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MOTM Nov 2009
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Discussion Starter #2
  • Type Eight-Type Two
These two types are more alike than they might appear to be at first. Both are action-oriented and want to have a personal impact on their environment. Both can be sentimental and deeply feeling, with a soft side that is often more hidden than apparent. Both can play the roles of provider, protector, caretaker, and nurturer while avoiding or even denying their own needs. Both tend to overwork themselves and both tend to be the strong one in relationships (although Twos will tend to do so as the power behind the throne while Eights will tend to clearly be on the throne). Both types bring passion, vitality, interpersonal and social skills, magnanimity, and generosity. The basic emphasis of both types is distinctly different, however, with Twos being primarily interested in the welfare of others while Eights tend to be interested in their physical wellbeing and in having a distinct impact on their world, often with beneficial fallout for others.
They easily play roles that the other needs and wants: the Eight is practical and concerned with results, whereas Twos are more people-oriented and more openly altruistic. They are both strong willed and like taking on responsibility, as long as they choose it themselves. Eights often bask in the glow of the Two's affection and adoration: Twos truly appreciate the Eight's strength and efforts—and see their often hidden self-sacrifice. Both see each other's noble qualities and can be each other's staunchest supporters and admirers. Their roles are also clearly delineated, so they do not get in each other's way. Each runs different spheres of their lives and cover different bases (one plays the symbolic Mommy the other the symbolic Daddy and things are clear and balanced). These qualities make this couple powerful allies who complement each other's strengths, particularly the good effects they can have on others.


Twos and Eights have very different value systems: as noted above, Twos tend to be person oriented, while Eights tend to be practical minded. Their interpersonal styles are also very different, with Twos tending to be more empathetic and indirect and Eights being more direct and independent. Even average Eights tend to become proud of their resolutely unsentimental way of dealing with people and situations, while average Twos become highly attached to people and overly-solicitous about their needs. Twos tend to see things from the points of view of others, while Eights do not: they see things from the point of view of self-interest, feeling that others need to learn to take care of themselves lest they become weak and ineffectual. Thus, in a relationship, Twos and Eights have very different ideas about where other people fit into the picture, including their own family.
Both types tend to move in opposite directions and have increasingly opposing views about how to treat other people. Eights become more hard-hearted and confrontational, while Twos become more possessive and self-sacrificial. Between themselves, they can get into battles with each other about whose philosophy will prevail. Rather than feel rejected or lose a key relationship, however, Twos can get caught in a codependent relationship with the Eight. The Two can become an apologist for the Eight's bad behavior, enabling them and thus encouraging Eights to continue with anti-social or self-destructive habits. Thus, this couple might not break up as quickly as some other pairings would, although they can drag each other down without seeing their mutual trap. Ultimately, Eights can lose respect for Twos, finding them insincere and manipulative, while Twos lose respect for Eights thinking them to be cruel and domineering. Both can become coarser and more controlling if this continues, with overtones of stalking and paranoia, fears of betrayal and acts of revenge.

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MOTM Nov 2009
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Discussion Starter #3
  • Type Eight-Type Three
These two types can form powerful and highly effective affiliations and can also have passionate and stimulating personal relationships. Both are assertive: both Threes and Eights go after what they want in life. Both can be larger-than-life figures who are outstanding in some way and because both stand out in their social circle. They cannot help but notice each other and come to terms with each other. Either an alliance forms that will enhance both parties or a competition develops that will keep them apart. Surprisingly, Eight's strength and solidity gives Threes permission to be more heartfelt: the Eight feels reliable and Threes seek safety to reveal their hearts. Eights also like seeing Threes use the opportunities and rise to the challenges they offer. On the other side, it helps Eights to relax once they see that the Three is competent and can do things on their own. Moreover, both Threes and Eights are action oriented, pragmatic, care about getting the job done and are willing to take the lead to achieve their goals.
They both have a marked degree of self-confidence (at least outwardly), they can be persuasive, and they can cut their losses and change goals when things are not working for them. To this mix, Threes bring more awareness of others, a feeling for public relations and for how to please people. They are more diplomatic and adaptable, both in their relationship with Eights and with others. Eights bring forthrightness in expression, fearlessness, physical vigor, and determination to achieve their personal vision. They bring solidity, decisiveness, and a kind of strength that the more flexible Three gains confidence from. They want to be proud of each other and to support each other's potentials and accomplishments. They tend not to compete with each other—surprising because both tend, in general, to be competitive with others.


Threes and Eights can be effective in the business world and in their professional careers where energy, determination to succeed, and personal drive are necessary. But both types tend to be workaholics, putting themselves under tremendous stress in order to achieve their goals and to hang onto to whatever success they have. Under sufficient stress, they may stop supporting each other and compete to top the other's achievements. Of the two types, Eights are more openly controlling than Threes, although Threes will attempt to control situations covertly—which can arouse the Eight's suspicions and lack of trust. Once trust is compromised, Eights can become jealous and possessive, ordering the Three to do things to prove their personal loyalty to the Eight. Threes may easily feel used and belittled, not adequately appreciated for their contributions or for their support of the Eight. Eights begin to expect and demand loyalty—even obedience—for their patronage and guidance. Threes begin to feel that they are losing their ability to pursue their own goals, that they are becoming an appendage of the Eight.
In response to deteriorating conditions, both types can become manipulative to get what they want. Once they begin to do this with each other, trust and openness cannot be maintained. Moreover, neither Threes nor Eights are very skilled at talking about their real feelings or needs, nor do they feel comfortable being vulnerable. For both, isolation and suspicion becomes the norm and can become difficult to break through. Eights may see the Three as deceitful and untrustworthy; Threes may see the Eight as willful and vengeful, and they can fear being humiliated and co-opted for life. Eights ultimately want support for themselves and their vision. Threes want to be developing themselves and to be admired for their qualities. Battles over who is supporting whom result. Whose agenda will prevail? A nasty, very personal, breakup may follow.

