[StraightCrushin]

Hello. I'm interested in seeing what the different types I'm not familiar of struggle with while growing up. I've heard lots of different statements and descriptions about ESTP but I doubt even half of them are true. I want to hear from your mouths.

I know the functions but how do you use them and which ones have given you trouble throughout your life? How does introverted intuition work for you? I see how introverted thinking works in ENTPs but how does it work for you?

Additionally,
Are the majority of you all really party-starters, adventurers, and smooth-talking negotiators?

 

[DJArendee]

my favorite letters are F and N. I live S everyday, it gets old.

smooth talker: Yes, someone once called me a "wordsmith."

Party starter: If I look around the party and know exactly what it needs and know I have the jokes and enthusiasm at that particular moment to pull it off, sometimes yes. At a wedding I was on the dance floor by myself with a beer in one hand pointing at all the old people using my right hand to signal that they need to booze up and get out here. haha. They looked at me like I was the biggest idiot they ever met.

Adventurer: Hell yes.

Which functions give me the most trouble? I'd say Fe. The weak Ni has never really been a problem for me, or maybe it has but I'm unsure in what ways. The Weak Fe is a pain in the butt with my bluntness. In my earlier days I had a phase where I feared isolation and I tried to fit in with everyone, it was almost like I was just sitting there collecting dust and everyone's expectations piled up on me while I never acted like myself. I've since given most of them the metaphorical bird and started being myself again. Humility isn't really what its cracked up to be, its mostly a word that they weak cry out when they're jealous of the strong "have some humility BRAAAGGHHH!" I have 2 INTJ's in my family so the Ni has been pretty much ingrained in me or I've just use my Se to get around it most of the time.

Then again the only real reason I'm an ESTP is because I'm giving it a shot. For the most part I believe it more than ISTP. The ISTP's on this forum aren't nearly ballistic enough for me to fit in.

random question: are you an INTJ? (I'm basing this purely on your avatar and "unknown personality" tag)

 

[natatatalia]

The biggest struggle was always the struggle with myself. Especially before I knew mbti and that I was an ESTP, sometimes I didn't understand myself, thought that I was weird. When I was a kid I didn't want to be different (well, who does), but later I thought that nothing is worse than being normal.
But I still struggle with myself, I think that an ESTP always would, as my head is full of paradoxes which would never be resolved. Like, for example, wanting to reach a goal really badly, and on the other hand wanting to not reach it, cause when you do it's over. The same thing with relationships. Wanting to dominate and to be dominated at the same time. This kind of shit. An ESTP can't reach a balance, and when they do, they would think of a new paradox to be struggling about, otherwise we'd die from boredom.

As for the functions. I love the Se-Ti combination. Just perceiving the world and then, like a computer, see a problem, analyse everything and come to a new conclusion. Like when I was younger, I loved maths, solving equasions, cause we go through our lives solving situations like those equasions.

 

[StraightCrushin]

smooth talker: Yes, someone once called me a "wordsmith."

HAWT!

Random answer: Nope, I'm something else.

@natatatalia
I had NO idea ESTP's went through this. I mean, you are logical sensors. Se-Ti sounds beautiful. You're like perfectly set-up to rape the opportunities this world has to offer; In a tangible way to boot. I still can't see what's so bad.

@Idan of Europa
About your earlier days, was there period where you were somewhat of a rebel that people admired? Also....Do ESTPs even sign onto the forums? Do you know how many there are here? It seems so quiet :crazy:

 

[DJArendee]

HAWT!

Random answer: Nope, I'm something else.

@natatatalia
I had NO idea ESTP's went through this. I mean, you are logical sensors. Se-Ti sounds beautiful. You're like perfectly set-up to rape the opportunities this world has to offer; In a tangible way to boot. I still can't see what's so bad.

