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Is the child from first pregnancy most important to the woman?

  • Yes, the child needs to be kept

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes, but keeping the child is the woman's choice, given that she understands the consequences

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes, but there are no consequences of she aborts the unborn child

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No, having a child is important, not whether it's the first pregnancy

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No, getting pregnant and having a child are totally different things

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Is it too emotionally costly to abort the first pregnancy?

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Is the child from first pregnancy really worth keeping?

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • What kind of life to give the future child is more important than whether the pregnancy is aborted

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    11
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Discussion Starter #1
It's been said that abortions can affect a woman for life, and have deep effects on her emotionally. Also, women tend to favor the first born, or oldest, of her children. This indicates that the child from first pregnancy is possibly the most important to the woman, hence, to avoid the emotional problems stemming from getting an abortion, it's important to keep the child, or at least, prevent pregnancy in the first place.

Please share your thoughts or comments, thank you.
 

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It's been said that abortions can affect a woman for life, and have deep effects on her emotionally. Also, women tend to favor the first born, or oldest, of her children. This indicates that the child from first pregnancy is possibly the most important to the woman, hence, to avoid the emotional problems stemming from getting an abortion, it's important to keep the child, or at least, prevent pregnancy in the first place.

Please share your thoughts or comments, thank you.
Who says these things? What data do you have supporting any of these notions?

This sounds like a lot of bullshit. I expect some women will have a lot of emotional fall out for years after an abortion. I also expect some women will only have relief and appreciation for their abortions long after. The difference being, the one who was happy with the outcome of her experience isn't going to be dwelling on it for years later.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Who says these things? What data do you have supporting any of these notions?

This sounds like a lot of bullshit. I expect some women will have a lot of emotional fall out for years after an abortion. I also expect some women will only have relief and appreciation for their abortions long after. The difference being, the one who was happy with the outcome of her experience isn't going to be dwelling on it for years later.
How abortion emotionally affects a woman has been discussed in the pro-abortion vs. pro-keep debate.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Do you have any data or just opinions?
When someone says how they feel bad, or regret, about something, what kind of data do you need? "On a scale of one to five, how bad did it make you feel, with one being the worst"?
 

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Without proof of the biochemical impact, I would speculate the first embryo/fetus has this supposed effect because our bodies are being broken in and programmed for the first time for future occurrences of producing the potential for life. Our bodies are going through various stages of "I can do this", "I am doing this", "what have I gotten myself into", "how the f--- do I stop this process", and "wow, I did it". The first successful bun to pop out of the oven is the biophysical wake-up call of a new chapter of abilities our bodies can perform and that first child is proof we can do it. So more emotional weight seems associated with the first child. It is a biophysical "achievement unlocked". Subsequent successful attempts may be taken for granted by our psyche due to the first successful attempt until biology throws in a wrench.

I am speculating that a potential mother isn't going to be drawn emotionally to any pregnancy unless she truly desires to and is present psychologically and emotionally.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Without proof of the biochemical impact, I would speculate the first embryo/fetus has this supposed effect because our bodies are being broken in and programmed for the first time for future occurrences of producing the potential for life. Our bodies are going through various stages of "I can do this", "I am doing this", "what have I gotten myself into", "how the f--- do I stop this process", and "wow, I did it". The first successful bun to pop out of the oven is the biophysical wake-up call of a new chapter of abilities our bodies can perform and that first child is proof we can do it. So more emotional weight seems associated with the first child. It is a biophysical "achievement unlocked". Subsequent successful attempts may be taken for granted by our psyche due to the first successful attempt until biology throws in a wrench.

I am speculating that a potential mother isn't going to be drawn emotionally to any pregnancy unless she truly desires to and is present psychologically and emotionally.
How you pictured the process at which the body accepts the first pregnancy is very interesting.

Even though the mother might not be drawn emotionally to the first pregnancy or having a baby, if she has the support of her parents, relatives, friends and society, then she might be even grateful to have the child. It will definitely save her a lot of future emotional anguish, or psychological stress from going through an abortion for first pregnancy.
 

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When someone says how they feel bad, or regret, about something, what kind of data do you need? "On a scale of one to five, how bad did it make you feel, with one being the worst"?
You need data about the percentage of women who regretted their decision and what their future health outcomes and their socioeconomic outcomes were. There's a ton of data to collect to quantify what that means.
 

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Without proof of the biochemical impact, I would speculate the first embryo/fetus has this supposed effect because our bodies are being broken in and programmed for the first time for future occurrences of producing the potential for life. Our bodies are going through various stages of "I can do this", "I am doing this", "what have I gotten myself into", "how the f--- do I stop this process", and "wow, I did it". The first successful bun to pop out of the oven is the biophysical wake-up call of a new chapter of abilities our bodies can perform and that first child is proof we can do it. So more emotional weight seems associated with the first child. It is a biophysical "achievement unlocked". Subsequent successful attempts may be taken for granted by our psyche due to the first successful attempt until biology throws in a wrench.

I am speculating that a potential mother isn't going to be drawn emotionally to any pregnancy unless she truly desires to and is present psychologically and emotionally.
Okay, so what research has been done on this?
 

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I chose Freedom of Choice

The reality is we are all impacted differently by life so how we all view the situation will be different.

A person who never wanted children, or sees the embryo as just cells dividing, may not see or feel any connection to aborting 1st pregnancy. It may not affect them in the least because there is no significance

A person who been trying for years to become pregnant and is forced to have one, regardless of the reason, will feel that loss significantly especially as it's the 1st
 

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A person who never wanted children, or sees the embryo as just cells dividing, may not see or feel any connection to aborting 1st pregnancy. It may not affect them in the least because there is no significance
This was my experience, with two abortions.

