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Discussion Starter #1
Wondered what it would look like if I compared IQ (left to right) with income (top to bottom) and noticed an interesting trend.
The less likely to be a genius each type is, the bigger part of the population they are, and the better off they tend to be financially.
The exceptions to this are INTJ and ENTJ, who earn significantly more than other intuitives, & ISTP and ISFP, who earn less than other sensors.



873174


Sources:
Population- https://www.careerplanner.com/Images/social/TypeInPopulation-500w.png
IQ- https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d8/23/8f/d8238f80efb26bd63de755553452bb1b.jpg
Gender- https://www.slayerment.com/files/slayerment/styles/large/public/images/manlytypes[1].jpg?itok=E9Bg0Dwy
Income-
https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/assets-stg7-v2.tech.co/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/myers-briggs-average-income.jpg
 

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I'm most impressed by how you managed to get Disney Pixar style faces of so many known people.

Also, sort of sad to see INTPs right at the bottom there, but only because society judges people by earnings alone.
 
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I’d be very interested in knowing where certain personality types fall based on different types of intelligence (i.e. spatial, intrapersonal, musical, kinesthetic, etc.). I know it’s easy to have correlative data on IQ because it is an easily accessible and easily measured, but it does “short” other personality types who may be highly intelligent in other capacities.
 

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iNtp sp/sx x84
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Also, sort of sad to see INTPs right at the bottom there, but only because society judges people by earnings alone.
like many istp, I find intp are comfortable with slumming it ... retreating from society.

the istp method often involves the development of trade skills and more likely to move to a smaller community. . . which may account for their lower earning potential

. . . whereas the intp prefers the conveniences offered by larger communities.

both have a tendency to remain stationary. I would suspect their income potential would improve with a nomadic lifestyle and focusing on short term contracts. . . but require the development of financial planning and kowtowing to some social necessities they find superficial.

another main fault is that intp generally have the problem of romancing education and career paths while discarding high earning jobs based on social anxieties, tendency for poor self esteem and assumptions about said field. they have a greater tendency to underestimate their potential and abilities while turning down pragmatic career paths to supplement their interests, lifestyles or ideological goals.

also not likely to find much personal motivation, unmoved by personal crisis, without a taskmaster, they require firm guidance. . . particularly in young adulthood. if not earlier. earlier life requires more developing the necessary habits.. they have a tendency to peak in their teenage years, plateau in early adulthood and gradually decline.

the practical solution.. stop pushing tech paths and redirect them to the allied health fields.
 

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@Rift There's also the fact that 'strong' career paths require an amount of social schmoozing and/or confidence to get anywhere. INTPs have zero care for excelling in those areas.

Also the fact that we aren't particularly obsessed with money or power.

That being said, one area that INTPs are suited to is programming. It's one of the very few careers that you must have the skills; being a social butterfly will get you nowhere. And, best of all, it pays quite well, so it's a good route for INTPs to elevate their position on the chart above.
 

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I think Elon Musk might be an INTP. I don't know why people are so set on the stereotype of hardworking TJs and laid back TPs.

Below is quoted from a Quora answer, which I believe would explain how he is more likely to be an INTP than INTJ:

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  • “You can ask Elon to do a lot of things on his computer but don’t ask him to catch a bus.” -Toska Musk
  • “well I do have an issue with punctuality” -Elon Musk on not meeting deadlines
  • “I say the stupidest things … My issue is that I don’t have a filter” - Elon Musk
  • “I thought of these three things sort of in the abstract. Not with the expectation that I would have careers in those arenas.” - Elon Musk (referencing his start ups)
  • “Well um…I don’t really mind if I lose my money. I’m not trying to figure out how to make money…I just thought it was important that humanity expand beyond earth.” - Elon Musk
  • “When he was very small, he would ask me ‘where is the whole world?’ when he was three or four. It was these sorts of questions that made me realize that he was a little different.” - Errol Musk
  • “Musk's great escape to Canada was not well thought out. He knew of a great-uncle in Montreal, hopped on a flight and hoped for the best.” - Esquire
  • “As far as Elon is concerned, I worry, what now? What is there? I start to worry of boredom. I get worried that he is getting bored of sending stuff to NASA every week or two weeks. I mean this is becoming passé… He is one of those people, and certainly was as a boy, if he suddenly decides it’s not interesting anymore he just kind of drops it. ” - Errol Musk
Elon Musk is an INTP. “where is the world?” at 4 years old?!?!? That’s extraverted intution (INTP), not introverted intuition (INTJ). You can look for things that make him INTJ and you will find them because he is a thinker and an intuiter. He is also older, mature, and disciplined. It’s best to look for things that make him NOT-INTJ. His life is littered with NON-INTJ behavior and I haven’t found anything that makes him NON-INTP. Especially when you consider his youth when his other functions would have been less developed.

