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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
...how do you react?

This is hard for me to articulate, but I think this is in line with what someone previously described as an NJ sense of justice. It really bothers me a lot when I see someone who doesn't deserve something, but attain it anyway.

This is a school related example since I'm a recent college grad: if someone works hard, earns good grades, spends a great deal of time/energy/dedication on their goals, and gets into a great grad. school, I respect them for their strong values, their ideology, and their hard work. Likewise, I've met people who told me, "I want to get into X Med school because it's prestigious and I'm ambitious." And they go about working hard for it. I acknowledge those people, too, because at least they are willing to work hard for something important to them, whether or not i agree with or like their motivations. Plus, at least they are honest and straight-forward about their motivations of pursuing ambition. I've also met people who aren't sure of what they want in the future, but still work hard and have strong values about what they do now. As long as they keep true to themselves and seek to develop some kind of ideology that is important to them while they figure out things, I respect them.

But, when I see someone cheat or see that someone is shallow/lacking in values/ideology, I lose respect for them. When I talk about "shallow," I am referring to those who pursue something not because it is important to them or because it is a goal they want. Hard to describe these people or know what they are about 'cause I can't relate... but I've met some people who lack a remote sense of ideology or strong values that ground them. I've also met people who are clearly pursuing something out of personal ambition, but spend half their time criticizing people who are upfront about their ambition and the other half trying to do something that I don't really quite get/can't put my finger on (I just sense the insincerity). Anyway if they get into a great grad. school, I feel frustrated and feel that they don't deserve it. And yes, I have a hard time getting over it.

Enough ranting! Do you guys also feel similarly when people get rewarded for something they don't deserve? and feel free to share your own personal examples/experiences too. Mine is just a recent example I encountered.
 

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Yeah, funnily I thought it was our sense of justice upon reading just the title before opening the thread. It explains why unhealthy infjs can become obsessed with seeking revenge. We may be opposed to acting on it but it doesn't stop the occasional fantasizing.

I definitely believe everyone should own the fruits of their labour, but in reality people don't have equal utility which makes me sympathise with slackers too. I would be a hypocrite not to. I hate competitive institutions bc they provoke people to suck up to superiors and step on others' toes just to get ahead. Sure some people need such an environment to realise their p.b., but I think so many variables can be manipulated when a diverse group of people have to measure up to a standardised criteria. Factor that in with differing perceptions of skill + intelligence eg. passion, hard work, playing by the rules vs getting the most done with greatest efficiency & least amount of effort... well the whole concept of fair play is sabotaged and tends to blow up in everyone's face. Being cynical and defeatist about the whole thing influenced my decision not to go to uni, just makes me want to romanticise all my indignant mediocrities ahah. But if I were in your situation, I would probably be feeling the same way.

I've also met people who are clearly pursuing something out of personal ambition, but spend half their time criticizing people who are upfront about their ambition and the other half trying to do something that I don't really quite get/can't put my finger on (I just sense the insincerity). Anyway if they get into a great grad. school, I feel frustrated and feel that they don't deserve it. And yes, I have a hard time getting over it.
Yes! It used to piss me off when this one girl would loudly scoff at how much effort I put into my essays (since I had a slight problem with minimum length), yet everyone knew she was one of the most competitive in the class and used tactics of intimidation to try and make successful students crack. Insincerity in general tends to infuriate me, but sometimes I have a hard time separating my own envy of those who are genuinely doing better than me from my criticism of those who aren't for the benefit of all.
 

