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To be honest, I think he probably wanted to try dating you, but he couldn't do it for a variety of reasons, whether it be just for the preservation of the friendship, which he might've believed could be ruined (and trust me, it does happen, from my experience), just plain fear, maybe he tried hinting at it futilely in a poor attempt to gauge your response, or some other reason. He definitely cannot just instantly turn his feelings off like a light switch, because it takes time to get over everything. Few human beings can, although INTPs definitely have an advantage in this field, in my opinion. You probably didn't even realize something was bothering him over the course of getting over his feelings.

Now onto the solution: I honestly don't think that leaving the friendship outside of maybe a week or two to cool off and get your head straight is the best idea. He will be hurt when you leave his company, whether he turned off his romantic feelings for you or not. Unless you've gotten on his blacklist, he still has friendly feelings toward you, certainly (hopefully?). That said, staying away from him for about a week to a month will do you good. For me, actual crying does a lot of good, and while I don't cry in public, it does retain some chemical benefits.

For future prevention: Graficcha's advice will become more pertinent when you actually try to date more people. Whenever you ask someone out and are rejected, it becomes that much easier to get over. Since it is a sociological phenomenon that women are usually approached by men, it might be a bit harder on you for some time when rejected, possibly a bit uncomfortable just approaching people. It differs for everybody, but usually it becomes much easier to get over rejection with the more rejection you have. I don't know how many people you've asked out/been rejected by before, but I'd suggest trying to date and approach other people more.



Also, this feels like a threat. Definitely a no. This raises all my hackles. All of them.

ALTHOUGH, of course, he could be just an asshole/I-could-be-wrong/something something something else. Still, my future prevention method stands. Soon, you, too, can flick your emotions on and off like a light bulb (I guess. I still don't believe that really anyone can to a great extent.)
Update: I apologized to him and said I couldn't hold it against him. I kind of continue to use him as a sounding board for my thoughts per our usual relationship but nothing else has changed. I have no fantasies about me and him. I'm just trying to move forward and am getting to know new people. I feel better having him in my life even just as a friend. Not sure how healthy that is :-/
 
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Ok so I'm having a trouble over here.

First off I go to an all boys school. Yeah, I know there are some major cons from that. >_>
I realize the importance of having many female friends, or at least getting to know females. I'm aiming at getting used to it because I've been in in a boys school right from grade 6 all the way till... well grade 11's almost over, so yeah. There ARE times when I get nervous but I realize I could probably make small talk if they were interested in talking. I can talk with my sister's friends since I've known them since childhood but someone new is a tough one.

So today as I was waiting to pick up my sister from school(she comes out of school 45 min after I do) I just kept looking at the girls of my age coming out of school and I was thinking to myself "I need to get over this sometime but how am I supposed to strike a convo just like that? I don't want to come across as flirt/creep but I still need to initiate a convo. Somehow."

So any other ways I could get over this? This isn't really about dating but more about getting used to talking to the opposite sex.

EDIT: And ftr I do know that girls are humans too I hope I don't get any comment like that. I mostly view things equally so no worries. Just you know, worried in case my post gives some sort of sexist vibe O_O
 

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Ok so I'm having a trouble over here.

First off I go to an all boys school. Yeah, I know there are some major cons from that. >_>
I realize the importance of having many female friends, or at least getting to know females. I'm aiming at getting used to it because I've been in in a boys school right from grade 6 all the way till... well grade 11's almost over, so yeah. There ARE times when I get nervous but I realize I could probably make small talk if they were interested in talking. I can talk with my sister's friends since I've known them since childhood but someone new is a tough one.

So today as I was waiting to pick up my sister from school(she comes out of school 45 min after I do) I just kept looking at the girls of my age coming out of school and I was thinking to myself "I need to get over this sometime but how am I supposed to strike a convo just like that? I don't want to come across as flirt/creep but I still need to initiate a convo. Somehow."

So any other ways I could get over this? This isn't really about dating but more about getting used to talking to the opposite sex.

EDIT: And ftr I do know that girls are humans too I hope I don't get any comment like that. I mostly view things equally so no worries. Just you know, worried in case my post gives some sort of sexist vibe O_O
I was indeed going to say 'girls are just people, too', just to point out there's really not much to worry about, but don't worry, you just sound awkward with a lack of direct personal experience, not sexist.

