edit: sorry wrong thread. I thought this was Ti vs Te :tongue:
I don't know here.... just guessing, based on what I've observed, and also some things ISTPs have posted on this site...A question I've wondered about for a while, for Ti and Fi users..
What is the major difference between the relation of Ti or Fi in a dom user? I mean, I almost always have suspected I'm using Fi. I'm not saying I think it's Ti, necessarily- but when I think about it, I could be confusing my strong feelings of Fi for Ti just by assuming a description fits me, without really delving deep into my reasoning behind my judgement process. Fi can seem really similar to Ti, because they both fit external objects and information into a subjective judgement process. Fi is described as being an extraordinary sense of an intense, moral compass. Knowing something is right or wrong, based on a gut feeling.
But I don't know if that's exactly what I'm feeling. I know I feel very stuck in my way of thinking, and I suddenly don't know how to differentiate between my judgement being based off of my feeling, or a feeling of it being logical, consistent and in tune with what makes sense to me. Maybe it feels right, and feels good because it aligns with my logic, my subjective judgement.
But where is the line between Fi and Ti? People have also described Fi as seemingly cold to others, and Ti isn't exactly described as being soft and warm. So again, how do you tell? Especially in someone who might feel like they're a feeler, but have strong tendencies as well, toward stereotypical thinking preferences.
One big thing I've noticed, is I do relate very well to the stereotype of an ISFP being an "artist" of some sort. But where I find confusion is my motivations for art. I want to excel in it. I want to improve. I enjoy studying skeletal anatomy, muscular anatomy and understanding and memorizing the very detailed basics and intricities of what I'm drawing so I can be the best I can be at it. A lot of the time, I have little to no imagination when I'm drawing without reference, and it's hard for me to muster up creativity. I draw well when I give myself a set idea, or something to work on- eg; hands. I need to look at the skeletal structure and anatomy of a hand, and I'll get better at it. And also understand the mechanics of a hand, and what won't look right in a drawing due to knowing the anatomy.
I do feel good when I draw, but only when I think it looks good, or if I've improved in some way.
I'm just suddenly really confused in regards to the REAL differences in Ti/Fi.
As an INTP, I also try to avoid conflict most of the time. But I do it consciously, as in "I don't want to offend them, so I'll just keep my mouth shut." I don't really have a sense of how I should say things, so I probably offended many people by accident when I was younger. Even now, people tell me to soften my tone all the time! I do care about how other people feel, it's just that I don't actually know whether they're upset unless they make it obvious, and then it's too late. I'm also really bad at noticing other people's tone as opposed to the words they're saying.I don't know here.... just guessing, based on what I've observed, and also some things ISTPs have posted on this site...
But under normal circumstances, in typical discourse, when stating something, do you take into consideration _how_ you say things, as in how what you will say will be perceived by others? (not for their sake, but for your own--as a form of "self preservation", if you will)? Or do you just blast things out there, and let the chips fall where they may? Do you inwardly cringe when others say things that could be taken wrong, knowing that how they said it might lead to conflict?
Conflict avoidance, I guess, is one way to describe it. I can honestly say that I have lived pretty much oblivious to how much conflict avoidance I have engaged in over the years. It is subtle, and often times unconscious--I just do it, and don't even notice I've done it--but looking back, I can see that it's been a large part of how I act. This is not necessarily because I'm "fragile" or "afraid", but it is something that matters to me. I care about these things--weirdly, not because I want people to think nicely about me, or to think I'm a good person--actually, it has nothing to do with other people, in the sense that I particularly what people think about me. In fact, quite the opposite. If I offend someone unintentionally, I may feel bad, because it is not something I want to do, but I seldom let their feelings get under my skin, and I certainly don't blame them for getting offended in the end. And lastly, I seldom let their taking offense directly impact me, or change what I'm saying. And I'm quite capable of upsetting people knowingly, but I do this because I know that what I'm saying needs to be said, and I am incapable in such circumstances of "tempering" how I'm saying it, so I will blurt things out, and let the chips fall where they may--but those are not what I'd call "normal" circumstances. Normally, it is like I'm naturally attuned to things, and just navigate the world and human relationships in a way that causes the least friction (I really think I need to add a caveat here... this is in areas that don't directly affect me--matters that don't set my Fi hairs on edge, so to speak)
What makes it hard to differentiate between the two is that we tend to be the exact opposite. They will step on toes and never care about what happens, and shrug it off in normal circumstances, but stress them, and suddenly they can be quite emotional and self-protective. At that point, their feelings become their weapon of choice to cut down people. But when we are under stress, we use our logic to cut down people. But it can seem quite similar--and may even feel similar, I suppose.
