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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I swear, the more I understand about MBTI, the more confused I get...

Anyway, I took Revy2Hand's questions and answered them. What functions could you see me using based on my answers?

When working on a project where do you place your emphasis? The process of putting it together, or the final product? (Do you experiment with your perspectives to create ideas?)
I’m not really sure on this. Probably the final product.

Are you a realist? Are you more of a no nonsense type of person? (I find these people like to call bullshit on everything)
I’d like to think I’m an idealist. No nonsense-wise, I don’t really think so, but other people have considered me to be a serious person. I’m not really clear on the BS thing either.

Would you say you make decisions quickly, or do you take a while coming to a conclusion, because you hope you're not missing some vital information that will change your mind?
Most of the time, I make decisions quickly. I get impatient when other people are fickle and can’t make up their mind, though I’m hypocritical in doing that sometimes too. :frustrating:

Do you ever experience nostalgia? For instance being able to completely remember a mood of a past experience/time?
Nope. Memories are rather fuzzy for me. I may feel embarrassed or ashamed thinking about something I did in the past, but I don’t remember the actual mood of it.

Are you of the rebellious sort? The sort who rebels for no reason other than to rebel against authority?
No. If I rebel, I want a reason to do so, not just for its own sake.

When watching a film and critiquing it, do you critique it based on details in the film, for instance on how you thought a certain portion of it was un-realistic (or something along those lines) or based on the idea or point they were trying to get across/how well they got it across? (It can be a combination of both sometimes too) (an example would be for example, critiquing Passion of the Christ, do you think the movies retarded because no one can live as long as he did with that much blood loss, or because of the fundamental errors the movie makes when trying to make its point, and the way it tries to connect the audience to that point?)
Neither. I’m not really aware (don’t know if it’s the right word) about the unrealistic parts of it unless someone points it out to me. Sometimes, I get annoyed at them for that. Just enjoy the movie! I don’t really think about how well ideas are being portrayed either.

When debating with others, do you ever get the feeling or state for that matter, that you can see where your opponent is coming from? For instance I have gotten into arguments over things I honestly don't believe (or could care less if it were true), but it all started when someone would tell me about a certain topic and how this certain stance is stupid. Then I would say well, I can see why they'd think that or how it could be possible, then they'd start arguing with me as if I had a stake in it.... Do you feel you do anything like that?
Hmm. Yea, I’ve had that feeling before. I think I do pretty well in seeing their perspective on things.

Do you notice symbols in the world, do you ever try and wrap the symbol back to an idea that you believe?
Nope.

Are you hurt by criticisms? Do you get personally offended when people try and criticize you, or are you thick skinned?
Yes, unless it’s something that I’m blah about, like saying I’m too blunt, or if I asked for criticism. Even if its constructive criticism, it’ll hurt, but I try to rationalize it in saying it’ll help me grow somehow. It doesn’t take away the sting, though. I don’t have a thick skin.

Say for example your learning about cameras in school, would you be more inclined to go home right away and read a whole shit load on cameras so you feel confident in your knowledge of cameras? or would you feel perfectly comfortable when the teacher calls on people to come try it out, to just hop up there and start using it?
For the camera, I’d just start using it. However, in a different situation, I need to feel confident in my knowledge of things, or else I feel like an idiot for not knowing what I’m doing or getting myself into.

When you are out do you worry about how people will interpret any action you take? (Sort of in a Seinfeld sort of way, where they over analyze actions people make, trying to find their true motivation) Do you feel a sort of pressure from this?
Sometimes I worry about it, and I do feel the pressure. It only happens occasionally though.

In a classroom setting do you ever find yourself helping other people out with projects or homework when you see their struggling? Do you do this to make yourself feel more comfortable?
Yea, I do that sometimes. I don’t think I do it to make myself comfortable, I just want to help. I do feel pretty good afterwards, though. :proud:

Do you find yourself ranting to your friends about how a certain something could have been done way easier? Or how someone went about doing something (anything like a project, work, etc.) was really stupid and you could have done it way better and in a more simple fashion?
Eh, not really.

How does your average day go in general?
It’s pretty slow and routine. Sometimes I feel uneasy about it, doing the same thing every day (wake up, go to school, etc.) and I want something different. However, when there’s a faster change of pace, I’m stressed that I can’t keep up. What a contradiction.

What things do you value the most?
I value my relationships, especially in family. I value my space and can be quite irritable if I’m deprived of it for too long. And my iPod. I can’t leave the house without it. It's like a key to open my own little world. Without it, I can't tune out everything else.

What things regularly bug you?
My mind is drawing a blank on this. There’s probably too many to name. I’m a rather irritable person.

What do you value most in other people and what qualities do you find most repulsive in others?
I value honesty, even though it might be painful. I value compassion, and can be envious of that too. I don’t see myself as a kind person, though I’m sensitive to how other people feel.

