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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
(As a type who struggles reading long posts I've created bulletins for you to skip the parts that may seem less interesting. Feel free to jump to 'The Real Situation'.)



PerC, I'm turning to all of you for help. I'm in need of some serious guidance.
-ISTP



Our Background:

I'm an ISTP and I met my wonderful INFP just over two years ago. We're gamers so naturally we met gaming. We considered one another our closest friend, despite the odd factor that we had never met. We spent time gaming together and getting to know one another. He'd talk to me about his flings/dates and I'd vent to him at the overwhelming doom of being alone forever.

In 2015 we decided that we would enter a long distance relationship, a whopping 2,340 miles from Idaho to Virginia. At that time we still hadn't met in person. In the beginning Skype was a really big thing for us. We talked every night and texted through out the day.

After the new year we decided we had waited long enough and it was finally time to plan a trip. I would travel for 18 hours to get to him. With the plain tickets finally purchased and a date set we where both ecstatic! And as life has it, things took a dark turn two weeks before I planned to visit.



Their Background:

My INFP is a father to a full of life toddler. For the sake of telling this story I will refer to his daughters mother as, Jen.

Jen and my INFP where in their late teens and very early twenties when they met. And as fate would have it they gave birth to a daughter. Based only on the story that my INFP has told me things with Jen where less than ideal. He was not fully invested in their relationship and at times felt like he had to settle with her. Jen was a stay at home mom even though their financial situation was unable to sustain that kind of life style. In a desperate attempt to get out of that relationship my INFP lashed out, cheated, and left Jen.

At the time Jen did what she needed to as a mother and took her self and their daughter to her mothers home in Texas. Where she has continued to live years later.



Where Our Stories Collide:

My INFP had planned a small weekend trip to Texas two weeks before I was due to visit. It was his daughters birthday and he wanted nothing more then to be there. And I, with out question, loved that he would be able to spend that time with her. I had occasionally picked up on his pain that he geographically wasn't close to her. I wanted to support him and I knew that this was something that would make him happy, which is all I cared about.

I rarely heard from him during his brief trip to Texas. I didn't find it odd or out of character. I assumed that he was spending time with his daughter and enjoying his time there. I didn't think anything of it.

On the third night of my INFP being there he sat in the living room spending time with his daughter. Jen had used his presence as an excuse to be a care free twenty something. She spent that night in the backyard drinking heavily with her friends. My INFP tucked his sweet daughter into bed then continued to go to bed himself.

In the middle of the night Jen entered my INFPs room while in a drunken stupor. She crawled into bed with my INFP and proceeded to rub him everywhere, kissing his neck, and eventually crawling on top of him and proceeded to have sex with him. During this time my INFP woke up, took a moment to understand what was happening, threw Jen off of him and shut her out of the room.

Two days later my INFP was on a flight back home and I received a facebook message documenting step by step what happened. When I read the message my world paused for a moment. The one person I had never expected to hurt me just describe to me a situation that I wasn't prepared to deal with. I was hurt, angry, and embarrassed. I had trusted him and still Jen felt like throwing herself at him was acceptable.

The following conversations between my INFP and me hurt. I've unfortunately always have had a skewed view on monogamy. I've never found it to be something humans are capable of and I understand mistakes happen. I decided to forgive the situation, under the understanding that my INFP needed to help me in the emotions that where to follow.


The Visit:

I arrived in Virginia a few weeks later. I was still dealing with the Texas situation but I felt like seeing one another would be good for our relationship, and I was right. We had an amazing time. It was great to finally feel like a 'real' couple. We where able to do the typical dating things. We went to museums, the beach, movies, dinners, everything.

And as those in long distance relationships know, the time flew by. Before I knew it our time was over and I was making the long trip home.


Being Alone:

I had anticipated that being apart again would be challenging. But something happened within myself, the overwhelming hurt from Texas finally settled in when I realized I was alone again. I didn't have my INFP with me to reassure me or give me that undying support. All the pain I had suppressed came at me full force, and it was angry.

I turned to my INFP for help, but regardless of his multiple attempts it was never enough. I then decided to do something about it. This pain was mine and I need to own it. I began to deal with myself and do what it took to make me feel better.

