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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone,

I believe that every action we do has consequences. And also that you can't have everything in life.
For example, when people in their 20s just want to have fun, especially in terms of partying and having sex with many different partners. "It's good to just have fun". On the other hand, I'm sure many of these people also want to eventually find a faithful partner for life and start a family.


I don't know why, but for me it's a bit of an either-or situation. Somehow I don't think you should be able to just party wildly and have sex without consequences. After all, if you assume that there will be no consequences to that behavior, then why hold back at all?

I think I find such behavior unnatural. Because without contraceptives there were consequences (children, danger of pregnancy, STDs, etc.). And just because today's society has the means to eliminate these consequences, surely one should not act this way?

I would appreciate it if someone could convince me of the opposite. Or simply strengthen me in my opinion.


I hope you understand what I mean and thank you for your answer :)
 

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INFJ 4w3
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I certainly have never found that right, personally, and there are numerous videos out there that tell you why INFJs, in particular, don't get into casual relationships or one night stands. We actually need to love someone before we can have sex with them; and there's only a one letter difference in our types, INFJ and ISFJ.

We look for a partner to uphold a relationship with, and allow our children the advantages of two loving parents... the time spent having many casual relationships is the time one could spend looking for the right partner, nor is this behaviour good once you're in a loving relationship; you certainly wouldn't want to keep the 'college parties' and fooling around up. Yeah, there's good reason why it doesn't feel right to some, or even most people.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I certainly have never found that right, personally, and there are numerous videos out there that tell you why INFJs, in particular, don't get into casual relationships or one night stands. We actually need to love someone before we can have sex with them; and there's only a one letter difference in our types, INFJ and ISFJ.

We look for a partner to uphold a relationship with, and allow our children the advantages of two loving parents... the time spent having many casual relationships is the time one could spend looking for the right partner, nor is this behaviour good once you're in a loving relationship; you certainly wouldn't want to keep the 'college parties' and fooling around up. Yeah, there's good reason why it doesn't feel right to some, or even most people.
I'm definitely with you on that one. In my life I am looking for a deep meaning and especially a deep romantic relationship. But that is a long term goal.

But assuming short term from 25-30 you tend to disregard your long term goal and have multiple changing partners. Where are the consequences? Sure you have less time to find the right partner. But on the other hand I would say that many people want to get involved in a long-term relationship only at a later age. Wouldn't that perhaps save more pain?

I'm really not sure which point of view makes more sense to me.
 

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I'm definitely with you on that one. In my life I am looking for a deep meaning and especially a deep romantic relationship. But that is a long term goal.

But assuming short term from 25-30 you tend to disregard your long term goal and have multiple changing partners. Where are the consequences? Sure you have less time to find the right partner. But on the other hand I would say that many people want to get involved in a long-term relationship only at a later age. Wouldn't that perhaps save more pain?

I'm really not sure which point of view makes more sense to me.
What do you mean by 'save more pain'?
 

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I do think patterns of behavior in young adults do set us up for either success or failure in later life. Friends/acquaintances who picked drugs over college/trade school are not doing so hot in their 30's. Friends/acquaintances who picked part time jobs to have more fun in their twenties are now bitter they are making less money than their peers. Friends/acquaintances who picked being single for a long time don't seem to have the emotional maturity for successful long term relationships. There are always exceptions but for me the pattern has been clear.

If you are a teen or in your twenties I am not saying live in a bubble and have no fun. Seriously though use your brain and be careful that one time things do not become habits that lead up to a not so great life.
 

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INFP
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Hello everyone,

I believe that every action we do has consequences. And also that you can't have everything in life.
For example, when people in their 20s just want to have fun, especially in terms of partying and having sex with many different partners. "It's good to just have fun". On the other hand, I'm sure many of these people also want to eventually find a faithful partner for life and start a family.


I don't know why, but for me it's a bit of an either-or situation. Somehow I don't think you should be able to just party wildly and have sex without consequences. After all, if you assume that there will be no consequences to that behavior, then why hold back at all?

I think I find such behavior unnatural. Because without contraceptives there were consequences (children, danger of pregnancy, STDs, etc.). And just because today's society has the means to eliminate these consequences, surely one should not act this way?

I would appreciate it if someone could convince me of the opposite. Or simply strengthen me in my opinion.


I hope you understand what I mean and thank you for your answer :)
Those who indulge in hookup-culture usually make terrible partners and parents. Luckily most of them don't want the family life.
 