I don’t like clinginess, it’s suffocating. I absolutely hate manipulation, especially through guilt. I don’t like when people ask for my advice and then promptly dismiss it. I don’t like fake people, but I’m sure that no one really does. I hate how cruel people could be, and I hate insensitivity, such as people being rude to waiters or something. If I knew them, I would reprimand them for it.
I tend to focus more on negativity in people than their good points.

Any peculiarities that you have noticed about your personality?
Not really, except for the excessive need to be alone after being around for people for too long.
Anything that makes you stand out from other people that you know?
I find that people always talk to me about their personal problems and ask me for advice. I feel uncomfortable with that since I’ve never really been in their particular situation, and that makes me the wrong person to ask. That coupled with the fact that I’m afraid my advice might screw them over. Others have noted that I always know the right thing to say, but I don’t even know how I do this, or how I come up with the advice. I just DO.

People also look at me strangely when I talk, and I thought it was because I was saying something possibly stupid or weird. I asked my friends about it though, and they say it’s because I know what I’m talking about, and I talk over their heads. I was completely oblivious to this, and I certainly don’t feel that way.
I’m also known to be opinionated, always having something to say.
I don’t know if that answers the question, but whatever.

What do you yourself think are your strengths and weaknesses?
Strengths:
I’m weary of taking only one side of information. For example, if person 1 was angry at person 2 for something, I wouldn’t immediately agree that person 2 was [insert insult here]. I need to hear the other side of the story to make a valid opinion. This is also because I can see different sides of the conflict, and why people would react the way they do.

I’m a good listener, and I genuinely try to help people fix their problems.

I’m calm in distressing situations, as I know everything will work out in the end. I find that I need to calm others down too, reassuring them that things will be alright.

Weaknesses:
I can become isolated from people if I’m not careful. I realized that it’s incredibly easy for me to drift away if I’m not careful.

I can be passionate in something easily, but I could lose it just as fast. It’s kind of depressing, like the things I once loved don’t matter anymore.

I’m not really attached, honestly. If I were to move away, I would miss my friends, but I could get over it easily. Family is a different story. Maybe it’s my priorities.

I spend more time actually worrying about a project/assignment/etc. than actually doing it.

I try to help people, but there have been times I have given too much of myself and left nothing for me. It’s a double edged sword.

I can hold a grudge.:mellow:

So, type away. :laughing:
 

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You seem like an INFP to me.

The way you are hurt by criticism and the value you put on family suggests a feeling preference; the way you identify with others looks like Fi to me, as does this:

What do you value most in other people and what qualities do you find most repulsive in others?
I value honesty, even though it might be painful. I value compassion, and can be envious of that too. I don’t see myself as a kind person, though I’m sensitive to how other people feel.

I don’t like clinginess, it’s suffocating. I absolutely hate manipulation, especially through guilt. I don’t like when people ask for my advice and then promptly dismiss it. I don’t like fake people, but I’m sure that no one really does. I hate how cruel people could be, and I hate insensitivity, such as people being rude to waiters or something. If I knew them, I would reprimand them for it.
This bit is just full of Fi values.


As you don't like rebelling for it's own sake and seem to be more of an abstract thinker, you're probably not a SP, but an intuitive, therefore INFP.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
You seem like an INFP to me.

The way you are hurt by criticism and the value you put on family suggests a feeling preference; the way you identify with others looks like Fi to me, as does this:



This bit is just full of Fi values.


As you don't like rebelling for it's own sake and seem to be more of an abstract thinker, you're probably not a SP, but an intuitive, therefore INFP.
Fi? Really?

The thing that makes me doubt that I have a dominant Fi is the fact that, from what I've read, the need to be authentic. Is this correct?
I don't feel different from others, really. I'm just...ordinary. :mellow:
 

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Fi? Really?

The thing that makes me doubt that I have a dominant Fi is the fact that, from what I've read, the need to be authentic. Is this correct?
I don't feel different from others, really. I'm just...ordinary. :mellow:
Authentic doesn't automatically mean different or extraordinary. IMHO, Fi is more about wanting to be your real true self than about being different. You wrote that you hate manipulation - it hinders people from acting as they really are inside. You don't like fake people - they probably wound your ideal of how people should show their true inner selves. In my experience, Fe doesn't care about that so much, and more about what behavior hurts or pleases others.
 

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I agree with Holunder on INFP!

Are you comfortable with the INFP descriptions you've found so far?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Authentic doesn't automatically mean different or extraordinary. IMHO, Fi is more about wanting to be your real true self than about being different. You wrote that you hate manipulation - it hinders people from acting as they really are inside. You don't like fake people - they probably wound your ideal of how people should show their true inner selves. In my experience, Fe doesn't care about that so much, and more about what behavior hurts or pleases others.
Ah, now it makes more sense. :happy:

I guess I never considered INFP for the fact that I do need structure and like having things decided.

