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I read this article online where it said something like how 'thinkers and mostly sure that they are thinkers' and 'feelers are more likely to type themselves as thinkers'. Of course thinkers are capable of using feelings and feelers are capable of logic. Obviously the online mbti tests are not too accurate, so how to do actually know for sure if you are a thinker or feeler? (generally speaking)
 

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May be a shitty example to answer your question, I don't know.

But here it goes:

I manage a large team, and I have a team lead that assists me. She's an ESFJ. One of our associates has an attendance issues, and is regularly running late and calling off. Her reasons range from, "I'm not feeling well" to "I was on my way to work, then I found out my father died as I was running over a nail and wound up with a flat tire, then I got pulled over and got a ticket for speeding because I was still trying to get to work on time, and then right before I walked through the door I got abducted by aliens." Ok, that was obviously an exaggeration, but she always has the craziest stories.

My lead's response to me when I was about to write her up for her last warning was, "I think we should give her a break. She's really going through a tough time in her personal life."

My response to her was, "She's either got to be the unluckiest person in the world to have like 5 family members die in a month, get a flat tire, have her kid get MRSA, have her niece get kidnapped, etc., or she's full of shit. I'm going with the latter, especially when she always seems to have something crazy happen conveniently on the day's she is late. I'm not buying it."

Maybe this doesn't answer your question, but whatever.
 

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I read this article online where it said something like how 'thinkers and mostly sure that they are thinkers' and 'feelers are more likely to type themselves as thinkers'. Of course thinkers are capable of using feelings and feelers are capable of logic.
I don't agree with that article. I've seen it in the past. They share a generalization but they don't really explain why (or that's how I remember it. Please share a link if possible.). But quite a few thinkers on this website have mistyped as feelers when they're:

1) in inferior F grip
2) in a loop involving F

Or put another way:

A) going through a personal crisis
B) being emo teens
C) confusing deep emotional states or distressed states for higher feeling function (eg: when they're emotional after a breakup)

Eventually, they realize that their focus is way less on ethics and morality and much more on problem solving. Or something like that. At that point, they usually realize they're not feelers.
 

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Actually does make sense. If you operate primarily with logic your probably kinda ''proud'' of that and would never consider that you're an F (even if turns out you are).

OTOH maybe some feelers don't like the definitions and prefer to see themselves as rational, thinking that F means you're some kind of hot mess who gets manipulated by people.
 

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I don't know why that is. I assume it's like how people mistype themselves as INTJs.

I never understood it. I have no shame in being ISFP. Shallow, over-emotional, yeah, but it's OK.
 

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The article you read sounds sorta surface mbti

I think it's easier to consider when applying the use of cognitive functions and understanding that better.

I am a thinker my Ti is very prevalent. Doesn't mean I can't be illogical or emotional. I actually think ExTPs can be dumbfucks when in grips and hyper emotional.

So why am I thinker because I predominantly filter the world with Auxiliary Ti. And I utilize Ti more frequently than Fe. If it were in reverse I would be NFJ.

Ti is subjective so it's actually not objective logic. We use correlation to frame and create our logic but it is supported with our other cognitive functions. Ti is questioning and organizing data to make sense with the other filters. It can be very astute but it actually requires healthy use of its complimenting function Fe to be at its most healthy objective use. From my view it should discern everything to break down the data and form a decision but then it should refer to Fe as a reference checker.

I find actually many of the people feeler or thinker who sound the silliest and most dogmatic and narrow are extreme in their use and do not balance and try and utilize their support functions. Lol how is that logical?

A feeler operating solely on Fe or Fi in extreme with out support of their tert or inferior is irrational but one who has learned to reference with their support functions probably can be more objective (than even a thinker in a grip or not utilizing their support functions) A thinker might understand they genuinely look for the objective or point in a matter and see and distinguish the difference from themselves but even many thinkers polarize their use in dom and aux and do not use or develop their support functions.