I eventually did have a child, and it was hell.
 

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How you pictured the process at which the body accepts the first pregnancy is very interesting.

Even though the mother might not be drawn emotionally to the first pregnancy or having a baby, if she has the support of her parents, relatives, friends and society, then she might be even grateful to have the child. It will definitely save her a lot of future emotional anguish, or psychological stress from going through an abortion for first pregnancy.
That's what happened with the very first time I had a complete stranger come up an ask me what she should do. A Christianly young lady about to complete her first trimester wrangling with the idea of having a baby and drop out of college or get an abortion. She had a do-nothing boyfriend whose parents were more than happy to call her family and help her with the baby, so she claimed. Wanted to keep the baby because of her faith, risk of her parents disowning her, and a developing maternal attachment. Being pro-choice but only wanting that "choice" to be of last resort, I suggested to her that if she had a good relationship with the boyfriend's parents and she trusted them in actions and word then she should consider keeping the baby. Her emotions, concept of faith, ability to continue her schooling and healthy connections will remain intact with a middle ground. I will never forget how uncomfortable that situation made me. A complete random stranger asking me such a heavy question. I hope she choose well for herself. If she did keep the baby, I hope they're both doing well.

You need data about the percentage of women who regretted their decision and what their future health outcomes and their socioeconomic outcomes were. There's a ton of data to collect to quantify what that means.
True. I've read quite a bit. But beyond the data, I also wonder what resources were available prior to a woman making that choice. What she felt was or wasn't available to her to influence why she felt abortion was her only recourse at that point in time. Was her emotional state her own or was a influenced by those around her. Such as community and cultural stigmas. What roles those factors could have influenced. That's data I would really like to read. But while I gather, that is why I stressed my statements as speculations. Not to be passed as data-set facts.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
You need data about the percentage of women who regretted their decision and what their future health outcomes and their socioeconomic outcomes were. There's a ton of data to collect to quantify what that means.
People are different, especially in the Frequency Temperament, which is explained here: Energy-based people (who relies on internal feelings)...

Therefore, percentages of people don't tell a lot about how women regret their abortions. As long as there are stories of women who regret their abortions, it means that abortions have an emotional impact on certain women.

In the Abortion and Mental Health" article, shared by user, Six, has this interesting quote:

Similarly, Julius Fogel, who as both a psychiatrist and OB-GYN and as a pioneer of abortion rights performed tens of thousands of abortion, testified that while abortion may be necessary and generally beneficial, it always exacts a psychological price:

Every woman—whatever her age, background or sexuality—has a trauma at destroying a pregnancy. A level of humanness is touched. This is a part of her own life. When she destroys a pregnancy, she is destroying herself. There is no way it can be innocuous. One is dealing with the life force. It is totally beside the point whether or not you think a life is there. You cannot deny that something is being created and that this creation is physically happening …
Often the trauma may sink into the unconscious and never surface in the woman’s lifetime. But it is not as harmless and casual an event as many in the pro-abortion crowd insist. A psychological price is paid. It may be alienation; it may be a pushing away from human warmth, perhaps a hardening of the maternal instinct. Something happens on the deeper levels of a woman’s consciousness when she destroys a pregnancy. I know that as a psychiatrist.
 

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Repent for what? Asking a question?




"The ability to identify women who are at greater risk of negative reactions has resulted in numerous recommendations for abortion providers to screen for these risk factors in order to provide additional counseling both before an abortion, including decision-making counseling, and after an abortion.24,25,31,6668

Notably, while there is no dispute regarding the abundance of research identifying risk factors, there is little if any research identifying which women, if any, acquire any mental health benefits from abortion compared to carrying a pregnancy to term, even if the pregnancy was unintended or unwanted.17"

This isn't indicating that all women have negative reactions to abortions. With any medical decisions you have to weigh risk vs benefit. What is the best solution for one woman isn't necessarily the best solution for others. Which is kind of the point of providing decision-making counselling and after abortion counselling.
 

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People are different, especially in the Frequency Temperament, which is explained here: Energy-based people (who relies on internal feelings)...

Therefore, percentages of people don't tell a lot about how women regret their abortions. As long as there are stories of women who regret their abortions, it means that abortions have an emotional impact on certain women.

In the Abortion and Mental Health" article, shared by user, Six, has this interesting quote:



I have zero interest in your energy drivel. That's not an argument. It's not real. It is imaginary. If you want to talk about fairies and unicorns, find someone else to chat with.

It has a lot of other quotes. Of note, their conclusion isn't that abortions have negative mental health outcomes for women who have abortions and should be stopped. Their conclusion is to identify women with risk factors for negative outcomes. If you're done cherry picking and ignoring the main conclusions of their research...
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I have zero interest in your energy drivel. That's not an argument. It's not real. It is imaginary. If you want to talk about fairies and unicorns, find someone else to chat with.

It has a lot of other quotes. Of note, their conclusion isn't that abortions have negative mental health outcomes for women who have abortions and should be stopped. Their conclusion is to identify women with risk factors for negative outcomes. If you're done cherry picking and ignoring the main conclusions of their research...
The Frequency Temperament helps explain how certain women are happy to play the role of mother as a child, while other women have no such motherhood role playing, or interest.

The research is, that there is general agreement there are no mental health benefits from having abortion, and that certain women are at increased risk for depressions, anxiety, sleeping disorders, or substance abuse after having abortion.
 

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The research is, that there is general agreement there are no mental health benefits from having abortion,
What does "benefits" mean here? Is that your term, or someone else's?

If you're trying to paraphrase the Reardon article, you have done so incorrectly.
 
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