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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm an INFP, NPIF in order of strongest to weakest letter (N is crazy strong, I've scored as high as 88% N and barely have any F dominance, it edges over T by a single digit each time I test). My girlfriend is an INFJ, IFJN respectively. She's very introverted, usually only has one friend at a time and usually doesn't see them often. She sees me as her best friend (as well as being the love of her life).

We've had a few problems in the past. When we first met sparks were flying, it was love at first sight, all that kinda thing. I really did fall in love with her almost immediately.

Anyway we broke up about a week or so into dating and she said it was because she found a guy who was a 'more logical choice'. I reacted very calmly, said okay, I'm glad to have known you and let her go gracefully. Inside I was seething but I didn't want to let her know. She kept in contact with me and while I tried to just get away from it all for a while, a very coincidental blizzard kept me at home and she ended up calling and talking to me. We got back together in one of those conversations, which is what I was secretly hoping for even though something told me it was 'wrong'. She told the guy and he reacted by losing his mind a little bit. He had known her longer than me and had been, I guess a 'friendzoned' guy friend of hers for a while. He saw me as some kind of interloper stealing away all the emotional bonding he had worked hard to develop with her and was threatening that he would kill me (not to my face, to her) and just in general having raging temper tantrums. She kept him around as a friend. I told her if we were going to date she needed to stop talking to him but she refused to do this, insisting he was a really good friend. I began to feel for the guy, never daring to tell him so because that would not go over well coming from me in my position. I started to see her as very stuck on herself; she has body dysmorphia and is very very self conscious so I began to think she liked this extra attention and it made her feel sexier.

That leads into another problem. I've had a long standing addictive relationship with internet porn. Now I've dated women in the past who just don't see this as a problem at all. They don't show even a hint of jealousy. Not this INFJ though. The very idea of it made her rage and she would constantly threaten to break up with me if I didn't stop altogether. She said she wanted me to be completely sexually devoted to her and would not tolerate anything less. I said alright, I'll stop if it bothers you so much but found out I really couldn't just stop so easily.

One thing that I tried to get her to understand is that I don't see it as right for her to just demand that level of devotion when she hasn't earned my trust yet (for good reason too!) but she refused to accept that. I can't force myself to be devoted 100% to someone if I'm not ready to yet. It just isn't genuine and I can be in love with someone yet still not fully trust them. Maybe it's a Perceiver thing to see the world this way but I don't think J people have an easy time understanding this way of thinking.

Now I'm not one to keep secrets from partners. It's just not in my nature and I tell them everything. Even the stuff that would really count against me. I would tell her each time I fell off the proverbial wagon and she would have a fit. Eventually after about 8 months of dating I went back to browsing some porn, told her about it and she just broke up with me. She said maybe we can make it work later but she needed space. Next thing I know I find out she's actually been flirting with and seeing this guy on the side and now she's dating him. I was enraged and stopped talking to her altogether.

Honestly I was just waiting for her to one day say "okay, I understand" and to not take it so damn personally for once; her insistence on total devotion just felt forced and domineering. She even showed me chastity devices once playing at it being just something she was casually interested in but that really showcased her sexual pathology and made me pretty damn uncomfortable.

Anyway she started using opiates briefly and started messaging me complaining about how 'materialistic' the new guy she is dating is. He's very rich and successful and apparently this just didn't jive with her personality. My sister heard about this particular bit and told me she's really just trying to rub her success in my face.

Whether she was or wasn't, she ended up breaking up with him saying it's not right, she didn't really love him and that she wanted us to work out our problems. Now this seemed like bullshit to me. One of the things she told me when 'complaining' to me was that she fell in love with this guy right away; presumably saying so because she knew that's what happened between us and wanted to hurt me even further.

I took her back anyway. She keeps asking me constantly if I'm "totally devoted to her" like she's really really worried about it. I tell her I love her all the time but I'm starting to wonder if I really do or if I'm just fucking brainwashed and spineless. If she leaves me once more, it's 3 strikes you're fuckin outta here. Sometimes I find myself wishing she just would so I don't have to deal with the anxiety over the possibility. I get so paranoid about her whereabouts sometimes it drives me up the wall.

Oh I am also not completely innocent. After she left me and I found out about the guy (she was not forthcoming at all) I sent her some borderline psychopathic messages expressing just how pissed off I was. Well, not borderline, just outright psychopathic. I won't go into detail but she said she was contemplating a restraining order because the new guy was urging her to (apparently she looked constantly frightened and on edge; this is her account of it). Also during this time her birthday passed and I didn't give her so much as a happy birthday, which she got extremely upset about.

