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Is there any possibility I might be INFJ?

1K views 19 replies 9 participants last post by  tarmonk 
#1 ·
For a long time I never doubted that I am an INFP, and maybe this sounds very superficial to you guys, but recently I have been realizing that I am actually a bit more put together and a routine-based than I originally thought, so the sneaking suspicion that I am an INFJ has crept into my mind. Maybe this is just a post to confirm that I’m INFP, or maybe it’s because I have a mix of Enneagram 4 and 9 traits (though my “‘main” combo is 4w5). Anyway:

1. I do crave interaction with others, but I can spend hours at a time being alone. Socializing with other people can be nice but I really need that alone time or at least time where I can retreat into my little “head space”, usually so I can re-engage better or at least feel a little more balanced. The older I get the more I prefer being alone over being with people who don’t “get” me at all.

2. I often find that expressing myself through words and writing / typing is easier than sending voice messages back and forth. It takes time for me to respond verbally if I’m being asked to do that right away, but if given time to write / type a response I often feel as though I can get my point across better. Still there are other times when I’m perfectly able to express myself verbally and immediately, usually with people who already get me / agree with me on most things, but I often find myself thinking over and over about different ideas and theories or just my imagination going over and over inside me and by the time I feel comfortable enough expressing it to someone, it will have been thought over god knows how many times. And there are others that never make it to the “verbal” front, at least not for a while. My mind’s definitely a lot more active than what people can pick up on.

3. There are times where I first experience something partially or fully before coming to any conclusions, but I’m more likely to feel / judge and come to a conclusion and it will depend on whether the experience (if I delve into it) is sufficient to change my mind somewhat or fully. I judge out of my inherent beliefs and values usually independent of the situation / external circumstances, generally if I have decided on a ‘no’ it remains a ‘no’. I definitely have these beliefs that I can’t really explain, it’s what feels right to me and by extension, what I feel would be good for humanity as a whole. I can’t really tell you why, and it’s not out of “but others are doing it” it’s just what resonates most strongly with me.


4. How I personal feeling with regards to something is valued more deeply than me than finding the universal or objective. This is not to say I don’t look for the universal / objective side to morality / emotions but I can do that better when there’s something personal I can draw from. For example I won’t feel sad over someone’s death just because it’s the end of a life. If I think that person did lots of harm to me or to the world, I think their death’s well deserved, a relief / necessary event if anything.


5. This is not to say I like conflict / stir conflict for the sake of it. I try my best to show a basic level of courtesy and to take the reactions of other people into consideration, especially if they’re someone close to me, but deep down I always try to keep a tab on how I truly feel about a particular situation. I will express my dislike / disdain most frequently through a lack of willingness to engage and do as I’m “supposed” to do, but if really backed into a corner I will either get away from it altogether or stand my ground and push back. I don’t want to hurt anyone for the sake of it, but if I am pushed over and over again, or if I feel there’s a genuine threat to me or a loved one, I feel as though whatever happens to the offender should be at my discretion.


6. I’m very much a rebel. Even when some of my beliefs do happen to align with the “majority”, I don’t feel as though I have to reach that point the same way as many other people do / I don’t feel as though what I want to do with it has to be the same. My biggest fear is not being understood and appreciated for my uniqueness, rather than not being accepted into a “commonality” / “normality.” I seldom, if ever try to express this desire for uniqueness through my outward appearance or statements that start with “I am so and so.” Rather, you have to engage with me and listen to the things I say / I will drop hints of how I feel my thoughts differ from the “majority.” I generally don’t like prolonged restrictions to my freedom of action, movement, or just a general sense of strangers / people I don’t know well and impersonal entities having authority over me.


7. I have a very sharp memory and recall when it comes to details that I choose to pick up. This often surprises people when I demonstrate how much info I can retain accurately. Usually I have to be very interested in something. Then, there are other times where I absolutely, for the life of me, cannot handle simple instructions / small details / small things usually daily things. I can be extremely absent-minded. I often freeze when given a set of instructions related to simple tasks in daily life, it’s like listening to a language from a faraway galaxy. I also get tired when I listen to people who go on and on about what I feel are small details / daily ramblings and I just want to get to the point and get insight into the bottom line.