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Discussion Starter #4
  • Type Eight-Type Four
This can be one of the most creative relationship couplings, although it is also one of the most inherently volatile. Both Enneagram Fours and Eights are intense and have strong emotional responses; both seek to get a reaction from the other, and both can be dominating of their environments—Eights are socially dominant, Fours are emotionally dominant. Both types bring passion, intensity, energy, and deep (often unconscious) feelings to all aspects of the relationship. They are attracted to each other's storminess, the other's vulnerability, and the other's "hidden" qualities: neither is what they seem to be on the surface. Both types are also highly intuitive—Fours by being self-aware and knowledgeable about how they are feeling, and Eights with their intuition about external phenomena, often with an extremely accurate insight about the potentials and possibilities exhibited by others. Because of their passionate natures, both types can become impulsive and reckless, taking extreme risks for love of thrills or for the sensation of being alive—and this can be tremendously exciting to the other. But there are trade-offs: Fours tend to depend on the Eight's practicality and ability to protect and provide for them, whereas Eights tend to depend on the Four's sensitivity and mysterious sense of challenge—the Four's emotional life and heart may be one world that the Eight cannot easily conquer.
On the other hand, Fours see strength, charisma, and solidity in Eights. Both feel that the other can meet their intensity—that the other will not be boring or non-responsive to them. They make each other feel more alive—something that both want. Intensity, vitality, passion, and immediacy are the emotional hallmarks of this couple, and they relate to each other (and to others in their world) from an unusually high emotional pitch—there is always something happening in their relationship, and they like it this way.

Both types take a certain pride in having a large than life quality about them: Eights in their larger than life willpower and quest for control, Fours in their larger than life emotions and in their quest for self-expression. Both types want to be free and to be free from having anyone control them, particularly in their careers and private lives. If they feel that the other is trying to control them, both types can become enraged, easily triggering gargantuan battle, financial and sexual intrigues, and rampant feelings of hatred. Both Fours and Eights are emotionally stormy and prone to periods of rage, depression, vengeance, and various forms of acting out. When conflicts between them reach a certain pitch, arguing replaces real connection, and fighting (and possible physical violence) becomes an increasingly common element of their communication, with the violence often running both ways.
They can also begin to get into the practice of fighting and making up because both are more exciting that way. They can also begin punish each other by withholding attention and affection and by verbally putting the other down, often in public. No coupling is more passionate than the Four/Eight combination—nor is any couple more likely to deteriorate into verbal and physical abuse and various kinds of personal retaliation for escalating offenses. (They also tend to draw their friends and family into their conflicts, trying to make others choose sides.) They may get into the feeling that they are not able to stop themselves from hurting each other, as much as part of them would like to quiet down and become more normal. The passionate attraction that they have for each other can end in obsession and hurtful, ruinously impulsive actions.

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Discussion Starter #5
  • Type Eight-Type Five
These two types bring to each other complementary and reciprocal talents—just what the other needs but is not necessarily aware of. For instance, Enneagram Fives need to be more identified with their body and with their instinctive energy; they need to be more engaged with the practical world and to feel their own sense of power and capacity. They can learn these qualities from Eights. On the other hand, Eights need to be more thoughtful and aware of the impact of their actions on themselves and on their environment. They need to know more and to think of consequences more carefully before acting. Every action produces a reaction, and it is not necessarily the one that the Eight wants to happen. This kind of analytic foresight is something Eights can learn from Fives.

Besides these qualities, both Fives and Eights bring a common insistence on independence and non-interference from others. Both types are aware of boundaries and dislike intrusion. Both enjoy a good debate, and both admire someone who stands up for himself intellectually and/or physically. Both types feel like misfits and so they understand each other's emotional core, often in an unspoken way. Both types need personal space, but when they find each other, they can both show a surprising degree of need and vulnerability. They see the other person behind the defense, relating to each others' sense of dignity and hidden vulnerabilities. Both can be stoical toward their own suffering and unhappiness, with little or no self-pity. As a couple, they can bring power and depth, action and thoughtfulness, brilliance and brashness to their world. They are also the natural protectors and advisers of each other: Eights love to protect less tough Fives, and Fives help Eights recognize the subtleties for their plans and actions. These two types can therefore band together as a coalition of power and brains, a formidable combination.



