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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I just came up with a great theory when I read this: MBTI truths: So Thinking is Evil? It's pretty much about how both thinkers and feelers can be villains---just in different ways.

What stood out to me the most is when the author said "Feelers use personal reasoning, factoring in emotions and how things affect people. They focus on feelings, and may to an extent care how others feel, but this does not mean that they want everyone to feel all good and happy inside. On the contrary, they know how to make people truly suffer if their intention is so."

And really, that makes sense doesn't it? Good, healthy feelers will of course want their words and actions to have a positive effect on people, but what about *bad*, unhealthy ones? When a thinker says something offensive, it's usually because they simply aren't aware of how their words will affect you, or just don't really care. But when a feeler says something hurtful, wouldn't it mean that they actually want you to feel pain? Of course, this is just a general trend. There are certainly sadistic thinkers and apathetic feelers.
 

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I'm sure it wasn't your intention to say this exactly, but I have to add that I wouldn't equate bad or unhealthy feelers as the only ones capable of being purposely hurtful. Sometimes you gotta be hurtful to get points across or to solve problems with other people. So many just don't listen, it's not even funny so you have to be a bitch/dick once in a while.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Hmm...I guess I just meant it as a general trend. It's not *always* the case. I'm sure there's sadistic thinkers for example, and apathetic feelers. It just really depends on how they developed because of how their life experiences affected them, which goes deeper than your MBTI type. I'd generally expect people who were really mistreated in the past(whether they are a thinker or feeler) to grow very bitter and angry towards the world, wanting to wreak havoc on it in revenge. Or to just not care anymore, because they are so dang tired of the world.
 
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I just came up with a great theory when I read this: MBTI truths: So Thinking is Evil? It's pretty much about how both thinkers and feelers can be villains---just in different ways.

What stood out to me the most is when the author said "Feelers use personal reasoning, factoring in emotions and how things affect people. They focus on feelings, and may to an extent care how others feel, but this does not mean that they want everyone to feel all good and happy inside. On the contrary, they know how to make people truly suffer if their intention is so."

And really, that makes sense doesn't it? Good, healthy feelers will of course want their words and actions to have a positive effect on people, but what about *bad*, unhealthy ones? When a thinker says something offensive, it's usually because they simply aren't aware of how their words will affect you, or just don't really care. But when a feeler says something hurtful, wouldn't it mean that they actually want you to feel pain? For you to suffer? Doesn't it makes sense that a feeler would want you to feel something, whether that be a positive or negative emotion?


I think there might be some general truth to what you're saying here, but I don't think it's quite as clear cut as this. A lot of it depends on the actual functions of the type you're thinking about, and there are a lot of other factors that play into it.


Anyone, thinker or feeler, can have a desire to want to hurt someone. Anyone, thinker or feeler, can unintentionally hurt someone.


I think it also has to deal with how well someone can control their emotions. If someone really wants to hurt someone else, there's something that happens to cause them to feel that way. A lot of times it's because they feel hurt or irritation themselves, and their natural emotional reaction might be to lash out at someone else.





I do agree with the notion that feelers don't always want to make everyone feel happy. And I do generally agree that thinkers are more likely to hurt someone unintentionally, or as KuRoMi said, as an unavoidable consequence.


However, I also generally believe that feelers place greater priority in not hurting people's feelings over what's making the more logical choice.


Of course, S and N functions affect this too. Sometimes an N is more likely to look at a bigger picture and ignore the feelings of the moment, whereas an S might make a decision that focuses on the past or present, but not think about all of the large scale consequences.
 