8. I value consistency and reliability for the most part if it’s someone I care about. Constant lateness does get on my nerves although I’ll forgive them again and again. I generally try to have some kind of routine, and can’t see myself living with someone who does random things at completely random times of the day. In this sense it still gives me some sense of security although my ultimate sense of security comes from more abstract things.


9. I often live in the past, and look to the past with regards to looking at the present and the future, but at the same time I also believe the past does not hold many of the definitive answers that are needed in the present and the future. Times and circumstances, people’s ideas and the world can change fundamentally. That doesn’t mean I’m on board with everything new and progressive, and in fact I fear much of it when it conflicts with what I feel is right. Take AI for example, I just don’t feel it’s right to have something that’s artificially conceived without any biological force of its own to become sentient.


10. As much as I wish I had a single, coherent vision for how things should be, I don’t think I do. It’s rather a loose idea or set of ideas where many details aren’t exactly set in stone, so pretty ad hoc, but I’m pro-marriage and pro-family and centrist / moderately conservative on most social issues, but economically I am socialist and my ideal world is a “global village” in the truest sense. I’m an anarchist at heart and I’m suspicious of higher authority yet I find it difficult to ditch the idea of religion (Christianity) and the idea of a theist god who intervenes altogether. I’m not super hardcore religious but I can only be so comfortable when exploring / dabbling into other religions / folk beliefs.

Still, I’ve never really felt like joining a church or organization and I wouldn’t send my kids to a Christian / Catholic school because I don’t really feel like being boxed in by “their” interpretation / having to follow their rules.


11. I’m not very accommodating of value systems that greatly differ from mine and would avoid people like that whenever possible. I appear calm / courteous most of the time but I am thinking about a lot more, when it comes to both people and things, than others can see. It’s much harder to ask me to explain what I feel / believe as bullet point statements, but much easier for me to open up through asking questions and getting to know me as an individual.


12. I am usually very generous when it comes to helping those in need, and I’ve fallen for more than my fair share of sob stories. I strongly believe in helping but not being seen / not making a show about it because that defeats the purpose. I don’t do it because it’s the”right thing to do”, but rather because I really want to contribute towards that person’s well-being and in a way I do expect results. However, I will be much less inclined to assist if I can’t morally reconcile myself with their cause / their aims.


13. When I am stressed I tend to become extra rigid and controlling and critical even when I don’t make sense at all. Sometimes I have ideas / perceptions that other people don’t really understand and they ask me where I got them from but I can’t fully explain. I’m far from a logical / rational person and feel that those who constantly pride themselves on being logical or rational are in fact blinded to the subjectivities of their own world view and their own feelings.


14. It’s so hard for me to really live in the moment though that’s what I keep saying. My mind is always onto something big or small. I don’t always show it but I have lots of concerns about the future with regards to what I want in my life and the world in general. And I will feel like a failure if I haven’t gone where I want to be. I also blame people for what I feel like were avoidable consequences as a result of what they chose in the past, and I criticize them for their lack of foresight and insight and hindsight. Ultimately I just want to enjoy life at a slower pace.


15. I try to look for deeper meaning even when there’s none or if it’s just pure coincidence. This can lead me to becoming a little superstitious or just having a wandering mind in general.


16. I readily make judgments with regards to what I see around me, with how things are done and how people behave.
 
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#2 · (Edited)
In addition, I’m very skeptical towards the whole idea of “self help” or “self improvement” because I feel as though it neglects very real and fundamental failings of the global order / global system, as well as being no more than a “feel good” road map to attaining what’s deemed “conventionally” esteemed and necessary for a fulfilled life. Positive psychology / the whole idea of self-actualization a lot of it is bogus to me, because too often it’s just another facade for perpetuating capitalism and the glorification of career and “wow look at me” kind of success. The whole idea of a “career” turns me off because IMO what’s really a “career” is to the vast majority of people just a glorified job. A real “career” to me belongs to the realm of true idealists, visionaries and revolutionaries, artists.