Have you talked to 'female specimens' online? If you want to experience for yourself what at least *some* girls are like, why not dump yourself into a conversation and just talk, do whatever. Ask them for advice, get second, third, fourth opinion, you might quickly figure out there's really not that many rules besides 'don't be an asshole' xD

If you can talk to guyfriends, you can talk to females as well. The only difference is that you'll have an increased chance that at some point you might want to make a few things a little more explicit, such as when you end up interested in someone or if you want to point out you're really just wanting to talk. Usually people appreciate open, honest communication, don't be afraid to just say things as they are xD

Though if you go ahead and tell them you're looking for a bit of exercise with social skills - the ladies chapter because you come from an all-dudes school, I wager you might get a few giggles or awwwws, and a whole lot of feedback xD
There are worse things, I guess?
 

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Ok so I'm having a trouble over here.

First off I go to an all boys school. Yeah, I know there are some major cons from that. >_>
I realize the importance of having many female friends, or at least getting to know females. I'm aiming at getting used to it because I've been in in a boys school right from grade 6 all the way till... well grade 11's almost over, so yeah. There ARE times when I get nervous but I realize I could probably make small talk if they were interested in talking. I can talk with my sister's friends since I've known them since childhood but someone new is a tough one.

So today as I was waiting to pick up my sister from school(she comes out of school 45 min after I do) I just kept looking at the girls of my age coming out of school and I was thinking to myself "I need to get over this sometime but how am I supposed to strike a convo just like that? I don't want to come across as flirt/creep but I still need to initiate a convo. Somehow."

So any other ways I could get over this? This isn't really about dating but more about getting used to talking to the opposite sex.

EDIT: And ftr I do know that girls are humans too I hope I don't get any comment like that. I mostly view things equally so no worries. Just you know, worried in case my post gives some sort of sexist vibe O_O
If I was in an all boys school I think I'd have dropped out of HS.
Seriously, seeing girls were the only reason I got motivated to go to school somedays.
Aside from feeling bad for your position I guess I'll offer some advice.

Talk to them like you know them well, be comfortable. Greet them like you've met a long lost friend.
Smile and repeat what they say to show you're listening to them. "Oh medicine? That's a pretty interesting field - how did you become interested in that?"
Ask them questions about themselves, since you're in high school college questions/how's high school is a good place to start.
When you say bye, say something like well it was nice to talk to you - I hope -> (something related to what they talked about) works out for you. And hey let me give you my number so you can give me a call sometime.

I just simply tell girls: Hey let me get your number. If I want to get a girl's number who I've had a nice conversation with it works all the time. I mean why wouldn't it? You thought they were cool you'll likely never see them again if you have no place you'd see them again. It's just logical they'd give you their number.

Seriously works pretty well. Notice the language is pretty confident and that's the way you have to approach it. Non-nonchalant, expected, not worried about the response. You have to imagine it'd be weird to get turned down...because it would be right?

Oh yeah I just realized that when I ask girls for their number I'll start looking for my phone or already have my phone out showing them. I've done that automatically but I assume it's associated with my high success rate. I really don't get why they'd say no if I decide to ask for it, because of the vibe that we got along well.

Oh yeah and in case you were wondering, just text them the next day with something related to what you talked about the day before. Don't delay texting them lol. I don't usually call cause I'm not a big phone guy. If you're a phone guy I'd still text them and ask when they're free to chat. Or better yet you can be like "I'm kinda busy but I am free (day or two later) we should chat if you have some time".

My tone of voice is the same sort of tone I'd have with a good friend or family member.
If you have a questioning tone you'll get rejected, you seem nervous and unconfident and perhaps they question your motives as a result. After all if you just want to continue the conversation what's the big deal?

I think it helped me at first to imagine I was just talking about something we were getting tested on in school. Just conversational, slightly excitable: Ex - Ugh I can't believe they're going to test us on the entire chapter.

Notice my use of "us", "we", "you", "your", etc. That's friendly language ;)
 

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@Graficcha:

Well I you know, lurked on the Sex and Relationship forums so I guess I'm wary after looking into the "I'm sick of people putting women on pedestals" thread? Dunno I don't try to portray anything like that. xD

Yeah I have talked to 'female specimens' online(haha yeah its fun to call it that) and I don't consider it practice although I guess insight is always nice to have? I'm generally paranoid about coming off as a creep or a flirt really. And kinda paranoid about developing feelings later on if I DO make female friends. xD Its cool though, I'm a straightforward person in any case.