Now let's use worst case scenario for either a thinker or a feeler being defensive. Often a thinker is going to refer to samples of objectives, tactics, strategy, efficiency, risk/reward in their use of logic. A feeler arguing logic will often refer to happiness. Lol just an observation. Feelers talk about happiness a lot. Whether it's their happiness, or others happiness it's a common theme of reference. They really will actually commonly use words in references to their feelings or others far more commonly.

Example I feel sad about this and that

A thinker more likely to express frustration, disappointment, or anger in an adjective like that and then refer to sequence of event or objective in working.

A thinker is more likely to look at a situation and want to address a solution or problem faster in a blue print or action oriented way that is feasible. Feeler often can react to problems in a way where (sorry) in this way in this scenario they can miss the big picture (not healthy ones who take a step back) but impulsive more dogmatics less developed feelers will get distracted in really petty things people related and lose track of an objective. As I said healthy ones reign that in. But it's still more of a natural inclination to gravitate to the feeling of the issue rather than the solutions or objective

Feelers get a bad rep for being illogical when many very developed feelers are balancing great use of all their functions and can be more 'logical' than a very dogmatic thinker. It's not simply logic itself it's the filter.
 

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the feeling functions are often co-related to emotions (not that that is the whole picture), and in our culture, especially among males, 'feelings' and 'emotions' are discouraged. someone who is insecure about their tendencies to behave in 'emotional' measures may sense this while taking the mbti and change their answers so that they don't feel like 'sissies' the way their family/ friends/ neighbors have shamed them into believing they must be.

i have a personal example. i am 100% certain my father is an enfp, same as myself. he definitely has a strong fi, but he also has a strong disdain for expressing his emotions or allowing them any room to make decisions for him, nor even offer up a few suggestions. as a result, he forces his te up into fi's place, and unfortunately he has no sense of how very illogical he really is when he does this. i already know that he was raised-- whether by parents or church or others-- to believe that men must behave a certain way, and he literally has told me on many occasions that 'women have no logic' and are not as intelligent as men. as a result of his disruptive beliefs his own logic suffers. i have seen him in an ne-te loop, and boy, that was not a pretty sight!

but guess what, if my dad tried to take an mbti, more than likely he will say he is an entj, simply because he will probably not be self-aware (or actually, honest) enough to admit that he is a feeler over thinker. but the problem is that he cannot be an entj, because both his intuition and thinking are definitely extroverted, but also if you ascribe to the idea that j types are orderly and organized-- then helllllllll no! :laughing: chaos rules his world, it is where he thrives. but that social stigma about (especially men) not being allowed to use your feeling as a tool places clear limitations on his usage of it, which as a result also damages his te-- his source of 'logic'.
 
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The way to know for sure is to understand and correctly apply Myers-Briggs theory (as opposed to relying on online tests and "logical" vs. "emotional" stereotypes/mischaracterizations).

Actually does make sense. If you operate primarily with logic your probably kinda ''proud'' of that and would never consider that you're an F (even if turns out you are).
Ironically, such pride would be based on a Feeling judgment (not to mention a misunderstanding of Thinking), which is an unsuitable basis for typing, so anyone who accurately self-typed with this attitude would have done so accidentally.
 

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I read this article online where it said something like how 'thinkers and mostly sure that they are thinkers' and 'feelers are more likely to type themselves as thinkers'. Of course thinkers are capable of using feelings and feelers are capable of logic. Obviously the online mbti tests are not too accurate, so how to do actually know for sure if you are a thinker or feeler? (generally speaking)

I reckon it is the high-functioning (reflexive)-nature that avoided deeper analysis of the "(F/T)" functons themselves, to which when end up with specimens utilizing 'emotionless' body-mannerism or specimens that have a "strong logical composure," as direct indicators of (X)-type, however, such thinking is fallacious + highly susceptible to high-functioning cognitive-biases / human-errors.

It could be said; "feelers," (while highly intuned with themselves) - have a 'distorted' sense of themselves: I will attempt to expound on my point.

