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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I find that I give the same advice over and over again. Sometimes it is asked for. Sometimes it is not.

"It's not that big a deal. You should just not care about it."

"Go take a nap."

"Seriously, stop talking."

"If you ate more fiber and got some exercise once in a while, you wouldn't be in this situation."

"Why are you talking to me about this? You know what you should do already. Go do it."


What unhelpful advice do you give?
 

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Tales from a lonely TJ surrounded by P's (especially with the FP's):

"It's easy, let me tell you..."

"It's easy, let me tell you again..."

"It's easy, let me show you..."

"It's easy, I just showed you!"

"Seriously?"

"It's determined by hormones & enzymes, not mass action" (I must be a masochist)

"Try to stay calm. Stressing/being emotional doesn't help"

"Try to keep perspective"

"What's actionable?"

"Stop avoiding/procrastinating/being lazy"

"Make a plan"

"That's not a plan, it's an intention"

"That's not a plan, it's a goal"

"You have this pattern..."

"It's more efficient if you..."

"You would never spend money the way you spend your time"

"Think"
 

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I find that I give the same advice over and over again. Sometimes it is asked for. Sometimes it is not.

"It's not that big a deal. You should just not care about it."

"Go go take a nap."

"Seriously, stop talking."

"If you ate more fiber and got some exercise once in a while, you wouldn't be in this situation."

"Why are you talking to me about this? You know what you should do already. Go do it."


What unhelpful advice do you give?
These should all be fortune cookies. Especially the fiber one. I would love to get INTJ written fortune cookies.
 

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"Be yourself" - to some people who I don't know if they should be themselves.

And I tend to advise people to believe everything will be good because I don't wanna hear them complaining. (And if they don't want to think objectively how to solve problems, then they better think wrong in optimist way.)

And the worst advice I keep giving is when someone doesn't find anything I don't say "search"/"next time remember where you put it"/"I'll help u look for it"/"try to remember where you put it"/"try to clean up the room". I ask how valuable is it for him or her, and then I say tactless: "sometimes you lose things..."
 

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Discussion Starter #6
"Be yourself" - to some people who I don't know if they should be themselves.

And I tend to advise people to believe everything will be good because I don't wanna hear them complaining. (And if they don't want to think objectively how to solve problems, then they better think wrong in optimist way.)
I do that too. And then I feel guilty but if it gets them to stop talking, I figure it's worth it. And I have always thought that whole "Just, be yourself" advice should be "Be sort of yourself, but you might want to fake some things."
 

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I do that too. And then I feel guilty but if it gets them to stop talking, I figure it's worth it. And I have always thought that whole "Just, be yourself" advice should be "Be sort of yourself, but you might want to fake some things."
"Ah, but we know that people get fired, nice guy. I assure you everything will be alright in two weeks. We've been in worse situations already. Like when I got fired. Two weeks after that everything was alright. I liked feeling fresh. Let me tell you about my first day at the new work..."
That doesn't sound guilty to me. And doesn't make me feel guilty. Besides, I don't mind being guilty (unless it's something legal).
I usually try to change the subject to something that's completely unrelated. Bad example. (+I've never got fired, I'm only 17 yo.)
 

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Plague Doctor
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I aim for my advice to be helpful. That doesn't exactly mean that it is helpful, though.
 

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I aim for my advice to be helpful.
i think mine is unhelpful along the subtextual lines of 'if you think i'm going to stand here and enable this shit, you are wrong.' i actually like listening while people talk through what is troubling them, if they're real. but i wildly hate being used or manipulated, so i also take a sneaky personal pleasure in thwarting people who give me agenda-shaped vibes. i like pointing o ut the perfectly-accurate shortcut so they'll have no excuse for trying to drag me through their long scenic self-wallowing route.
 

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Plague Doctor
INTJ, 5w4, Ni-T type
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i think mine is unhelpful along the subtextual lines of 'if you think i'm going to stand here and enable this shit, you are wrong.' i actually like listening while people talk through what is troubling them, if they're real. but i wildly hate being used or manipulated, so i also take a sneaky personal pleasure in thwarting people who give me agenda-shaped vibes. i like pointing o ut the perfectly-accurate shortcut so they'll have no excuse for trying to drag me through their long scenic self-wallowing route.
In that case, I'm unhelpful right there with you.
 

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I don't really dispense advise, but I often remind people of death when they complain to me. Cuts them nicely short.

Acquaintance: "I hate it when people X and when A told B what C did to D I felt X about Y..."
Me: "You'll die one day and suffer no more."

 

I think it's due to a coping mechanism I developed a long time ago to deal with my own internal issues. It's essentially a darker take on "This, too, shall pass". Somehow, reminding myself that I come with an expiration date helps me accept the heaviness within.
 

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In that case, I'm unhelpful right there with you.
:laughing: i just can't stand being made to watch while they claw at their emotional sores. and this really is a very different thing from someone who is genuine and sincere. i tend to jump right to the end. 'so x and you feel y about it.' what's remarkable to me is that genuine people usually react to validation with relief and delight - yesss! thank god you get it. the posturers get pissed off by validation. it short-circuits the one-man-wankfest they were intending to have at your expense. they wanted to drag you through the whole incremental step-by-step process towards the reveal, and they wanted you to sit still and be awed while they unveil The Point before you.

can't stand those people. not sure that it really has anything to do with dispensing advice, but i can't. i guess i do advise them if i'm feeling punitive enough. 'here's the answer to all this posing and persiflage. now would you please just shut up.'
 

