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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So as an INTP Si is my tertiary function, and last night as I was a bit tipsy and I began listening to a lot of songs that I listened to a bunch my freshman year in college, which is probably the favorite time in my life because it was when I came out of my shell and was just astounded by the reception and appreciation I got from people. So when I hear those songs now having a graduated and started on a career it just takes me back to that time so powerfully and I experience an emotion I'd almost call grief, like I'm grieving for those times knowing their gone forever, and it's such a bittersweet thing having them as memories but knowing they won't ever be that vivacious again. Is my Si to blame for this?
 

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Well, your Si is your tertiary, which is also called the child function, so that makes sense... I'm no expert on Si, but it sure sounds like Si to me. And like the tertiary... :happy:

add: OK, I see I was way too brief... The Child function could be considered the function that a person retreats into in order to temporarily let go of all responsibilities, sort of like your inner child... So it has nothing to do with memories per se. That part is your Si. Hope that makes more sense...
 

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The funny thing is that when I saw this thread, my first thought was "I bet this is an INTP." :tongue:

That sounds a lot like Si to me. Si tends to want to bring old sensations along with new ones.

The more interesting question to me is why you're feeling this so strongly. Typically, you tend to use your tertiary function more as a defense mechanism against your inferior function (Fe in your case) than anything else. That's not to say that there's anything wrong with using your tertiary function. You just have to be careful with it. Usually, when it just "sneaks in" as you describe, it's the wrong way to handle a situation.

The ideal way to deal with this kind of situation is to try to engage your secondary function (Ne). Find someone you can bounce ideas off of or something along those lines.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
At Amnorvend: most interesting, that I'd be using it to battle my feelings.. that actually explains some of the tumult that comes from such things. I don't know why I feel it so stongly... maybe it's the booze, I'm not sure what or why. I just really miss and "grieve" a certain time in my life. It was just too awesome for me. I wish I could explain better.
 

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I often get severe nostalgia when I listen to music too. Certain songs/albums remind me of the period of my life when I started listening to that music, except in rose-tinted glasses. Tool - Lateralus reminds me of driving to my cottage; Pink Floyd reminds me of a rather uneventful but memorable summer; King Crimson reminds me of frequently playing chess with my dad on the front porch one August; The Cure's early 80s albums remind me of this past summer even since I listened to them non-stop for about a month.

I actually horde all my old deodorants because the smells invoke this same sort of nostalgia.:crazy: Smells and music do it for me. And yeah, I'm sure that's Si at work.
 

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That happens to me too, Si is my inferior.

But for me it happens most often with scent. Sometimes music. Its whatever sense was was receiving the most input at the time. The reminiscing doesn't happen often though, I have usually have to sit down and think about it to use Si, or my mind has to already be in the right state, like, not focused on something else to the point I'm not noticing things.
 

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My ENTP ex did say that listening to certain music would remind him of past relationship. I think it was like the main factor we got back together second time. I hooked him up on some music his liked and after we broke up he happened to listen to that same music which brought back the memories. He also had very good sense of smell that was very strongly connected to past for him. Neither of these things work like this for me - I can listen to music I listened to when we were together and not get any recollection of the relationship. Music, tastes, smells, texture I usually interpret in the context of present moment rather than automatically linking them to the past. So quite possibly this is a Si phenomenon.
 

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This sounds farmiliar, :laughing:, endearing title. Interesting points about using teritary to deal with inferior/responsibilities too, Personally I can see my Ti working in such a way with other functions also in both healthy and less healthy ways.

In my early teens I'd spend hours on end attemtping to grip onto - even construct - emotional states as a source of comfort and stability where emotional connections with other's wern't sufficient to help me process stuff. I still do it now to an extent really.
 

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Si isn't my most used cognitive function, yet there are certain 'things' (be it a song, a setting, etc.) that evoke strong and more so visceral past memories.

Whatever memories evoked are overall generalized and not at all specific, as I can't find the 'concrete details' that Si is well-known for. I simply notice the general and perhaps 'details' that are significant.

For instance, when I hear the song "Wild Boys" by Duran Duran I might under stress remember how I listened to that song after a close friend's son died in an automobile accident. We all can do this (as this is basic psychology), but I feel Si users have a [distinct] advantage when it comes to recollecting the past.
 