INFJs, what is this INFJ doing?

Edit; I think this was posted in the wrong forum? Sex and relationships maybe would've been the better one?
 

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Well I am sure your perception embellishes this alot but.....

Man, I know you are infp and all, but that doesn't give you the right to disrespect yourself. If she isn't satisfying you sexually, you have every right to porn, if that's what you need. However if you are addicted you may want to figure that out, but not because she demands it.

She's most likely on and off with you because you never stand up to her about anything. But your existence strokes her ego. So consciously she will enjoy the ego strokes, and probably the N part of you, but unconsciously you are so whipped that her inner woman wants someone she deems as "strong", whatever that means. It's the whole evolution thing. She's probably doing these things/getting these urges right around her period, when the hormones kick in highest. Research consistently shows a shift in what any woman, not just she, finds attractive, at period time.

I say take the reigns and tell her flat out you'll date her casually while also seeing other people. Maybe not "your style", but some introspection might open you to it. Hell, she was doing it without even saying, at least you'd be upfront. And if she says no? W-A-L-K. Make her come to you.
 

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I think it sounds like she's being unreasonable.

Demanding that you give up porn? Chastity devices? Those things are fine for people who want to live that way, but to force it on someone as a means of demanding loyalty? I mean... what?

Sounds poisonous, bro. I don't like to rain on parades or anything. But when you find yourself thinking, "If this happens one more time then I'm done!" then you're probably already done. That's my opinion, anyway.

I can't pretend I don't understand what she's doing, though I think it's wrong. Fi and Fe are way different and it's pretty normal for an INFJ to be focused on sharing ideals with their partner. It can be stressful for the Fe-aux when they don't feel like they're "on the same page" about these issues. She's upset because she has a difficult time understanding how something that bothers her so much could be fine with you. She wants to see that she's so important to you, you'd do anything for her. I get it, I've felt that way. Feeling that way is not justification for demanding that you change. It seems to me that she might be a bit immature and caught up in the idea of a perfect romance, perfect boyfriend, and can't handle the fact that you're a real person who isn't going to meet her every expectation.

I'd re-evaluate the whole relationship. If you really want to be with her, you're going to have to tell her that she's being unfair to make you change, and that her unrealistic standards for your behavior are harmful to the relationship. If she doesn't care, then I don't know why you would.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Well I am sure your perception embellishes this alot but.....

Man, I know you are infp and all, but that doesn't give you the right to disrespect yourself. If she isn't satisfying you sexually, you have every right to porn, if that's what you need. However if you are addicted you may want to figure that out, but not because she demands it.

She's most likely on and off with you because you never stand up to her about anything. But your existence strokes her ego. So consciously she will enjoy the ego strokes, and probably the N part of you, but unconsciously you are so whipped that her inner woman wants someone she deems as "strong", whatever that means. It's the whole evolution thing. She's probably doing these things/getting these urges right around her period, when the hormones kick in highest. Research consistently shows a shift in what any woman, not just she, finds attractive, at period time.

I say take the reigns and tell her flat out you'll date her casually while also seeing other people. Maybe not "your style", but some introspection might open you to it. Hell, she was doing it without even saying, at least you'd be upfront. And if she says no? W-A-L-K. Make her come to you.
I know all this is likely true, you really get to the vital components when you talk about her seeing me as weak and whipped while desiring a "strong" man in her life. I do often feel emasculated by her and I worry that some more assertive man will come into her life and she will drop me for them. I can be assertive as well but it's usually in a negative shadowed ESTJ fashion where I start threatening people and lashing out which is, I know, the opposite of real and healthy assertiveness.

I should mention she's 7 years older than me, so that kind of plays a part too, I think she's worried I'll run off with a younger fresher woman at some point. Actually, I don't think that, I know it because she's told me she's worried that's exactly what I'll do. I promised her I wouldn't but the truth is it's a possibility.

I'm on and off with her too and I guess I feel that evens things out even though as far as she knows I'm always 'on' because I haven't told her otherwise. I think I need to just start doing that. My biggest fear is that she will leave me soon as she learns I am not always completely into her. This really frustrates the hell out of me because in my mind it's okay to date someone without wanting to be their total third eye blind to everything else soulmate for life and I would be a lot more comfortable being more devoted to her if she were okay with that but she treats everything like these graven ultimatums.

I also get extremely jealous and possessive of her too so I see it as me being very unfair sometimes.

