Personality Cafe banner

1 - 11 of 11 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,425 Posts
Discussion Starter #1

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,567 Posts
The first few words already upset me. "The mentally ill Vietnamese woman". Summarises the problems with what happens when the media talk about police shootings they always have to paint the victim in a horrible light to make them 'foreign' or 'insane' so that they can somewhat justify their actions rather than focusing on other elements... I don't truly understand what the reasoning behind this all is but it sounds horrific. I'm not going to bring my foreign politics about how I think American Police should deal with things... that never goes down well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,425 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
The first few words already upset me. "The mentally ill Vietnamese woman". Summarises the problems with what happens when the media talk about police shootings they always have to paint the victim in a horrible light to make them 'foreign' or 'insane' so that they can somewhat justify their actions rather than focusing on other elements... I don't truly understand what the reasoning behind this all is but it sounds horrific. I'm not going to bring my foreign politics about how I think American Police should deal with things... that never goes down well.
Here's the 411 on the entire case



https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Cau_Bich_Tran


Imo ...The police had no excuse in this case- they shot her within matters of seconds of entering her house

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
INFP so/sx
Joined
·
562 Posts
Why is it so difficult to teach officers to only shoot when necessary and never to kill? What’s the point in undergoing strenuous physical training when the reflex action is to shoot point blank at a suspected criminal? So many innocent people lose their lives because of fuck ups like this and it pisses me off.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,260 Posts
Why is it so difficult to teach officers to only shoot when necessary and never to kill? What’s the point in undergoing strenuous physical training when the reflex action is to shoot point blank at a suspected criminal? So many innocent people lose their lives because of fuck ups like this and it pisses me off.
Because US police officer training is designed that way. There's a BBC documentary about racial issues with police- it had a bit about the training officers get, and essentially the biggest message of police training in the US is "always be suspicious that someone will try to kill you, even if they seem innocent/harmless/detained. Overly paranoid = prepared.".. Like literally I'm not exaggerating- that is the mindset they purposely instill as part of their training programme. The public is the enemy.

That is one side of it, another side is obviously the guns but as long as guns are legal then police also need to carry them, that's understandable so that's a whole another debate- but the dumbest failure has to be, why is he going into a perceived knife-situation with a drawn gun, and not a taser? I mean how is that not policy considering a gun offers zero advantages over a taser in that situation? and in fact in any situation that doesn't involve firearms or explosives..

That's like giving a 5 year old normal scissors instead of safety- normal scissors offer no advantage in cutting out pretty pictures, and neither do guns in dealing with knife-wielders, and so lets put away the dangerous things until they're strictly necessary?

I'm not ignoring the other issues attached to this, I'm just focusing on a certain part of it.
 

·
Registered
INFP so/sx
Joined
·
562 Posts
@Tridentus

Do you remember the name of the documentary? �� I remember Panorama did an episode a few years back about America’s obsession with guns. Might rewatch it!
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
14,105 Posts
I think it's a good example of how police can react so badly to people who have mental health issues or are in a temporary state of psychosis.

But that also says something about our society imo, because we do end up letting mental health issues (including substance abuse) as well as societal issues (like poverty) create dangerous and disturbing situations, in which we expect police to solve--and police are really not a great catch-all solution for all of societies problems. So in some ways, I feel it's a failure of our society to put police in the situation of being front-line response to mental health and poverty issues. It's not efficient, and is a band aid at best--and often times it ends tragically.

I do think training can help--like further down in the article, the hostage negotiator talked about his technique of talking people down. And I think this is super important for mental health--but again, it's also not fair to saddle police with all these responsibilities. We need to address health care, as well as mental health care as a country, and that means better access to services, better services, and especially addressing poverty.

I agree that training is important, but I disagree that law enforcement should be the primary solution to issues that stem from larger social and economic problems. Focusing on solving some of these (like poverty and access to health care/housing etc.) would help relieve some of the pressure on law enforcement, and allow them to focus their resources more efficiently.

I remember looking at some stats about police interventions on mentally ill people, and it's staggering how much lethal force is used when someone's having a psychotic break.

It was spawned when a friend of a friend...actually, a very intelligent young college student, who had won debate competitions and been offered a place in UCLA, but was saving up to go to Harvard, was shot by a police officer when he was psychotic off of mushroom intoxication.

He had jumped out of the second story building, breaking his glasses...nearsighted and psychotic, he was running around bleeding...I think he was semi-naked (from the story my friend told me). Police shot him dead--a promising young man who made the poor choice of taking mushrooms with his friends and had a bad reaction.

He got more coverage because of his (probably) middle class status, as well as because he was such a bright young man. But the tragedy itself just highlights how police can respond to those suffering from mental health issues or psychotic breaks in tragic ways.

(I had to look up the story to correct some details--but was Feras Morad if you want to look into it.)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,260 Posts
@Tridentus

Do you remember the name of the documentary? �� I remember Panorama did an episode a few years back about America’s obsession with guns. Might rewatch it!
It's a Reggie Yates documentary. He's made a bunch of documentaries and they're all brilliant. I'm pretty sure he's an ENFP- his recipe is actually immersing himself in the situation, and walking in people's shoes, and he's fantastic at it. At one point he goes into a prison as a guard for a week, and then does a sequel documentary going in as a prisoner.

The one I'm referring to I think is "Reggie Yates: Life and Death in Chicago", it's not on BBC iPlayer anymore and I can't seem to find a link but you could have a look around. All his other documentaries seem to be easy to find though- I'd recommend his "insider" series, which includes those prison ones I mentioned.

There is this one along similar lines, but not Reggie.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,277 Posts
If the officer had enough time to tell her 6 times to drop the weapon, he had enough time to realize it was not a weapon.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Falling Foxes

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,652 Posts
There are cases all the time in america, where individuals get shot and killed, unarmed and without any indication of mental illness.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/national/justine-damonds-fiance-beyond-frustrated-over-delays-in-bringing-killer-to-justice/news-story/503bcda2f874eb0a39b1719cd0382ab0

There are many reasons to explain the high number of shootings in america, including: the level of training given, the better pay and the procedures of european countries.

The expectations and priorities of american police forces are also different to that of other countries.

https://www.vox.com/cards/police-brutality-shootings-us/us-police-shootings-statistics

The above stats show that american police are half as likely to be convicted and even when convicted, are half as likely to be imprisoned. Police are rarely prosecuted for police shootings, in the first place.
 
Joined
·
5,146 Posts
When you have tons of guns you end up with paranoid police because almost anyone can pull out a deadly weapon on you.
 
1 - 11 of 11 Posts
Top