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Is there a double standard for gay parents? A new study suggests that gay parents are being judged more harshly than straight parents.


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Shocking...not.
 

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Probably stems from the fact that a man/man and woman/woman dynamic cannot procreate and therefore it is unnatural?
 

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Probably stems from the fact that a man/man and woman/woman dynamic cannot procreate and therefore it is unnatural?
Human society exhibits unnatural behavior and uses a lot of "unnatural" tools, though.

And homosexuality/bisexuality pops up in the animal kingdom quite commonly, like in the Bonobo, so...
 

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Human society exhibits unnatural behavior and uses a lot of "unnatural" tools, though.

And homosexuality/bisexuality pops up in the animal kingdom quite commonly, like in the Bonobo, so...


Homosexuality and bisexuality may "pop up in the animal kingdom" but the strict practice of it guarantees their lineage will die out.

And in reference to the Bonobo, there sexuality is a from of greeting, conflict/post conflict resolution and social bonding. They also do not have permanent monogamous relationships...should we just kill marriage altogether?(I'd agree with that). Neither do they discriminate by AGE...therefore, citing your own example, pedophilia is okay with you? They also have sex with their own family members...so incest is acceptable, as well?

So, per your example, are you suggesting we take a step back from our "civilized"(I use that term loosely) ways and play tummysticks(look it up) when two males greet each other, or rub their scrotums together after a debate or fight? When I go to my friends' homes, should it be culturally acceptable for them to play with MY genitalia in order to "accept" me into their circle?

Hell, why don't we fling our poo at people that piss us off on the roadways, too?

The "animals do it, too" argument is fatally flawed and I suggest you don't employ it in your future debates.

So...
 

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Originally Posted by SimpleSauropod
Human society exhibits unnatural behavior and uses a lot of "unnatural" tools, though.



And just how exactly is homosexuality a tool?
 

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Homosexuality and bisexuality may "pop up in the animal kingdom" but the strict practice of it guarantees their lineage will die out.

And in reference to the Bonobo, there sexuality is a from of greeting, conflict/post conflict resolution and social bonding. They also do not have permanent monogamous relationships...should we just kill marriage altogether?(I'd agree with that). Neither do they discriminate by AGE...therefore, citing your own example, pedophilia is okay with you? They also have sex with their own family members...so incest is acceptable, as well?

So, per your example, are you suggesting we take a step back from our "civilized"(I use that term loosely) ways and play tummysticks(look it up) when two males greet each other, or rub their scrotums together after a debate or fight? When I go to my friends' homes, should it be culturally acceptable for them to play with MY genitalia in order to "accept" me into their circle?

Hell, why don't we fling our poo at people that piss us off on the roadways, too?

The "animals do it, too" argument is fatally flawed and I suggest you don't employ it in your future debates.
yankeemofo, you jumped to conclusions and got my position wrong. I'm not saying because it happens in nature that homosexuality/bisexuality is right. I'm arguing that we can't use what's natural or not natural as a basis for rejecting things in human culture. Because as I pointed out, homosexuality/bisexuality exists there so why would it being 'unnatural' be the reason why we reject it? Plus all the other unnatural things we do and accept like computers, alcohol, cars, etc...

Marriage might be even be the unnatural thing considering our closet relatives don't seem to be very monogamous.

And just how exactly is homosexuality a tool?
I wasn't calling it a tool, I was saying whether or not it's natural doesn't matter.

But to answer the question --- human homosexuality and bisexuality could be very similar to the bonobo's, though obviously not as common, as a way of forging stronger bonds between the same sexes to stop conflict. I know the ancient Greeks and Romans culture used sex as way for male soldiers to bond and care about each other more in battle so it's not unheard of.
 

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I don't think they should be judged more harshly. And I personally don't have trouble with same sex couples living together or wanting legal privileges or whatever. However, I do think that a child needs both a mother and a father. So from that perspective, single heterosexual fathers or single hetero moms are as lacking, as are same sex couples. Of course, an argument has been made that it's better to have two men taking care of a little child than nobody at all (orphans) or incompetent parents (abusive, etc). Similar arguments have been advanced in favor of divorce...better to have a single dad raise the little one than mom and dad who are fighting all the times and taking it out on the kid.

But it's about meeting the child's needs, not who is doing it or how or why. If an educated, successful, and loving gay couple adopts a child, then it is possible that they can satisfy some basic needs a child has. They can provide a safe place and protect the child, provide love and care, etc. And to the extent that they do that, it is not fair for anyone to judge them harshly, anymore than a single father who is providing those things for a child.

The children of gay couples, of course, do face some new challenges, in particular with their own perception of what a family is like and should be like, but in particular they could be excluded or bullied because of their parents and matters of acceptance of homosexuality. So of course, additional help needs to be provided as a result, to protect the child.

But aside from that, I think it would be nice for any kid to be cared for by loving people in forms of friends and family, regardless of their sex or gender or religion or whatever.
 

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yankeemofo, you jumped to conclusions and got my position wrong. I'm not saying because it happens in nature that homosexuality/bisexuality is right. I'm arguing that we can't use what's natural or not natural as a basis for rejecting things in human culture. Because as I pointed out, homosexuality/bisexuality exists there so why would it being 'unnatural' be the reason why we reject it? Plus all the other unnatural things we do and accept like computers, alcohol, cars, etc...

Marriage might be even be the unnatural thing considering our closet relatives don't seem to be very monogamous.



I wasn't calling it a tool, I was saying whether or not it's natural doesn't matter.

But to answer the question --- human homosexuality and bisexuality could be very similar to the bonobo's, though obviously not as common, as a way of forging stronger bonds between the same sexes to stop conflict. I know the ancient Greeks and Romans culture used sex as way for male soldiers to bond and care about each other more in battle so it's not unheard of.

My point was regarding the unnatural aspect of same sex couples raising children, until I went off on a tangent...
 

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My point was regarding the unnatural aspect of same sex couples raising children, until I went off on a tangent...
That's nice, but like you even argued, what's natural or not natural does not translate to if it's acceptable or good for society. Maybe instead of saying "unnatural" you say negative or disadvantageous and we can go from there for this debate.
 

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That's nice, but like you even argued, what's natural or not natural does not translate to if it's acceptable or good for society. Maybe instead of saying "unnatural" you say negative or disadvantageous and we can go from there for this debate.

I don't believe it is necessarily negative or disadvantageous. I do, however, believe it is unnatural:
un·nat·u·ral/ˌənˈnaCH(ə)rəl/

[COLOR=#878787 !important]Adjective


  1. Contrary to the ordinary course of nature; abnormal.

[/COLOR]


Same sex couples simply cannot procreate and homosexual "relations" are deviant by definition thus, raising a child may be considered by most as being unnatural.
 

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I don't believe it is necessarily negative or disadvantageous. I do, however, believe it is unnatural:
un·nat·u·ral

/ˌənˈnaCH(ə)rəl/

[/COLOR]


Same sex couples simply cannot procreate and homosexual "relations" are deviant by definition thus, raising a child may be considered by most as being unnatural.
Well, if you're using the first defintion of as abnormal or uncommon, then yes. The second of it never happening in nature would be wrong. There's the gay/bisexual penguins that try and raise chicks for an example off the top of my head.
 

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Well, if you're using the first defintion of as abnormal or uncommon, then yes. The second of it never happening in nature would be wrong. There's the gay/bisexual penguins that try and raise chicks for an example off the top of my head.
I understand where you're coming from, I believe. I don't know if the penguins are (technically speaking)homosexual but I agree they do attempt to raise young together. Maybe it's more like "My Two Dads"?
 
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