I was borderline depressed / suffered from moderate levels of generalized anxiety and major depression during college and what I came to hate about the counsellors I saw was that they all told me one way or another that it was my failure to adapt, all they gave me were “reframing” / coping mechanisms while I felt like their biggest failure was to acknowledge and analyze the very deep failings of the mess of a global system we’ve created for ourselves. The preoccupation with a fast paced life, with acquiring as much as we can, with impressions and showing off at the cost of authenticity, among other things.

What really made me continue on was acknowledging these failures as being inherent to the wider world and not myself, but having certain goals / even vague ideas of the life and freedom I could attain and basically going at it with an attitude of “screw it, I better make my stand” and realizing that extreme problems needed extreme solutions, and that if I didn’t lift myself out of it no one else in “the system” would as it was fundamentally unconcerned with me and wanted to disenfranchise me. That’s what really made me get out of my depression though it returns from time to time when I lament the state of the world and how little one can do to change it for the better.

I’ve never really understood the idea of making a point / seeking fulfillment through outward appearances. My source of fulfillment, the image I want to present ultimately comes from within and I rarely, if ever feel the need to “justify” it to someone else through anything outwardly appearing.
 
#3 ·
How much do you know about the cognitive functions? Most of this seems pretty INFP to me, other than maybe losing patience with people who are late. Even so, we have Te in our function stack, which can actually cause a strong interest in scheduling and order. For me, this manifests in an inherent difficulty with following a schedule, yet I’m drawn to draft schedules each week anyway in order to actually realize my creative ideas, and do my best to adhere to them.

INFJ 4s may look like Fi-doms; I’m not sure. But most of your points are actually really consistent with the FiNe SiTe function stack. I don’t see the aux-Fe like an INFJ would have.

Fi+Ne is also open to many possibilities which is why we can often doubt our own type as well.
 
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#4 ·
I really appreciate your insights. Yes I have looked up all the cognitive functions and I’ll provide a bit more info:

Fi vs Fe- I pay the closest attention to my personal values and my instinct is to find out where I stand on a particular thing or situation. It could be positive, negative, neutral or undecided but more often than not I want to come to a conclusion rather than leave it in ambiguity. I’m not as comfortable with ambiguity and not as flexible as I appear to be. I form judgments before seeing the whole picture, and these judgments can be hard to undo at times. My beliefs on what should be universal or objective ultimately stem from what I personally feel is right and good, and I feel most uncomfortable when I am being pressured into accepting or joining in the “general mood” around me if I know I don’t feel the same way inside.

I am not the most expressive and sometimes I show that I care more through my actions than my words, but I know very well how committed I am within. However, words of affirmation generally make me feel at ease. While I do let others with differences go their own way, if they happen to clash with one of my non-negotiable Fi values that I hold strongly, I will become a lot more cautious towards them.


Ne vs Ni- It’s harder for me to narrow things down than it is to come up with new possibilities. It’s like the more time I have to think about something the more my mind wanders and the more confusing it becomes because I keep trying to find new possibilities and pathways. I love coming up with new ideas for the sake of it and that means coming up with ideas completely from myself, rather than needing to reference an existing or someone else’s ideas even though I might be influenced by one or multiple people’s ideas to varying degrees.

I have a vague set of ideas but as much as I did I don’t really have a precise / concise, singular vision most of the time. It’s the details I have trouble with more than the general picture.


Ti vs Te- When I’m around someone who understands, or when I’m in the mood for it, I express my ideas as openly and plainly as possible even when I haven’t figured everything out. I use information and data gathered from the outside world, using external evidence to formulate and validate conclusions about people and things from within. I use the outside world to justify and reinforce my inner world rather than reinforcing my inner world and then applying it to the outside world.


Si vs Se- I often have trouble being fully immersed in whatever environment I’m in and as I said above I’m often left dumbstruck and paralyzed when it comes to manipulating or making changes in my physical environment. It’s much easier for me to understand a bigger concept than it is for me to follow an often simple set of instructions on what to do in the here and now. My biggest sense of frustration is not when I can’t fully immerse myself in the environment around me but when I’m feeling internally out of whack.

I often live in the past and while I don’t believe it’s always definitive, I often look for experiences in the past to provide clues for what I’m dealing with presently and for the future. I have a sharp memory and recall of details and past events and tend to ruminate a lot. Though I don’t like an overly mundane life and would hate that, having some sense of routine / what I know still gives me a sense of comfort.
 
