[Alucia]

So I'm doing some research into INTJ's and how they function in relationships as I am an ISFJ female and tend to find myself attracted to them most, however the relationships don't seem to last and it's usually due to their stance on the situation since they are very idealist. Is there any INTJ's out there that feel like they have found true love and it has to be a person up to those standards? Or do you have to drop your standards eventually to get to that point? or does finding that relationship just feel impossible?

 

[lil intro vert]

Idealistic in what way? What situation?

 

[Alucia]

Idealistic in the sense that there's someone that is a better fit for them, or rather a more "perfect match"

 

[changos]

Idealistic in the sense that there's someone that is a better fit for them, or rather a more "perfect match"

First welcome I see you are new around. Second I'm intj with lots of miles on my counter and lots of info to share, sadly is difficult online.

What you say is not soemething that can be considered accurate or true. There are many reasons why relationships fail, granted many are patterns of A or B person in terms of way of living (personality trends) but tha statement is way too unfair, not to say unrealistic. Among all the tons of information I have in my head I COULD say... intjs can see ideal ways on how things could go, and sometimes people don't adhere to those potential approaches. I'm sure this is very common among intjs, like "hey don't call me so often", yes privacy or alone time, but when people can't adapt (yes we can, and diff people can do so in diff ways) then we start seeing the alternate path that could have been taken with little effort but... it didn't happen. Yet is just a comment that needs expansion and I wouldn't advice to focus too much on that for the sake of the thread.

however the relationships don't seem to last

We are all different, and things end due to many personal reasons, I get we are talking about "when intjs are the reason relationship ends, like they choose to". Well, many times is because we see people repeating the same thing expecting a change... is unreasonable. When things happen again and again we can give time, but evidence can push us to believe is a waste of time to keep trying. I've seen many staying in relationships where is common to say "I told you I don't like this X or Z because of ABCDE", it's valid but not for years, well INTJS won't roll with that, if we see is not making sense... damn that's check mate in 3, 2, 1...

Another thing is, in all honesty despite the many mistakes we all can make: we can listen, learn, read you and memorize you, to the limits of "damn I bet this is coming this way, I hope not" and then people prove... that's their trend, don't surprise you and you know what to expect, we give chances hoping to see we are wrong, or that at least people won't make the same mistakes multiple times... OK, then try to get an intj to explain this to the other person... they hate it. I call this time traveler. Why? is the same, you are telling them what's happening and what's going to happen... and they get into denial only to prove the pattern, that's boring. When people break the pattern then that's worth the surprise and effort.

Many things are said about intjs, many are true, many are false. It's been said intjs can survive being deeply depressed, some say they are cold, some say they are affectionate, etc... But trust me, no intj stays too long on a relationship that has no future.

however the relationships don't seem to last and it's usually due to their stance on the situation since they are very idealist.

I See your comment but can't agree with you. I'm intj with many miles on my counter and intjs along the way, your description of idealism doesn't fit.

however the relationships don't seem to last and it's usually due to their stance on the situation since they are very idealist. Is there any INTJ's out there that feel like they have found true love and it has to be a person up to those standards? Or do you have to drop your standards eventually to get to that point? or does finding that relationship just feel impossible?

I've found true love, it happens a few times if you are lucky, yet that doesn't mean marriage or staying together (not always), sometimes she is not ready, other times we are not ready, you know. Standards? Trust me... we can learn fast and avoid repeating what you don't like, it kills us to see others can't, so we can elevate standards, in many ways we have high standards but flexibility too, depends on the intj.

I will end my post with this: many intjs had to take care of others... some in ways like a parent figure... this gives you enough training to be a good partner or someone unable to relate with people who haven't faced those challenges.

This kind of topics deserve a lot of coffee and time to talk. You can find a lot of bad descriptions on how intjs are bad on relationships, ha ha, yet you can see many intjs pursued... for years, with GFs who want to get back with them.

 

[Alucia]

Just to clarify a bit. I'm not generalizing all INTJs to be like this, just the ones I have encountered so far have explained to me they are looking for more. I definitely don't have a clear view on how all of them function because I've met many that have differences whether it be idealist, or not, and so on. I am looking for advice on dealing with the idealistic ones I've stumbled upon. I agree they are good partners to have in a relationship, and I work hard to be just as good by also trying to understand as best as I can.

 

[Dare]

Is there any INTJ's out there that feel like they have found true love and it has to be a person up to those standards? Or do you have to drop your standards eventually to get to that point? or does finding that relationship just feel impossible?