Before she left me for someone else I was actually feeling bored and irritated with her and was hoping she would cheat on me or something so I could just forget about her and move on. She did and I didn't react at all like I expected myself to (expected to be relieved; was enraged and wanted her back suddenly) so I think I have some serious problems with my own emotions and ego.
 

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... I agree with the above posters but I have to ask... you arent bothered by the fact that she broke up with you simply because you watch porn? o_O Hell, were you at least watching so much you weren't spending enough time with her or.. preferred the porn OVER her?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I think it sounds like she's being unreasonable.

Demanding that you give up porn? Chastity devices? Those things are fine for people who want to live that way, but to force it on someone as a means of demanding loyalty? I mean... what?

Sounds poisonous, bro. I don't like to rain on parades or anything. But when you find yourself thinking, "If this happens one more time then I'm done!" then you're probably already done. That's my opinion, anyway.

I can't pretend I don't understand what she's doing, though I think it's wrong. Fi and Fe are way different and it's pretty normal for an INFJ to be focused on sharing ideals with their partner. It can be stressful for the Fe-aux when they don't feel like they're "on the same page" about these issues. She's upset because she has a difficult time understanding how something that bothers her so much could be fine with you. She wants to see that she's so important to you, you'd do anything for her. I get it, I've felt that way. Feeling that way is not justification for demanding that you change. It seems to me that she might be a bit immature and caught up in the idea of a perfect romance, perfect boyfriend, and can't handle the fact that you're a real person who isn't going to meet her every expectation.

I'd re-evaluate the whole relationship. If you really want to be with her, you're going to have to tell her that she's being unfair to make you change, and that her unrealistic standards for your behavior are harmful to the relationship. If she doesn't care, then I don't know why you would.
I think it does come down to me having to explain she's being unrealistic. The problem is I know she's probably going to just leave if I do and I am starting to really believe that if that's going to be the case we both shouldn't be together and are likely doing each other more harm than good. I really would like for this to work out because we connect so well in many ways. I love her and care about her but she just can't stop controlling and probably doesn't realize it's emasculating and turns into a vicious cycle of control > disempowerment > lost attraction > drifting away > control.
 

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I think it does come down to me having to explain she's being unrealistic. The problem is I know she's probably going to just leave if I do and I am starting to really believe that if that's going to be the case we both shouldn't be together and are likely doing each other more harm than good. I really would like for this to work out because we connect so well in many ways. I love her and care about her but she just can't stop controlling and probably doesn't realize it's emasculating and turns into a vicious cycle of control > disempowerment > lost attraction > drifting away > control.
It seems to me like you already know where this is headed.

Don't get me wrong, if you can find a way to work it out then I sincerely hope you do. But sometimes, a love connection isn't enough to keep a relationship going for the long haul. You need mutual respect, boundaries, trust, room to be an individual, etc, on top of all the lighter/happier things like love, lust and laughter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
... I agree with the above posters but I have to ask... you arent bothered by the fact that she broke up with you simply because you watch porn? o_O Hell, were you at least watching so much you weren't spending enough time with her or.. preferred the porn OVER her?
I am bothered by it but she claims she's always seen people who use porn as 'disgusting' and she's very very judgmental about it. She's a bit of a prude and without bragging I can say I've opened her up a LOT sexually, for example she was never able to have a proper orgasm. I still initiate about 90% of the time and she's extremely self conscious and can get downright frigid. She had an obsession with body modification and plastic surgery when I met her and she still does though it's a bit less crazy now.

As for me I'm pretty sexually open, was abused sexually as a kid and I guess I'm a little twisted as a result but I like to think I've done pretty well in overcoming that. The way she seems to just want to put me back in a box, I can understand that she is possessive and I am too but it seems like she can't tread any water in between seeing no sexuality anywhere but between her and I or seeing it everywhere and I become just another piece of meat which happens to be a pretty average cut all things considered. Maybe I'm being a hypocrite.
 

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I wouldn't date a guy who was addicted to watching porn either. It's funny how people nowadays don't even seem to find it sick anymore, in near future it may even be shown live before our very children in their classrooms.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I wouldn't date a guy who was addicted to watching porn either. It's funny how people nowadays don't even seem to find it sick anymore, in near future it may even be shown live before our very children in their classrooms.
I appreciate you sharing your perspective; could you elaborate on what about it makes you so uncomfortable? Why does it make me a sick person, in your mind?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Also this time around she doesn't seem to want to leave my side, is constantly saying "I love you" and just being extremely attentive. It's bothering me because I'm just waiting for her to go all cold again at the slightest hint that she's not the only person on the planet. This is making me think I am not good for her, which really breaks my heart. I don't think I could make her understand the way I see things though. That total devotion or else stuff just threatens me on a really visceral level.