This idea that INTP’s don’t execute or plan is silly. I have the next 2 months of work planned out (I’m a start up co-founder). I manage people and my work life is centered around goals and execution. It’s called being disciplined and developed. Sometimes I give public talks and presentations and everyone thinks Im an extrovert. Again, it’s about development.

If you read about Musk’s youth and personal life, he’s a total INTP. If you watch him closely during post-talk question sessions, he trails off into dreamland like the dreamy professor stereotype. If you read about what other people have to say about him, they often comment on how he gets lost in thought props in the middle of hallways or in random places. He sat down with Ashlee Vance for an interview and started the dinner on a low-carb diet and ended the dinner with piles of ice cream and syrup.

He’s not an INTJ. He’s an INTP who has found his passion and is now executing on it relentlessly, just like all INTPs do.

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In other words, INTP should be on the higher on the income graph. Don't forget about Bill Gates who might be an ENTP, too.
 

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@Rift That being said, one area that INTPs are suited to is programming. It's one of the very few careers that you must have the skills; being a social butterfly will get you nowhere. And, best of all, it pays quite well, so it's a good route for INTPs to elevate their position on the chart above.
but it could be applied to numerous other fields... where intp shortcomings may be overlooked for their overall ability.

They could work as independent contractors or go into business for themselves but overall, many have trouble with this.. and some of their traits aren't suited longterm in the corporate tech industries. so, I suggest it's something that becomes more of a hobby, a part-time gig.

I recommend allied health fields, largely because demand supersedes character flaws. . . they can start with less education and investment in said education, higher potential to have it fully covered, mostly covered or be able to pay back it quickly.

advancement is largely based on how far one goes with their education in the fields, while pay can be moderated by additional skills.. many of our key interest areas which are sorely lacking in the field. Also, options for higher pay based on demand in smaller ... even isolated ... communities.

there's also lifestyle and quality of life. the potential for significantly less hours per week, well, annually, while maintaining a high level of pay.

there are also several more slacker positions availables, such as those that simply require someone with licensing on the grounds to dial for emergency services when necessary.

they have greater amount of options for only working a few months a year vs remotely working vacations

the equivalents in programming requires greater time investment, social skills, upselling and marketing. Some of which can be mitigated based on geographical location, i.e. overall living expenses.

also for the win, the health field may provide them with more personal growth to those areas they are weak in but doesn't significantly make those demands or at least there is enough diversity to seek out other employment in the field... improving their overall quality of life. Or I suppose, we could look back the previous year of shutdowns, if you like.
 

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but it could be applied to numerous other fields... where intp shortcomings may be overlooked for their overall ability.

They could work as independent contractors or go into business for themselves but overall, many have trouble with this.. and some of their traits aren't suited longterm in the corporate tech industries. so, I suggest it's something that becomes more of a hobby, a part-time gig.

I recommend allied health fields, largely because demand supersedes character flaws. . . they can start with less education and investment in said education, higher potential to have it fully covered, mostly covered or be able to pay back it quickly.

advancement is largely based on how far one goes with their education in the fields, while pay can be moderated by additional skills.. many of our key interest areas which are sorely lacking in the field. Also, options for higher pay based on demand in smaller ... even isolated ... communities.

there's also lifestyle and quality of life. the potential for significantly less hours per week, well, annually, while maintaining a high level of pay.

there are also several more slacker positions availables, such as those that simply require someone with licensing on the grounds to dial for emergency services when necessary.

they have greater amount of options for only working a few months a year vs remotely working vacations

the equivalents in programming requires greater time investment, social skills, upselling and marketing. Some of which can be mitigated based on geographical location, i.e. overall living expenses.

also for the win, the health field may provide them with more personal growth to those areas they are weak in but doesn't significantly make those demands or at least there is enough diversity to seek out other employment in the field... improving their overall quality of life. Or I suppose, we could look back the previous year of shutdowns, if you like.
I should probably add that I am a programmer, so I'm biased haha.

All it took was a bit of curious learning, which I enjoyed greatly, so it wasn't much of an expense in any way. I didn't require any extra social skills or schmoozing, and now recruiters are falling over themselves to put me in jobs, even though I'm not looking for a new job, and during the economic downturn caused by covid. From a selfish point of view, it's quite fantastic!

Healthcare is probably a good area too, I mean if you're a doctor/surgeon/whatever then your skills are wanted, simple as that.
 