I have learned that you just can't solely base yourself on dichotomies though, and the actual functions are more important.

That being said, I have a rather hard time coming up with ideas and don't consider myself to be a creative person. Do you think you could explain how Ne is used as an auxiliary function?

@ penchant, I read the INFP profiles and was rather iffy about them, but I could really relate to the "For INFP by INFP" thread made by Psilo, particularly these parts:


Introverted Feeling basically drives the INFP's yearning for positive emotions in life. INFPs like feeling positive emotions, they thrive on them. If their emotional state is a good one they will do everything better while in that state. It's like mental adrenaline.
If someone treats them well, they will generally return the favor since the person has done them well. The way Udog puts it is great: "INFPs tend to have a ‘bank’ of sorts. We fairly freely let people we like make withdrawals from it, in the way of listening, comforting, supporting, and doing favors. However, it’s important for the other person to make deposits, too. We need people to listen to us, do us favors, etc. It’s not a 1:1 ratio, but we are not very good at freely giving and giving unconditionally, either. If the withdrawal/deposit ratio gets too skewed, we eventually drop the person from our life." If the person has wronged an INFP without trying to make it up to them then the INFP may shut them out of their life until the negative emotions cool down. It's all relative to the individual as to how sensitive they are, some INFPs may purely go by the person's intent and feel good about that, disregarding if something simply sounded negative. Some may take the words they say personally if they are perceived as a threat. It varies as to how sensitive an INFP is, you can't just pinpoint it in a profile. That's for you to figure out on your own with your interactions with INFPs. So basically an INFP's emotional state and what makes it good is all relative to the individual.

Inferior- Extroverted Thinking/Te: Extroverted Thinking is a very good tool for INFPs. It allows them to rationalize a situation or a problem of theirs, more often than not resolving the problem whether it's personal or emotional. When everything else fails for an INFP they will resort to Te (if they don't already resort to Te), and they will rationalize their feelings and try to make sense of everything.

You also must understand that as an inferior function that the other functions will drown out Te's voice unless you try to hear it, and at times INFPs may be very disorganized and not realize right off the bat the logical consequences of their actions. Inferior functions are typically very protected to the individual, and an INFP may be reluctant to start their Te up due to this and also a fear of screwing up or a fear of failure, and inferior functions are usually difficult to use for people which is where this fear would come from with Te being inferior. What I demonstrated in the above paragraph is INFP Te being put in good use, it of course can be misused (and is misused).
 

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@ penchant, I read the INFP profiles and was rather iffy about them, but I could really relate to the "For INFP by INFP" thread made by Psilo, particularly these parts:
That seems to me to be a good description. Many descriptions online only focus on the positive of the personality and that can be misleading at times. I think if you relate to the post you quoted, that's a good indication. Is there anything in there that you don't agree with?
 

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INFJ possibly

fuzzy memories
getting upset by conflict between people which doesn't remotely concern you
overanalyzing/overthinking stuff that leads you to stress out before you start a project
easy on the move, not attached to your physical environment, may be slow learner though i.e. not easily moved on mental plane
nothing seems to bug you a lot to stand out yet at same time many things can be thought of that way
wanting to see things from multiple perspectives
people treat you as confidante

only way to confirm your type for sure is to study the cognitive functions in detail and decide which ones you use most often:
References:
MBTI characteristics & 16 Personality Types
Function Attitude
comparison of Jung's 8 types
Understanding Yourself and Others ... - Google Books
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
That seems to me to be a good description. Many descriptions online only focus on the positive of the personality and that can be misleading at times. I think if you relate to the post you quoted, that's a good indication. Is there anything in there that you don't agree with?
Well, I don't disagree with much of it really, but there are parts I don't understand, like the function Ne.

I mean, I've read up a lot on it, but I feel like I need a concrete example to see if it applies to me.

INFJ possibly

fuzzy memories
getting upset by conflict between people which doesn't remotely concern you
overanalyzing/overthinking stuff that leads you to stress out before you start a project
easy on the move, not attached to your physical environment, may be slow learner though i.e. not easily moved on mental plane
nothing seems to bug you a lot to stand out yet at same time many things can be thought of that way
wanting to see things from multiple perspectives
people treat you as confidante
I'll read up more on the functions as I go.:happy: Thanks for the links!
I have this doubt that I'm an INFJ though.

For example, my mom is an INFJ, and even though we get along really well, I know I'm very different from her. I feel like I have a stronger Si, especially compared to her. She can even forget that it's her own birthday. She pauses mid-sentence to find the right words for things, which I'm guessing is her Ti. I do that too sometimes, but not to the extent she does.