I did simple things for myself like re-joining yoga, hiking, meditate daily, etc. What ever would make me feel better I began doing and it helped.


Life Moving Forward:


My INFP and I have been planning to move some where together. The company I've worked for has taken interest in me for a position that I've been striving for. I've interviewed and I'm currently awaiting to hear about the second stage of interviewing. This would mean that my INFP would have to move here, I would have a huge career advancement and I would become financially unburdened.

When I first learned of the position and was encouraged to apply my INFP expressed how he would be more than willing to make the move from Virginia to Idaho. This made me feel incredible, it was extremely easy to get excited about what life would be life for us.

So our plan became for him to move to Idaho to be with me, for us to start a life together, and to embrace his huge adventure together.



The Real Situation:

This morning my INFP was delivered some devastating news, his elderly father has been diagnosed with a life threatening disease. In the midst of dealing with this new emotional burden my INFP contacted Jen to have his daughter come visit for two weeks. He believes it could potentially be the last time his father has an opportunity to see her. I support this decision 100%.

But Jen had a few demands, she insisted on traveling with their daughter for Virginia. I think if I where a mother that I would probably feel the same, so I'm ok with this. Jen's second demand was for my INFP to make the drive from Virginia to Texas to pick them up then travel back to Virginia with them. Also insisting that he returns them to Texas in the same manner. I at this point am not ok with this, round trip flights would be financially and logically much more practical. But because Jen is refusing to pay for her own flight my INFP now feels some type of obligation to do so. I don't agree with this but feel like it's not my decision to make.

But the last and final blow on Jen's list of demands is that she move to Virginia from Texas with their young daughter. Jen expects to move in with a friend and find a waitress job after she has moved, with only a single month notice.

A few facts I know about Jen:
1. She works as a part time waitress and has no form of savings.
2. She blames her lack of fund on her mother and my INFP. Example "If you hadn't made me a single mother I wouldn't be struggling".
3. She has no ambition beyond being a mother.
4. She has made it known that my INFP will not see his daughter unless my INFP and Jen where back together.

While I do believe my INFP is sincere when he says that he doesn't want to be with her and there would be no repeat of his Texas visit, I'm still horrified. I think he is opening himself up to a very negative situation. I worry that if my INFPs father where to pass away that Jen would manipulate my INFP during his grief into being together. I can imagine her saying, "Family is the most important thing in life, this is what your father would have wanted" or something to that effect.

If Jen where to move to Virginia I don't know that I could endure the challenges it would create for us.




What I need help with:


-I want to trust that my INFP won't put me through that same situation again, but I don't know where to begin doing that.

-How would others handle this?

-Do INFP's struggle with hurting others feelings and/or saying no?

-What the hell should I do?

-Should I speak up with my concerns? Is it my place to even say anything?



General input is welcome. I feel like I'm being foolish in this whole situation and I could use clarity. Any help would be more than appreciated. When I told a family member about Jen and my INFP's plans they responded with "Fuck them both!"

Help.





EDIT: He's and INFP* not INFJ like I had originally typed.
 

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There doesn't seem like much you can do about the situation except sit back and wait to see what he decides to do. It sounds like he is being attempted manipulated by his ex and child's mother. i wouldn't give him a hard time about it, he is probably just as miserable about it as you. as far as staying in virginia to be with his father, and having to deal with his ex, i'd say he probably needs a friend right now. a friend, not someone who will put demands on him. hope everything works out for you two! just be patient and what can you do but hope? and btw, i think asking him to drive to texas and back twice is insane! if the daughter is a toddler, she won't remember visiting granddad anyway. i think that would be a poor excuse to have to see his ex, to have their daughter visit to see her grandfather for the last time. i probably wouldn't tell him that but that's what i think. i'd do what you were doing, focusing more on yourself, your new job, interests, and forget about this guy for a while, i mean, not stop talking to him, but you know, cool it a bit until there's more info on his dad's condition as that might squash him moving to idaho. but still let him know how much you would love to start a new life together in the future should he move out to you. (provided you are prepared to deal with a lifetime of dealing with his ex and daughter!) i'd really think about it and discuss a solution to that problem (of how he is going to see his daughter without seeing his ex or whatever) before you invite him into your life. hope that makes sense and good luck!
 