And yeah, there are worse things lol. ^_^
@NT the DC:

Asking questions about themselves is a no-brainer for me- I do that with anyone I talk ftr. More like "I need to know said person better before talking about other topics." I'm not sure if that's a questioning tone or anything, I just can't get convos started otherwise. I'm also not much of a phone guy but I guess having something to do with a phone for the change is worth a shot. xD

Well I've had a friend who I never spoke to for a long time so when we did talk on phone she said I'm not as 'nervous as I was when we were in the same school' and that was a long time ago(7 yrs or something). So apparently I'm more confident now? Maybe its my paranoia more than anything?
 

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@NT the DC:

Asking questions about themselves is a no-brainer for me- I do that with anyone I talk ftr. More like "I need to know said person better before talking about other topics." I'm not sure if that's a questioning tone or anything, I just can't get convos started otherwise. I'm also not much of a phone guy but I guess having something to do with a phone for the change is worth a shot. xD

Well I've had a friend who I never spoke to for a long time so when we did talk on phone she said I'm not as 'nervous as I was when we were in the same school' and that was a long time ago(7 yrs or something). So apparently I'm more confident now? Maybe its my paranoia more than anything?
Well that's the thing.. you talk to the people that you actually talk to by asking them questions. But you don't talk to people you don't know, hence you don't ask them about themselves because you don't talk to them lol.

Your question seemed to be how do you ask people questions about themselves if you don't know them.
Be interested in them, ask them questions about themselves. The same sort of thing you do with friends or friends of friends. If you have problems approaching them find something you like about them and compliment them on it. Think about someone who displays something you resonate with - for example they have a shirt from your favorite cartoon. And you instantly think they're pretty cool cause you like the same obscure cartoon.

You may even make a compliment like: hey that's a pretty sweet shirt, I love that show. - conversation starts..."How long have you watched it? I like so and so in the show, etc." the ice is broken you can flow from there.

Look for aspects of clothing that say something about the person.
Basketball shoes? Minimus trail shoes? Dress shoes? Each says a different thing about them.
For example: Oh I dig your minimus shoes I have some myself, do you know of any great hiking trails in the area? - ice breaker. They're so comfortable I like wearing them everywhere if I can get away with it. Etc.

Also if you can't find an easy thing to bring up about their presentation look at the environment. If you're at school that's why I said it's easy to say something like "So how is so and so school? I have a sister that goes there and she said it sucks".. ask your sister things about the school that makes it seem like you're somewhat familiar with it. I know so and so (your sisters friends) do you know them?

Chicks always say stuff like you're not as nervous as you were before, I've found it's because they liked you.
But really it's because they want you to make comments about them. In that situation she probably wanted you to say, "Oh well yeah I was more nervous then, but you're a lot different now you were so and so in school. How do you think you've changed since 7 years ago?"

That's how you avoid talking about yourself.
Oh yeah and make jokes at your expense, people like that because it seems like you're confident if done right.

Ex: Minimus trail shoe person: Yeah you look like you can handle that kind of trail that sounds level 10 of 10 to me. I'd probably have to start rolling halfway through while you were still running like a gazelle. (Note I am in shape so it's obvious I can hang, yet they dig that I compliment them and I am not afraid to laugh at myself)
 

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Well, I can say from an INFPs standpoint (I'm dating an INTP). We fall deeply in love when we do. We have the tendancy to put our partners on a pedastool and would do just about anything for them. Sometimes this happens rather quickly, and may seem a bit odd to the other person.
Thanks! He's said some rather similar things about himself, so I think I'm on the right track with my INFP assumptions. Well...even more than I did before, because he's pretty overwhelmingly INFP-ish.

To be perfectly honest, I'm terrified of the "putting someone on a pedestal" kind of love. I experienced this in a long (and, to be fair, lovely) relationship with an ENFJ. He thought I was absolutely perfect to the point where I ended up feeling pressured and restricted and...like he didn't really know me. His perfect vision of me was so far from the truth that I thought our relationship couldn't help but snap when the truth inevitably cut in. (And so I distanced myself and ran away, which is another story, but hey I was 17 and I know not to treat people that way anymore. I hope.)