@Idan of Europa
About your earlier days, was there period where you were somewhat of a rebel that people admired? Also....Do ESTPs even sign onto the forums? Do you know how many there are here? It seems so quiet :crazy:

Teachers hated me. My friends would sit around me joking during class. I'd be dead silent and the teacher would punish ME. I must've been a bad influence or something. In the military I was looked up to yet hated simultaneously. Looked up to for strength and I was never anxious about anything. Hated for not giving a shit about military structure and not caring about other people's dumb anxieties. People were uncomfortable with the fact that they'd flip a shit trying to prepare for something, and I wouldn't prepare at all. I'd show up at some function completely unprepared, wearing the wrong uniform while everyone else was dressed the prescribed way. Then the officer in charge who wanted to make a negative example out of me told me to stand up to show everyone how I'm wearing the wrong uniform. Instead I'd just throw both hands in the air and shout, "Yeah!" and the officer's plan would completely backfire as everyone laughs. Then I'd get reamed for being "disrespectful."

/rant
The military sucks fyi. After a while I eventually crumbled and stopped being myself, because anytime I was "myself" I'd get in trouble. I'm still recovering from it. Contrary to popular belief, the military isn't looking for leaders, its looking for scared sheep.
/end rant

I don't want to post too much in this forum. It just feels wrong when I'm the only one. I'm unemployed right now so I have a lot of time on my hands and I'm living an extremely efficient lifestyle so I don't go out and do much. Once this changes I can kiss this forum goodbye. No offense to anyone but I'll have things to do.

 

[Fizz]

None of those are even types. I can't answer this, you may struggle with my Ti though.

E/I and J/P are indicative of the leading cognitive function, it will either be an extroverted or introverted perceiving OR judging function. Peceiving and Judging don't really mean "procrastinator" and "control freak" but people like to think that. Most ESTPs shouldn't struggle with Se, which is NOT equivalent to Si or can really be grouped as "S". If you wanted a better answer to this question, you should have asked which cognitive functions we struggle with.

Se - Ti - Fe - Ni

I imagine most of us have troubles with Fe and Ni. Some barely develop their Fe and I can't imagine how untouched their Ni goes.

 

[Nessie]

Hello. I'm interested in seeing what the different types I'm not familiar of struggle with while growing up. I've heard lots of different statements and descriptions about ESTP but I doubt even half of them are true. I want to hear from your mouths.

I know the functions but how do you use them and which ones have given you trouble throughout your life? How does introverted intuition work for you? I see how introverted thinking works in ENTPs but how does it work for you?

Additionally,
Are the majority of you all really party-starters, adventurers, and smooth-talking negotiators?

I have a bit of love/hate relation with my extraversion. If you look at my E% in signature, youll find quite quickly with what I had strugle when growing up/throughout life.
My strong E and inquisitiveness were clearly visible already when I was younger than year and pediatrist was saying that „something like that“ never seen before in his life. „That“…..it was me.
I was developing in high acceleration and „pleased“ people around me with stuff in style like inserting my face into jaws of animals when playing with them, they had to take me down from 2 metres fence when I was realising my escapal strategy (still younger than year) etc. My grandma liked me of course, so instead of getting angry she had special expression: she was telling Im „very into world“.
Basically strong E makes personal social contact surprisingly easy, but also brings shitty traits like very low anxiety, need for excitement and being bored more quickly than introverted ones.
Adventurer? Yes.
Smooth talking negotiator? When Im not having domineering ass day: in this case Im not smooth, but very direct.
Party starter? Not. I am giving party sometimes, but its not always me. I dont like drink often. I strongly like animals and nature: as you could guess, in nature isnt always convenient bar or club around corner.

 

[StraightCrushin]

Teachers hated me. My friends would sit around me joking during class. I'd be dead silent and the teacher would punish ME. I must've been a bad influence or something. In the military I was looked up to yet hated simultaneously. Looked up to for strength and I was never anxious about anything. Hated for not giving a shit about military structure and not caring about other people's dumb anxieties. People were uncomfortable with the fact that they'd flip a shit trying to prepare for something, and I wouldn't prepare at all. I'd show up at some function completely unprepared, wearing the wrong uniform while everyone else was dressed the prescribed way. Then the officer in charge who wanted to make a negative example out of me told me to stand up to show everyone how I'm wearing the wrong uniform. Instead I'd just throw both hands in the air and shout, "Yeah!" and the officer's plan would completely backfire as everyone laughs. Then I'd get reamed for being "disrespectful."

