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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
As title suggests, or things that you're annoyed with yourself with, being an ISTJ. I really like you ISTJ's and have a lot of respect for you so this is not a hate thread just a little vent thread to perhaps lead to better understanding.

I think this is an ISTJ trait: I love my ISTJ boyfriend but I'm annoyed that he doesn't put himself in other people's shoes and isn't very understanding naturally. He does sometimes after I present the other perspective mull it over and see if he can work with the information and later incorporates it but usually he is too quick to only see things through his eyes and how he is affected. He is sensitive and caring but kind of has a narrow perspective at times. This makes any disagreements difficult b/c he just gets defensive and does not try to understand my side (or at least he doesnt express at the time that he is trying). I know most people are like this but being an INFP I am always taking on everyone else's perspective (to the point that it actually is something I annoy myself with b/c it makes life difficult sometimes since I am always taking on everyone's problems).

This leads me to mention another annoyance: that although he is very honest and blunt, there is sooooo much that goes on internally in his brain that I feel excluded from because he is not very verbally expressive. I wish he would understand that although he may have certain intentions if I don't know how can I understand? I know you guys show through actions but sometimes it would be nice to have verbal expression and confirmation, especially if the action is something that isn't put into practice right away.

Anyway what traits of yours, or the ISTJ in your life, bother you sometimes?
 

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The fact that I have so much trouble getting my point across, there is (most of the time) only one way I can explain things, and if whoever I'm talking to doesn't understand that I have no idea what to do.

My personality leads people to believe I'm always hostile and down-right rude, when I do not mean to come across as such. Even when I try to be outwardly nice I fail miserably. It would be really swell if that didn't happen.

I also wish that I was more open to changing my mind. Once I've made a decision, even when the other possibilities may be (or are) better, I hardly ever switch sides.
 

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Little patience

Not verbally expressive

IRL I come off as a ice bitch(or always mad)

Perfectionist about some things too the point I think it's OCD sometimes

some others but I don't want to over share.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
about the lack of verbal expression, reading some ISTJ comments i feel that my thoughts on the topic have been confirmed: that in many cases what is actually felt internally is not what comes out, or comes out misrepresented or incorrect, or even the opposite due to perhaps communication issues and defensiveness. this would explain a lot for me in my interactions with ISTJ.
 

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Maybe that's why I'm not prone to knowing them in person. There are some people I see in the world that walk around with the toughest skin, it seems. It's intimidating. A random "hi" would take ages to work its way out. Y'know, next time I see one I'm doing it.
 

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IRL I come off as a ice bitch(or always mad)
This is me a million times. My longest standing friend still calls me the ice queen.

about the lack of verbal expression, reading some ISTJ comments i feel that my thoughts on the topic have been confirmed: that in many cases what is actually felt internally is not what comes out, or comes out misrepresented or incorrect, or even the opposite due to perhaps communication issues and defensiveness. this would explain a lot for me in my interactions with ISTJ.
To me, my verbal expressions make total sense. I say exactly what I mean, but I forget that not everyone interprets what I say the same way. I have to make a conscious effort to keep myself aware of that fact. So, I agree.
 

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That it takes ages to loosen up and relax.

That I come across as neutral or indifferent when I'm just relaxing.

That I come across as stone-cold intimidating when unhappy with someone or a situation (or tired dammit!).
 

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Being an ice princess.

People think I'm mad when I'm not. Made worse by the fact that my guts are screwed up and I feel sick half the time.

Being hard to get close to and consequently having only 3 close friends.

People not realizing how much I love them because my demeanor is so cold. Or they don't believe that I'm really sorry when I apologize.
 

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I'm too rigid. I want to see more possibilities but it's so difficult for me!!
I think a lot of people also perceive me as cold or think that I don't like them.
I can't tell if someone is lying to me, being sarcastic, or being truthful; well only sometimes, when its dead obvious.
I can't tell if someone is really mad or sad, until they raise their voice really loud, cry, or something dramatic happens.:frustrating:
 

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about the lack of verbal expression, reading some ISTJ comments i feel that my thoughts on the topic have been confirmed: that in many cases what is actually felt internally is not what comes out, or comes out misrepresented or incorrect, or even the opposite due to perhaps communication issues and defensiveness. this would explain a lot for me in my interactions with ISTJ.
NB: the following comments are theoretical, in that, I kinda made them up from reading stuff and observing, but if you don't agree that's cool - don't take it as gospel!!!