I hope this question doesn't sound disrespectful...but do you find that this deep love lasts at all? Do you find it blinds you to the other person's faults for a while, but then things change?

For the record, my INFP doesn't make me feel as overwhelmed as my ex did. He readily acknowledges that I have flaws and that there are some things I do that he doesn't like (being too worried about stepping on other people's toes to make decisions is number one), but he says he wouldn't change anything about me. So it's easier to believe that he "knows" me in a way that will last. But sometimes it seems impossible that one could direct such intense emotion toward the same person for very long. Which I suppose is a hypocritical thing for me to say, since I have intense feelings for him and the sense that I will for a very long time.

I'm not sure my INTP boyfriend understands why I love him, or even how much I do. I sometimes wonder why he likes me as well. I think both types (since they are very similar) understand eachothers quirks and special traits, the traits we don't think much of because they usually go unnoticed by others.
I think you're right about that! He mentioned to me that some people find him off-putting because he's...well, introverted and can't always find ways to make conversation, but I'm so astronomically bad at social interaction that I never noticed that he was a lesser degree of "socially awkward" until he pointed it out. Honestly, people shouldn't even complain about being awkward in front of me; it's practically my middle name. But anyway, since I don't pick up on things like that, I always saw him as incredibly charming. And I love the way his mind works. It's a lot like mine.
 
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ugh. here again. always in moments of internal crisis. I hate myself already for my rambling. Sorry for the novel I am about to write all over this thread.

Not only is my boyfriend an INTP, but he is an upperclass British INTP. The british upperclass alone have their own language, which, from what I have gathered over the years, consists of underestimating everything (when something is absolutley fantastic=not bad. when you're violently sick and vomiting your insides out=feeling a bit under the weather) and generally not showing emotion, save maybe elation, esp for the men. Seeing as he is proud of and adheres to his british background, its a double threat combined with being an INTP. The lack of extroverted feeling/showing emotion.

And I am sort of an idiot when it comes to relationships myself. Oh, and I am an INFP. That part about approaching everything with Fi first makes me trust NOTHING I think about relationships, because I always doubt how much logic really went into that thought.

Is there some concrete sign that an INTP loves you? I think in most situations one would say, "If you have to ask, it's probably a no" but for this particular case, aka my boyfriend, I really do. The way he treats all of his relationships, close friends and family, is to expect he can call and hang out when it comes to mind and when he has finished whatever project he's doing. They may go weeks or months without hearing from him, then he'll pick up the phone and say, "hey, lets go to lunch". They go to lunch, its great, then they won't hear again from him until....? Whenever it strikes him to call again or he needs something from them. Text messages have a low chance of being responded to, and definitley not in a timely fashion.

So, I give him credit for making the effort to call me once a week, pretty regularly. I don't think anyone else, not even his parents, can expect to hear from him that often, and knowing how chaotic he is, it does deserve mention. Ha, though he probably thinks I don't notice he always calls 30 min before dinner or very late at night before bed as a means to easily end the call.

When I go to visit, he always plans a wonderful stay, takes me to nice places, plans get togethers with friends (yes...planning, I find that also to be mention worthy for someone who's philosophy is if you leave it to the last minute it only takes a minute), and I always have a great time. As soon as I go back to my country however, it's always a question what the time inbetween visits will be like. Sometimes he's in a romantic mood and will call every other day and send me music/sheet music etc. though this is the more rare situation. More often than not it will be 4 weeks of one prescribed 30 min phone call per week, and the couple of txts I send go ignored 50% of the time. It really is as though it is how the moon strikes him that particular week.

So I am left feeling confused in those intermitant periods of zero affection, then I see him, going in with the expectation he will be somehow distant to me in person as well, but it simply depends. Somedays he is flirtatious and cuddly, others a robot. Makes me think of The Prestige...as though he has an identical twin which sometimes takes his place.

I don't know if I am being used, which is what I fear, because I am so very leniant to his personality. I think most girls wouldn't put up with it, definitley for not as long as I have. I do it because I love him and he is a fantastic, talented, good hearted person who I love being with. But as I said, this feeling of confusion, not knowing if he truly cares about me or if I am just a girlfriend he has found that he must put minimal effort into and still gets to have sex with, is causing me great anxiety. I think his character is much better than that, I have a hard time believeing he would do that, but, still, nonetheless, the thought crosses my mind, since he is young.