Fives are not much in touch with their physical bodies—they identify with their minds and are indifferent to virtually all of the physical and practical goals that more earthy Eights have. Not wanting a house, a company, or a spouse are all sources of pride to average Fives who feel good about themselves when they can cut off from their needs and learn to do without. Eights, by contrast, take pride in their earthly conquests, whether socially, financially, sexually, or psychologically. Making their mark on their environment is a primary goal for Eights and they often use their physical stature and energy to intimidate people and enforce their will. Thus, the more insecure these two types become, the more they react in completely opposite ways: Fives shut down more completely, become more taciturn, secretive, and isolated, while Eights become more confrontational, threatening, and enraged.
The biggest problem is that in the lower Levels, these two separate physically from the other and any real communication ceases to take place. Lower functioning Fives tend to lose respect for anyone they judge to be irrational, destructive, and out of control. The storminess and threats of unhealthy Eights terrify Fives who must physically leave to feel safe. They know and will attack each other's vulnerabilities if sufficiently provoked—and both Fives and Eights tend to provoke each other as a way of protecting themselves. Both types are also sensitive to rejection and both tend to feel rejected easily. The Five's departure will trigger a strong rejection reaction in the Eight who will likely retaliate in any way that he or she can. An Eight's departure will trigger the Five's rejection feelings, but more likely with a collapse into cynicism and depression. Both can be extremely cynical, and the demise of their relationship only confirms their darkest opinions about the possibility of human beings living together.


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Discussion Starter #6
  • Type Eight-Type Six
Enneagram Sixes and Eights can build an extraordinarily strong, long-lasting relationship on what is, at root, a defensive view of the world. Both types feel that most people and the world are selfish and untrustworthy, and that they world is highly unpredictable. One therefore needs to take care of oneself and one's own interests (Eights) and have strong allies and the ability to get back up from one's friends (Sixes). Both Sixes and Eights have deep issues with trust—and with finding people they are able to trust-and so when they have found each other and have gone through a period of testing, their alliance can be solid and deep. Once they have bonded with each other, both types have done so on a deep level of their being, and while the relationship may change over time, they are never indifferent to each other. They both admire and try to embody strength, commitment to one's word, honor, unquestioned loyalty, responsibility, hard work, courage, a spirit of protectiveness, and fighting for the underdog. Both are doers, and enjoy being active, getting tasks accomplished, building a more safe and secure world for themselves and their loved ones. Sixes bring warmth, the desire for personal connection and commitment, a certain playfulness and sensitivity.
They are also mental types and bring skepticism, analytic thinking, and the ability to think through decisions and to foresee outcomes and potential problems before acting. Sixes thus tend to act as advisors and lieutenants to Eights who tend to take the lead and provide the vision and audacity that Sixes sometimes lack themselves. Eights also bring directness and decisiveness, strong wills, confidence, a can do spirit that is energized by adversity and a penchant for taking on challenges. Sixes tend to look up to the Eights as their hero, while Eights are touched by the Six's devotion and courage. Eights are aware of their inner struggles and what it takes to overcome them. When there is genuine affection between these two types, there may be fireworks and occasional fights, but the bond only seems to grow stronger with time.

Both Sixes and Eights are emotional, although both tend to hide their emotions and vulnerabilities as best they can. Eights do so under a veneer of toughness and bravado, Sixes under a shell of defensiveness and bluster. Both tend to counterattack and go on the offensive when threatened—or when they feel they are being threatened. In general, Eights tend to take the lead in most relationships they are in and to set the tone and make decisions. They expect others to obey them and to be loyal to them. Eights may tolerate (or even be amused by) an occasional flare up of independence on the part of others around them, but ultimately, they expect to be in charge. For the most part, this is also fine with Sixes, except for those times when Sixes feel the need to push back and to prove themselves. They need to show others (including the Eight) that they cannot be pushed around or taken advantage of. Power struggles of all kinds can ensue. This is especially true of "counterphobic" Sixes who can actually react much like Eights, displaying leadership, decisiveness and independence (on the positive side) as well as bluster, aggression, and defiance. Sixes who are more counterphobic tend to get into more open fights with Eights until both have determined their territory and just how far each can push the other.
Sixes who are more openly phobic (fearful, timid, anxious) generally tend to avoid confrontations with Eights; instead, they tend to present no open threat to the Eight's dominance, while being covertly passive-aggressive and evasive. Eights can get into conflicts with phobic Sixes by sensing their indirect, questioning qualities—and whether or not the Six is as loyal to the Eight as the Eight wants. Eights may become more or less openly contemptuous of them if they feel the Six is weak or vacillating. Problems in this relationship can be exacerbated by the Eight's tendency to get into rages, to make threats to the Six's security, or to bully and play on weaknesses. When trust and respect crumble in this relationship, constant testing from both parties brings about the end fairly quickly.

