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Okay so this is a bit of a rant, but I wondered if any of you have noticed this and what you think? Can you relate? Are there certain types that seem to have this perspective?

I've noticed that some people seem to have this attitude that it's invalid for someone to express unhappiness with a situation if they haven't already done a thorough search for ways to fix it. To me this just doesn't make any sense... it's the unhappiness that motivates you to find a solution, so obviously you feel it BEFORE you start looking. Why would it be invalid to state that you don't like how something currently is? It explains why you're about to go searching for other options. Some people with that attitude seem to somehow assume that stating unhappiness means you're not going to make any effort to fix it, but how that follows I don't know. Sure there are some people who do complain without making any effort to better a situation, but that's definitely not everyone who expresses an emotion about something. It's like they think saying "I hate this" comes with the assumption that you think it can't be changed, but I just don't see the logical connection there. I suppose it's like feelings are only part of a final conclusion? I don't know. I just don't get it. It baffles me, and because of that it's extra irritating.
 

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I've experienced that very attitude from a cocksure idiot who couldn't comprehend that sometimes there is a dimension to existence that goes beyond just having solutions. It's basically emotionally invalidating which is why it's frustrating. The same guy also told me that self-esteem has to be earned, that you aren't allowed to like yourself until you've achieved measurable success in life. He didn't think school kids deserved self-esteem. He was just strange like that. He was probably EXTJ or at least a Te user, which makes sense.
 

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For me, emotional reactions come really late down the line. It isn't that I'm not feeling the emotions early. I just have a really hard time fleshing out what I'm feeling and why I'm feeling it. By the time I get that clarity, it's usually shortly followed by a solution to my problem.

Or in more extreme cases, the emotions come out randomly attached to something else. It's going to look like I'm super upset about some random, little thing, but the truth is that all 14 things bothering me just globbed together onto whatever the last thing was. *sigh*

Back on topic of people not understanding - I've been surrounded by Te users all my life, and they're doers, you know? Very proactive. So their natural assumption when you voice a problem is that you want help with the problem. Declining solutions in favor of just talking about feelings/venting reads as whining. It isn't that they can't be quietly supportive, but it seems like I need to clearly voice what kind of support I need in that moment. And then be aware that they're going out of their comfort zone to do so, when they'd much rather work on a solution together.

It isn't just Te that's guilty. My INFP bestie gets frustrated when she tries to vent to her ESFJ sister and I at once. All that Fe comes out as pushy, too. I feel useless just patting someone's arm and telling them it's going to be okay. I want to help them figure a way out and be happy again. Making a plan helps me feel better about the problem. I have to consciously pull myself back from forcing others to fix things in the same way.

I feel like my post jumped around a bit, but I did want to say that your point is very valid, and it can be frustrating when people just don't get it. And embarrassment for when I am one of those irritating people. There are more people out there that want happiness for you than know how to show it. *hugs*
 

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When im in control of what will happen in a certain situiation, I try to be as positive as I can, so I will be pushed forward, rather than pulled back by my emotions. When im not in control though, I will expect the worst so it only can get better
 

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It depends a lot on the story behind a vent and the general tendency of the venting person, but we can't simply know that so simply casting judgment is not being reasonable too. So if someone is too fast to judge and assume that a venting person is just being emotional or whiny or whatever, then this person is just giving an immature and arrogant impression of himself/herself anyways. Or that this person is not good at seeing things from other perspectives rather than projecting his/her own.

Sometimes people with too much Fi and not developed much Fe can be a bit inflexible and project their values as valid judgement basis. We all use our Fi as judgement basis, but the difference is when we are so sure that ours is valid without even know a bit more about others.

Logically it sounds weird to assume that we feel after we found a solution, since as you said, people feel as reactions to what happened and then it can motivate them to find a solution (or not). Feelings are triggered. The only thing that can sound logical is if the other person is expecting you to repress your feelings 'till you find solutions? Thought that might not always be doable and it's not necessarily that bad. IMO, people can have some time to vent, express and find support from others, everyone has their own way and pace of dealing things.

