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Has anyone ever met an NT that wasn't more intelligent than the average person? I don't think I've ever met a 'dumb' NT. Just curious about this.
 

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I know one INTP who is of average intelligence. At least I think she's an INTP, as far as I know.

All the other NTs I've met have been completely brilliant. They're intellectually curious and just never stop learning.
 

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I consider myself an NT whose intelligence is pretty much on par with the average person. While I have a general interest in a bunch of subjects, I'm not an expert nor am I anywhere near expertise in any subject. My understanding of science, philosophy, technology, literature, and the arts are basic at best with some detailed knowledge of sub fields within those subjects. For example, I can hold a conversation about the generalities of science and history but if you want to discuss the war of 1812 or quantum mechanics with me, I'm afraid I'm going to have to stop you there. I also have marginal acquaintance with current events, simply because I hate watching/reading/listening to the news. I am very distrustful of media, and find a lot of it incredibly shady and one-sided, so I tend to avoid most news networks and websites. I am only familiar with the bare bones of what is going on in the world, and don't care for having some news reporter trying to implant their opinions into my brain.

Never got the best grades going to school (though that was mostly due to me rebelling against the school system rather than, not actually understanding the material), and I am really slow learner. I mean it takes me hours to understand something other people can grasp in minutes or seconds. I always have to repeat, repeat, repeat a new piece of information in my brain in order for me to understand it, meaning it takes me twice as long to do readings for class, and twice as long to finish my work. I find school goes too fast and, just when I get something, we're already moving onto something else and, I don't have time to apply what I just grasped. I just barely keep up with the school, and I get confused really easily. I don't understand things that are apparently "obvious" to so many other people, so often times I just nod my head and go along with everyone because, people tend to get exasperated explaining things to me after a while.

Truthfully, I don't know a lot of things and just about everything in this world confuses me and gives me headache but I get by pretty well provided I stay away from heavy intellectual discussions.
 

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there is a remarkable difference between knowledge and intelligence in my opinion.

I like the analogy of a computer when describing human intelligence ; General intelligence is more like RAM and processor ; how many things you can compute at the same time, and at what speed.

Knowledge makes for better decisions, but it's still more like a hard-drive, and not what i would count as general intelligence. STupid people might be masters of trivial pursuit.

The interesting things about humans and neuroplasticitiy is though that the processes i just described as intelligence might be "trained" and improved through continous usage, although i also believe in a genetic presdispositon.
 

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No, not all NTs are brilliant. They make up at least 10% of the population, and there cerainly aren't that many "brilliant" people, by definition when it comes to being relative with the gen population.
 

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I don't think brilliancy is in question right here. Being above average intelligence doesn't require that one is brilliant, there is much room in the middle. I would certainly say that I am above average intelligence, but I would never go so far as to say that I am brilliant. I have that same feeling about all of the confirmed NT's in my life. They are all above average where intelligence is concerned, but most also have a major deficit in some other arena. One is just fucking crazy (severe bipolar), one is deeply insecure, one can't grow up, and two are very out of touch with the reality of human relationships. But to answer the question, all of them are very intelligent.
 
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isn't george in seinfeld an intp? i mean, he is brilliant, but not that bright. bad example maybe, but my point is that intelligence is not always a very good indicator of a person's abilities. personality theories are much better at that, and they are also less discriminating. furthermore, you need to define intelligence. normally it is measured in terms of IQ. but then, many with high iq can be utterly stupid in practical tasks that "lesser" men can do with ease.
 

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When asked if they drive better than average, some 70% of the asked population said that they were better than average. Intriguing and pointing to something.

As to intelligence: Is thinking fast "intelligence"? I think faster than most persons I have met, but I know people that are my equals or better IN CERTAIN AREAS. In some areas I am a complete moron. I have accepted some weaknesses and worked hard to better others. No one is good at everything nor bad at everything. But science shows that if you are apt at some intellectual tasks, the likelyhood that you will be good at others is almost 100%.

I also know some self professed and tested INTJs that are not particularly brainish.... But that is just MY opinion, right? I find their narrowing down the world into one absolute vision to be limited and narrow-minded. They find my brain-dumping Ne weird, unsettling and practically useless (or hard for them to get). Some persons find it intelligent to memorize facts even if they dont see the correlations and how things are connected to a greater vision.