This is very true. Internally I 'feel' alot more like an INFP than how I come accross externally. It's just that when I start interacting with the outside world, for some reason I'm forced to use Te - and my internal SiTeFi realm disappears as this blunt, fact-based, etc. person that I don't really know starts to come out. I like spending time in my own world on my own because I'm alot more fun than when I'm around people (in my head) lol :)

As an INFP you would use Ne as your primary way of interacting - the random, fun comments and explorations. Ne and Te clash a bit, what you're using is you ISTJ weakest function, so it makes us feel uncomfortable, off-guard, and incompetent. We try to respond using Te, but that just makes us sound arrogant and narrow-minded.
 

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Being an ice princess.
Patently false. It's other people that have that erroneous opinion. Of course, it's like anything else - if you believe it's true, and you hear it directed toward you enough times, then you will start to believe it's true. It's up to you to decide if you are comfortable enough in your own skin to allow other peoples' well-intentioned (but poorly-worded) expressions affect you in that way.
 

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Patently false. It's other people that have that erroneous opinion. Of course, it's like anything else - if you believe it's true, and you hear it directed toward you enough times, then you will start to believe it's true. It's up to you to decide if you are comfortable enough in your own skin to allow other peoples' well-intentioned (but poorly-worded) expressions affect you in that way.
And many people don't take the time to dig deeper... It's all to easy to say "oh she's a bitch" from a bad first impression and then never take the time to see if it's actually true or not. That's definitely one thing I've learned in my interaction with ISTJs... there's so much under the surface worth taking the time to understand.

What annoys me about ISTJs? You guys are so hard to get to know sometimes. And although you are often right, you are not ALWAYS right! :tongue:
 

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Patently false. It's other people that have that erroneous opinion. Of course, it's like anything else - if you believe it's true, and you hear it directed toward you enough times, then you will start to believe it's true. It's up to you to decide if you are comfortable enough in your own skin to allow other peoples' well-intentioned (but poorly-worded) expressions affect you in that way.
And many people don't take the time to dig deeper... It's all to easy to say "oh she's a bitch" from a bad first impression and then never take the time to see if it's actually true or not. That's definitely one thing I've learned in my interaction with ISTJs... there's so much under the surface worth taking the time to understand.

What annoys me about ISTJs? You guys are so hard to get to know sometimes. And although you are often right, you are not ALWAYS right! :tongue:
Yeah, my self-confidence is a bit low. I'm still getting comfortable in my own skin. I've just recently learned that some of my character "flaws" that my ESxx (can't figure out the rest of the letters) Mom has been criticizing me for years about is actually typical ISTJ stuff.
 

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If you want to see the ice princess archetype portrayed in a movie, please check out "The Secret Life of Words" with Tim Robbins and Sarah Polley. The lead character is an obvious ISTJ who prefers to keep to herself but the Robbins character (an ExFx), an injured worker on an oil rig, keeps trying to dig deeper and eventually gets to know her.
 

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It takes a long time for me to open up to someone i met to the point that I believe that they think I don't like them or that i'm ignoring them- not very expressive about my feelings.
I analyse stuff way too much- i like it most of the time but on certain occasions it gets really annoying cause i end up worrying in the end.
 

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As title suggests, or things that you're annoyed with yourself with, being an ISTJ. I really like you ISTJ's and have a lot of respect for you so this is not a hate thread just a little vent thread to perhaps lead to better understanding.

I think this is an ISTJ trait: I love my ISTJ boyfriend but I'm annoyed that he doesn't put himself in other people's shoes and isn't very understanding naturally. He does sometimes after I present the other perspective mull it over and see if he can work with the information and later incorporates it but usually he is too quick to only see things through his eyes and how he is affected. He is sensitive and caring but kind of has a narrow perspective at times. This makes any disagreements difficult b/c he just gets defensive and does not try to understand my side (or at least he doesnt express at the time that he is trying). I know most people are like this but being an INFP I am always taking on everyone else's perspective (to the point that it actually is something I annoy myself with b/c it makes life difficult sometimes since I am always taking on everyone's problems).