I have expressed these feelings to him before, he normally panics and says he's an idiot and will try harder, and he does for about a week, then everything goes back to how it is. I don't care really, honestly, how often he calls. I'm just not used to, or rather, this system of compartmentalising love into a certain order, "Ok. Call girlfriend, check. Now do this...." and being able to set it aside completley when involved with something else is....very foreign to me and hard to grasp. So I just need to be reassured it is possible for someone (namely INTP types) to love you and act that way (or... reassured it's not.)
 

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Questions: just how far apart do you live? What's his occupation atm actually? Yours? Do you use IM media to communicate? Does he? Do you both? If no, why not? If no, START DOING IT.

Talk more, just talk, whenever possible, take it all into writing, when you're apart-together, it *works wonders*. He won't have to emote, he can ponder over his words, he might feel more expressive when he has the time, you can speak freely. I've had little trouble that way speaking about very feelsy issues and topics with my INTP-foxy. We're a longdistance thing (Belgium-California), but we talk every single day pretty much. Little pinches of 'hi hey everthing ok, I did this thing today, found a funny story, been thinking of this and that, have a nice day just pretend I'm in your pocket' that keeps the presence up.

If he wants to try and communicate more, make it easy for him. If he has access to a computer you can write e-mails, go via gtalk, mobile IM, anything you can think of. Leave him some thoughts, ponderings, things you find funny... Ask him to tell you when the contact becomes too voerwhelming, and if it does you might chunk it up, like these daily/weekly phonecalls where you discuss what's been going on over a longer timespan.

Give him a hand in 'involving himself' in you, and letting you get involved in his life. Bit by bit. You can even discuss these topics with him in writing/typing. I think he might find it easier to talk about that way.
 
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Questions: just how far apart do you live? What's his occupation atm actually? Yours? Do you use IM media to communicate? Does he? Do you both? If no, why not? If no, START DOING IT.

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Writing. We used to skype chat a lot, before he entered the army. I used to send him emails. But I have stopped because my feelings were getting far too hurt when he never responded. I think the last email he responded to was a few months ago.

The army has much to do with it, it has been a busy year for him which is also why I gave him a lot of space. But, at what point should I be disappointed in the lack of communication?

The distance is UK-Germany, so not so great.

I just don't know. I agree to communicate more would be best but, I don't handle being ignored too well. It puts me off. So maybe on part its my fault for communicating less. I still do try, but not as often because, as I have said, its more likely I won't be responded to.
 

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Writing. We used to skype chat a lot, before he entered the army. I used to send him emails. But I have stopped because my feelings were getting far too hurt when he never responded. I think the last email he responded to was a few months ago.

The army has much to do with it, it has been a busy year for him which is also why I gave him a lot of space. But, at what point should I be disappointed in the lack of communication?

The distance is UK-Germany, so not so great.

I just don't know. I agree to communicate more would be best but, I don't handle being ignored too well. It puts me off. So maybe on part its my fault for communicating less. I still do try, but not as often because, as I have said, its more likely I won't be responded to.
I can't say I have experience with army stuff, but I think he's limited because he's really just busy and hasn't much access to the conventional means. I'd perhaps advise to just stick it out until he's back home, yes? I can't imagine it's easy for him to retain a connection like that either, when you need to kickstart it every time all over again.

Keep communicating, but I'd just be patient and wait until he comes back to see where you stand.
 
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I can't say I have experience with army stuff, but I think he's limited because he's really just busy and hasn't much access to the conventional means. I'd perhaps advise to just stick it out until he's back home, yes? I can't imagine it's easy for him to retain a connection like that either, when you need to kickstart it every time all over again.

Keep communicating, but I'd just be patient and wait until he comes back to see where you stand.
He is moving this weekend actually, and we will only be an hour apart by car, so I am interested to see how that changes things.

My question though is, as I asked before, as an INTP are you able to have no communication with someone who care for, like an on and off switch, when they are not around? Is this something that sounds peculiar or normal for a young INTP man? Is there any sure"test" to see if he genuinely cares?
 

