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Discussion Starter #1
Is this correct or okay? My tutor once said that I'm a person with many ideas, but at times I have trouble articulating a number of them :bored: Just checking..

Anyway.. Would this be an okay/ relatable example?

Say for example, the reactions of an Fe person and an Fi person to the evils of imperialism.

Fe person : What they're doing to other countries is wrong, because think of what they're doing to the families and people in the long run. In the long run, this will just increase humiliation and intolerance for many groups of people, and not just for a few countries.

(then again this may be a thinking process of Fe-Ni person, the ability to envision things)

Fi person : If I were in the victims' shoes, I would feel humiliated and thus imperialism is wrong. I get a bad feeling seeing families kicked out of their homes. Certain values are wrong no matter what, and one of them includes unfair exploitative imperialism.
 

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Both of those could be Fe/Fi or they could both be Thinking function (especially the first example where there is almost a logical argument taking place here), but the second example is probably more Fi, but again it is really contextual. Appealing to the 'bad feeling' (assuming it is a real feeling and not an intuition or something sensation related) would likely indicate the person was a feeling-type. But a lot of what you write really deals more with a person's moral sphere, which really isn't always Feeling related.
 

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Fi: I know this is wrong, what you just said tells me that it's wrong. (emphasis on internal subjective standard judging external information)
Fe: I know this is wrong, I see what it is doing to people and it's wrong. (emphasis on the external objective standard setting the precedent of right and wrong)

Fi/Ti both work internally to validate what they are given and then shift for inconsistencies on how it sits with them. Te/Fe work on the external to validate what they are given, this is no good and can't be useful on a larger scale for everyone or others. At least that's the way I understand it.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Fi: I know this is wrong, what you just said tells me that it's wrong. (emphasis on internal subjective standard judging external information)
Fe: I know this is wrong, I see what it is doing to people and it's wrong. (emphasis on the external objective standard setting the precedent of right and wrong)

Fi/Ti both work internally to validate what they are given and then shift for inconsistencies on how it sits with them. Te/Fe work on the external to validate what they are given, this is no good and can't be useful on a larger scale for everyone or others. At least that's the way I understand it.
Yeah I was trying to articulate the internal vs external, but I couldn't find better words. Thanks for the post.

__________

What I meant (this is in general for clarifying the thread)

Fe person : What they're doing to other countries is wrong, because think of what they're doing to the families and people in the long run. In the long run, this will just increase humiliation and intolerance for many groups of people, and not just for a few countries. --> Seeing what is being done wrong to people on an external objective standard in assessing how it could effect the hierarchies and interests of groups in the long run

Fi person : If I were in the victims' shoes, I would feel humiliated and thus imperialism is wrong. I get a bad feeling seeing families kicked out of their homes. Certain values are wrong no matter what, and one of them includes unfair exploitative imperialism. --> Disagreeing with the exploitative value of imperialism. It is worth standing up for against the agendas of certain people on an internal subjective standard, evaluating the truth that it is just ''wrong''

It might seem like a similar moral compass, but I'm talking about the reaction. Though a similar conclusion, I am asking about the Fi and Fe thought processes specifically.

Or maybe I didn't explain enough, I'm not sure.

My head hurts >< Will maybe write more clearly later.
 

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Is this correct or okay? My tutor once said that I'm a person with many ideas, but at times I have trouble articulating a number of them :bored: Just checking..

Anyway.. Would this be an okay/ relatable example?

Say for example, the reactions of an Fe person and an Fi person to the evils of imperialism.

Fe person : What they're doing to other countries is wrong, because think of what they're doing to the families and people in the long run. In the long run, this will just increase humiliation and intolerance for many groups of people, and not just for a few countries.

(then again this may be a thinking process of Fe-Ni person, the ability to envision things)
There is a lot of Ni in that, with Fe passing a value judgement on it. It's hard to draw a Fe/Fi comparison from it. It is easier to draw an Ne/Ni comparison though. An Ne user may point out that there are also some benefits and it's not all bad. Si may point out that it's always been this way. Se may not see how it affects them.
 

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How about this?

Fi : assessing values that are worth standing up for, deciding on internal based evaluation.

Fe : assessing which values to accommodate and be flexible with, what are best for harmony, deciding on external based evaluation.
Mmm...not sure about this one, though I see what you're getting at. The Fi explanation you've offered seems a lot more natural to me than the Fe. But maybe I don't understand your explanation for Fe...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Mmm...not sure about this one, though I see what you're getting at. The Fi explanation you've offered seems a lot more natural to me than the Fe. But maybe I don't understand your explanation for Fe...
Sorry I have trouble elaborating at times :bored: I hope I get it right

Fi - '' These values are inherently right and wrong because___________'' (i.e. learning how to take a stand or be firm with ideals, from an internal standpoint)

Fe - ''Okay I hold certain different values but in understanding the opposite values, I want to see how these values fit in/accommodate____'' (i.e. learning flexibility/tolerance when finding people oriented solutions from an external standpoint)
 

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Ah, okay, that makes more sense! :) No worries. Thanks for elaborating!
Sorry I have trouble elaborating at times :bored: I hope I get it right

Fi - '' These values are inherently right and wrong because___________'' (i.e. learning how to take a stand or be firm with ideals, from an internal standpoint)

Fe - ''Okay I hold certain different values but in understanding the opposite values, I want to see how these values fit in/accommodate____'' (i.e. learning flexibility/tolerance when finding people oriented solutions from an external standpoint)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I think I'm able to write up a better example [I hope] because I couldn't find more appropriate words before, I'm still coming to terms with explaining better in words so pardon me;

Maybe an example of Fe and Fi.. for example if someone wanted to give a speech on the importance of talking about very artistic inspiration

Fi - You might reflect on how important the speech on art is and absolutely must deliver it. You also consider for people to benefit from a culture that will regard art and visionary more favorably, so that people will value new creativity.

Fe - You might think about how to deliver the speech on art, while at the same time considering the variant undertones delivered in the speech depending on what kind of audience you deliver it to. Likes and dislikes of others are considered in communicating one's values about art.

http://personalitycafe.com/articles/34956-function-attitudes-applied-differing-scenarios-9.html#post2943936
 

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"Values" of focus artistic impression
"Perception" art and great people

Fi: Great people with their majestic focus stem art that is wonderfully articulated. (the values drive the "subject", the perception is kept as the objective influence)
Fe: Majestic art is focused around great people where great work presents it self. (the perception drives the "subject", but the values retain their objective influence)

Anyway this is kind of hard to describe the difference, sometimes I even think some ENTPs are INTJs because its hard to tell what the thought process "subjects" and "objects", when given well thought out examples of the two functions.
 

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I think I'm able to write up a better example [I hope] because I couldn't find more appropriate words before, I'm still coming to terms with explaining better in words so pardon me;

Maybe an example of Fe and Fi.. for example if someone wanted to give a speech on the importance of talking about very artistic inspiration

Fi - You might reflect on how important the speech on art is and absolutely must deliver it. You also consider for people to benefit from a culture that will regard art and visionary more favorably, so that people will value new creativity.

Fe - You might think about how to deliver the speech on art, while at the same time considering the variant undertones delivered in the speech depending on what kind of audience you deliver it to. Likes and dislikes of others are considered in communicating one's values about art.


http://personalitycafe.com/articles/34956-function-attitudes-applied-differing-scenarios-9.html#post2943936
The first one could as well be Ti, because I know I'd do that. I think you need to get more on the gist of cognitive processes than values and what else that muddle these examples.
 
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