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These should all be fortune cookies. Especially the fiber one. I would love to get INTJ written fortune cookies.
I think there might a market for jerk advice fortune cookies. I would definitely hand them out as party favors :laughing:.

Also, some pearls of not-wisdom I have given:

"You can figure it out."

"Try searching on the Internet."

"Get help from somebody who knows the answer."

"You worry too much."
 

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I think there might a market for jerk advice fortune cookies. I would definitely hand them out as party favors :laughing:.
I was thinking about this more after I posted. I think that INTJ's (and others) do really give helpful advice and observations, but some people aren't able to hear solid practical advice from actual people in their lives. Maybe because they are not willing to change that thing about themselves or face up to something that someone else noticed before they did. These same people who don't want to or are annoyed by real advice from people in their lives might take advice from something mystical and random like a fortune cookie. If someone said it to them they would get offended but if it came from the heavens above it would be fate and a really good idea to them.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I was thinking about this more after I posted. I think that INTJ's (and others) do really give helpful advice and observations, but some people aren't able to hear solid practical advice from actual people in their lives. Maybe because they are not willing to change that thing about themselves or face up to something that someone else noticed before they did. These same people who don't want to or are annoyed by real advice from people in their lives might take advice from something mystical and random like a fortune cookie. If someone said it to them they would get offended but if it came from the heavens above it would be fate and a really good idea to them.
I did something like this with someone close to me who was going through a rough patch and kept coming to me for advice and emotional support. The problem was, he had such a negative script running in his head, that when he needed help the most, nothing I said would sink in. I was actually accused of lying when I tried to say anything realistic or positive. That would make me angry, and the conversation would end badly.

So I gave two last pieces of advice:

1. Take some time while you are calm and in a stable frame of mind, get a bunch of note cards, and write down all the negative stuff you tell yourself. Then write down why it isn't true. When you start feeling bad, don't come to me. Go look at the note cards. You know you weren't lying when you wrote them.

2. Go talk to a therapist and leave me out of it.

That actually worked pretty well for both of us. We got along better, and he did good work with the therapist. He actually used the note cards, and told me the therapist thought they were a great idea. So hah! I do give useful advice sometimes.
 

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"Yep...you say the same thing every day. I'm not sure what you thought you were signing yourself up for...but you did. So...find a solution or suck it up."

Living with a non-SO person who "processes"/wallows out loud can be trying.

edit: oh I missed the point of the thread. lol this is the in-my-head version. My out-loud version is "oh, well maybe you should talk to a supervisor about that"
 
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Discussion Starter #17
"Yep...you say the same thing every day. I'm not sure what you thought you were signing yourself up for...but you did. So...find a solution or suck it up."

Living with a non-SO person who "processes"/wallows out loud can be trying.

edit: oh I missed the point of the thread. lol this is the in-my-head version. My out-loud version is "oh, well maybe you should talk to a supervisor about that"
I like hearing both - what you say out loud and what you say in your head. The in-your-head version is usually more interesting anyway.
 

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Tales from a lonely TJ surrounded by P's (especially with the FP's):

"It's easy, let me tell you..."

"It's easy, let me tell you again..."

"It's easy, let me show you..."

"It's easy, I just showed you!"

"Seriously?"

"It's determined by hormones & enzymes, not mass action" (I must be a masochist)

"Try to stay calm. Stressing/being emotional doesn't help"

"Try to keep perspective"

"What's actionable?"

"Stop avoiding/procrastinating/being lazy"

"Make a plan"

"That's not a plan, it's an intention"

"That's not a plan, it's a goal"

"You have this pattern..."

"It's more efficient if you..."

"You would never spend money the way you spend your time"

"Think"
...and you say your eye-rolling muscles haven't degenerated from overuse?
 

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I don't really dispense advise, but I often remind people of death when they complain to me. Cuts them nicely short.

Acquaintance: "I hate it when people X and when A told B what C did to D I felt X about Y..."
Me: "You'll die one day and suffer no more."

 

I think it's due to a coping mechanism I developed a long time ago to deal with my own internal issues. It's essentially a darker take on "This, too, shall pass". Somehow, reminding myself that I come with an expiration date helps me accept the heaviness within.
Here, then. At home, by no more storms distrest,
Folding laborious hands as we sit, wings furled;
Here in close perfume lies the rose-leaf curled,
Here the sun stands and knows not east nor west,
Here no tide runs; we have come, last and best.
From the wide zone through dizzying circles hurled,
To that still centre, where the spinning world
Sleeps on its axis, to the heart of rest.

Lay on thy whips, O Love, that me upright,
Poised on the perilous point, in no lax bed
May sleep, as tension at the verberant core
Of music sleeps; for, if thou spare to smite,
Staggering, we stoop, stooping, fall dumb and dead,
And, dying so, sleep our sweet sleep no more.
 
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