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Can you elaborate on the statement? Statistics / experience? (If you have the time)
I don't have it on hand, it's mostly personal experience with people over the last 10 years. However I have seen quite a few examples posted on YouTube and other sites.

Back when hookup culture was exploding, it wasn't uncommon to hear people say after the fear of death, the second biggest fear was becoming a parent.
 

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If there are natural consequences for something, then they will consequently happen.

I think there's also a good chance that "fucking around" actually gives people knowledge and insight into relationships and the type of person they'd be compatible with.

Someone who never engages in a relationship might have a really hard time knowing what they really need in one to be happy. They might just assume that it's what everyone else wants. Or what popular culture tells them they should want.

Whereas, hypothetically, someone who dates twenty people is probably going to have a better understanding, by the 21st person they date, of compatibility.

It doesn't work that way for everyone, I'm sure--but I really don't see the point in acting like celibacy or abstaining from dating is going to get you ahead in the world of relationships. It might feel unfair, but cause and effect does work that way--it's not always fair or right. Though tbh I don't think there is anything wrong with people having casual sex.
 

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If there are natural consequences for something, then they will consequently happen.

I think there's also a good chance that "fucking around" actually gives people knowledge and insight into relationships and the type of person they'd be compatible with.

Someone who never engages in a relationship might have a really hard time knowing what they really need in one to be happy. They might just assume that it's what everyone else wants. Or what popular culture tells them they should want.

Whereas, hypothetically, someone who dates twenty people is probably going to have a better understanding, by the 21st person they date, of compatibility.

It doesn't work that way for everyone, I'm sure--but I really don't see the point in acting like celibacy or abstaining from dating is going to get you ahead in the world of relationships. It might feel unfair, but cause and effect does work that way--it's not always fair or right. Though tbh I don't think there is anything wrong with people having casual sex.
So would you say Monogamous relationships should be a by-product or goal?
 

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I certainly have never found that right, personally, and there are numerous videos out there that tell you why INFJs, in particular, don't get into casual relationships or one night stands. We actually need to love someone before we can have sex with them; and there's only a one letter difference in our types, INFJ and ISFJ.

We look for a partner to uphold a relationship with, and allow our children the advantages of two loving parents... the time spent having many casual relationships is the time one could spend looking for the right partner, nor is this behaviour good once you're in a loving relationship; you certainly wouldn't want to keep the 'college parties' and fooling around up. Yeah, there's good reason why it doesn't feel right to some, or even most people.
Look if you don't like casual that is your decision but others are free to do what they want long as all is consensual. This would mean you also think you should police swingers, poly couples and bdsm relationships. Let people be.
 

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Look if you don't like casual that is your decision but others are free to do what they want long as all is consensual. This would mean you also think you should police swingers, poly couples and bdsm relationships. Let people be.
You should police that stuff, personally, if you’re intention is to raise a family, and for a majority of us, maybe to even cultivate true love, like my parents did. But people can be so different; sure there can be a really sexually free person in their element, ‘loving’.
 

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Hello everyone,

I believe that every action we do has consequences. And also that you can't have everything in life.
For example, when people in their 20s just want to have fun, especially in terms of partying and having sex with many different partners. "It's good to just have fun". On the other hand, I'm sure many of these people also want to eventually find a faithful partner for life and start a family.


I don't know why, but for me it's a bit of an either-or situation. Somehow I don't think you should be able to just party wildly and have sex without consequences. After all, if you assume that there will be no consequences to that behavior, then why hold back at all?

I think I find such behavior unnatural. Because without contraceptives there were consequences (children, danger of pregnancy, STDs, etc.). And just because today's society has the means to eliminate these consequences, surely one should not act this way?

I would appreciate it if someone could convince me of the opposite. Or simply strengthen me in my opinion.


I hope you understand what I mean and thank you for your answer :)
That's what I like about ISFJs.
Yep I agree with you on that. Lots of the things that happen to us are the consequences of so many decisions that we even didn't care to reflect on.
It depends on the mindset. As for myself I believe that faithfulness demands faithfulness and responsibility. If I can't sense faithfulness in myself cause I have the one night one fun attitude then it's just like that.
I shouldn't demand a fairy from the stories if I live my life like that.
But whatever, I don't fuck around anymore. Life requires conservation and control over self.
 

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So would you say Monogamous relationships should be a by-product or goal?
I would say people who want to be in monogamous relationships should make it a goal.

If someone doesn't particularly care, or enjoyes casual sex, or polygamy, then they should make their preferred relationship type a goal?