Finally, most important is her sense of "knowing". For example, she knew that she was going to open a business. She didn't necessarily want to or know how, she just knew it was going to happen. She possesses a strong Ni. < That right there is the defining point. Ni is the dominant function of INFJ, and I've never had a feeling like that.

There's this website on differentiating between INFP and INFJ:
It helped me... :happy:
I read up on that link you gave me. Right now I'm definitely leaning more towards INFP. Some things contradict how I am (like, communication styles. INFP is said to be more informing and indirect, but I know that I'm blunt and straightforward. That might be because how I was raised though.) but for the most part I could relate to it.


On another note, do you think I could be an S instead? Hmm...Gah, indecisiveness. >.<
 

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I'd shoot for ISFJ, or INFJ. Leaning towards ISFJ.

I see your feeling as Fe, and your perception as Si.



Ne, is an associated thought, loosely connecting the outer world to create something new. Branching.
 

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Well, I don't disagree with much of it really, but there are parts I don't understand, like the function Ne.

I mean, I've read up a lot on it, but I feel like I need a concrete example to see if it applies to me.
It's not one of my normally used functions, but I'll give you one example from a recent thread here. Ne is brainstorming function. The ability to spawn new ideas and see lots of possibilities and options is typically Ne. So if you find brainstorming difficult, your probably not a Ne. I hope someone else can help you more on that.

I read up on that link you gave me. Right now I'm definitely leaning more towards INFP. Some things contradict how I am (like, communication styles. INFP is said to be more informing and indirect, but I know that I'm blunt and straightforward. That might be because how I was raised though.) but for the most part I could relate to it.
That could be significant. It is very much a cultural thing, yes, and also to some extent a gender thing. But it could be significant...

On another note, do you think I could be an S instead? Hmm...Gah, indecisiveness. >.<
Si and Se are the functions that I personally have the hardest time understanding, so the fact that I didn't notice that much Si/Se in your post probably doesn't say that much. And since Scruffy has suggested it, I'd go with that as another possibility. It goes against my understanding that Si would always lead to a good memory, but maybe that's too much of a stereotype to be true anyway... Still, if you relate better to the descriptions of Si or Se than that of Ni or Ne, then go with it.

If you can figure out if you relate more to Si or Se, thats very helpful too, since in the end determining your type, is really about determining the order of your cognitive functions... :happy:

Ok, re-reading that, I see it wasn't probably very helpful. If you were to post your short comments on all the eight cognitive functions, from what you've read so far, what would it be?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I'd shoot for ISFJ, or INFJ. Leaning towards ISFJ.

I see your feeling as Fe, and your perception as Si.



Ne, is an associated thought, loosely connecting the outer world to create something new. Branching.
I considered ISFJ, but I couldn't relate to the descriptions. Maybe it's the way they're worded, but I disliked the emphasis on their need of service to others. I don't know, I just don't see that being me. I enjoy helping, but it's not a primary focus or anything. I consider myself a rather selfish person. :proud:

It's not one of my normally used functions, but I'll give you one example from a recent thread here. Ne is brainstorming function. The ability to spawn new ideas and see lots of possibilities and options is typically Ne. So if you find brainstorming difficult, your probably not a Ne. I hope someone else can help you more on that.



That could be significant. It is very much a cultural thing, yes, and also to some extent a gender thing. But it could be significant...



Si and Se are the functions that I personally have the hardest time understanding, so the fact that I didn't notice that much Si/Se in your post probably doesn't say that much. And since Scruffy has suggested it, I'd go with that as another possibility. It goes against my understanding that Si would always lead to a good memory, but maybe that's too much of a stereotype to be true anyway... Still, if you relate better to the descriptions of Si or Se than that of Ni or Ne, then go with it.

If you can figure out if you relate more to Si or Se, thats very helpful too, since in the end determining your type, is really about determining the order of your cognitive functions... :happy:

Ok, re-reading that, I see it wasn't probably very helpful. If you were to post your short comments on all the eight cognitive functions, from what you've read so far, what would it be?
Don't worry, any input is helpful.:happy:

Brainstorming is difficult. Like, when I'm writing a timed essay or something, oh man. Mind= blank. It's like I feel pressured to come up with an idea, and nothing is popping up.

Haha, I felt uneasy about the Si stereotype too, but it's something to pin down the function to.

I don't think I have a grasp on the N/S functions in general, honestly. No matter how much I read, I can't wrap my head around it, with the exception of Se. I can't say I really use it, though.

What do you mean about short comments on the functions?
 

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I feel like I have a stronger Si, especially compared to her. She can even forget that it's her own birthday. She pauses mid-sentence to find the right words for things, which I'm guessing is her Ti. I do that too sometimes, but not to the extent she does.
She probably remembers that it is her birthday somewhere in the back of her head just seems unimportant :) ... do you put much emphasis on your own birthday? As for eloquence ... well such people as Ghandi and Hitler and even Oprah and even Jung himself have been classed as INFJ and they were/are able to communicate quite well. INFJs are not all the same person to person - there are approximately 100 million of us on this planet.