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Healthcare is probably a good area too, I mean if you're a doctor/surgeon/whatever then your skills are wanted, simple as that.
I'm a little biased, too.

nursing would be more practical than becoming a physician or surgeon... particularly if the end goal is to become a practitioner.

for the intp, psychiatric nurse practitioners would likely make the most sense. less amount of years to move into field vs doctors, but high demand, high salary - not as high as docs/surgeons of course but in some locations it can reach the mid six figure (usd) range, able to work independently, options to deal one on one with clients, and in many locations, have prescription power - the primary bit of why NPs earn so much. it's also more practical for those considering becoming therapists.

the other popular area would be anesthesiology.

those with the least amount of education requirements that would likely suited to intp diagnostic medical sonographers, lab techs and lower level nurses. slightly above the median wage but there are potentials for higher earning power, especially for nurses that have more flexiblity. while the other two largely depends on the nature of their employer.
 

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A lot of INFP and INTP have high IQ but they make little money :\

Also, it would have been less confusing to put high IQ on the right and low IQ on the left. :\

I think Elon Musk might be an INTP. I don't know why people are so set on the stereotype of hardworking TJs and laid back TPs.

Below is quoted from a Quora answer, which I believe would explain how he is more likely to be an INTP than INTJ:

----------
  • “You can ask Elon to do a lot of things on his computer but don’t ask him to catch a bus.” -Toska Musk
  • “well I do have an issue with punctuality” -Elon Musk on not meeting deadlines
  • “I say the stupidest things … My issue is that I don’t have a filter” - Elon Musk
  • “I thought of these three things sort of in the abstract. Not with the expectation that I would have careers in those arenas.” - Elon Musk (referencing his start ups)
  • “Well um…I don’t really mind if I lose my money. I’m not trying to figure out how to make money…I just thought it was important that humanity expand beyond earth.” - Elon Musk
  • “When he was very small, he would ask me ‘where is the whole world?’ when he was three or four. It was these sorts of questions that made me realize that he was a little different.” - Errol Musk
  • “Musk's great escape to Canada was not well thought out. He knew of a great-uncle in Montreal, hopped on a flight and hoped for the best.” - Esquire
  • “As far as Elon is concerned, I worry, what now? What is there? I start to worry of boredom. I get worried that he is getting bored of sending stuff to NASA every week or two weeks. I mean this is becoming passé… He is one of those people, and certainly was as a boy, if he suddenly decides it’s not interesting anymore he just kind of drops it. ” - Errol Musk
Elon Musk is an INTP. “where is the world?” at 4 years old?!?!? That’s extraverted intution (INTP), not introverted intuition (INTJ). You can look for things that make him INTJ and you will find them because he is a thinker and an intuiter. He is also older, mature, and disciplined. It’s best to look for things that make him NOT-INTJ. His life is littered with NON-INTJ behavior and I haven’t found anything that makes him NON-INTP. Especially when you consider his youth when his other functions would have been less developed.

This idea that INTP’s don’t execute or plan is silly. I have the next 2 months of work planned out (I’m a start up co-founder). I manage people and my work life is centered around goals and execution. It’s called being disciplined and developed. Sometimes I give public talks and presentations and everyone thinks Im an extrovert. Again, it’s about development.

If you read about Musk’s youth and personal life, he’s a total INTP. If you watch him closely during post-talk question sessions, he trails off into dreamland like the dreamy professor stereotype. If you read about what other people have to say about him, they often comment on how he gets lost in thought props in the middle of hallways or in random places. He sat down with Ashlee Vance for an interview and started the dinner on a low-carb diet and ended the dinner with piles of ice cream and syrup.

He’s not an INTJ. He’s an INTP who has found his passion and is now executing on it relentlessly, just like all INTPs do.

----------

In other words, INTP should be on the higher on the income graph. Don't forget about Bill Gates who might be an ENTP, too.
I thought Musk was ENTP. Maybe my analysis is a bit too stereotypical but he's the epitome of a visionary.
 

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No financial knowledge , Entj , Intj and Estj are the most prone to have that.
 

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No financial knowledge , Entj , Intj and Estj are the most prone to have that.
From my experience accountant can be any personality type. If you say financial knowledge is required to work in accounting any type can be knowledgeable in the field.

From experience INTP in accounting tend to work in consolidation (putting financial statement of many companies together) or fiscality (tax laws) though.
 

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From my experience accountant can be any personality type. If you say financial knowledge is required to work in accounting any type can be knowledgeable in the field.

From experience INTP tend to work in consolidation (putting financial statement of many companies together) or fiscality (tax laws) though.
Of course, any personality can be anything, but the "rich" mindset has this workaholic attitude and they know how to create more money by investing.

I mean ... If we use an Entj as an example, even if they were poor they have a great probability of growing economically because they have a natural strength against laziness.