I believe I understand what you mean by this idealism. I had a very clear idea of what kind of man and what kind of relationship I wanted before I met Mr Right. I dated a little (cut off as soon as I realized not the 'one') and knew people who had some interest in me in the years prior but I held out for my ideal.

Naturally I had some concerns regarding finding him but I had a plan on how to meet a large number of what I thought would likely be the right kind of men. I guess that's part of the point with us INTJs, rather than give up we devise plans. The other thing is that INTJs say they'd like to have someone special but would rather nothing than compromise -- it's easy for us to be alone so there is no need to compromise in any big 'settle' type way.

That all said, it's apparent from all the 'what do INTJ men look for in a woman' type of threads that what they seek frequently overlaps but is unique to the individual. Some like 'bubbly' some like 'reserved' and so on. They tend to value loyalty which I hear ISFJs excel in. And a lot of the time they seek things that can be controlled (don't lie, don't be overweight/lazy etc). So if you're being your best you, then just keep trying to meet new INTJ men if that's what you have your heart set on. Eventually one will be after someone like you. Hopefully you'll like that particular one too and all the other lifestyle/compatibility/timing stuff lines up.

It always seems difficult until it happens and then it feels easy. Good luck!

 

[changos]

Just to clarify a bit. I'm not generalizing all INTJs to be like this, just the ones I have encountered so far have explained to me they are looking for more

May I? I'm intj. There are basically two types of intjs (1) the ones who are isolated, saying they only know 1 or 2 intjs, and (2) the ones who went outside looking for more getting to know many intjs in person or online. The second allows to get a better understanding on patterns and trends, and differentiate the rest. At the end of the day we are all different, but yes you can see patterns. I share this because I belong to group #2. And sure I made my homework.

There is a problem with INTJ's... many people see it as a positive thing and claim themselves to be intjs when they aren't. Some get things confused. There was a nice trhead on Intj Forum where people discussed the many suicidals, loners, rejecteds, sociopaths and more who read the intj profile and said "yep, I'm that" and nope... they just feel related to many traits described on the profile. There were in fact, people confessing how they confused this and later found out it wasn't a result of a score, but actually a problem they had and was later diagnosed or just went away. Being that said... and also well said on that thread: a lot of people who have problems on a relationship can say "oh I'm INTJ" and that's... not... it. If I could find that thread...


Also, as you know more intjs you can find out many of them(us) can do many things. Some to the level of being experts (and sure we can suck at many things, I wasn't good at Latin or French despite my constant efforts) and I suck at math while I'm very proficient at abstract thinking. What's the deal with this and your thread? perhaps I see a relation with idealism. Many intjs that can't do something today will be able to do it one year from now, specially if that ability is required for a personal project. Meaning? we hate when we are on a relationship and we both can't cook, can't X, can't Z, and later on WE can, but our partner can't. It is very relative, but the meaning of this is we leave when we see people failing to get better at simple things.

Example: some GF said "why you make a problem of such little thing?" and I told her: "you lost concept of the many times this has happened, besides, if it's so -little- why don't you get better at it?". The so called "little" problem was a constant in her past relationships, what I saw was her inability to remove something that was affecting her relationships, instead she expected people to adapt. I moved on. We all make mistakes, we all fail at something, but there are things where it is absurd to keep living with such a problem that you should have removed from your life. That's called self evolving, that's also called "giving the best of you to your partner". Many times we intjs are challenged on this by our partners, only to prove we can change and improve. There are excellents examples at intj forum on how intjs are at sex, we all have different preferences but we can learn and adapt to our partner taste too, that's good. Evolving is good, adapting is good, what's not good is stopping being yourself.



Consistency. You hear people complaining about intjs on this or that, but very rare people tell you the discussions about consistency. When you date an intj... everything or at least most of what you say will be remembered, noted, recorded, and a model of your words-personality will be built. When you fail at your own consistency... we might think there is an error, we ask for info, we can also think you are lying, or that you don't know what you are talking about, unstable, or just "talking shit".

In the long term, things like "I don't want to have babies" can be written in stone, is not ok to say later something that contradicts those words. Trust me, many discussions with an intj go around "but you said... and then... because..." and sometimes people don't remember their own words. You will find intjs think a lot in the future... we can build things and expect people to honor their words (classic introvert memory).

If a person can honor her-his own words... there is no reason to stay.
Many dreams and plans will be broken...

And guess what? many call this idealism, perfectionism... go figure.