Finally, most important is her sense of "knowing". For example, she knew that she was going to open a business. She didn't necessarily want to or know how, she just knew it was going to happen.
This sort of knowing doesn't happen magically but is really the product of a lot of background thinking. One time I just knew I was going to screw up really bad and yes indeed I ended up failing, but to be honest with myself it wasn't some oracular knowledge that one that day imparted on my mind - it was result of observing patterns of my behavior over several months, I just didn't want to consciously admit it to myself.

Most often Ni kind of knowing comes from optimizing something. You think about it a long time then an optimal solution comes to mind. Then comes the hard time explaining why it is optimal to others :)
 

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Some more differences between INFP and INFJ:

INFJ:
Perceive events in a continuous sequence – continuous changes rather than discrete states.
More inclined to say how stage A leads to stage B, and how stage B leads to stage C.
Describe events in a specific and concrete manner.
More inclined to talk of movements and interactions of reality.
The stories of dynamics usually involve multiple main characters.
Strategist type - tactical:
- Focus on methods, and manipulate them, with goals unsettled.
- Goals are defined by, and modified to fit methods.
- Prefers to expand options. Doesn't like to have too few of them.
Communication type - asking:
- likes to establish a dialogue
- much of what an askers says seems more question-like, even statements
- always, as the other person talks, affirm the receipt of information with yeah, mhm, etc.
- talk to an audience as a whole very well
- starts talking at times expecting someone to get interested and start paying attention
- has a tendency to interrupt and feels comfortable pausing half way on the speech and with "questions allowed all the time" way, returning to what was said later if necessary
- quite often asks a non-rhetorical question and answers it himself
- often just asks questions to fill in time, without serious need to actually find the information asked
Task accomplishing - Result:
- Do things randomly, seemingly doing them from the end to the beginning.
- Detached from processes and tends to multitasking.
- Focus on the beggining and the end of processes.
- More inclined to read texts on books or computer randomly, maybe reading random paragraphs or chapters.
Natural state - Decisive:
Natural state is readiness.
Work best if they are able to tart mobilizing in preparation for what they must do.
Easily go from 'relaxed' to 'mobilized', but not from 'mobilized' to 'relaxed'. Thus, they may need external stimuli (like a movie) to relax.
Tend to perform an entire task at once, and to maintain their internal 'readiness' between tasks.
Become of aware of their own mobilization at its maximals – i.e., when it is time for action. However, they are often poorly aware of when the mobilization firsts manifests – i.e., when they first start considering an action.
Focuses and places the most importance on taking action – preparation is considered implicit and given less attention.
Consider the possible results and rewards of their work (e.g., how much they are paid) more important than the working conditions (e.g., comfort, freedom, and convenience).
This attitude is strengthened by extroversion.
More aware of when they are relaxed than when they are mobilized.
“I will not get stuck in the process of consideration – it always ends in a decision being made.”
Emotivist:
- Tend to concentrate foremost on the emotional background of interaction, with 'business' a secondary concern.
- Prefer the new and novel over the old and known.
- Information perceived as unprofessional or low-quality can leave them indifferent.
- Have greater difficulty disassociating from requests for action or consideration than from others' emotions and experiences.
- “If a conversation is emotionally negative, I consider it wasted.”