That said, I have never met a STUPID - as in not using their brain on at least an average level - NT.
 

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I would say that if an NT can find a way to not be foiled by their emotional weaknesses, that is high intelligence! I know an INTJ and an ENTJ who could have led much happier lives had they been able to control their negative emotions. Both have relative success in their endeavors---but could have had so much more in life if they weren't overpowered by their emotional achilles heels.
 

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Don't most people think they're smarter than average? That's why I don't want to call myself intelligent. Besides, I don't even think I understand what intelligence is.

I know NTs who are failing or doing badly in school, but I don't know any stupid ones. None of them seem to be brilliant either.

I get called stupid quite a bit (I am extremely absent-minded and also very bad at communicating complex thoughts).
 

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I consider myself an NT whose intelligence is pretty much on par with the average person. While I have a general interest in a bunch of subjects, I'm not an expert nor am I anywhere near expertise in any subject. My understanding of science, philosophy, technology, literature, and the arts are basic at best with some detailed knowledge of sub fields within those subjects. For example, I can hold a conversation about the generalities of science and history but if you want to discuss the war of 1812 or quantum mechanics with me, I'm afraid I'm going to have to stop you there. I also have marginal acquaintance with current events, simply because I hate watching/reading/listening to the news. I am very distrustful of media, and find a lot of it incredibly shady and one-sided, so I tend to avoid most news networks and websites. I am only familiar with the bare bones of what is going on in the world, and don't care for having some news reporter trying to implant their opinions into my brain.

Never got the best grades going to school (though that was mostly due to me rebelling against the school system rather than, not actually understanding the material), and I am really slow learner. I mean it takes me hours to understand something other people can grasp in minutes or seconds. I always have to repeat, repeat, repeat a new piece of information in my brain in order for me to understand it, meaning it takes me twice as long to do readings for class, and twice as long to finish my work. I find school goes too fast and, just when I get something, we're already moving onto something else and, I don't have time to apply what I just grasped. I just barely keep up with the school, and I get confused really easily. I don't understand things that are apparently "obvious" to so many other people, so often times I just nod my head and go along with everyone because, people tend to get exasperated explaining things to me after a while.

Truthfully, I don't know a lot of things and just about everything in this world confuses me and gives me headache but I get by pretty well provided I stay away from heavy intellectual discussions.
I really relate to this. I attribute a lot of it to simply being very selective about what I learn and retain. I notice Ps (particularly ENTPs) aren't selective about the information they collect, so they have a huge base of knowledge. However INTJs may be better able to focus on one particular thing in great depth, with a practical application. (That is, if they ever run into anything they're interested in.) Another thing is, I've realized my introversion impinges on my ability to learn things from other people (including teachers), so in a public setting I can seem relatively slow.

I'm not going to say anything about intelligence because we keep talking about the question of definition. However, compared to my peers I know I can analyze ideas and their implications well — in fact, I can't not do this, whereas a lot of people simply aren't interested or able.
 

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It depends what are you talking about. I would say classical intelligence meaning favors NTs. And for me it means the ability to learn and use non-personal data fast and accurate. Now emotional intelligence in my case and I do believe in many NTs cases is a whole different story. Probably has to do a lot to your T <-> F spectrum and strong N preference wouldn't help either. Some of you where talking about area of expertise and that is for me KNOWLEDGE. At least no one would ask you about quantum mechanics on an IQ test. I personally prefer talking about MA or biology then physics or history anyway :)
 

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Perhaps one sign of intelligence is how you react or create resolution when faced with a problem/dilemma you've never faced before. What do you do when caught out of your element? Do you think creatively? That ability cannot be memorized or learned in a book.
 

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My brother is an ENTP and he is borderline genius like me. We both score between 130 and 140 on IQ tests.

We both are extremely gifted in languages and can assimilate a foreign language to the point where we can just switch to any of the know ones at a snap of a finger and communicate on a native level. We are great in math (we both find it boring and dry thou) and pretty much everything except sports, singing.

This is where the similarities end. Most people when they get to know me think I'm an idiot, and get shocked afterwords because of the stark contrast between how I behave and my skills/intelligence. My brother on the other hand likes to make people feel that he is superior or that is how I see it, maybe he is just really blunt about it.