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Discussion Starter #7
  • Type Eight-Type Seven
Both Enneagram Sevens and Eights are highly self-assertive, independent, and strong willed. Both types also resist being controlled or limited by authorities or even by internal, psychological mechanisms. Once someone (or even some inner voice) says do not, both Sevens and Eights respond with defiance and a desire to push the limits, whatever they may be. Both types are practical, this world-oriented, not necessarily worldly or materialistic, but concerned with concrete affairs and finding happiness and fulfillment in the here and now. Neither likes to postpone their satisfactions or to settle for vague promises about the future. Both tend to overspend their budget on a bountiful lifestyle that is a source of pleasure for themselves and their friends and family. They love to entertain and offer the best there is to others as a sign of their generosity and as a signal of their success and standing in the world.
Both are high energy people, often gifted with a vitality and gusto for life that is noteworthy. A Seven/Eight couple can get a tremendous amount done, and are revitalized by staying active. They are adventuresome and are willing to try new things in their relationship. They are also both extremely outspoken and do not hold themselves back from voicing their own opinions or making their needs known. Sevens bring more lightness and a sense of fun and excitement, trying something new and different for the sake of keeping things fresh and stimulating. They are also usually the more talkative of the two: Sevens are usually highly engaging storytellers and raconteurs, turning their adventures (and catastrophes) into entertaining tales. Eights are usually surprisingly more reserved and moody than is often recognized, and they rely on the Seven to lighten the atmosphere and to make their practical affairs more fun and enjoyable. Eights also bring directness, decisiveness, and the willingness to face difficult situations with determination and persistence.

While a Seven/Eight couple can be an extremely productive, high-energy pair, problems may begin if the constructive outlets for that energy are thwarted or misguided. Sevens and Eights both need to find positive outlets for their prodigious energies and interests, and if they do not, they will inevitably discover destructive ways of releasing them. They may also begin to turn against each other or bring each other down in a kind of dark collusion that can have tragic consequences for them both. Both Sevens and Eights are extremely strong willed and independent and so both resist being controlled by the other, often taunting the other with their lack of influence over them. Eights tend to be authoritarian and bullying, ordering the Seven around and making threats if they are disobeyed. Sevens will attempt to avoid being controlled, and can become highly insulting and contemptuous of the Eight and their heavy-handed tactics. Both types will flaunt the other's inability to have their way, as if their defiance were a badge of honor. Both types can be extremely selfish and self-centered, feeling that the world revolves around them and their desires. Of course, this builds in the likelihood of conflicts.
Both types can also be verbally crude and insulting, frequently saying things that other types might only occasionally allow themselves to think. Their fights can be gargantuan brawls and public scenes in which physical abuse and violence may also play a significant part. The problem is, however, that both types tend to be addicted to excitement and the adrenaline rush of reckless behavior. Once they have begun to build their relationship on a certain level of physical excitement (whether it is from sexuality or violence), it is difficult for this couple to turn back to something more moderate. Anything less than being death defying seems lifeless and boring. They may, however, push the limits once too far, with tragic consequences not only for their relationship, but for everyone around them.

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Discussion Starter #8
  • Type Eight-Type Eight
As with all double-type relationships, two Enneagram Eights generally bring the same qualities to each other. Therein lies both a main source of the attraction as well as one of the main pitfalls. Thus, the Level of health of each person is especially important for these types of relationships as are their dominant instincts. Both Eights will bring a lot of energy, vitality, and passion to the relationship: few other combinations are so intensely involved with each other as this nor are they able to create such fireworks. They both have strong willpower, independent thinking, the ability to make decisions and get things done, and a desire to see results in the practical world: they will not simply talk about building a house or going on vacation—they will make it happen.
When two Eights are well matched, they paradoxically both stimulate each other and relax each other at the same time. They feel that their energy has been met, so they can relax around the other Eight and turn their attention and energy toward other interests. Two Eights are also able to profoundly relax each other because they have confidence in each other. They know that they have what it takes as a team to do what needs to be done, to be safe, secure, and stable in their own world. The feeling is "We've got it covered." Rather than be marked by high energy, quiet confidence is a hallmark of a double Eight couple. This is because they are relieved (and quietly happy) to have found someone else strong who they can depend on. This also leads to a profound feeling of mutual respect, direct and frequent communication, the ability to air their needs and feelings and to settle their occasional disagreements cleanly and quickly. Double Eight pairs can build a significant empire of some sort together, and because they feel that they have unshakable support in the other, they can also be generous and open-hearted with others.

A double Eight combination will be extremely volatile, with lots of ego on display, frequent tests of wills and more or less open jockeying for control. They can get into competitions and rivalries because real equality and sharing is difficult between a lower functioning double Eight couple. Issues about being (and staying) in control will likely be the center of many conflicts, especially since lower functioning Eights do not want to back down or be seen as weak in any way. Both will therefore struggle to dominate, at least in some area, making for a highly reactive and conflict-ridden relationship.
Both Eights can have hair-trigger tempers and a certain degree of suspiciousness and paranoia might set in, even in regard to their partner. Tests of loyalty will come from both sides and both will tend to up the ante emotionally (and often sexually and financially) as things deteriorate. Nevertheless, someone will always need to make the final decision, and unless they learn how to communicate and negotiate effectively with each other, this combination can wear each other down. Both Eights tend to feel rejected unless they have the power, money, or position that would make their significant other want or need them. They may feel free to disparage the other, justifying their aggressiveness with the attitude that they can take it. Verbal and physical rough-play can get out of hand. Neither will be the first to back down in a conflict and it is very difficult for them to apologize.
Nevertheless, Eights can be surprisingly thin skinned and easily hurt, resulting in the banishment of others often over seemingly trivial matters. Further, two Eights can also find that they tend to take up a lot of space—and therefore to need a lot of room-with each other. They may find it worthwhile to declare certain parts of the house (or similar territory) off limits to the other. In short, there is often too much bluntness and pushing each other around which can escalate into outright battles. Power struggles become occasions for revenge by the one who feels aggrieved, or they may simply take turns hurting each other as they continue to wear each other down until "the final straw" has been reached.