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It does make sense, yes. I think it's next to impossible to find someone who was born a bad person, but I've met plenty of people who are simply a product of their environment. And bad environments (as well as people from said environments) change people, whether they are Thinkers or Feelers. The only difference is that when a Thinker has turned bad, they become hollow and soulless, whereas when a Feeler had turned bad, they become cruel and sadistic. And in my experience, the latter are the worst to be faced with. I rarely stand up for myself unless I feel really endangered and unfortunately, this means that I have few enemies, but the few I do have are true enemies. The Thinker (ESTJ) who hated me was physically imposing but I was never truly scared of him and when I did end up telling him to back off (by standing on my toes, leaning into his face and telling him to "F*CK OFF." twice.) I felt brave afterwards. But the Feeler (ESFJ) was less big, less strong, and so much more terrifying. At one time in a fight with her I felt truly scared that she would kill me. Yet she wasn't evil because she was born that way, but rather because she was poor and no-one really cared about her (At that time I was poorer than her, probably still am, but I had family who spent time with me and gave a damn about me, whereas she never had that.). And I can tell you one thing, the look in her eyes when she was attempting to choke me was so demented and so bestial that it was inherently obvious that, as a Feeler, she really did want to make me suffer.
 

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No one wishes happiness for others if that happiness diminishes their own. That is not thinking or feeling, that is a human being.
 

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What stood out to me the most is when the author said "Feelers use personal reasoning, factoring in emotions and how things affect people. They focus on feelings, and may to an extent care how others feel, but this does not mean that they want everyone to feel all good and happy inside. On the contrary, they know how to make people truly suffer if their intention is so."

But when a feeler says something hurtful, wouldn't it mean that they actually want you to feel pain?
I would say anyone that purposely causes conflict or uses emotions as a tool to get what they want isn't a dominant feeling type. Specifically because feelers hate conflict in pretty much all capacities and because they are guided by their feelings they try to take great care of others feelings as well.

Feelers generally hate hostility and conflict in general and will avoid it every way that they can. I have seen this across all feeling types for the most part - INFP, ISFP, INFJ, ENFJ, ESFP, etc. from what I have seen. The reason why feelers are typed as feelers is because they value personal relationships, feelings and other people's emotions more then their own ideas or arguments. Thinkers will cut off a limb simply to prove they are right on principal. Feelers will react adversely if they are wounded, angry, etc. But most of the time it's reactionary and usually in a form of self-defense or against an aggressor/outside influence who has pushed them into acting or reacting to their situation in a hostile manor. They are feelers, they aren't made of stone, push hard enough and hit the right buttons and they will crack. When they do crack then I guess you may have a point, but I can't imagine a feeler planning out ways to hurt someone by ways of revenge. I can see it happening in the heat of the moment though that they make a flash decision that has major consequences for them and others. But not the Machiavellian way I think you are describing, that to me screams T. Feelers are crimes of passion and are all heart.

I think it also has to deal with how well someone can control their emotions. If someone really wants to hurt someone else, there's something that happens to cause them to feel that way. A lot of times it's because they feel hurt or irritation themselves, and their natural emotional reaction might be to lash out at someone else.
Agree here. I think a lot of the time when Feelers hurt people intentionally it's more out of anger because a feeling wire was tripped or they had a really awful day more so then not.

However, I also generally believe that feelers place greater priority in not hurting people's feelings over what's making the more logical choice.
Agreed here as well. Which is what generally makes them great protectors of feelings and emotions. They generally will do everything possible to keep the place amicable and hostility free.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Hmm...Some people are just really messed despite the MBTI type, I guess. I don't think feelers or thinkers are more Machiavellian than the other, but I was just thinking that feelers might find it easier knowing what makes another person tick, what makes them feel good or bad. Thinkers can notice other peoples' emotional states too, they just don't pay attention to them as much.
 

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And honestly... I feel somewhat pressured by the feeler label. I mean, only the "good guys", it seems, are typed as feelers, and the "bad guys" are typed as thinkers
I don't think the bad guys are thinkers necessarily, they just don't focus on people and personal relationships that isn't what drives them. Feelers are very conscious of the way people feel, that makes them "nicer" so to speak that doesn't mean that F's can't hurt others it just means that they care more about them.
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Yeah..I know what you mean. I think it's more that some of the descriptions of MBTI types can be pretty flattering. I wanted to be a INTP once because the descriptions made them sound so intellectual.
 
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