I'll admit that lately I've been kind of liking it, just in the back of my mind a little voice keeps telling me "once you give her everything she's gonna tear your heart right out, wait and see". Porn is a way to still get my rocks off without having to risk emotional investment in what has really demonstrated itself to be a very, very unstable market.
 

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I should probably mention that INFJ, with inferior Se, will often manifest their atttraction to the inferior by unconscious attraction to:

1. Money/status
2. Unpredictability
3. Physical prowess
4. In the moment thinking

It seems like the two guys she dumped you for had all her unconscious buttons pressed.
 

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I think the girl is emotionally unstable and is developing a habit of occasionally projecting her insecurities onto you. Concerning my dislike for porn addicts, well, being a spiritual person who seeks ways to grow and transcend the exclusively primitive drives of human beings (I know this sounds funny :D), I simply don't the see use of indulging in sexual pleasure just for the sake of it, to the point of your mind becoming a slave of these drives. If you imagine the chakras, or energy centers humans supposedly have, survivalist and reproductive drives would be at the very bottom, while striving for enlightenment is at the very top. It's like seeking a partner on the same energetic level as you... Being with someone who drags you down is simply unproductive and frustrating in the long run.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
It seems like the two guys she dumped you for had all her unconscious buttons pressed.
You're only assuming that because the second one was like that. The first one was a 27 year old neurotic mama's boy who came across as pedantic, overly logical and incredibly submissive. He thought I was this big alpha dog. Hilarious.

The second one is more that type yes, but according to her he displayed very little emotion whereas me, well I wear my heart on my sleeve on the rainiest of days. She tells me she got really sick of his mentality too; very into his favorite brands, expressed himself very much like an elitist with a lot of disdain for less than well off people, that kinda guy. She's not like that. Maybe she thought she was but she's the type of girl who would rather eat broken glass than wear a dress and go to a fancy dinner.
 

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You guys both sound emotionally unstable. I'm not usually so judgey on these boards (at least, I hope not), but yeesh. Google BPD. You're in a Cluster B personality dance.

Yeah, that's super harsh and I obviously don't know your situation, but I've LIVED the Cluster B personality dance many times, and what you described sounds pretty consistent.

Take a long dating break and figure yourself out. This is all whacked.
 
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I think the girl is emotionally unstable and is developing a habit of occasionally projecting her insecurities onto you. Concerning my dislike for porn addicts, well, being a spiritual person who seeks ways to grow and transcend the exclusively primitive drives of human beings (I know this sounds funny :D), I simply don't the see use of indulging in sexual pleasure just for the sake of it, to the point of your mind becoming a slave of these drives. If you imagine the chakras, or energy centers humans supposedly have, survivalist and reproductive drives would be at the very bottom, while striving for enlightenment is at the very top. It's like seeking a partner on the same energetic level as you... Being with someone who drags you down is simply unproductive and frustrating in the long run.
While I also like the system of chakras I resent the implication that porn use is of a 'lower level' than aversion to the physical realm. I would see life as absolutely purposeless if pleasure were not a component of it and I think Eastern mysticism is deliberately sensually deadening. I prefer philosophies that embrace the lower realms as places of divine enjoyment and creation, not entangling prisons to be escaped. They can certainly become as such though and an addiction is an addiction. It's disempowering and ultimately that's the point of why it's bad; it weakens your ability to do what you will yourself to. That's my 2c.

I'm also actually a big survivalist and this is an interesting distinction because she's expressed appreciation of this aspect in me and sees me as a really grounding anchor unafraid to put my feet on the ground. I personally think I'm nowhere near as grounded as she sees me but I am really in touch with what you'd call the lower chakras. She's said things like, if an apocalypse happened she'd rather just let herself be killed rather than live in a world like that whereas I'd try to survive severe radiation poisoning before even contemplating suicide.

Inferior Se confers a conscious aversion to hedonism (while often an unconscious attraction to it).

Think about you and inferior Te and how it affects you.....
That applies to her quite accurately. What are you implying inferior Te is doing? I don't follow.

You guys both sound emotionally unstable. I'm not usually so judgey on these boards (at least, I hope not), but yeesh. Google BPD. You're in a Cluster B personality dance.

Yeah, that's super harsh and I obviously don't know your situation, but I've LIVED the Cluster B personality dance many times, and what you described sounds pretty consistent.

Take a long dating break and figure yourself out. This is all whacked.
No I think you're probably right, I'm not at all offended.
 
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