#6 ·

Ne vs Ni – It’s harder for me to narrow things down than it is to come up with new possibilities. It’s like the more time I have to think about something the more my mind wanders and the more confusing it becomes because I keep trying to find new possibilities and pathways. I love coming up with new ideas for the sake of it and that means coming up with ideas completely from myself, rather than needing to reference an existing or someone else’s ideas even though I might be influenced by one or multiple people’s ideas to varying degrees.
That is so NP! And what you have listed above confirms IF. So fortunately, we NPs do not have to surrender you to the NJ camp!
 
#7 ·
Sorry, my attention span ran out when I first read your opening post. Then I forgot to reply.

3.... I judge out of my inherent beliefs and values usually independent of the situation / external circumstances
Fi-Te

6. I’m very much a rebel. .... My biggest fear is not being understood and appreciated for my uniqueness, rather than not being accepted into a “commonality” / “normality.”
IxxP (discrepancy between yourself and other people)

10. As much as I wish I had a single, coherent vision for how things should be, I don’t think I do.
Not Ni

11. I’m not very accommodating of value systems that greatly differ from mine and would avoid people like that whenever possible.
Fi, probably... depending on stuff

There is a possibility you are an INFJ, but the chance is small.
 
#10 · (Edited)
INFP's have that tert Si and Te as 4th function in their stack, so are capable of abiding by a routine and being organized if those are well developed in the individual. INFJ's are also capable of procrastinating and being a disorganized mess since they lead with intuition. Though I would say they probably don't prefer it that way.

I definitely have these beliefs that I can’t really explain, it’s what feels right to me and by extension, what I feel would be good for humanity as a whole. I can’t really tell you why, and it’s not out of “but others are doing it” it’s just what resonates most strongly with me.

This is Fi. As an INFJ, I would feel the need to understand it, rationalize it, justify it with my own logic to help myself and others understand the "why" by explaining it. To me, something is not right or wrong just because I feel it is so, but because it has sound reasoning. I want to get to the root of it to see if it's valid/true or not.

How I personal feeling with regards to something is valued more deeply than me than finding the universal or objective. This is not to say I don’t look for the universal / objective side to morality / emotions but I can do that better when there’s something personal I can draw from. For example I won’t feel sad over someone’s death just because it’s the end of a life. If I think that person did lots of harm to me or to the world, I think their death’s well deserved, a relief / necessary event if anything.

Very much a preference for Fi again.

but deep down I always try to keep a tab on how I truly feel about a particular situation. I will express my dislike / disdain most frequently through a lack of willingness to engage and do as I’m “supposed” to do

Fi -- keeping tabs on how you personally feel about things is your top priority/focus.


My biggest fear is not being understood and appreciated for my uniqueness, rather than not being accepted into a “commonality” / “normality.”

Type 4/ Fi


I generally don’t like prolonged restrictions to my freedom of action, movement, or just a general sense of strangers / people I don’t know well and impersonal entities having authority over me.

Inferior Te -- especially the last part. Sounds a bit 6ish too.

I have a very sharp memory and recall when it comes to details that I choose to pick up. This often surprises people when I demonstrate how much info I can retain accurately. Usually I have to be very interested in something. Then, there are other times where I absolutely, for the life of me, cannot handle simple instructions / small details / small things usually daily things. I can be extremely absent-minded. I often freeze when given a set of instructions related to simple tasks in daily life, it’s like listening to a language from a faraway galaxy. I also get tired when I listen to people who go on and on about what I feel are small details / daily ramblings and I just want to get to the point and get insight into the bottom line.

Tert Si. Preference for intuition.

I value consistency and reliability for the most part if it’s someone I care about. Constant lateness does get on my nerves although I’ll forgive them again and again. I generally try to have some kind of routine, and can’t see myself living with someone who does random things at completely random times of the day. In this sense it still gives me some sense of security although my ultimate sense of security comes from more abstract things.

Tert Si, preference for intuition again. Sounds a bit 6ish when you start talking about security too (not saying you're a core 6).