This leads me to mention another annoyance: that although he is very honest and blunt, there is sooooo much that goes on internally in his brain that I feel excluded from because he is not very verbally expressive. I wish he would understand that although he may have certain intentions if I don't know how can I understand? I know you guys show through actions but sometimes it would be nice to have verbal expression and confirmation, especially if the action is something that isn't put into practice right away.

Anyway what traits of yours, or the ISTJ in your life, bother you sometimes?
I am an older ENFP in a relationship with an older ISTJ. We've both been over the mid-life hump. I can formulate that my rational function is subjective Fi, and I also can understand and appreciate that Te is objective. There is obviously a time and place for both. And a battle over something like that is pointless because my personal values do have an agenda. And obviously, since I have Fi as my auxilliary function, it's not hard for me to know what I'm feeling at any moment. However, I may struggle sometimes to lay it out in terms of logic. I often have to go through Fi in order to get to Te. This is why sometimes I have to go off on my own and isolate in order to sift through it all.

Dealing with matters of the world does require Te, otherwise I'd get myself into trouble. Dealing with matters of the heart, it might be better with Fi. But if I'm to consider YOUR perspective as an ISTJ, Ne is essential. I can "imagine" what it's like to be you, better. Ne gives me the desire to understand you and your Te, which is my tertiary function. I do see it's necessity and I do wish to make it stronger.

Likewise, maybe the ISTJ's tertiary Fi will connect them to their own feelings, although they may still use Te to express it (How awkward is that? lol) And with eventual acceptance their inferior Ne, will also give a better perspective and lend itself to more imagination on how someone else may think or even feel. I believe my ISTJ has this ability.

With all that being said, I don't know what my ISTJ is thinking now or at any hour of the day. I won't know it until I ask. Sometimes I'll ask "Are you mad?" and usually the response is "No".

I need way more feedback than he does. So if he only sees that need from his perspective, it won't help him. It won't make sense to him. But he can collect his data from over the years of other relationships and see what information those others have given him. He can probably by now see a pattern in how verbal feedback might often be a request (ISTJs feel free to comment on this) and it has made him more open to doing it now when I request. However, it's very easy to just fall back into treating others how we want to be treated.

In other words, if I send my guy emotional and loving texts, does that mean I will receive them in return? NO, absolutely not. Lol. I'd really have to ask for something like that and I doubt I would receive it then. That actually would be mean of me to pressure him into something I know is not his strength.

Last night my guy asked to take my daughter and me out to dinner. It was a beautiful dinner at a beautiful restaurant. I think that means something. He also invited me over to Thanksgiving dinner with his family. I think that means something. He also made sure to take care of me after my marathon and made sure I got my ice bath in. I think that means something. Whenever I get upset at him for not calling me enough, and I text him exactly how I feel about it, he will immediately call me, assure me he feels no pressure in doing so and then asks me about my day. I think that means something. Whenever he leaves my place, he always makes sure to borrow a book I just finished reading and reads all of it. I think that means something. See what I'm getting at?

I'm an ENFP. When I "mean something", I tell him. "I miss you so much. I can't wait to see you again. You are so handsome. I appreciate you in my life. Thank you for getting me into my place the other night when I locked myself out. That means so much to me." I am hoping he can tell how much I care about him. I don't "do" as much for him as he does for me. I'm starting to pick up on the fact that he's a little old fashion, too. But I try to be verbally expressive as much as I can. But I'm not sure that always works.

But physical intimacy seems like a very nice and safe place for us both. Usually then, he has no problem telling me how much he "misses me" and cares about me. I am glad we both have the courage to be vulnerable with one another. It's quite precious.

By the way, I wrote that who novel up there ^^^ because I texted my ISTJ 3 and a half hours ago and still haven't heard from him. Not that I'm actually counting the minutes and hours like a dork on a Friday night. Sigh....:wink:
 

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+1 to being more verbally expressive.
@pinkrasputin - Even if I say something that I really mean, saying it can feel so hollow.

Waffling between trusting too easily and being too skeptical. It seems like one extreme or the other sometimes. (Not sure if this is ISTJ. It sounds more like an E thing.)

I wish sometimes I didn't waste so much energy getting distracted by negative possibilities (by possibility I mean something that would likely never even happen)



Sometimes my friends seem so much cooler than me.
 
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