it works for them. it's still not my style. but three, i've learned to give it a shot when i need to.

i hate to say it but as a result, i might talk about my feelings when i want something from someone. i use my budding skill at feelings talk as a tool.

for example, if someone seems nice, and responsible, and they're not the overly-intellectual type, and if they have a history of being oblivious to concrete reality, and needs, and sensations, but they love the idea of caring, then i will try more sentences with feeling words in them.

so i'm using feeling talk to get what i want, because it works. goes against my values somewhat. so i do it sparingly, and without fibs. and never in a way that misuses people. and by golly, it's exhausting. i'm ready for a vacation just writing all this. :cool:

but all in all, i prefer to put my time and energy into doing fun and cool things that don't involve a lot of sentences about feelings. if i can make something, or do something, or be there and spread joy to someone's life, don't you think people enjoy that more than sentences?

i trust actions more than words :cool:
 

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Fe and Fi.

See a breathtaking sunset. Fi notices the beauty of it and feels a warm appreciation rise inside. May or may not comment.

Fe says, "Wow! Look at that! Isn't it beautiful??"

Fi may feel something, and will probably have to make an effort to show it to people around him/her.
Fe may feel something, and will probably have to make an effort to hide it from the people around him/her.

However, I don't know if I have a firm grasp of cognitive functions. I invite someone who feels more confident in their knowledge to either verify the above post, or correct any falsity about it.
 

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I can relate to everything that has been mentioned here so far.

Like RyRy was saying, if someone asks me how I feel about X, I'll likely be stumped about what to say, simply because I really don't know how I feel about it. A lot of the time I can only assess my own feelings when it relates to the present moment, and it's something I'm experiencing in the here and now.

It can be frustrating, because, like Neko was saying, people probably think that I have no depth, since I can't tell you how I feel about X. I wish that I could, but my brain won't let me make that assessment.:crazy: Just like Neko said, everyone sees that you're so nice, but not much else, when in reality there is so much more going on.

Also, like aLaKing and sparkles were saying, I have many feelings everyday that I just don't bother to express. It usually doesn't benefit me to talk about my feelings. I know how I feel, so I guess I just don't see much point in telling others about it.
 

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i hate to say it but as a result, i might talk about my feelings when i want something from someone. i use my budding skill at feelings talk as a tool.

for example, if someone seems nice, and responsible, and they're not the overly-intellectual type, and if they have a history of being oblivious to concrete reality, and needs, and sensations, but they love the idea of caring, then i will try more sentences with feeling words in them.

so i'm using feeling talk to get what i want, because it works. goes against my values somewhat. so i do it sparingly, and without fibs. and never in a way that misuses people. and by golly, it's exhausting. i'm ready for a vacation just writing all this. :cool:

but all in all, i prefer to put my time and energy into doing fun and cool things that don't involve a lot of sentences about feelings. if i can make something, or do something, or be there and spread joy to someone's life, don't you think people enjoy that more than sentences?

i trust actions more than words :cool:
There's nothing wrong with using feeling talk as a tool. I usually use empathy as a tool, but I keep it win/win with my values.

Just the other night, I was a bit oblivious to a loved one's need to share emotional-level content. Granted, the need wasn't stated directly, and we weren't in person, but my initial response to it was pretty insensitive.

So I called them back and apologized, and purposefully turned on my active listening and empathy to put some water under the bridge. This worked very well, but I kind of wish I caught the signs in the first place. Just because I can resolve conflict like a pro, it doesn't mean I want there to be friction so I can exercise those skills :/

It may sound cynical, but I think even naturally caring, kind, selfless people use certain tactics or perspectives as tools. Doesn't have to be a negative thing.

When i was INFP (tested that way) I was way more sugary in my communication of care, in terms of the verbal side of things. Now, I show it more in the way of action and touch (kinesthetic), unless I'm specifically trying to tap into my empathy state.

Which is very easy to do. But for some reason, it feels like I'm sligtly divorced from it, compared to how it felt to express that way when I tested INFP. It feels like I'm working with a process. It doesn't feel artificial exactly, but it does feel different somehow.

Oh and as for communicating feelings, I will usually do this by showing the emotion itself, or venting where the content of my communication matches the feeling. I don't usually say, "Hey I am feeling a little sad/happy/scared right now. Can we talk about it?" I don't usually bother with that, because my Fe usually creates a sense of immediacy to process/express the emotion, and giving a verbal invitation foregoes the fulfillment of that.

If the emotion feels intense, though, I definitely make myself pause and warn people verbally that this is where my mind is at, as otherwise I would not be as satisfied with myself. I do like to give a direct warning for emotions with intensity, if I know or think there's a psosibility the people around would prefer one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
That's a beautiful story aLaking, and it shows a good emotional health! I think your Fi shows up when you decided not to complain to your friend after her quick change of mind, you made a judgement and a decision of what to do after what you have seen. When you say you want to spread the joy of life, it could be one of your beliefs you worth to believe in.

However, I don't see how much of Fi is when you experience physical reactions because of your emotions. But when you yearn for practical advice, that could a manifestation of extroverted Sensing, as it is concerned with actual occurences and what is noticeable and quick to do.

sparkles, I think that's good example. For a Fe or Fi dom, the sunset is a great element for waking up harmony and well being to you and others, they will surely make subtle of loud reactions that yearn to make others feel good and calm. I think both Fe and Fi would try to express the reaction in one way or another. However, the warm feeling inside can also mean Sensing, as it is a whole appreciation of the physical impact the sunset has, as it expresses beauty. But I'm not that expert on Sensing, so I don't know!

I like how well welcomed is this thread!!
 

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Okay, maybe I don't understand Fe/Fi. I see people talking about these, or one of them(Fi) in relation to values and morals.

But to me, Fe or Fi just means whether your feelings are expressed naturally more internally or externally.

I don't get how extroverted or introverted feeling connects to expression of values. I see it more as whether your emotions are more naturally under the surface or on the surface. Yes, T/F is about decisions, but I still don't see how Fe/Fi is more than whether you show your feeling-based decisions on the surface, or keep those feeling-based decisions under it.

Would someone help me understand how Fe/Fi relates to more than just whether you communicate feelings on the surface or inside yourself by default?
 

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No, it's not about expression of feelings only. I used to think like that, but after making these threads I see more key elements. This definitions are by far the best for explaining Fi in a deeper level:

Introverted Feeling

And for Fe:

Extraverted Feeling
Thank you! I'm going to read more from those pages later today when I have more time, but based on what I glanced at, it seems my above example of calling that loved one to apologize for being insensitive might be an example of Fe, not Fi, because I was drawing from a desire to be closer aligned to how I want my relationships to be, in my decision to resolve the conflict.

Rather than being motivated by a strong inner desire to fix things, I was motivated by a strong desire for my relationships with those around me to meet certain personal standards.

On second thought... I can't tell. Maybe the above example of calling the person to sort it and apologize is a combination of Fi and Fe. I should read the entire pages you shared before I start trying to fit my actions into boxes, lol.
 
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I think of Fi as selfish. Not in a bad way, but that is the best way to explain it. Most of the time putting your feelings and thoughts before others.
 
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