/rant
The military sucks fyi. After a while I eventually crumbled and stopped being myself, because anytime I was "myself" I'd get in trouble. I'm still recovering from it. Contrary to popular belief, the military isn't looking for leaders, its looking for scared sheep.
/end rant

I don't want to post too much in this forum. It just feels wrong when I'm the only one. I'm unemployed right now so I have a lot of time on my hands and I'm living an extremely efficient lifestyle so I don't go out and do much. Once this changes I can kiss this forum goodbye. No offense to anyone but I'll have things to do.

My god. I feel you bro. I think the struggles you're having is what every non SJ person feels. I mostly understand where you're coming from. I'm actually an ENTP and being myself really doesn't come across well to some others either. It sure ain't easy. Anytime I share one of my plans and get rich quick schemes, a majority of people think I'm an idiot that doesn't want to do things "normally." Haha, and I'm still trying to figure out why you joined the military. It's not like in the video games man and that blows. I wish it was like Gears of War. But anyway, I'm sure you're not the only one feeling like this; just the only one willing to share. And no offense taken, if I had something to do, i'd be doing it too.

@Fizz
Okay, I see what you mean. I can picture how they'd have trouble with Fe but do you know how an ESTp with somewhat developed Ni would feel? Is it annoying to use or is it actually helpful in some situations?

@Nessie
Thank you for sharing! I now see ESTP don't have things easy..I never thought experiencing the world like you did would be a problem.

 

[Fizz]

@Fizz
But I did; 2nd Paragraph, 1st line.
(Will finish post later.)

The poll answers are still misleading, I just don't see the purpose in answering about an arbitrary letter that is just code for other parts of my type. I don't look at it as E - S - T - P, since I don't see how any of the letters could be difficult, just functions on their own.

 

[Eighty]

I agree with Fizz on the poll.

It makes no sense at all.

 

[themartyparade]

The poll answers are still misleading, I just don't see the purpose in answering about an arbitrary letter that is just code for other parts of my type. I don't look at it as E - S - T - P, since I don't see how any of the letters could be difficult, just functions on their own.

Maybe not the letters but what they're associated with. P for procrastination?

I don't know, I voted E 'cause I like being the fine extrovert I am and it's the only aspect of these letters that is so easy to identify and identify with.

 

[laikta]

As a ESTP, I struggle the most is have a long concentration span to complete one task first and then start the other rather than starting hundreds of tasks and end up not finishing most of them.
What a mess!?

 

[The Proof]

my favorite letters are F and N. I live S everyday, it gets old.

Party starter: If I look around the party and know exactly what it needs and know I have the jokes and enthusiasm at that particular moment to pull it off, sometimes yes. At a wedding I was on the dance floor by myself with a beer in one hand pointing at all the old people using my right hand to signal that they need to booze up and get out here. haha. They looked at me like I was the biggest idiot they ever met.

I can relate, some people make it a point to be downers

Teachers hated me. My friends would sit around me joking during class. I'd be dead silent and the teacher would punish ME. I must've been a bad influence or something."

hah, one time I took the teacher to the principal to file a complaint against him for doing this, the principal told the guy he was gonna handle it, the teacher left, then the principal told me the teacher's basically a wide collection of neuroses and not to take him too seriously, I went back to class bursting with laughter

 

[Muxoe]

As a ESTP, I struggle the most is have a long concentration span to complete one task first and then start the other rather than starting hundreds of tasks and end up not finishing most of them.
What a mess!?

I agree entirely. Also I'd say that I'm too optimistic for my own good sometimes when getting into new things.

 

[Brian1]

Things I struggle with...cognition wise Ni and Fe. I've gotten into seripus amounts of trouble because of my weak Ni. I just don't know where the boundaries are so I have to keep searching, and that leads to can I do this? type situations which people with stronger Ni say "Brian1's being a troublemaker." Sometimes I'll admit trouble making is fun. Yesterday, I told a co-worker who was already taking out the trash..."manager told me to tell you he wants this all done by seven." This guy is easily gullible, but still I had found it hard to keep a straight face and even then I chose to set up the joke while I was walking away, because there's this big machine in between us protruding the vision of me and and him viewing each other. Most of the time the joke will be, he'll ask me the time. "What time is it?" And I'll say, "it's howdy dowdy time." And he'll stand there "what is that?" But so I don't normally try to trouble make, it's just that I'm oblivious to other people in the room and protocol.