Although; we can argue all the (internalized) function(s) seem to be as well: (Si/Ni/Ti/Fi) - due to the fixation on "internalized"-states: which has an overall-fixation on (self-disturbances + self-frequencies), as seen with (Ni):


And again with (Si) - with a disposition to be concerned with (internalized-discomforts / self-anatomic disturbances + high-functioning self-safety).

________


(Feeling) - as I understand it, deals with the anatomic-function / well-being of subjects - which is never said within typology itself, although, it becomes evident "Feelers," will be fixated on subjects (regardless of external / internal) stimuli, but differential anatomic "states" - thus, for the feeler, it is a subconscious reflex to be concerned with either the psyiological / psychological / anatomic states of subjects (including themselves), above all else, to which such logicla-judgments will be made with the following categories/fixations/focuses in mind.

And I suppose, when we here 'fixation on subjects,' a hueristical-reflex occurs that equates it to nurture, habital care, and "emotions,", which may be a side-effect, however, not what "feeling," actually is - or 'fixates' on, which is not emotions, caring for other specimens, rather it is a logical-function constantly making judgments on the high-functioning anatomic states / well-being of surrounding agents + subjects:



So what is "subject-fixation," concerned with (?)

Ex; (1)


In general: (A, B, C):


(A) -

 
Anatomy of other subjects (re: organ health / bone health / muscluar/tissue health) - health of body :




(B) -

 
Physiological well-being (re: chemical-make-up / hormonal level + homoestatis / stability) of subjects:





(C) -

 
Psychological states of subjects: (emotions / feelings / biases / cognition/mind)




::



(Fi)-users will be utilizing the anatomic-states of themselves to address the anatomic-states of other humanoids;

(Fe)-users will be utilizing the anatomic-states of others; to address the anatomic-states within themselves;


::

If you wish; I can demonstrate what "logical-judgments on anatomic," states looks like (re: the distinctions between F/T - and Fi/Fe), however, I wish to keep this post less lengthy.



If we will break these down in "degrees", rather than either/or black/white:

(Fi) will have more fixation on (A, B) in this order,

While (Fe) will have more fixation on (B, C) in this order:

_______________


(Thinking) - as I understand it, will be logical-judgments via with the ('anatomic function / structure / state-of-affairs') of all non-subjects which entails "objects," - but not always, some "thinking," function(s) can be utilized to break-down the anatomic-structures of subjects (re: "psychology of 'humans'), however, it differs from that of the feeler, in so far as it is not concerned with overall well-being, of said structures: which may by implication/disposition create a 'cooler' demeanor - but I do consider this a "strong" / sound distinction between the 'feeler/thinker' - in so far as there certainly are "emotionally cold" feelers (re: INFJ) - and "emotionally soft thinkers," (re: INTJ):

Reflecting back on the "thinking function," itself: it will fixated on (the following below in the opposition to the 'feeler' function):


Ex; (2)


It can entail things;

State-of-affairs; -----> (Do not confuse this with the 'perception' function(s))

Events; ------> (Do not confuse 'events' with the (Ni) dealing with time-lapse / essences) - rather than direct events themselves:



(D, E, F)


(D)

 
Structure: - All internalized (physical - properties / rules / attributes / substances') belonging to (X);





(E)

 
"Things":- All external intimate-objects consisting of (attribtes / properties / substances):





(F)

 
"Objects": - All external events, state-of-affairs, occurrences, et al - "existing," outside the subject/self






If we will break these down in "degrees", rather than either/or black/white:

Ex; (Te)-doms are less analytical than (Ti)-doms,

Thus the (Te)-doms fixation revolves around (F, E),

While the (Ti)-humanoid follow (D, E) - in this order:


[HR][/HR]

Based off the above: It appears to myself,


As to why "feelers," are more likely to type themselves as thinkers; it does not seem to be rooted within the (strong thinker/logic) bias, although, it may occur in less skilled-specimens within typology (&) be products of other personalized/psychological-malfunctions (e.g., insecurities), but this is not all it is.