Honestly he does seem more intelligent then I am. My main issue with learning is that I'm very much so like an ESFP...I need to learn by doing and need to learn skills not memorize stuff and theory bull...finding the motivation to learn boring theory is hard.

He on the other hand does not seem fazed by it at all.

Intelligence is in general defined by fluid intelligence and crystallized. We both have really good fluid and very shitty crystallized. Other then that intelligences vary from mathematical to kinesthetic and are plenty in between.

My theory on the whole subject is that T does not make you intelligent, you are either intelligent or not, regardless of your MBTI personality. The reason is simple. The types of intelligence are too varied and many fall into the jurisdiction of other types :wink:

PS: :p my EQ is almost 2x higher then his. Oh and most of the time I feel stupid compared to other people....at least achievement wise. The people that shine are usually those who are exceptionally gifted in one area or another. I don't think I'm one of those.
 

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Intelligence is such a broad term and I've yet to see someone accurately describe it to the point that I would quote them on it.
I think it's more likely to associate NTs and being knowledgeable. This is also very prone to change though. If you talk to an NT about something they're interested in or studied, you'll probably think they're highly "intelligent". Switch to a topic they don't know much about, however, and you might start thinking otherwise. It really depends on the conversation subject. I feel like it's that way with all the types, only NTs are just more passionate about learning new things, at least the ones that I've met.
 

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No, not all NTs are brilliant. They make up at least 10% of the population, and there cerainly aren't that many "brilliant" people, by definition when it comes to being relative with the gen population.
Nevermind not "brilliant". How about just not dysfunctional.
 

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I consider myself an NT whose intelligence is pretty much on par with the average person. While I have a general interest in a bunch of subjects, I'm not an expert nor am I anywhere near expertise in any subject. My understanding of science, philosophy, technology, literature, and the arts are basic at best with some detailed knowledge of sub fields within those subjects. For example, I can hold a conversation about the generalities of science and history but if you want to discuss the war of 1812 or quantum mechanics with me, I'm afraid I'm going to have to stop you there.
You are pretty much like me...or I am pretty much like you...I know plenty of stuff but not enough to hold a long conversation. I love to learn as much as I can but there is a limit. I don't really want to master anything. Just knowing stuff is enough.....
I also have marginal acquaintance with current events, simply because I hate watching/reading/listening to the news. I am very distrustful of media, and find a lot of it incredibly shady and one-sided, so I tend to avoid most news networks and websites. I am only familiar with the bare bones of what is going on in the world, and don't care for having some news reporter trying to implant their opinions into my brain.
I watch/read news occasionally but not much into them. Useless stuff! except a few..
Never got the best grades going to school (though that was mostly due to me rebelling against the school system rather than, not actually understanding the material), and I am really slow learner. I mean it takes me hours to understand something other people can grasp in minutes or seconds. I always have to repeat, repeat, repeat a new piece of information in my brain in order for me to understand it, meaning it takes me twice as long to do readings for class, and twice as long to finish my work. I find school goes too fast and, just when I get something, we're already moving onto something else and, I don't have time to apply what I just grasped. I just barely keep up with the school, and I get confused really easily. I don't understand things that are apparently "obvious" to so many other people, so often times I just nod my head and go along with everyone because, people tend to get exasperated explaining things to me after a while.
I failed my exams. Only because I realized that what I learn is going to be changed in the future so why should I learn a lie?
There are some problems I understand fairly quickly than anyone else...which in turn happens to be more complex to comprehend. I somehow do a simulation in my head and understand what it is. So I never get a question to ask from the lecturer. And there are some easy problems which are so easy that even a dumbo can understand. I try to find alternate ways to solve it and end up in a more complex-ed problem which is SO WRONG!

Basic rule is if it is too easy - I wouldn't understand.

Truthfully, I don't know a lot of things and just about everything in this world confuses me and gives me headache but I get by pretty well provided I stay away from heavy intellectual discussions.
[Ctrl + V] :crazy:
same here. Only when it comes to something really challenging I hop in and be a jerk.

What I do is, although I know that I am smarter than average, I tend to hide it, others call me idiot constantly because of the way I act. I act like a total dumb ass. It helps me get along with dumb ass people. :laughing:
 
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