People can say a lot of things when they are alone or when you are absent. But when their intj is present, things might be different, like "wait... that's not what I said, I said A, and B, and C". Sure we are not computers, but many times we can say "I was doing this and you that, suddenly you said BLAH, and I said BLAH", see? we can reconstruct not only the conversation but the context. Many people hate this. Then again, many complain about "perfection".




If I could make one thing and one only thing being noticed on this post will be this: How many intjs tell their stories on why they left: "I told her I don't see her as the mother of my children, I don't see us together" only to share how their EX went on a battle saying "there is another woman right? who is she???". Or the classic "you leave me because you don't love me"


Well, I'm intj, been there, even have the tshirt. When I started talking to other intjs discovered the funny thing about strong patterns, similar stories, and also the unability of people to deal with what's being said.

 

[Alucia]

I have definitely seen those patterns before in some of my relationships and in the current one as well. I've been on here seeking advice to see if my INTJ (and he didn't claim to be one, I had him test as one) will open up his mind more to how he feels about us.

He had reached a place of understanding that you discuss, when you see that someone isn't changing "the little things" and can see that they aren't "the one" you see yourself with. But it had bothered me more just because he hadn't communicated any of his emotions until he had made up his mind, so I had no idea on any improvements I could have made (which I consider myself good at doing as an ISFJ).
I was told by others to give up on someone that can't communicate when it is necessary for the relationship to even move forward and I'm struggling rationalizing giving up on something that I haven't been able to see through as well as the fact being convinced everything was fine for months and moving forward with my feelings in a positive direction.

He's seemed open to all the points I have made, I've shown him a lot of forums to understand himself and myself better and those point in the direction of trying with communication involved, but he says he just "knows."

On a side note, I didn't come to this forum to be told to just let it be, or give up. I understand that is an option especially for what is going on, but I am here to put forth effort because I think it's worth it if it works, or even to learn from it. So any positive feedback helps, and I am prepared for the situation to go in the opposite direction that I want it to regardless what is said on here.

 

[ponpiri]

How do you define success? Keeping up interest in a guy for more than three months is success for me.

I consider myself idealistic when it comes to close relationships, but it's shrouded in cynicism. Couple that with the 'I can do bad all by myself' attitude, and you get a person that doesn't do well with compromising on issues I've worked out long ago. There are large gaps in between relationships and I'm not unhappy about it.

Guys have told me that I'm looking for perfection, but that's not what's going on here. There is a feeling - at least for me - when something is just right. If I don't feel that with a person, then they aren't right for me. And, if what the person has to offer doesn't outweigh the aggravation they bring, then what's the point in participating? I conduct these little checks every so often to make sure I'm on the 'right' track.

This is how I operate in every aspect of life. If the thing I'm pursuing isn't worth the effort, then I'll drop it or the person like a bad habit.

I have definitely seen those patterns before in some of my relationships and in the current one as well. I've been on here seeking advice to see if my INTJ (and he didn't claim to be one, I had him test as one) will open up his mind more to how he feels about us.

He had reached a place of understanding that you discuss, when you see that someone isn't changing "the little things" and can see that they aren't "the one" you see yourself with. But it had bothered me more just because he hadn't communicated any of his emotions until he had made up his mind, so I had no idea on any improvements I could have made (which I consider myself good at doing as an ISFJ).

I was told by others to give up on someone that can't communicate when it is necessary for the relationship to even move forward and I'm struggling rationalizing giving up on something that I haven't been able to see through as well as the fact being convinced everything was fine for months and moving forward with my feelings in a positive direction.

He's seemed open to all the points I have made, I've shown him a lot of forums to understand himself and myself better and those point in the direction of trying with communication involved, but he says he just "knows."

Maybe he's fine with you being yourself and has acknowledged that you are't what he wants. Trying to change his decisions by "opening up his mind" and sending him to forums to "understand" himself won't nudge him further into your corner. If anything, you could be pushing him away and proving his judgment correct.

I agree with your friends that communication is important to progress a relationship. Still... when I do these mental checks and make up my mind about something or someone, I don't tell them about the process.

How long have y'all been dating? Usually I don't want my input to influence anything I see. If I tell a guy I like X and he changes himself to be that thing, then I'm not really seeing him, just his mirroring of my preferences in order to get me to like him more. Then because he changed something about himself so early int he relationship, I wonder about his consistency, principles and his backbone, frankly.

However, if this is an established relationship that I've committed myself to, then communicating displeasure won't be an issue.