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im not sure words can truly describe how much i hate it... it might have to do with my upbringing.
in my family i was the one that did all the work out of my siblings despite being the youngest, my older step brother was the star football player (enfj i think) and reminds me a lot of a car salesman lol..
i would do all the cleaning and cooking for my family and he would life a finger right before my parents would walk in and get all the praise for the work.. :angry: i would clean the gutters or paint the house while he was across the street smoking pot and just as he would see my dads car drive up he would run up and grab a rake and get near the pile of leaves i had just raked and be rewarded money while i just looked.. somewhat in shock.. and just went back to work. i thought i was just imagining these things until my parents somewhat recently told me they were sorry for treating me so badly but by that time the "bridge had been burned" and i've.... "disowned" them and moved half way across the country.
i rather spend my time helping people who work hard and still need help then spoiled people who only put just enough effort to get by and expect the rest to be handed to them. this is something i'll always have a problem with and its soo prevalent and accepted in today's "culture" all you have to do is turn on the tv... people famous and rich for nothing...sorry if im ranting.
 

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Yeah... I don't really speak up about this stuff... but it does bother me quite a bit..

I think it's our strongly held value system... we believe in Integrity and Justice... so when we see something like this it turns our stomach. Does anyone speak up about it? Call them out on it?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Btmangan, are you asking those questions to me specifically? Because in these situations, people I know rarely talk openly about it or call people out on it. Most people I know react by saying, "I can't believe she got in!" or when they first hear about it, "Are you serious...? Cause that really sucks." And then they move on, or so it seems. For me, my first thought is "how is that even possible?" and I start questioning the fairness of this situation. After deliberating on various factors and after I conclude that this is indeed an unfair/unjust situation, I get stuck in a rut about it.
 

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When I was a Senior in High School, there were several of us who were auditioning for a college scholoarship; to audition, we were required to perform two pieces of music on our instrument of choice (mine was voice), and we were also interviewed briefly by the judges who would be deciding who got the scholarship.

Anyway, there was this one girl who I overheard talking to a friend of hers, and she mentioned the scholarship audition coming up and said something like, "I don't really need the scholarship, my parents can afford to send me wherever I want to go." Guess who won the scholarship...Grr...
 

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When I was a Senior in High School, there were several of us who were auditioning for a college scholoarship; to audition, we were required to perform two pieces of music on our instrument of choice (mine was voice), and we were also interviewed briefly by the judges who would be deciding who got the scholarship.

Anyway, there was this one girl who I overheard talking to a friend of hers, and she mentioned the scholarship audition coming up and said something like, "I don't really need the scholarship, my parents can afford to send me wherever I want to go." Guess who won the scholarship...Grr...
God damn that sucks :crying:
 

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Only INFJs and "Unknown Personalities"? Looks like it's time for a T invasion.:kitteh:
When this occurs around me, it plays out 1 of 2 ways.
1) If it's someone I'm unfamiliar with, or a not-so-close friend, I'll keep my mouth shut, but I give them one heck-of-a-glare.
2) If it's a family member, or someone I'm close to, I snark about it. A lot. To the point that I annoy myself. I don't let people get a sense of superiority for something they didn't deserve. It's just annoying.
 

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I think that situation is endemic in the world - and you have to cope with it or lose your perspective. This is an immoral world. Virtue MUST be its own reward because there sure as heck is none other.
Back in the day we had a phrase - "Hero Designate" the fair haired lads - and lasses - that showed up at the critical moment with a powerful sponsor and then got all the credit, rewards and acclaim - and we would say, "I would't want it like that!" but we lied.
 

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Yes. I used to think this way very much.

But no so much now. I think I've learned to accept the fact that not everyone has the same values and ideals as me. And that that is okay. And that they should not be penalized for who they are. (they still deserve what they get in life).

It is okay to be honest and not admire, respect or enjoy their company as much due to these traits.

But the fact is that the sun revolves around a slacker as much as a productive person,

and that is truth.

Being honest and being truthful are 2 totally different concepts. And in my honest opinion, I think it is a Ni Dom + J Combo that makes us shank ourselves every day to swim in the depths of our inner waters of both; truth and honesty. It's a balance ... Try to find your balance.
Yes. I am aware I am talking to a retired account.
But honestly, you are (probably) so lurking about anyways :tongue:
 
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