Here's where it gets weird. IMO, ISTPs and ISFPs seldom come to any great conflict over their inferior functions, simply because their field of battle is common--their aux. Se. We are able to hash things out in that realm, so we seldom see that ugly side of each other from opposite sides of the coin. If you want to see that, upset an INTP. ;-) But then, the Ne and Se are in conflict as well, and between the Ne-Fe and Se-Te, it's an endless spiral downwards until one of both parties disengage--which becomes increasingly difficult as they go at it--it generally ends with one or both parties too exhausted to continue. But ISXPs don't tend to do that, in my experience. So that would be another thing that clouds the differences.
I think, though, that the main thing is that ISFPs tend to take subjective "tones" into consideration. Oh, and our inferior Te means that we tend to aspire to be logical and rational and cool-as-a-cucumber--but we aren't really very good at it. It takes a great expenditure of energy to do so, and we eventually must disengage our thinking to restore equilibrium. I absolutely need to disengage my brain. If I don't, the results are disastrous. ISTPs don't seem to be like this. Engaging their brain _is_ their past time. My INTP wife, for instance, loves playing Scrabble online, and it's the thing she does to calm her brain before she goes to bed. She plays three minute games, and scores in the mid-hundreds.... I can't imagine how she does that--but that, to her, is relaxing. For me, music, or imagery that allows me to turn off my brain is best--and music without lyrics is best of all, just soundscapes. aaaahhh... Let me feel it without having to "explain" it... And I've been like that since I was a kid. He. I used to hide a radio under my pillow, and fall asleep to music. At one point--probably my early teens, I discovered the local Classical and Jazz public radio. It went off the air at midnight, and came on in the morning around 5 or 6, playing "Sleepers Awake" to start the day. It'd wake me up, and put me right back to sleep every day. ;-) But it was my alarm clock. ;-) My ESTP son also prefers puzzles to help him unwind--not necessarily word or picture puzzles, but things like a rubic's cube or creating Legos creations, or other weird things. He prefers to physically manipulate things, but that's how he unwinds--with mental and physical enigmas and puzzles. Those, sadly, exhaust me.
And looking back at it all.... don't know that I answered your question in any way... duh
I thought of making a thread about this, made one and afterwards started really doubting myself. But I'm just going to leave my interpretation here:I'm just suddenly really confused in regards to the REAL differences in Ti/Fi.
Interesting take. I'm generally quite picky about logical inconsistencies but I also have moments when I just can't bother about details as long as everything makes sense on a larger scale. I don't know if other INTPs are like this too.A distinction from the inconsistency targeting of Ti where things must fit, Fi can work with small inconsistencies as long as the bigger picture can still function as whole.
I, as an INTP, cannot bear small inconsistencies and I *have to* correct them, even if it's amidst the most important discussion of my life.Interesting take. I'm generally quite picky about logical inconsistencies but I also have moments when I just can't bother about details as long as everything makes sense on a larger scale. I don't know if other INTPs are like this too.
Wow. Maybe Neil DeGrasse Tyson had a close friend or relative that died from a medical accident. I once comforted a friend whose healthy mother died after a colonoscopy. Americans are overtreated to their own harm, sometimes so doctors can make a few extra bucks. Anyway, I don't agree with the youtube vlogger because I can't verify Tyson's motive for the post. Is it introverted feeling that makes people think they know what other people are thinking and judge them for it? I really hate it when someone tells me what my motives are and condemns me for it, even though my motives are nothing like they accuse me of.When Fi and Ti disagree.