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Discussion Starter #9
  • Type Eight-Type Nine
Enneagram Eights bring leadership qualities—a take charge, "we can do it" mentality that others usually look up to and rely on. They are full of self-confidence and vitality and feel like a force of nature that cannot be denied. Nines generally admire these qualities in Eights and often gravitate to them. Nines typically tend to live vicariously through the positive qualities of the other, and Eights like to have people around who are impressed and stimulated by the Eight's leadership, vitality, and brashness. Nines genuinely admire the Eight's ability to make things happen and to fearlessly take on challenges.
On the other hand, Nines bring a sense of calm and stability that Eights find soothing and necessary for their wellbeing. They also bring to Eights a feeling of quiet pride in the Eight's bravado and more assertive qualities, encouraging Eights to continue in their take charge style. Even healthy Eights spend a lot of time overcoming obstacles and adversity; they are fighters trying to survive and make their mark on the world. Nines are like a safe harbor, a respite, a person with whom Eights can let down their guard and relax. They tend therefore to teach each other what the other lacks: Eights bring Nines self-confidence and self-assertion, while Nines teach Eights which battles are worth fighting for and how not to push so hard. The Eight/Nine couple is thus like fire and water—an active force and a receptive force—that has an archetypal feeling about it. Their roles are well-defined with each paying a parenting role toward the others-one is usually the daddy while the other is the mommy—although this does not go along gender lines as might be expected. Both have powerful drives and strong willpower; both like comfort and simplicity; both want to create a safe retreat from the world. When these forces and their talents are harnessed together after the same goals, this pair can be dynamic and powerful but also comfortable and receptive at the same time.

One of the main problem areas for people of this combination is that, as they deteriorate, their defenses go in opposite directions: Eights tend to push harder, while Nines tend to increasingly shut down. Nines can become unresponsive, or worse, energetically pushing away the Eight as a defense. Eights become more aggressive and belligerent, demanding that their energy be met. Nines respond by not responding: they go on emotional strike, and may begin to reactive passive-aggressively, sabotaging the Eight's activities in various ways. This causes Eights to escalate berating and threatening the Nine, or else to encourage Eights to react passive-aggressively.
Eventually, Eights tend to lose interest in Nines, feeling that they are too obstructionistic to them and their plans. Whenever Eights want to do something exciting, Nines respond with "Why bother?" or its equivalent. Eights can not only feel thwarted in their vision, but also feel that one of their core strengths is being undermined or rejected. On the other hand, Nines can begin to see lower functioning Eights as too bossy and controlling, selfish and wanting everything to be their way. (Nines think that they want someone to be in charge and to direct things, but when Eights start directing them, they rebel and become stubborn.) Eights think Nines are blank slates who could be molded to their needs—and they get surprised by the depth and power of the Nines stubbornness.
The relationship often founders on rage whether expressed openly or covertly. Nines often feel that Eights are too openly aggressive and harsh with others in order to maintain their dominance. They may begin to have to take sides to protect their children or others who are vulnerable to what they see as the hardness and potential violence of Eights. At its worst, this archetypal, elemental combination can deteriorate into a domestic battlefield with frequent verbal and physical abuse.

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That's it for Type Eight.
 

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Four is where it's at! Definitely the best compatibility IMO, from experience of two relationships with Fours. Especially considering most IEIs in socionics are Fours, and a sizeable number of SLEs are Eights.
 

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  • Type Eight-Type Three
These two types can form powerful and highly effective affiliations and can also have passionate and stimulating personal relationships. Both are assertive: both Threes and Eights go after what they want in life. Both can be larger-than-life figures who are outstanding in some way and because both stand out in their social circle. They cannot help but notice each other and come to terms with each other. Either an alliance forms that will enhance both parties or a competition develops that will keep them apart. Surprisingly, Eight's strength and solidity gives Threes permission to be more heartfelt: the Eight feels reliable and Threes seek safety to reveal their hearts. Eights also like seeing Threes use the opportunities and rise to the challenges they offer. On the other side, it helps Eights to relax once they see that the Three is competent and can do things on their own. Moreover, both Threes and Eights are action oriented, pragmatic, care about getting the job done and are willing to take the lead to achieve their goals.
They both have a marked degree of self-confidence (at least outwardly), they can be persuasive, and they can cut their losses and change goals when things are not working for them. To this mix, Threes bring more awareness of others, a feeling for public relations and for how to please people. They are more diplomatic and adaptable, both in their relationship with Eights and with others. Eights bring forthrightness in expression, fearlessness, physical vigor, and determination to achieve their personal vision. They bring solidity, decisiveness, and a kind of strength that the more flexible Three gains confidence from. They want to be proud of each other and to support each other's potentials and accomplishments. They tend not to compete with each other—surprising because both tend, in general, to be competitive with others.