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He is moving this weekend actually, and we will only be an hour apart by car, so I am interested to see how that changes things.

My question though is, as I asked before, as an INTP are you able to have no communication with someone who care for, like an on and off switch, when they are not around? Is this something that sounds peculiar or normal for a young INTP man? Is there any sure"test" to see if he genuinely cares?
See how it develops, I can't say the army sounds like a typical INTP place to hang out in as it is. Personally I like to stay in close contact with my friends, at least online.

Anyone else any input on this?
 

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My question though is, as I asked before, as an INTP are you able to have no communication with someone who care for, like an on and off switch, when they are not around? Is this something that sounds peculiar or normal for a young INTP man? Is there any sure"test" to see if he genuinely cares?
There is a cultural difference, with the Brit uppercrust thing you've described, so I can't tell you that for sure.

I will just tell you that, for me, I can be very fond of someone and care about them, but not talk to them much. They are still often in my mind; I am thinking about them and things we have done together or shared together; but it's really draining to invest in a lot of direct communication without an easily delineated break-off point.

(You mentioned noticing that he will call where he will have an easy escape within a certain amount of time. I find that even when I really like someone, I will do the same thing; it depletes my energy to talk to them, but I'm bad at saying, "Hey I need to go," and I'm afraid you won't let me go "just because I'm worn out," and so I will strategize the encounter to allow me an excuse. It's not personal, it's honestly me and not you.)

Anyway, it's still very possible he very much cares. I think the question you need to ask yourself is if what he is giving is what you need and want. Are you cool with things being this way, if this is the way he needs/wants to relate to you? there is no right or wrong, necessarily; and it might just be the way he rolls. Is it good enough? Are you happy? If not, you will need to negotiate or leave. If so, overall, then you are good.

Don't be afraid to ask an INTP for something, IF you do it in a non-emotional/undemanding way. We're reasonable and adaptable but sometimes clueless. If you present it as you're just asking, since it would mean something to you, and don't pressure us, then we will puzzle through it and adapt if we can in general. Of course, if you want us to resist you with every ounce of our being, then trying to emotionally manipulate or browbeat us... that's going to cause an immediate, "See ya."
 
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Anyway, it's still very possible he very much cares. I think the question you need to ask yourself is if what he is giving is what you need and want. Are you cool with things being this way, if this is the way he needs/wants to relate to you? there is no right or wrong, necessarily; and it might just be the way he rolls. Is it good enough? Are you happy? If not, you will need to negotiate or leave. If so, overall, then you are good.
thanks ladies for your input.

those questions, "are you cool with things being this way" "is it good enough" "am I happy" I've had a lot of time to think about. Ultimatley the answer is yes, as long as I know for sure he cares for me. Its hard for me to be rational about it all at the moment because, everything else in my life is going so terribly wrong. I know when things are all well, I have a different mindset that copes far far better with the long distance/little communication. I'm a person who appreciates having space too, but all in moderation :)
 

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@Jennywocky nailed a lot of things. Good post!

My prevailing thought from your first post was that you are running into hurdles that are inherent to long-distance relationships. Him moving closer will probably help, because I suspect, based on the fears you mentioned, that you'll not get the amount of interaction you are seeking of him unless you can have more regular in-person communication (still the best kind, even with all our modern networking conveniences.)

I second Graficcha's suggestion of trying instant messaging, though I know it's not for everyone. I'm personally pretty terrible about returning calls or texts on any conventionally acceptable time frame (unless it's work related), and only slightly less bad about emails. With instant messages one can hammer out a few sentences to express oneself (including affections!) immediately as it occurs to them. Being able to express affections spontaneously is important, because without getting that “at the source,” the INTP may never bother to express it. Their mind will already have engaged upon something else. This is where those intermittent periods of zero communication/robot phases come from.

My question though is, as I asked before, as an INTP are you able to have no communication with someone who care for, like an on and off switch, when they are not around?
Absolutely. The friends I care deeply for will often be in my thoughts, even if it's been awhile since we last spoke.
 

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I agree with the texting thing. Short, simple, and immediate... it really works well for me in terms of making contact. I also use texting with my kids, since they're older and we spend some time apart; we can just zing each other and feel connected just by an occasional back-and-forth even if the big blocks of time are not available at the time.
 
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