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I think that all INTPs have read the Paul James description of that type. I am not sure how most perceive it now, but when I frequented INTPC many years ago, it was arguably the best description of that type. Here is what James says about using Si in the tertiary placement:
Another area of interest common to INTPs, where Si has a strong influence, is Music. INTPs are usually fascinated by music and may have deep and wide-ranging tastes. Indeed, each of their three main functions (Ti, Ne, Si) plays a role in the enjoyment of music, and indeed music is a key interest for bringing out the feeling shadow of the INTP. Si itself brings a fascination for mood and atmosphere in music as well as for a strong sense of personal nostalgia. INTPs are therefore often keen on melancolic minor-key music in which an introspective and/or esoteric mood is conveyed. Equally, INTPs enjoy hearing music that they heard and enjoyed when younger (provided they can still appreciate it now) and yearn for the sense of nostalgia that it yields. INTPs are also drawn to complexly structured music, thanks to their Ti core. An appreciation of modern classical music, as well as perhaps contemporary jazz, is therefore common with them. Such music types are usually too complex to be understood after a single hearing, which hence provides excellent material for analysis, exciting the INTP no end. Once the basic developmental structure of the music has been assessed, Ne provides the impetus to derive a general meaning of the piece. What does the composer wish to convey, for example? Why was that particular development chosen? Indeed, the Ne is usually hard at work during listening sessions, trying to grasp the meanings behind the often fascinating combinations of sound-world evocations, structural developments and nostalgic impressions.

When the Ti core dominates the choice of music to listen to, the need for intellectual stimulation derived from complex structures and sounds will override concerns for cultured harmony. Hence, INTPs are often drawn to dissonance. Indeed, they may even thoroughly strive for dissonant sound worlds. When in such moods, consonant harmonies, especially of the three-chord-melody variety, are dismissed as boring and uninspired. If an INTP is forced to listen to simple harmonic music for a while, he usually can't wait to feel the relief provided by a few minutes of pure dissonance. The ideal music for the Ti core might be typically a modern symphony, with a complex, but analysable structure, with a rich and varied sound world, predominantly dissonant but with sections of melodic motifs to provide solidity. Examples of modern classical composers who particularly speak to the Ti core might be Simpson, Arnold, Holmboe, Maxwell-Davies and Shostakovich.

However, feeding the Ti core alone with music will rarely satisfy an INTP for long. Where music really inspires in when the Si function is brought into the picture. Generally, INTPs are fascinated by atmospheres evoked by music. Examples of modern classical composers whose music speaks more to the Si-melancoly through sound-world evocation might be Bax, Tavener, Pärt, Szymanowski and Rautavaara. Some elements of world-music also speak strongly to the Si-melancoly. INTPs may be interested in the Folk musics of eastern Europe and India, for example. The role played by the Si function is shared by SJ types, so that INTPs may find a common musical bond with some SJs in this area. Indeed, INTPs often feel at ease with SJs, especially their near-shadow xSFJ types. The SJ's guardian instincts usually help the INTP to feel at ease, while the tradition-based predictability of the SJ approach to life helps the INTP to know where he stands, giving him the space he needs to relax. Although the most intense communicative friendships may develop with fellow NTs, some extraverted intuitive types may overstress the INTP by being too dominant and unpredictable, extracting too much energy from the Ti core.

Ultimately, however, music forms a vital, central role in awaking the underdeveloped Fe shadow in the life of an INTP. It is undoutedly Fe that gives the INTP the life-spark to introduce a genuine sense of joy that music is experienced with. To the INTP, the role of Fe in music appreciation remains mysterious. Music forms which may be useful for awakening the shadow are expressive forms of jazz, where extraverted Feeling is central to the music-making process, as well as some expressive Folk styles (Irish for example). Examples of modern classical composers whose music may appeal to the Fe shadow of INTPs are Messiaen, Copland, Schnittke, Bartok, Vaughan-Williams and, again, Shostakovich (Noting that Fe can be expressing a range of positive or negative feelings).The music of Shostakovich is a particular favourite because, alongside its developmental structure, it also yields an immense sense of passionate tragedy which awakes the Fe-shadow together with the Si-melancoly.
As for the tertiary function being used defensively toward the Fe makes little sense to me and implies that a lower function has influence over a higher function. It’s like saying the auxiliary function works in defense of the dominant. Based on my understanding the only functions that oppose others are those of the same makeup. Perceiving functions will oppose one another, but work well with judging functions. Thus the only function that would make the tertiary function work defensively in the INP type, is the auxiliary (Ne), and that is not necessarily true either since Si-Ne or vice-versa are as Dario Nardi calls then, tandem functions.. The point is that the placement order of functions in each type is made up to where the the functions do not oppose one another, but work with each other. Fi is so low never to have any influence on the Ti and Te is low to where Fe will ward off any attempts at thinking with another function.
 
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