Threes and Eights can be effective in the business world and in their professional careers where energy, determination to succeed, and personal drive are necessary. But both types tend to be workaholics, putting themselves under tremendous stress in order to achieve their goals and to hang onto to whatever success they have. Under sufficient stress, they may stop supporting each other and compete to top the other's achievements. Of the two types, Eights are more openly controlling than Threes, although Threes will attempt to control situations covertly—which can arouse the Eight's suspicions and lack of trust. Once trust is compromised, Eights can become jealous and possessive, ordering the Three to do things to prove their personal loyalty to the Eight. Threes may easily feel used and belittled, not adequately appreciated for their contributions or for their support of the Eight. Eights begin to expect and demand loyalty—even obedience—for their patronage and guidance. Threes begin to feel that they are losing their ability to pursue their own goals, that they are becoming an appendage of the Eight.
In response to deteriorating conditions, both types can become manipulative to get what they want. Once they begin to do this with each other, trust and openness cannot be maintained. Moreover, neither Threes nor Eights are very skilled at talking about their real feelings or needs, nor do they feel comfortable being vulnerable. For both, isolation and suspicion becomes the norm and can become difficult to break through. Eights may see the Three as deceitful and untrustworthy; Threes may see the Eight as willful and vengeful, and they can fear being humiliated and co-opted for life. Eights ultimately want support for themselves and their vision. Threes want to be developing themselves and to be admired for their qualities. Battles over who is supporting whom result. Whose agenda will prevail? A nasty, very personal, breakup may follow.

[Source]
It's almost scary how accurate this description is. My best friend is a three, and I'm an eight. We have brilliant moments when we work together and produce great things. But we also have a lot of very bad fights because of her emotional swings and my utter inability to deal with them.

I don't know if I can say this is a good combination or not. I guess that awaits to be seen.
 

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  • Type Eight-Type One

Enneagram Ones and Eights bring a common concern with fighting for truth and justice in their world. They both often feel (although in different ways and for different reasons) that it is up to them to stand against whatever they perceive as injustice or falseness. Both can see themselves as gallant crusaders protecting the weak, righting wrongs, and making the world a better place. In a relationship, these two types are both action-oriented, and if their attention and energy is turned toward social causes in particular, they can have a big effect on their family and their community, perhaps even their country or the world. Both bring a certain nobility of vision and a focused purpose, practicality, and perseverance in supporting whatever they believe is right. Both are willing to sacrifice a great deal to do what they believe needs to be done. For both, fairness is centrally important. (Ones bring a sense of absolute or ideal truth and justice whereas Eights bring a more practical and immediate approach to these concepts.)
The combination can be very powerful: they accomplish things with a clear cut sense of purpose and personal mission. Both are decisive and direct, although Eights bring a passion and gusto that counterbalances the One's self-restraint and propriety. Ones can find Eights exciting, physical, and earthy-all the things that they restrain in themselves. Thus, there can be a strong attraction from both sides. Further, Eights recognize that Ones are as strong-willed and determined as they are: they cannot easily sway or bowl over Ones. Eights thus admire their conviction and are attracted to the challenge of getting closer to Ones. In many ways, these two types are opposites-the pirate and the schoolteacher-although both could learn a great deal from the other, if they are willing to listen to someone with such different values, reactions, and ways of doing things.


What breaks Ones and Eights up is often the very thing that attracted them in the first place: how different they are from each other, like fire and ice. This is a relatively rare romantic pairing; it is easier for them to be friends or colleagues than to live intimately together. Both want to be in charge; both want to accomplish something significant, but they tend to disagree about the means to take. Ones tend to be self-controlled and restrained in their self-expressions and methods of doing things. They will deny themselves the pleasure of acting on their real desires and impulses if they are convinced that something they want is not right according to their moral convictions. While they may admire the brashness and roguishness of Eights and their apparent ease in going after whatever they want, Ones ultimately begin to draw a line if they see Eights going too far in the pursuit of their self-interest. Ones can begin to regard Eights as selfish, insensitive, aggressive, and morally corrupt. They may admire the outlaw's bravado, but abhor where it leads them and how much chaos and destruction it creates in its wake. Ones can begin to see Eights as crude, untrustworthy, and violent.
On the other hand, Eights see Ones as hypocrites who preach one thing publicly while doing the opposite privately. They see Ones as rigid, self-righteous, nitpicking, and utterly unrealistic about the way the world works. Eights often want to do more outrageous things just to provoke the morally judgmental One into apoplexy: both respond with anger before they will acknowledge hurt or fear. They can both get into rigid positions and feel that they cannot back down. Violent arguments can often ensue as the relationship flies apart in personal attacks. This is one relationship that is much more difficult to fix once a certain threshold of abuse has been crossed.