Knowing how to use money makes you invest and intelligence helps you analyze risks.
 

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Of course, any personality can be anything, but the "rich" mindset has this workaholic attitude and they know how to create more money by investing.

I mean ... If we use an Entj as an example, even if they were poor they have a great probability of growing economically because they have a natural strength against laziness.

Knowing how to use money makes you invest and intelligence helps you analyze risks.
Yes well, there's a difference between making a good salary and becoming rich. Only a fraction of people become rich. This the american dream, everyone can "potentially" become rich, most people want to but very few people succeed. That's why most people want low taxes for the rich and everything they think it will help them get rich and they are like don't tax the rich even if there's 0.0001% probability of me becoming super rich happen, I don't want to pay taxes then. These people live in a world of very unlikely potential probabilities.

Most certain way of becoming rich is to become an entrepreneur, create a company in field were margins are high (like IT/tech) or with good intellectual property (biotech/engineering). I think that's why a lot of very successful company value wise by are created by NTs, cause they require creativity+logic and also technology+research to have ground breaking products.

On the other hand making a good salary depends a bit more on the kind of studies you did and your ambition. Most people can make a good salary. Of course it always depends on what you consider good.
 

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Rather than an assessment of gifted adolescents, I'd like to see this reevaluated by assessing gifted students from Harvard, Princeton, Stanford and MIT.
 

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I got fired from my last job because I was insubordinate and didn't keep regular schedules. Technically, "laid off" but them's just words. I also have a history of working for less than standard pay at "startups" because I can't stand the idea of corporate bureaucracy, and also I'm insecure about my capabilities. I think I can do anything except 1. walk around in a pantsuit and take myself seriously and 2. play the "game."

I could make more money if:
  • I wasn't worried about my social skills
  • I was willing to exaggerate my capabilities
  • I sacrificed my time to work long hours
  • I could pretend to like people
  • I didn't hate working (for other people)

But you know what, I decided everything is my fault. If I wanted to make more money I should put in the effort.

I don't know enough about Elon Musk to type him but he looks like every stereotypical INTJ tech bro ever, black t-shirt and all.
 

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Yes well, there's a difference between making a good salary and becoming rich. Only a fraction of people become rich. This the american dream, everyone can "potentially" become rich, most people want to but very few people succeed. That's why most people want low taxes for the rich and everything they think it will help them get rich and they are like don't tax the rich even if there's 0.0001% probability of me becoming super rich happen, I don't want to pay taxes then. These people live in a world of very unlikely potential probabilities.

Most certain way of becoming rich is to become an entrepreneur, create a company in field were margins are high (like IT/tech) or with good intellectual property (biotech/engineering). I think that's why a lot of very successful company value wise by are created by NTs, cause they require creativity+logic and also technology+research to have ground breaking products.

On the other hand making a good salary depends a bit more on the kind of studies you did and your ambition. Most people can make a good salary. Of course it always depends on what you consider good.
Of course , i want to use the "Financial freedom" concept , Intp's loves this .
You don't need to be Rich to reach that level , you need constant hard work and smart investments .
Being your own Boss sounds nice , right ? , everyone can do it even if you own a small business.

Living just for a salary is just the "Poor mentality" , The "Rich mentality" use their salaries to invest and grow .

Rather than an assessment of gifted adolescents, I'd like to see this reevaluated by assessing gifted students from Harvard, Princeton, Stanford and MIT.
You can learn more about how to use money from a small kiosk that has been running for 5 years than from a Harvard professor.
Universities only teach you the "Poor mentality" ( Living by paycheck , even if extremely high ) even careers as business Administration only teach you how to use other persons assets .


So yeah , You can even have the "Poor mentality" when you are politician , without that high salary ( and the state )they probabily couldn't compete against a hot dog seller.
 

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I got fired from my last job because I was insubordinate and didn't keep regular schedules. Technically, "laid off" but them's just words. I also have a history of working for less than standard pay at "startups" because I can't stand the idea of corporate bureaucracy, and also I'm insecure about my capabilities. I think I can do anything except 1. walk around in a pantsuit and take myself seriously and 2. play the "game."

I could make more money if:
  • I wasn't worried about my social skills
  • I was willing to exaggerate my capabilities
  • I sacrificed my time to work long hours
  • I could pretend to like people
  • I didn't hate working (for other people)

But you know what, I decided everything is my fault. If I wanted to make more money I should put in the effort.

I don't know enough about Elon Musk to type him but he looks like every stereotypical INTJ tech bro ever, black t-shirt and all.
Funny enough, you have to be a good employee to be a good boss (generalizing of course), I think we should always think about being independent and playing the game is only one step.

The theory of money changes anyone who knows it.
 
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