As far as people who really value monogamy--then they probably should not be engaging in types of relationships that they won't find fulfilling (such as casual sex or polygamy).

I don't really see how monogamy can be a byproduct--it's not easy for people who don't value monogamy to be monogamous, I assume. It's probably easier for them to go with their preferred style.
 
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I think I find such behavior unnatural. Because without contraceptives there were consequences (children, danger of pregnancy, STDs, etc.). And just because today's society has the means to eliminate these consequences, surely one should not act this way?
I'm no historian but I think it's fairly well known that Romans and Greeks had absolute sex fests at times.

Also the far east with their emperors and concubines. It isn't a stretch to imagine others in wider society were doing similar.

I find such behavior unnatural
One could just as easily argue that culturally enforced rules of sexual abstention are unnatural, since procreation - and the desire to do so - is one of the key tenets of life itself.

I do think patterns of behavior in young adults do set us up for either success or failure in later life. Friends/acquaintances who picked drugs over college/trade school are not doing so hot in their 30's. Friends/acquaintances who picked part time jobs to have more fun in their twenties are now bitter they are making less money than their peers. Friends/acquaintances who picked being single for a long time don't seem to have the emotional maturity for successful long term relationships. There are always exceptions but for me the pattern has been clear.
I don't see a pattern like this at all in any of the people or places I've found myself in. It sounds a little bit like you're proscribing your view of these things on the world a bit too rigidly.

Personally:

- Took copious amount of drugs and was a directionless waster until about 23, then didn't truly get my act together until about 28. Now I'm a software engineer and feel extremely secure in my future employment prospects and financial security.
- Youngest brother still does take copious amounts of drugs, in his free time when he is free to do as he pleases. He's also an Oxford University graduate, with masters scholarship, also has obtained Qualified Teacher Status just for the hell of it, and now works as a developer for a financial firm in the heart of London.

I don't think we are exceptions to the rule. I know tons of people who lived carefree and wastefully in their youth and are now doing fine. There is no rule that says one must take XYZ 'sensible' route to make sure one becomes XYZ sensible person in later life.

I mean, I can certainly agree that those who continue to do such things well into adulthood are indeed utter wastes. I know a few myself. But there is absolutely no hard and fast rule that says young people must set themselves up early to prevent problems later on.

Going back to the premise of this thread, I should probably also add that I tend to agree with the concept of sexual exclusivity and monogamy. In fact I detest the concept of polygamy, and cannot stand the "I'm so sexually liberated that I'm going to do it with as many people as possible every night of the week" mindset. I think it's crass and misguided. However, I don't think it's fair to conflate that with the general fumblings, frolickings, trials and tribulations of youth.
 

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Hello everyone,

I believe that every action we do has consequences. And also that you can't have everything in life.
For example, when people in their 20s just want to have fun, especially in terms of partying and having sex with many different partners. "It's good to just have fun". On the other hand, I'm sure many of these people also want to eventually find a faithful partner for life and start a family.


I don't know why, but for me it's a bit of an either-or situation. Somehow I don't think you should be able to just party wildly and have sex without consequences. After all, if you assume that there will be no consequences to that behavior, then why hold back at all?

I think I find such behavior unnatural. Because without contraceptives there were consequences (children, danger of pregnancy, STDs, etc.). And just because today's society has the means to eliminate these consequences, surely one should not act this way?

I would appreciate it if someone could convince me of the opposite. Or simply strengthen me in my opinion.


I hope you understand what I mean and thank you for your answer :)
Obviously there are consequences like STDs, unwanted pregnancies, crazy people etc... but the one that has a very high probability of happening is you start losing your ability to peer bond.
 

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Do you have any citations for this (not the STI and pregnancy thing, but the last claim)?
I interpreted "Fucking around and partying" as literally fucking (casual sex) and partying.

The theory/concept of casual sex screwing with your ability to peer bond is as summarized below;

"Pair Bonding
Research from the Medical Institute for Sexual Health goes on to illustrate the importance of oxytocin when it comes to bonding.

Casual sex leads to a decrease in this neurochemical production and interferes with what is called pair bonding.

Repeated sexual encounters with multiple partners rewires the brain.

When an individual chooses to engage in casual sex, breaking bond after bond with each new sexual partner, the brain forms a new synaptic map of one-night–stands. This pattern becomes the “new normal” for the individual. When and if the individual later desires to find a more permanent partner, the brain mapping will have to be overcome, making a permanent bond more difficult to achieve."

A longer iteration link below;
 
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