If some people are being judgemental then they are showing different ways of dealing things and different values. IMO, it'd be more preferable to stay with people who share similar values and ways, or at least compatible values and ways, as otherwise we might feel devalued and not understood due to differences.
 

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Honestly I am inclined to think of this behavior as abusive: someone is trying to invalidate your feelings, which is is always a red flag for me.

First of all, there is very little if any correlation between being unhappy and finding solutions. a lot of people remain dissatisfied and never lift a finger to do anything about it, and a lot of people arrange plans for a solution and have to continue tolerating unpleasant circumstances until the the plans are carried out. being unhappy in either of those cases is perfectly valid. Equating happiness and productivity is just asinine.

Usually, people who make it a matter of problem solving instead of an emotional conversation, they are simply refusing to exercise empathy. That's their own problem.
 

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Okay so this is a bit of a rant, but I wondered if any of you have noticed this and what you think? Can you relate? Are there certain types that seem to have this perspective?

I've noticed that some people seem to have this attitude that it's invalid for someone to express unhappiness with a situation if they haven't already done a thorough search for ways to fix it. To me this just doesn't make any sense... it's the unhappiness that motivates you to find a solution, so obviously you feel it BEFORE you start looking. Why would it be invalid to state that you don't like how something currently is?
The reason is that it is inefficient use of mental energy to be focusing on how a situation feels rather than to be planning a solution.
See the whole idea is to handle the problem and have a strategy ready, before you get to a point where you have feelings about about it. To express unhappiness is to be telling others I do not know how to control my situation. At least, that is how this INTJ will read it.
It can be difficult to provide sympathy to such lack of organisation and planning, but I will always be ready to suggest a solution to help a friend.
 

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Okay so this is a bit of a rant, but I wondered if any of you have noticed this and what you think? Can you relate? Are there certain types that seem to have this perspective?

I've noticed that some people seem to have this attitude that it's invalid for someone to express unhappiness with a situation if they haven't already done a thorough search for ways to fix it. To me this just doesn't make any sense... it's the unhappiness that motivates you to find a solution, so obviously you feel it BEFORE you start looking. Why would it be invalid to state that you don't like how something currently is? It explains why you're about to go searching for other options. Some people with that attitude seem to somehow assume that stating unhappiness means you're not going to make any effort to fix it, but how that follows I don't know. Sure there are some people who do complain without making any effort to better a situation, but that's definitely not everyone who expresses an emotion about something. It's like they think saying "I hate this" comes with the assumption that you think it can't be changed, but I just don't see the logical connection there. I suppose it's like feelings are only part of a final conclusion? I don't know. I just don't get it. It baffles me, and because of that it's extra irritating.
You may be an exception, but most people that I hear complain about things never solve them. So after seeing this pattern so much, I've just been conditioned to assume that all complainers are like this.
 

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The reason is that it is inefficient use of mental energy to be focusing on how a situation feels rather than to be planning a solution.
Your premise is flawed in OP's context. OP is claiming that without the emotional stress, she wouldn't have any mental energy to solve the problem. That is, the emotional "stuff" gives her the energy to solve problems. Having said that, I have yet to meet a person that consistently has emotional outbursts and then solves problems; they just quit or the act of ranting removes the bad feelings, which many feelers see as a solution. Bad feelings gone, problem solved; even if the true root of the problem hasn't been solved.
 

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People seem to really dislike what they term "whining", which would be expressing displeasure over an unpleasant situation. But, I find that usually comes with two other factors involved:

* The "whiner" hasn't taken steps to help themselves and habitually relies on other people to do stuff for them.
*The person hearing the "whining" feels powerless to help or is partly guilty for the unpleasantness, and doesn't like to be reminded of that.

I doubt you qualify for the first factor, but perhaps the second is true for them?
 
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