[Source]

I am an INFJ One & My husband is an ISTJ Eight.
It can be difficult at times. But we are very committed to each other, & have enough respect, loyalty & love to keep it kosher! :)
 

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What breaks Ones and Eights up is often the very thing that attracted them in the first place: how different they are from each other, like fire and ice. This is a relatively rare romantic pairing; it is easier for them to be friends or colleagues than to live intimately together. Both want to be in charge; both want to accomplish something significant, but they tend to disagree about the means to take. Ones tend to be self-controlled and restrained in their self-expressions and methods of doing things. They will deny themselves the pleasure of acting on their real desires and impulses if they are convinced that something they want is not right according to their moral convictions. While they may admire the brashness and roguishness of Eights and their apparent ease in going after whatever they want, Ones ultimately begin to draw a line if they see Eights going too far in the pursuit of their self-interest. Ones can begin to regard Eights as selfish, insensitive, aggressive, and morally corrupt. They may admire the outlaw's bravado, but abhor where it leads them and how much chaos and destruction it creates in its wake. Ones can begin to see Eights as crude, untrustworthy, and violent.
On the other hand, Eights see Ones as hypocrites who preach one thing publicly while doing the opposite privately. They see Ones as rigid, self-righteous, nitpicking, and utterly unrealistic about the way the world works. Eights often want to do more outrageous things just to provoke the morally judgmental One into apoplexy: both respond with anger before they will acknowledge hurt or fear. They can both get into rigid positions and feel that they cannot back down. Violent arguments can often ensue as the relationship flies apart in personal attacks. This is one relationship that is much more difficult to fix once a certain threshold of abuse has been crossed.
Sounds about right. The only 8 I think I've actually come in contact with more very long in RL was a lady who had a face that looked like it just got out of a knife fight, apparently she had been in those sorts of confrontations many times. She had some sort of control issue going on, even when I was being very giving. I love to teach people and help them out of a bind, but she got so incredibly frustrated at the fact that I would say "Here let me show you" and take control of the mouse on the computer. She told me that it drove her up the wall and never to do that again. I was dumbfounded by this logic that she couldn't accept help despite obvious best intentions because of some weird ideological issue. She may have been racist, but I didn't get the feeling she took issue with it considering she always sat by me. I would sit there for 10 minutes straight and watch her get frustrated with the program and I would reach out to her and she would say that she was fine and just let her wait for the teacher took another 10 mins to get around to her.

Other type 8's I thought I had experiences with were probably actually cp6's.
 

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Don't Four's emotions get on Eight's nerves?
I think we just have to learn to be more resilient around them, but I think at some point, we don't quite get on their nerves as much as they see us as week. :( I don't know if there is any way of avoiding it. Maybe you need someone with a secondary or third type of Eight. I want a 3-8.
 

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Hmm, to me it seems like 8's get along best with 2's, 4's and 6's. If I compare some of these descriptions, it seems like they match some of the socionics duality pairing descriptions.

LSI/EIE (8/2 or 8/6 pairings), LIE/ESI (8/6), and the SLE/IEI (8/4). The ESTp and INFp love arguing with each other and actually get sadomasochistic at times. The ENTj wants a good loyal companion who is competant and a good advisor but not controlling (8/6), and the ISTj is looking for a powerful ENFj woman who can serve as power behind the throne. (for the sake of my examples, assume T = male and F = female)

I (LIE/ENTj) personally have met some 4's and its quite terrifying and exciting, yet the thought of having to take care of someone financially makes me kinda sick to my stomach. I'm friends (hoping for more than that) with a 6 and she almost always pulled me aside in the workplace to calm me down when I was getting incredibly pissed off. I'd be to the point where I was about to have an impulsive shouting match with my boss and she caught on and hugged me and would get really emotional in order to stop me from doing anything I'd regret. Her empathy almost always would just melt my anger away in seconds.
 

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I am an INFJ One & My husband is an ISTJ Eight.
It can be difficult at times. But we are very committed to each other, & have enough respect, loyalty & love to keep it kosher! :)
I am currently seeing a 1. IT IS AWFUL.

He is 1 sx/sp and I am 8w7 sx/sp. I appreciate his inner moral compass since I am big on moral justice. I also like that he will never betray/cheat on me, because of this moral guidance.

BUT HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH HIS JUDGMENTS? He is always so within control; he hates drinking and drugs. On the other hand, I 8w7 am all about partying and having a good times. I am all about getting what I want(as long as it doesnt hurt the others); i can ignore a rule here and there and say "fukc you" to the traditions and conventions.

I can definitely tell he is constantly struggling with his typical 1 conflict : what he must do vs. what he wants to do. He told me I remind him of all the "bad" things he wants to do but cannot do. He is envious of me yet HE IS SO JUDGMENTAL AND CRITICAL OF ME. I think I make him very, very angry.

Since you are married to one, could you please give me an insight?
I would love to save this relationship, but I really do not know how :(
 