9. I often live in the past, and look to the past with regards to looking at the present and the future, but at the same time I also believe the past does not hold many of the definitive answers that are needed in the present and the future. Times and circumstances, people’s ideas and the world can change fundamentally. That doesn’t mean I’m on board with everything new and progressive, and in fact I fear much of it when it conflicts with what I feel is right. Take AI for example, I just don’t feel it’s right to have something that’s artificially conceived without any biological force of its own to become sentient.

Si, Ne, Fi.

10. As much as I wish I had a single, coherent vision for how things should be, I don’t think I do. It’s rather a loose idea or set of ideas where many details aren’t exactly set in stone, so pretty ad hoc, but I’m pro-marriage and pro-family and centrist / moderately conservative on most social issues, but economically I am socialist and my ideal world is a “global village” in the truest sense. I’m an anarchist at heart and I’m suspicious of higher authority yet I find it difficult to ditch the idea of religion (Christianity) and the idea of a theist god who intervenes altogether. I’m not super hardcore religious but I can only be so comfortable when exploring / dabbling into other religions / folk beliefs.

Ne/inferior Te.

Still, I’ve never really felt like joining a church or organization and I wouldn’t send my kids to a Christian / Catholic school because I don’t really feel like being boxed in by “their” interpretation / having to follow their rules.

Inferior Te -- not wanting to submit to the external structure but in a way, it also appeals to you. People usually have love/hate relationships with their inferior functions. Kind of all or nothing.

11. I’m not very accommodating of value systems that greatly differ from mine and would avoid people like that whenever possible. I appear calm / courteous most of the time but I am thinking about a lot more, when it comes to both people and things, than others can see. It’s much harder to ask me to explain what I feel / believe as bullet point statements, but much easier for me to open up through asking questions and getting to know me as an individual.

So very Fi. You march to the beat of your own drum.


and in a way I do expect results. However, I will be much less inclined to assist if I can’t morally reconcile myself with their cause / their aims.

Te / Fi

13. When I am stressed I tend to become extra rigid and controlling and critical even when I don’t make sense at all. Sometimes I have ideas / perceptions that other people don’t really understand and they ask me where I got them from but I can’t fully explain. I’m far from a logical / rational person and feel that those who constantly pride themselves on being logical or rational are in fact blinded to the subjectivities of their own world view and their own feelings.

Inferior Te reaction to stress.

15. I try to look for deeper meaning even when there’s none or if it’s just pure coincidence. This can lead me to becoming a little superstitious or just having a wandering mind in general.

Preference for intuition.

16. I readily make judgments with regards to what I see around me, with how things are done and how people behave.

Dominant judging function.

In addition, I’m very skeptical towards the whole idea of “self help” or “self improvement” because I feel as though it neglects very real and fundamental failings of the global order / global system, as well as being no more than a “feel good” road map to attaining what’s deemed “conventionally” esteemed and necessary for a fulfilled life. Positive psychology / the whole idea of self-actualization a lot of it is bogus to me, because too often it’s just another facade for perpetuating capitalism and the glorification of career and “wow look at me” kind of success. The whole idea of a “career” turns me off because IMO what’s really a “career” is to the vast majority of people just a glorified job. A real “career” to me belongs to the realm of true idealists, visionaries and revolutionaries, artists.

I was borderline depressed / suffered from moderate levels of generalized anxiety and major depression during college and what I came to hate about the counsellors I saw was that they all told me one way or another that it was my failure to adapt, all they gave me were “reframing” / coping mechanisms while I felt like their biggest failure was to acknowledge and analyze the very deep failings of the mess of a global system we’ve created for ourselves. The preoccupation with a fast paced life, with acquiring as much as we can, with impressions and showing off at the cost of authenticity, among other things.

What really made me continue on was acknowledging these failures as being inherent to the wider world and not myself, but having certain goals / even vague ideas of the life and freedom I could attain and basically going at it with an attitude of “screw it, I better make my stand” and realizing that extreme problems needed extreme solutions, and that if I didn’t lift myself out of it no one else in “the system” would as it was fundamentally unconcerned with me and wanted to disenfranchise me. That’s what really made me get out of my depression though it returns from time to time when I lament the state of the world and how little one can do to change it for the better.