INFP:
Perceive events in an episodic manner – discrete states rather than continuous changes.
More inclined to say how stages A, B and C are.
Describe events in a general manner and by comparing them to other similar events.
More inclined to talk of properties and structures of reality.
The stories of statics usually involve one constant main character.
Strategist type - strategic:
- Focus on goals, and manipulate them, with methods unsettled.
- Methods are defined by, and modified to fit goals.
- Prefers to defend goals. Doesn't like to be forced to deviate from them.
Communication type - declaring:
- tendency to monologue
- much of what a declarer says seems more statement-like, even questions
- listens attentively and silently to others' speeches to return to a long speech
- finds it easier to talk to one person at a time
- before starting to talk, first ascertains that attention is grabbed
- is very patient in terms of others speeches in terms of letting finish
- prefers to finish the speech before letting others talk, likes closure and that their point was conveyed
- questions are often either rhetorical or only strictly motivated by serious need for certain information
Task accomplishing - Process:
- Do things sequentially, from the beginning to the end.
- Immersed to a process and tends to single-tasking.
- Focus between the beggining and the end of processes.
- More inclined to read texts on books or computer from beggining to the end.
Natural state - Judicious:
Natural state is relaxed.
Work best when they can relax beforehand, and are mobilized only for the duration necessary.
Have an easy time going from 'mobilized' to 'relaxed', but not from 'relaxed' to 'mobilized'. Thus, they may need external stimuli to become mobilized.
Tend to divide up matters into smaller stages during which they are mobilized, relaxing between each stage.
Become aware of their own mobilization as soon as it manifests – i.e., as soon as they start considering an action. However, they are often poorly aware of the periods of maximal mobilization – i.e., the time of action.
Focuses and places the most importance on the preparatory stage – the 'action' stages are considered implicit and given less attention.
Consider their working conditions (e.g., comfort, freedom, and convenience) more important than the possible results and rewards (e.g., how much they are paid).
This attitude is strengthened by introversion.
More aware of when they are mobilized than when they are relaxed.
“Consideration is very nice, that time during which you still don't have to make a decision. It's even better when it isn't necessary to do anything afterwards.”
Constructivist:
- Tend to minimize the emotional elements of interaction, preferring to focus on the 'business' elements.
- Have emotional 'anchors' (eg, books, films, places) which they use to support their internal emotional state.
- Can become 'emotionally hooked', and can have a strong reaction to a particular part or section regardless of their feelings towards the entirety.
- Have greater difficulty disassociating from others' emotions and experiences than from requests for action or consideration.
- “I prefer when people offer concrete solutions instead of comfort or sympathy.”

Hope this helps :)
 

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Brainstorming is difficult. Like, when I'm writing a timed essay or something, oh man. Mind= blank. It's like I feel pressured to come up with an idea, and nothing is popping up.

Haha, I felt uneasy about the Si stereotype too, but it's something to pin down the function to.

I don't think I have a grasp on the N/S functions in general, honestly. No matter how much I read, I can't wrap my head around it, with the exception of Se. I can't say I really use it, though.

What do you mean about short comments on the functions?
I realize I didn't link to this thread yesterday, though you might have seen it already, there are some things in there on Ne. http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/31949-question-about-ne-3.html#post722236

My thinking behind asking for comments or thoughts on all of the functions was partly to see how you understand them and partly how you relate to them.

There are a few tests around online for cognitive functions, but I understand that they are not considered very reliable. If you want to have a look anyway here's one: Keys 2 Cognition - Cognitive Processes

All that said, my feeling so far is that your an INFP. Especially this
I considered ISFJ, but I couldn't relate to the descriptions. Maybe it's the way they're worded, but I disliked the emphasis on their need of service to others. I don't know, I just don't see that being me. I enjoy helping, but it's not a primary focus or anything. I consider myself a rather selfish person.
is a strong indicator for me that you are not any kind of IxFJ.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
She probably remembers that it is her birthday somewhere in the back of her head just seems unimportant :) ... do you put much emphasis on your own birthday? As for eloquence ... well such people as Ghandi and Hitler and even Oprah and even Jung himself have been classed as INFJ and they were/are able to communicate quite well. INFJs are not all the same person to person - there are approximately 100 million of us on this planet.


This sort of knowing doesn't happen magically but is really the product of a lot of background thinking. One time I just knew I was going to screw up really bad and yes indeed I ended up failing, but to be honest with myself it wasn't some oracular knowledge that one that day imparted on my mind - it was result of observing patterns of my behavior over several months, I just didn't want to consciously admit it to myself.

Most often Ni kind of knowing comes from optimizing something. You think about it a long time then an optimal solution comes to mind. Then comes the hard time explaining why it is optimal to others :)
Haha, probably. She's so absent-minded sometimes, which is ironic because she always comments on how oblivious I am. I won't deny that! :tongue:
I place a lot of emphasis on my birthday. Presents galore!

As for eloquence...Yea. I don't think I;m a very eloquent speaker. Like I said before, people have commented on how I "know what I'm talking about", but I suspect that's its because I speak more with
conviction than anything else.
Some more differences between INFP and INFJ:

INFJ:
Perceive events in a continuous sequence – continuous changes rather than discrete states.
More inclined to say how stage A leads to stage B, and how stage B leads to stage C.
Describe events in a specific and concrete manner.
More inclined to talk of movements and interactions of reality.
The stories of dynamics usually involve multiple main characters.
Strategist type - tactical:
- Focus on methods, and manipulate them, with goals unsettled.
- Goals are defined by, and modified to fit methods.
- Prefers to expand options. Doesn't like to have too few of them.
Communication type - asking:
- likes to establish a dialogue
- much of what an askers says seems more question-like, even statements
- always, as the other person talks, affirm the receipt of information with yeah, mhm, etc.
- talk to an audience as a whole very well
- starts talking at times expecting someone to get interested and start paying attention
- has a tendency to interrupt and feels comfortable pausing half way on the speech and with "questions allowed all the time" way, returning to what was said later if necessary
- quite often asks a non-rhetorical question and answers it himself
- often just asks questions to fill in time, without serious need to actually find the information asked
Task accomplishing - Result:
- Do things randomly, seemingly doing them from the end to the beginning.
- Detached from processes and tends to multitasking.
- Focus on the beggining and the end of processes.
- More inclined to read texts on books or computer randomly, maybe reading random paragraphs or chapters.
Natural state - Decisive:
Natural state is readiness.
Work best if they are able to tart mobilizing in preparation for what they must do.
Easily go from 'relaxed' to 'mobilized', but not from 'mobilized' to 'relaxed'. Thus, they may need external stimuli (like a movie) to relax.
Tend to perform an entire task at once, and to maintain their internal 'readiness' between tasks.
Become of aware of their own mobilization at its maximals – i.e., when it is time for action. However, they are often poorly aware of when the mobilization firsts manifests – i.e., when they first start considering an action.
Focuses and places the most importance on taking action – preparation is considered implicit and given less attention.
Consider the possible results and rewards of their work (e.g., how much they are paid) more important than the working conditions (e.g., comfort, freedom, and convenience).
This attitude is strengthened by extroversion.
More aware of when they are relaxed than when they are mobilized.
“I will not get stuck in the process of consideration – it always ends in a decision being made.”
Emotivist:
- Tend to concentrate foremost on the emotional background of interaction, with 'business' a secondary concern.
- Prefer the new and novel over the old and known.
- Information perceived as unprofessional or low-quality can leave them indifferent.
- Have greater difficulty disassociating from requests for action or consideration than from others' emotions and experiences.
- “If a conversation is emotionally negative, I consider it wasted.”

INFP:
Perceive events in an episodic manner – discrete states rather than continuous changes.
More inclined to say how stages A, B and C are.
Describe events in a general manner and by comparing them to other similar events.
More inclined to talk of properties and structures of reality.
The stories of statics usually involve one constant main character.
Strategist type - strategic:
- Focus on goals, and manipulate them, with methods unsettled.
- Methods are defined by, and modified to fit goals.
- Prefers to defend goals. Doesn't like to be forced to deviate from them.
Communication type - declaring:
- tendency to monologue
- much of what a declarer says seems more statement-like, even questions
- listens attentively and silently to others' speeches to return to a long speech
- finds it easier to talk to one person at a time
- before starting to talk, first ascertains that attention is grabbed
- is very patient in terms of others speeches in terms of letting finish
- prefers to finish the speech before letting others talk, likes closure and that their point was conveyed
- questions are often either rhetorical or only strictly motivated by serious need for certain information
Task accomplishing - Process:
- Do things sequentially, from the beginning to the end.
- Immersed to a process and tends to single-tasking.
- Focus between the beggining and the end of processes.
- More inclined to read texts on books or computer from beggining to the end.
Natural state - Judicious:
Natural state is relaxed.
Work best when they can relax beforehand, and are mobilized only for the duration necessary.
Have an easy time going from 'mobilized' to 'relaxed', but not from 'relaxed' to 'mobilized'. Thus, they may need external stimuli to become mobilized.
Tend to divide up matters into smaller stages during which they are mobilized, relaxing between each stage.
Become aware of their own mobilization as soon as it manifests – i.e., as soon as they start considering an action. However, they are often poorly aware of the periods of maximal mobilization – i.e., the time of action.
Focuses and places the most importance on the preparatory stage – the 'action' stages are considered implicit and given less attention.
Consider their working conditions (e.g., comfort, freedom, and convenience) more important than the possible results and rewards (e.g., how much they are paid).
This attitude is strengthened by introversion.
More aware of when they are mobilized than when they are relaxed.“Consideration is very nice, that time during which you still don't have to make a decision. It's even better when it isn't necessary to do anything afterwards.”
Constructivist:
- Tend to minimize the emotional elements of interaction, preferring to focus on the 'business' elements.
- Have emotional 'anchors' (eg, books, films, places) which they use to support their internal emotional state.

- Can become 'emotionally hooked', and can have a strong reaction to a particular part or section regardless of their feelings towards the entirety.
- Have greater difficulty disassociating from others' emotions and experiences than from requests for action or consideration.
- “I prefer when people offer concrete solutions instead of comfort or sympathy.”

Hope this helps :)
Thanks, it helped a lot. The bolded ones pertain to me. The others I either don't understand, or I don't relate to.

I realize I didn't link to this thread yesterday, though you might have seen it already, there are some things in there on Ne. http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/31949-question-about-ne-3.html#post722236

My thinking behind asking for comments or thoughts on all of the functions was partly to see how you understand them and partly how you relate to them.