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  • Type Eight-Type Six
Enneagram Sixes and Eights can build an extraordinarily strong, long-lasting relationship on what is, at root, a defensive view of the world. Both types feel that most people and the world are selfish and untrustworthy, and that they world is highly unpredictable. One therefore needs to take care of oneself and one's own interests (Eights) and have strong allies and the ability to get back up from one's friends (Sixes). Both Sixes and Eights have deep issues with trust—and with finding people they are able to trust-and so when they have found each other and have gone through a period of testing, their alliance can be solid and deep. Once they have bonded with each other, both types have done so on a deep level of their being, and while the relationship may change over time, they are never indifferent to each other. They both admire and try to embody strength, commitment to one's word, honor, unquestioned loyalty, responsibility, hard work, courage, a spirit of protectiveness, and fighting for the underdog. Both are doers, and enjoy being active, getting tasks accomplished, building a more safe and secure world for themselves and their loved ones. Sixes bring warmth, the desire for personal connection and commitment, a certain playfulness and sensitivity.
They are also mental types and bring skepticism, analytic thinking, and the ability to think through decisions and to foresee outcomes and potential problems before acting. Sixes thus tend to act as advisors and lieutenants to Eights who tend to take the lead and provide the vision and audacity that Sixes sometimes lack themselves. Eights also bring directness and decisiveness, strong wills, confidence, a can do spirit that is energized by adversity and a penchant for taking on challenges. Sixes tend to look up to the Eights as their hero, while Eights are touched by the Six's devotion and courage. Eights are aware of their inner struggles and what it takes to overcome them. When there is genuine affection between these two types, there may be fireworks and occasional fights, but the bond only seems to grow stronger with time.

Both Sixes and Eights are emotional, although both tend to hide their emotions and vulnerabilities as best they can. Eights do so under a veneer of toughness and bravado, Sixes under a shell of defensiveness and bluster. Both tend to counterattack and go on the offensive when threatened—or when they feel they are being threatened. In general, Eights tend to take the lead in most relationships they are in and to set the tone and make decisions. They expect others to obey them and to be loyal to them. Eights may tolerate (or even be amused by) an occasional flare up of independence on the part of others around them, but ultimately, they expect to be in charge. For the most part, this is also fine with Sixes, except for those times when Sixes feel the need to push back and to prove themselves. They need to show others (including the Eight) that they cannot be pushed around or taken advantage of. Power struggles of all kinds can ensue. This is especially true of "counterphobic" Sixes who can actually react much like Eights, displaying leadership, decisiveness and independence (on the positive side) as well as bluster, aggression, and defiance. Sixes who are more counterphobic tend to get into more open fights with Eights until both have determined their territory and just how far each can push the other.
Sixes who are more openly phobic (fearful, timid, anxious) generally tend to avoid confrontations with Eights; instead, they tend to present no open threat to the Eight's dominance, while being covertly passive-aggressive and evasive. Eights can get into conflicts with phobic Sixes by sensing their indirect, questioning qualities—and whether or not the Six is as loyal to the Eight as the Eight wants. Eights may become more or less openly contemptuous of them if they feel the Six is weak or vacillating. Problems in this relationship can be exacerbated by the Eight's tendency to get into rages, to make threats to the Six's security, or to bully and play on weaknesses. When trust and respect crumble in this relationship, constant testing from both parties brings about the end fairly quickly.

[Source]
I tend to date 8s, and I am seeing one now. I would say this fairly describes us. The way I usually get my way is to just completely detach. Lol. Then he knows he is not the one pulling all the strings. I have a say in whether I'm in this relationship or not, and sometimes he's not worth it to me. I think he respects that.

He has some seriously strong staying power. As I found most 8s I've dated do. They don't frighten off easily when my 6ness tests them. They go for it in the long haul. We actually avoid a lot of conflict because they don't take things personally and their really good at dealing with my crap. I in turn, probably have more respect for them than I do with most people. I can break down most others. And that is what will make me want to go away.

However, I have an 8 daughter. There is a serious power imbalance since my daughter does not like to give up control on the basis I'm her mother. Logic like that would never fly with her. According to her, she is on equal footing with everyone: Kids, adults, presidents, Queens, etc. So I often have a problem with this. However, where we do connect is when we both think people are stupid or too emotional.

I'm not very phobic. Eights tend to kick up my CP side. And they usually listen to it, especially in romantic relationships. I've had a harder time dealing with my 8 daughter and my 8 father. They don't back down as quickly. I don't give up my power or my testing easily. But in my 8/6 romantic relationships, I feel like I'm finally with someone strong enough where I don't mind handing over the reigns. They make me feel secure, therefore I can relax in my femininity.
 

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My ADDITIONAL tips to 8s compatibility with other types:


2
Things i appreciate: their sacrifice, constant attention, and love-giving, emotional care
Parts that annoy me: too weak. flattery confused/annoys me. Hate it when they are too accepting of others.

3
The good: efficiency, knows how to get shit done, knows how to appear good in public, perfect eye candies to bring along, they are always constantly seeking for my approval which fans my ego and makes me laugh, AMAZING WORK-ETHIC
The bad: liars!!!!! No genuineness. No "real face." No moral grounds.


5
Good: Clarity of insight. Objectivity. Intelligent discussions. I like having the power of knowledge on my side.
Bad: Their super discomfort with my 8 intensity and aggression. They will never budge or show a reaction when I provoke them. They retreat when I push.

6
Good : Worrying together about the world's dangers and criticizing injustice. Sharing similar moral foundation. Knowing I can count on their minds in cases of danger. Their desire for security(as opposed to 3's desire for prominence or 8's desire for control)less threatening to my competition for power. Phobic 6 are the nicest people!
Bad: When they feel the need to play "the devil's advocate" it annoys me to no end.....

7
Good: so much damn fun! Love the speed of their thinking. Endless adventure and social gatherings.
Bad: their choice for variety over intensity. I can't quite make them "mine." Their never-ending selfishness.
 
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