Inferior Te. And I think Ni would be more likely to take the "reframe" approach as a form of coping.



I’ve never really understood the idea of making a point / seeking fulfillment through outward appearances. My source of fulfillment, the image I want to present ultimately comes from within and I rarely, if ever feel the need to “justify” it to someone else through anything outwardly appearing.

Preference for Fi over Fe/Se.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Aww thanks really appreciate your time. For a long time, like a good number of N types, I felt really lacking compared to the S types around me. I wanted to be like them and desperately tried to connect with them, be on the same page, but was often met with confusion on my end and rejection on their end no matter how hard I tried. I wanted to get them but they had no business with me. I really thought there was something wrong with me and a fair number of them I’m sure thought the same of me. They just saw me as a total creep and weirdo. I’m not ashamed to say that I am quite disillusioned and resentful towards many S types. There were numerous occasions where I was subtly excluded or even low key bullied.

My biggest gripe with many S types is their general lack of insight, hindsight and foresight into their own lives and the lives of others. They seem to me fundamentally very disengaged, disinterested people who think they have it all figured out and are not afraid to let me know by rubbing their butts in my face (to put it vulgarly), that is, until they don’t. I’m not saying us NF or N types in general are immune from the same, we often are in our own ways, but I feel as though I can only go so far and so deep with most of them. I almost always feel like I have to hold back a big part of myself in order to appear “normal” to them.

And I’m almost offended by descriptions that say, make ISFJs or ESFJs the caring and giving souls that try to take care of everybody, while even us NFs are made out to be brain dead, just good at thinking about stuff. Sure I may not be as good with many of the little details and I don’t always know how to respond to many “practical” situations in a timely manner but I very much use gestures and do tangible things to show my care for someone. However, I also go beyond that and really go for that deeper, more authentic emotional and intellectual connection. Types like ESFPs are always made out to be the “fun” and “live in the moment” types and some sites when comparing them to us NFs they talk about us as if we’re just good for daydreaming and that we’re killjoys by always having our mind on “bigger stuff.” Yes this is true but I very much enjoy a good time alone or with the right people and I very much enjoy some “sensing” pleasures such as food (I’m a big foodie) and music and art and nature. Yes, I’m not as in touch with my five senses as say an ESFP is but they make it sound like “look at those pretentious snobs, they will never understand our common pleasures and the good things in life.”

I very much do, I just don’t necessarily view the same interests or life in general the same way as they do. It’s not the be all, end all.

All in all, I find S types more tiring than not. What’s also quite hurtful, usually coming from SJ types, is the old “you just don’t understand” when I am making a sincere effort to understand. I feel as though I share myself much more readily with them than they’re willing to share themselves with me.

I can’t see myself marrying an S type unless they’re really that rare gem who preferably has their Ni or Ne somewhat developed. If I’m looking for loyalty and reliability I don’t see why someone like an INFJ or ENFJ can’t give me that.
 
#14 ·
With S types, due to my history of not being understood by them / mocked by them, I either freeze up around them (usually STs) or I can’t help but get a little pushy and adversarial like I’m more desperate to tell them everything and let them know how I feel (SFs). I don’t usually have the same problems with N types especially other NFs, where I feel like it’s a much more natural and most of all, equal conversation. I don’t feel like I have to make myself heard because I know that the other side is actively listening, engaging, and processing things in a way that’s more similar to mine. I notice that I get a lot more pushy around S types than around N, especially NF types.

Regarding beliefs, it’s not that I don’t look up or try to make sense of why I happen to have that particular belief, a lot of times I am very aware of that but that won’t stop me from believing it because to me if it just “feels right” and if it’s something I feel is an integral part of my identity I just can’t let it go.
 
#15 · (Edited)
Have your experienced those very clear sharp visual insights while perceiving information? Like you see state of information in a way that's not directly and obviously there, as a very clear picture. Can't tell for sure but that seems to be general trademark of Ni in reality, to me so far and every dom/aux Ni user I've asked has explained it sort of similar way.

I can't remember if I've already given you the same or similar answer in some other threads but I'll do it here.