There are a few tests around online for cognitive functions, but I understand that they are not considered very reliable. If you want to have a look anyway here's one: Keys 2 Cognition - Cognitive Processes

All that said, my feeling so far is that your an INFP. Especially this

is a strong indicator for me that you are not any kind of IxFJ.
Yea, I read up on that thread yesterday.
I took that cognitive functions test, but I didn't find it very reliable. I came up as an INFJ though.
So IXFP's are more self-centered? :crazy: I guess that could make sense, in a way, having Fi and all.
Maybe the reason I thought I was a J was because I felt...rigid, I guess, on the inside. Yet when I ask others how they percieve me, they see me as laid-back and mellow. :mellow:
 

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Yea, I read up on that thread yesterday.
I took that cognitive functions test, but I didn't find it very reliable. I came up as an INFJ though.
So IXFP's are more self-centered? :crazy: I guess that could make sense, in a way, having Fi and all.
Maybe the reason I thought I was a J was because I felt...rigid, I guess, on the inside. Yet when I ask others how they percieve me, they see me as laid-back and mellow. :mellow:
Well your Fi might be more self-centered than our Fe, but I'll bet our Ni is more selfcentered than your Ne. :laughing:
Ok seriously, no it's not being more or less self-centered; it's just different ways of being self-centered...

To mistakenly type oneself as a J because of the need for structure seems to be common for INFPs (and possibly all Ixxx types, but I don't have personal experience on that). Since the J or P doesn't refer to your dominant (Fi), but your extraverted function (Ne), your dominant is actually judging. Your primary extraverted function is P. And add that up, and it makes total sense why you see yourself as J-type, but others see you as P-type.
 

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It feels more self-centered because it is subjective. All of the introverted functions - Ni, Fi, Ti, Si - are subjective and only operate inside a person's mind not aligning with outside standards. All of the extraverted functions such as Te, Fe, Ne, Se are objective and are aimed at interacting with environment outside of person.

INFPs have subjective feeling and objective logic - judge yourself on some inner morals values, judge others critically on some competitive standard the group accepts
INFJs have objective feeling and subjective logic - judge yourself critically on some inner competitive basis, judge others based on set of morals that the group accepts
So INFPs can re-difine moral values and INFJs can re-define what is logical according to their own manner. This is the subjective or "selfish" side of these two personalities respectively.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
It feels more self-centered because it is subjective. All of the introverted functions - Ni, Fi, Ti, Si - are subjective and only operate inside a person's mind not aligning with outside standards. All of the extraverted functions such as Te, Fe, Ne, Se are objective and are aimed at interacting with environment outside of person.

INFPs have subjective feeling and objective logic - judge yourself on some inner morals values, judge others critically on some competitive standard the group accepts
INFJs have objective feeling and subjective logic - judge yourself critically on some inner competitive basis, judge others based on set of morals that the group accepts
So INFPs can re-difine moral values and INFJs can re-define what is logical according to their own manner. This is the subjective or "selfish" side of these two personalities respectively.
That's pretty interesting. Can you elaborate on the "judging others critically on a competitive standard" part?

Well your Fi might be more self-centered than our Fe, but I'll bet our Ni is more selfcentered than your Ne. :laughing:
Ok seriously, no it's not being more or less self-centered; it's just different ways of being self-centered...

To mistakenly type oneself as a J because of the need for structure seems to be common for INFPs (and possibly all Ixxx types, but I don't have personal experience on that). Since the J or P doesn't refer to your dominant (Fi), but your extraverted function (Ne), your dominant is actually judging. Your primary extraverted function is P. And add that up, and it makes total sense why you see yourself as J-type, but others see you as P-type.
LOL.

Anyway, I didn't have time before to post my short comments on the functions, so I'll do so now. :happy:

Ne: The word that pops up is possibilities. What are all the things that could happen?
Ni: Foreseeing the things that'll happen, like vel said, thinking about it in the background until a solution pops out at you.
Fi: The feeling of needing to be authentic and needing to be real with yourself.
Fe: Aligning yourself with the needs of others. Feeling unity with the group(?)
Ti:Looking at the framework of the system.
Te: All that comes up is the step by step logic.
*The T functions are rather ambiguous for me.
Se: Taking everything with your five senses; living in the moment
Si: The memory of your senses, the things you take in.< This is pretty fuzzy for me too.

Um, if that's not what you wanted, I apologize. :blushed:

All in all, like you, I'm inclined to feel that I'm more of an INFP.

But gosh, I cannot tell you how much this has been bothering me for the past year.
I always have MBTI in my head, being self-consciously aware of my actions to see if they align with the type I think I am. When I'm given some new info that contradicts something, I end up questioning myself. Sometimes I wished I never discovered it at all.
I understand that everyone is different and that you can't put yourself in a box, but dammit, it bothered me! Logic simply won't work for me. I would not be surprised if a few weeks from now, I'll question my type again. :bored:
Hopefully, I'll get past this phase soon. :proud:
 
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