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First off, I'm sorry for your situation. I feel like you're doing your best to be understanding and you're doing activities which imply you are aware of the control you have over your own mental state (yoga/meditation). That makes a huge difference.

As for what 'Jen' did to your INFJ when he was in Texas...from what you are saying, she raped him. She got him hard, climbed on top, and raped him. If that's true as you stated it, you aren't dealing with a normal ex who wants her man back. She is a manipulative rapist. I don't know what should be done about that...but it needs to be stated in such blunt terms to understand the issue.

Now that the elephant in the room is addressed:

-I want to trust that my INFJ won't put me through that same situation again, but I don't know where to begin doing that.

-How would others handle this?

-Do INFJ's struggle with hurting others feelings and/or saying no?

-What the hell should I do?

-Should I speak up with my concerns? Is it my place to even say anything?
1. I don't really think he put you in this situation. I think his ex did. Now...he shouldn't be complacent and just allow her to make all the decisions. He has rights as a parent (unless she was awarded full custody). Also, it is not his responsibility to just roll with whatever she wants. That's not fair to him, nor is it accurate. He can stand up for himself and for you, and he can make the decisions he wants to make as he is an adult with his own life.

2. I would honestly probably very much push to go along with your original plan, forgive him for the sex since it was really a rape, and hope he agrees to move. If he refuses, push as to why. Is it his daughter? Because (not to sound crass), but he already didn't leave near her, and his ex cannot keep her from him without cause. If it's something else...then you may need to evaluate that.

3. They do, but they are not spineless. So it would be harder for an xxFJ than an xxTP to do this (using that example bc you can relate as an ISTP), but it can be done.

4. I think you just need to close your eyes and consider the following: what do you want 5 years from now? What choices can you make to allow this to happen? If it's not an option, how would that make you feel? Just explore what YOU want and work through it.

5. Yes yes yes.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
As for what 'Jen' did to your INFJ when he was in Texas...from what you are saying, she raped him. She got him hard, climbed on top, and raped him. If that's true as you stated it, you aren't dealing with a normal ex who wants her man back. She is a manipulative rapist. I don't know what should be done about that...but it needs to be stated in such blunt terms to understand the issue.
I absolutely agree that it is rape 100%. It was unwanted and she forced herself on him. That was a lot of why forgiving him over the whole situation was such a clear thing for me. The only ongoing issue I've had over it was that Jen felt like it was ok. My INFJ revealed to me that he didn't make it clear that he was with me and not interested in her. That plus feeling pushed aside really took a tole on me after the fact.

Thanks so much for your input.
 

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Has he since then made it clear to 'Jen' that he is in a serious relationship with you?

Definitely speak up, though, and see how he takes it. Your feelings matter regardless of situations, and the most natural remedy for trust issues is communication. As an INFJ he may seem a bit flaky trying to fulfill his perceived obligations (and burden himself in the process of doing so), so it may be up to you to help him put some logical perspective into things.
 

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Your INFJ sounds, at least if you take everything at face value here, like he is dealing with two irrational women. One raped him and refuses to move on and the other doesn't understand that his actions appear to be very much about his daughter and not his ex and that he was RAPED. It seems like you're also having difficulty trusting him. If you can't trust him, look inwards and try and find out why that is. Has he given you a reason not to trust him? Do his stories seem questionable? Or are you projecting some kind of insecurities onto him. Either way, you need to figure out what the issue is and either resolve this trust issue or dissolve the relationship.
 

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Yes shortly after the Texas incident he did make that clear to her. I have reminded him that he should do so again.
I would suggest to keep calm and wait to see, then. Be there for him, as he might need your support, but also share your thoughts and feelings. If it comes to that point, it is also an option to talk to Jen yourself.
 

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I would have to agree with what some others have been saying.

you're in a bit of a tricky situation considering your INFJ is not emotionally stable right now.

Also, keep in mind that if your INFJ willingly slept with Jen then he most likely would not have told you the story (it really does seem like the girl is unstable, manipulative, and possibly a sociopath/psychopath).

Even in this time of emotional unrest, you MUST state your concern. Tell him how you feel and what you're afraid of happening. Make sure to cater to both his logical and his emotional side so that he can truly understand where you're coming from.
 
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