I have experiences mostly with NTJs though, can't tell about NFJs too much, although one male colleague who's most likely ENFJ, described it in similar way - incoming information triggers a way to very clearly see what the other person is talking about, usually filling in the caps. Sometimes this insight can kick in later, without immediate trigger. From outside it looks like a person is zoning out when it kicks in - can see this a lot in my partner.

My partner is NTJ and she has brought me some examples from real life: for example when we walked around old hilltop where ancient castle lied (now only plain hill), she vividly saw full old town with people, animals, buildings and such, in action - meanwhile I received nothing, just had to conclude from tangible information, what could have been there :) Or looked at the flower in forest and perceived an old manor where this flower is painted on a painting on the walls of this manor. Tripping on shrooms and such only amplifies this phenomenon for her, making it a constant flow. It's important to realize it's not just good visual imagination and not a result of concious processing - any type could have the latter. It's just a way of perceiving state of information.

My best friend (INTJ) and other more close people who are Ni users, have explained it in similar way. If you can't perceive state of information this way, you're most likely not Ni user regardless of what mbti says. Forget about tert and inf Ni (same for other roles as we can't be aware of them conciously) :p I don't have that ability and it couldn't be trained or learned :) It's not about a theoretical mbti construct or stereotypical behaviour, it's real brain's ability some possess and most of us not :) That's what makes types, it's not about external behaviours and stereotypes.

Making it obvious how stoopid those threads are what focus on "Help, I lost my NE" or "How I can I be better at SI" - these are just different ways to experience world not any learned behavioural expressions :p

And nope, writing this post didn't require any N unlike many would like to think :p
 
#16 ·
[...]

I have experiences mostly with NTJs though, can't tell about NFJs too much, although one male colleague who's most likely ENFJ, described it in similar way - incoming information triggers a way to very clearly see what the other person is talking about, usually filling in the caps. Sometimes this insight can kick in later, without immediate trigger. From outside it looks like a person is zoning out when it kicks in - can see this a lot in my partner.

[ ... ]
I'd liken it somewhat to what kicks in if first you're viewing a Pointillist painting too closely:

886052


Huh? What's that???

Ni in effect "pulls the camera back" until it makes contextual sense:

886053


The above is literal, it's basic, it's what's there. But as with your partner and the old town, it can go beyond what's literally before one's eyes to fill in the gaps with what's not currently present but which is of highest likelihood to have been present (or what will be present) at such and such a time under such and such conditions. As you note in the part I didn't quote, it's not something one initiates with an effort, it just happens automatically. Thank you, Ni.
 
#18 · (Edited)
I’m not very accommodating of value systems that greatly differ from mine and would avoid people like that whenever possible. I appear calm / courteous most of the time but I am thinking about a lot more, when it comes to both people and things, than others can see. It’s much harder to ask me to explain what I feel / believe as bullet point statements, but much easier for me to open up through asking questions and getting to know me as an individual.
You can have this as a INFJ, sure, but if this dominates then that is strong Fi. I get it, there are some things I dislike about other people's values (cough cough, leftist extremists cough cough) but I just think such people grew into those values because they were lied to, manipulated or because of their culture. Being a weirdo isn't something bad in itself, it's what you do. so, you could be a complete leftoid, but if you're keeping it civil, then I see no problem. There are some things I won't accept either. I have strong Fi and I know what it looks like. I do however try to understand that there are reasons for why people are the way there are. Doesn't mean I agree with them or understand if they cross the line. Also, avoiding people because of their belief system will only make you understand them less. You are free to avoid people, but you should at least try to hear them out, even if you disagree. Voice your opinion on why you disagree. You both might learn something.