"Feelers," may be more susceptible to high-functioning cognitive / psychological biases via the fixation on (congition / subject-fixation) in general, which is demonstrated to be 'unreliable' in scientific discourse, and other highly sound / reliable testing methods: (re: why 'ancedotal evidences / "experiences" / appealing to intuition over trial/error) and other subject-related abstractions are simply unreliable; which does not surprise me that 'feelers' may have more malfunctions typing themselves accurately than "thinkers" due to the the genetic / cognitive-disposition make-up to fixatue on less reliable "typing" methods when addressing themselves: - while 'thinkers' certainly have malfunctions typing themselves, and are susceptible to the same human-baises / hueristical reflexive thinking disregarding deeper analysis of the self:

Futher, a specimen may say in defense of this oppsition, "feelers have deeper understanding of themselves," (and who they are), which indeed, may be true on (surface-value psychology (re: "emotions") and/or other reflexive conscious-outputs, but this does not seem to be case when devolving deeper into the subconscious to which (cognition / and/or the 'inner workers') of humanoids has yet to be accurately described as "what is," (and how the 'self-subject' operates), in the subconscious degree: meaning, the deeper the "feeler" goes into understanding themselves via typology (re: appealing to the anatomic / psychological-states of themselves), the more unreliable, dogmatic / hueristic - it becomes. Which may certain explain why we have more "confused" feelers typing as thinkers; than vice versa. The thinker, due to less subject-fixation (will have a small, however significant) reduction in susceptibility to such internalized-psychological / cognitive-biases due to appealing to (structures / things / objects), outside of the self - or the subject. Creating a more 'stable' foundation in typing oneself; even if the foundation is 'unstable', the accuracy of such typing increases - due to the reduction of psychological-bias implementation.
 

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I read this article online where it said something like how 'thinkers and mostly sure that they are thinkers' and 'feelers are more likely to type themselves as thinkers'.
More questions (I am still thinking through):

Are feelers more 'dynamic' (&) does this 'dynamicism' cause more mistype / type confusion?


I can say, I have certaintly noticed more "flexbility / dynamicism," regarding 'feelers' in general - which perhaps, may be contributing to the mistypings at a hyper degree ::

Consider:


Feeling fluctations:

Mood fluctations:

Homoestasis / body / well-being fluctation (more keen awareness) to such changes/fluctations of subjects (which includes themselves):


Higher adaptibility (thus, more likely to "change themselves,") around more frequently than thinkers:


____________

Rather, is it not that "Feelers" are more emotional / moody / adapting than thinkers, but rather, they fluctate/rotate more on the self-axis.

It seems to me:

"Feelers," may (be more scattered about the spectrum) - similiar to the IQ-scale; and fluctate more often between the extremes: (re: "object-favoritism") - (re: "subject-favoritism") - or perhaps may be more likely to utilize both preferences simultaneously, due to this 'dynamicism' that comes from the (feeler-disposition/function) in general:


While:


"Thinkers" may be clustered more in the 'middle' - thus more static, and fluctate less often: ("object-favoritism"), and overall lower-subject fixation disposition.
 

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Both T/F have the same capability of using logic & emotions. However they do it differently. In facing any situation, the Thinker types default is to detach & approach the situation with logic to analyze & solve the issue whereas the Feelers' default is to approach the situation through their emotions to analyze & solve the issue. However it doesn't mean that Thinkers are cold, heartless creatures or the Feelers are stupid irrational beings. It is just the default behavior.
 

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It's "how will this make others/me feel" verses "what do I think is objectively the best idea that gets the best results?" As a result thinkers are generally more competitive because the feeler wants everyone to feel good and the thinker wants to win/objectivity do the best. It's much easier for people with strong T/F preferences, but if yours is a little closer to the line then try paying attention to your decision making process when in a non stressful environment (in an extremely stressful environment you tend to operate as your opposite type (you could utilize this but I doubt you'd be thinking about it in the moment)). Hopefully that will help. It is also helpful to explore your subconscious and try to figure out which one you want to be in order to help expose potential bias, but that's not all that important. Generally you will know after a little self observation/reflection.
 
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