I also struggle with my basic belief system. I don't have a clear idea what is right and what is wrong. I think that's my Ti talking. I know I'm liberal and I vote Democrat, but don't ask me to get all fire in the belly, at a political rally for wedge issues like education in the schools. I'm more cool headed liberalism.

I struggle with motivation to finish the task. And like one poster says, I have the shortest attention span.

 

[StraightCrushin]

Things I struggle with...cognition wise Ni and Fe. I've gotten into seripus amounts of trouble because of my weak Ni. I just don't know where the boundaries are so I have to keep searching, and that leads to can I do this? type situations which people with stronger Ni say "Brian1's being a troublemaker." Sometimes I'll admit trouble making is fun. Yesterday, I told a co-worker who was already taking out the trash..."manager told me to tell you he wants this all done by seven." This guy is easily gullible, but still I had found it hard to keep a straight face and even then I chose to set up the joke while I was walking away, because there's this big machine in between us protruding the vision of me and and him viewing each other. Most of the time the joke will be, he'll ask me the time. "What time is it?" And I'll say, "it's howdy dowdy time." And he'll stand there "what is that?" But so I don't normally try to trouble make, it's just that I'm oblivious to other people in the room and protocol.

I also struggle with my basic belief system. I don't have a clear idea what is right and what is wrong. I think that's my Ti talking. I know I'm liberal and I vote Democrat, but don't ask me to get all fire in the belly, at a political rally for wedge issues like education in the schools. I'm more cool headed liberalism.

I struggle with motivation to finish the task. And like one poster says, I have the shortest attention span.

THANK YOU SO MUCH! This is exactly what I was looking for! I thought ESTPs would have a somewhat easier time in the world since they're sensors with cognitive functions that allow them to do things in out-of-the-box ways. But from what I'm seeing, it's looking like there are actually some difficulties.

 

[Brian1]

THANK YOU SO MUCH! This is exactly what I was looking for! I thought ESTPs would have a somewhat easier time in the world since they're sensors with cognitive functions that allow them to do things in out-of-the-box ways. But from what I'm seeing, it's looking like there are actually some difficulties.

I'm glad my pain could be of assistance.

 

[Adventure]

Hard time with making decisions, especially major ones. Can't see too far what the consequences or too eagerly ignore them, which often ruins any long term plans. I also tend to be offensive to people when negative - I might insult someone unintentionally or intentionally joke of somebody, forget about it after 10 minutes-1 day, depending on scale. Imagine how suprised I am when someone brings this after several months. If I overdo then sometimes I'll make up to this person somehow, but in closed communities the fame of evil/egoistic/uncaring person will grow anyway, and I'm too carefree to do something with it.

As for the favourite letter i'd say P. Cannot imagine myself not being fully open-minded.

 

[StraightCrushin]

Hard time with making decisions, especially major ones. Can't see too far what the consequences or too eagerly ignore them, which often ruins any long term plans. I also tend to be offensive to people when negative - I might insult someone unintentionally or intentionally joke of somebody, forget about it after 10 minutes-1 day, depending on scale. Imagine how suprised I am when someone brings this after several months. If I overdo then sometimes I'll make up to this person somehow, but in closed communities the fame of evil/egoistic/uncaring person will grow anyway, and I'm too carefree to do something with it.

As for the favourite letter i'd say P. Cannot imagine myself not being fully open-minded.

I see, I see. You don't mean to not be nice or not make major decisions..They are just things that dont come natural. I think I understand now how the lower functions of Fe and Ni affect ESTPs.

 

[elvis2010]

Hello. I'm interested in seeing what the different types I'm not familiar of struggle with while growing up. I see how introverted thinking works in ENTPs but how does it work for you?

SC, I think you want to see how ENTPs and ESTPs have similar struggles. Maybe part of you thinks that ESTPs have it easier because due to our sensing, we have a more realistic grasp on the world.