In addition, I’m very skeptical towards the whole idea of “self help” or “self improvement” because I feel as though it neglects very real and fundamental failings of the global order / global system, as well as being no more than a “feel good” road map to attaining what’s deemed “conventionally” esteemed and necessary for a fulfilled life. Positive psychology / the whole idea of self-actualization a lot of it is bogus to me, because too often it’s just another facade for perpetuating capitalism and the glorification of career and “wow look at me” kind of success. The whole idea of a “career” turns me off because IMO what’s really a “career” is to the vast majority of people just a glorified job. A real “career” to me belongs to the realm of true idealists, visionaries and revolutionaries, artists.
Self help is a good thing. I don't mean books and the likes, but those are good also. The idea behind self help is to obtain self reliance, be self sustaining and overall to not depend on anybody but yourself. To clean your room before you even think about cleaning the world. The world will clean itself with each and individual that cleans the area around him. Also, most people don't have careers, they have jobs. And while there are problems with people slaving away to get that latest device or take that expensive vacation somewhere, that is actually the fault of the individual, not the fault of capitalism. Had it not been for capitalism, the device you write your hatred for capitalism from wouldn't exist, not would you be able to afford it, nor would you be allowed to own it if it existed and you could afford it. You can complain about capitalism because capitalism exists. They don't have such luxuries in communism and such. You can prove me wrong by trying to write this message from North Korea. I can wait just to prove a point.

I don't work for the "look at me" success. I used to be on the left side of politics, although never a communist, my country has suffered enough to know that we don't want communism ever again (Eastern Europe). I used to work in a bank for a measly salary dealing with statistics and reports about house loans. I watched people buy houses all day when I could never ever afford one. Yet, 15 years and one economic depression later, here I am, having bought my own house (sure, I took a bank loan, I'm not rich like Bernie Sanders to afford a house payed with cash every year), married, 2 kids et all. I got here through self help and work. Nobody gonna give you free stuff. Free stuff doesn't exist. Stuff exists because someone made it. That in itself has value. Therefore it is not free. Someone spent their time to make it. To gain access to it, you have to spend your time to make something else to trade. We trade with currency. Capitalism.

Also, don't diss career people. They sacrifice a lot to get a career. Me, I'm no CEO, nor do I aspire to become one, but think about this: if you think such people are happy because they have money, you're wrong. You're supposed to live within your means and that doesn't imply just money wise. Also, a lot more money can be made from being a plumber, a trucker, a builder than an artist. At the end of the day, art doesn't realistically keep the society working. When you flush your toilet, it's not art that is taking your poop down the pipe. It's someone's work building and maintaining that system for which you don't seem to show appreciation. You don't see the importance of both sides. I like art. I buy art when I can. I don't think art is a bad thing at all. But I buy a lot of things before I get to buy art. That's fine, I'm assuming you're still young, so you have the time to find your way. The first thing to think about is that NOBODY OWES YOU ANYTHING. If someone gives you something, appreciate it, make something out of it. A successful society is made out of successful individuals. It's bottom up, not top down. Art is fine, but if the power goes out tomorrow, art is meaningless. Art is a luxury, I can bring up Maslow's pyramid, where art is at the top. Only that the most important parts of the pyramid lie at the bottom. The top of the pyramid would not exist without the bottom. Take the bottom out and it all crashes. Take the top and it is no longer a pyramid, but it still stands, it still works, even if it is not quite as good as if it were complete.

Anyways, you might be an INFJ, you asked if it was possible. Do some tests. Do a lot of tests. Read about cognitive functions. Ask for an expert to type you, if that is a possibility for you. If it matters to you, then you should definitely spend some money finding the truth. By doing that you're essentially helping yourself. You already were doing self help when you started this thread, but you didn't see it that way. Try to show some appreciation for capitalism. What you hate is probably corporatism. And we can together protest the big corporations. We are probably more united by our hate of corporations than divided by our different appreciation of capitalism. I mean, I assume you dislike corporations, but you never know. Corporations have more in common with a centralized system like communism than capitalism. You gotta dress the same, think the same, individuality is frowned upon, creativity is inhibited, you are heavily monitored, just like in a totalitarian communist state. So if you wanna say something about google, facebook, amazon etc, go ahead, I'll totally support you, even add my own. But mom and pop shops trying to make a living by having a small business? Nope. That is true capitalism and I think that is worth appreciating. You could be INFJ. How much does that mean to you anyways? How does that improve your life?

I forgot to add this, which is a very important distinction between INFP and INFJ. INFJs follow through before moving to the next thing, while INFP move to the next project before following through. The J's always need closure and completion, while P's need to leave things open and constantly explore.
 
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