In reality, both of our types have troubles as it seems the Js dominate our world early on. One example of this is school and the concept of a 0 to 100 in school. If I do the best essay of all time, the highest grade I can get is 100. Then if there is a stupid assignment I blow off, I get a zero. My overall grade is 50, a fail. But in real life, there is no limit to how exceptional one can be. School then is stacked against the P and his extraordinary efforts and then lying dormant. The J types are rewarded even for being consistently mediocre, a student getting two 70s is better in the school's eyes than one getting a 100 and then a zero. The idea is that you should always try, but why I should expend energy on something I think is stupid?

And seeing as how we share Ti as a means to personality growth, we unlike other types don't mind tweaking the powers that be. So when an ENTP or ESTP challenges the powers that be with our facts, Ti, we are often belittled. How can any school present itself as having exceptional students when mediocrity and not exceptionalism is rewarded?

I laugh when I hear athletes make the J statement and say, "I always give 100%." Really? Since when is giving 100% all the time best? Aren't there times when it is wise to preserve energy for later?

Earl Campbell was a running back who gave 100% all the time and today is in a wheel chair. OTOH, Tony Dorsett was a running back who decided when a play was dead and knew when to protect himself. He gained more yards, had a longer career, and is walking today. You can't tell me the P way in this case was not superior to the J way. The P way then may be about getting the ultimate long term performance but if that jibes with the J view of the world, forget about it. The P will be crushed, and the only Ps that I have seen with the guts to get in the face of the Js and challenge them are the ESTPs, ESFPs, and ENTPs.

I think though that the ESTPs have a harder time with this than the other two types. The ESFPs have their feelings to fall back on, and the ENTPs have their egos. ESTPs are too grounded in reality. Unlike an ENTP, who thinks he is a God's gift and can handle such criticism, ESTPs take it to heart and can become isolated and depressed.

For me, the outlet has been the stock market. When I hear the blowhard J types and those using Te talk about the ways of the world, and it conflicts with my Se and Ti, I can bet against them. The Te and J cliches were and are endless. In 2000, it was the "new economy". In 2004, it was "real estate never goes down". In 2008, it was peak oil and inelastic demand. In one way or another, I bet against all of the popular trends and made money. As of now, there is this trance like state that the world's governments can go into debt and print money to pay said debt, and somehow everything will work out. Again, my bets are in against this ridiculous sentiment.

Unlike most fields, investing like sports is way more about performance than politics and being a contrarian in investing is celebrated. I don't have to worry about not being a "team player". It is insulting to me that the team is always right, and I am wrong. I don't see the merits of following a team off a cliff if that is where it is headed. Isn't being a team player another way of calling someone a sheep?

Where ESTPs and ENTPs differ is realism. Unike a lot of Ss, I tend to be as creative as Ns, but my creativity is in line with reality. Maybe it is becuase I am so P. So when it comes to business ventures, I see a lot of ENTPs with these boneheaded get rich quick schemes that are completely devoid of reality and use creativity as an excuse for my being skeptical. They do this N thing and imply I don't get it, but I do. The N is just wrong.

For example, I had a roommate in medical school who was going to be a millionaire selling Amway products. I shook my head and asked, "Don't you think practicing medicine is a better route to being a millionaire than selling Amway?" Of course, I didn't get it, was accused of crushing his dreams, and he was going to prove me wrong. Dammit. Well, he didn't prove me wrong. In fact, he made a fool of himself with his Amway dreams, and he is infinitely poorer for not taking my advice and the advice of others.

So when you ENTPs have had your five or ten failed get rich quick schemes and are tired of failing, then maybe you can come out and ask the advice of ESTPs and get a more realistic picture of how things may work out. We aren't going to give you the hackneyed J or Te version of what is right/wrong about your plan.

One of my favorite TV shows with regards to this dynamic is Shark Tank. People with ideas approach people with money about investing. While I prefer the artisans in the shark tank and can easily pick them out, it is usually between the S venture capitalists and the N inventors. As an ENTP, it would be an invaluable tool to watch this show and see how the S mind works and how you can turn one of your get rich quick schemes into actually getting rich slowly.