[middle_aged_enfp]

We speak here about how INTJs try to excel at everything and optimize everything, including the act of loving their partners. What I've almost never seen discussed is, what they expect in return.

Queasy topic to bring up/discuss. But what the hell... no one is a pure "giver"; there's got to be some "taking" as well to maintain fairness, balance and equilibrium in the long term.

Sure, an INTJ likes to feel like 'they've done it all correct and have won the round'. I wonder what the partner might be able to do to help the INTJ feel good about the whole thing.

[EDIT: Added the text below:]

Let me clarify what I am looking for. Sorry it wasn't clear enough the first time.

In your reply, if possible:
1. Please answer from two distinct points of view: 'General love' and physical intimacy
2. Please indicate whether you are a male/female (if you think the distinction matters and if you are OK to reveal this about yourself)

Reg: point 1. The reason I asked to distinguish is that while giving alone-time and a lot of room might be a really nice thing for an INTJ from their partner, the same cannot be extrapolated to intimacy, since by definition, intimacy cannot be about 'leaving someone alone'. Therefore, to me, the two states are likely to be very different, especially for INTJs.

Thank you forum people, for you all actually take the effort to answer sincerely (can't say that about some other fora).

 

[VinnieBob]

we want what every one else wants
honesty, truthfulness, loyalty, love, respect and most importantly the need of our weekly alone time

 

[Mmmm]

I agree with @vinniebob
We all want to feel wanted, & loved by our SO. I require honesty, respect, & for me, above all else, consideration. Sprinkle in some affection, good cooking, & a weekly massage, & I'm yours for the taking. :tongue: I also need quiet in the mornings, alone time, at some point during the day, to recharge my batteries, & a listening ear.

For me, words mean nothing, without the actions to back them up. Gifts aren't necessary, unless you request my wish list. That's all I can think of right now.

Edit: What I stated above, would fall under the "general love" category, & what I put in bold goes under "physical intimacy". I enjoy being touched, & held by my SO. Climbing into his lap, as he wraps his arms around me, is very comforting, especially after a stressful day. As I stated above, I love massages too. I hope this is what you are looking for, if not, let me know so I can delete the following, because it will be TMI.

 

As far as sex goes, I expect consideration. I like a more sensuous experience, fully connected, body, & mind. I enjoy the whole experience, including eye contact, hearing him, kissing, touching, etc...

 

[contradictionary]

My INTJ girlfriend and I were discussing this the other day, but I realize that even on this forum, this particular angle doesn't get explored much. (Or if it has been, please point me to the link; happy to read up.)

We speak here about how INTJs try to excel at everything and optimize everything, including the act of loving their partners. What I've almost never seen discussed is, what they expect in return.

Queasy topic to bring up/discuss. But what the hell... no one is a pure "giver"; there's got to be some "taking" as well to maintain fairness, balance and equilibrium in the long term.

Sure, an INTJ likes to feel like 'they've done it all correct and have won the round'. I wonder what the partner might be able to do to help the INTJ feel good about the whole thing.

Recognition. Not in the thing we do or "optimize" in working for the relationship, but on each our personal competence, each our personal field of expertise, and our "me time" requirements. The last part is the most expensive payment any partner have to give, especially the F people, naturally.

And let us optimize your things -your bells and whistles- too cuz we'll be happy to do that. We are happy when you are.

 

[middle_aged_enfp]

@vinniebob, @Mmmm @contradictionary : Thank you for your response. Would you like to add to your responses based on the Edit/clarification in the question (OP)?

 

[VinnieBob]

general love is a term INTJ cannot relate too
we care very deeply for our S.O. but once betrayed we cut off our emotion to that individual in the blink of an eye

pretty sure I am of X stock
lots of people call me a fucking dick
no ones ever called me a cunt or pussyh:

 

[contradictionary]

At risking being stereotype, mmmm already answer it for me.

Physical intimacy is okay, good, nice, lovely, as long as its not excessive and proper and timely

Not excessive and proper and timely being the difficulty factor.


Sent sans PC

 

[middle_aged_enfp]

I agree with @vinniebob
We all want to feel wanted, & loved by our SO. I require honesty, respect, & for me, above all else, consideration. Sprinkle in some affection, good cooking, & a weekly massage, & I'm yours for the taking. :tongue: I also need quiet in the mornings, alone time, at some point during the day, to recharge my batteries, & a listening ear.

For me, words mean nothing, without the actions to back them up. Gifts aren't necessary, unless you request my wish list. That's all I can think of right now.

Edit: What I stated above, would fall under the "general love" category, & what I put in bold goes under "physical intimacy". I enjoy being touched, & held by my SO. Climbing into his lap, as he wraps his arms around me, is very comforting, especially after a stressful day. As I stated above, I love massages too. I hope this is what you are looking for, if not, let me know so I can delete the following, because it will be TMI.

 

As far as sex goes, I expect consideration. I like a more sensuous experience, fully connected, body, & mind. I enjoy the whole experience, including eye contact, hearing him, kissing, touching, etc...

Thank you, @Mmmm.

It is interesting how INTJs infrequently talk about what they want from their SOs to make their lives nice. But we've still had some conversations out here about it. At least a little bit.

But in the realm of sex, nothing. INTJs never reveal what _they_ want from their SO, to make their experience better. You are probably one of the first to mention anything at all on the matter! Thank you for starting the conversation.

And totally not TMI.

 

[middle_aged_enfp]

we want what every one else wants
honesty, truthfulness, loyalty, love, respect and most importantly the need of our weekly alone time

OK, but these are broad ideas, not actions. What would loyalty look like? What actions will make you feel 'love' and 'respect'? etc.

Let's talk about specifics of what makes an INTJ feel loved - generally and intimately.

 

[middle_aged_enfp]

At risking being stereotype, mmmm already answer it for me.

Physical intimacy is okay, good, nice, lovely, as long as its not excessive and proper and timely

Not excessive and proper and timely being the difficulty factor.


Sent sans PC

OK. What does sufficient, proper and timely translate to, in actions? Any specific ideas?

 

[VinnieBob]

I am incapable of feeling/experiencing ''love''

 

[ponpiri]

What are you gathering these answers for?

My wants are an honest and truly good person that brings stability to my life, not chaos. I'll take some quirks, since that's what makes people interesting, but I'm not here for the player types, the swindlers or even the good boys with no backbone.

I've been thinking about this lately. So far, the best that I've 'dated' have been much nicer and emotionally available versions of myself or a male version of my best friend.

 

[HBMe]

We want love, affection, respect, loyalty and consideration. The world is a foreign place and it's important that the SO can look beyond the stereotypes and actually see us for who we really are (even though we don't let them, sometimes).
And the whole "I'm happy when you are" is very true for me too, as long as it doesn't betray the fundamental rules of respect, loyalty and consideration.

As for intimacy, everyone has their personal "pressure points" so that's hard to generalize as a Type thing.

 

[Blue Flower]

What are you gathering these answers for.

I have not answered, though I have ideas, because I’m not INTJ. But your question above is my thought too.

I was reading some of the ENFP threads and was surprised at what a difference the I and E make. NFPs start out with similar types of topics. But ENFP then seems to go into ask and ask again mode where INFP is more “ok, now it’s time to listen to what you are ok revealing.”

I found some of the ENFP questions what I would think of as intrusive, even in a relationship. It puts me in “Why do you want to know” territory.

 

[ponpiri]

I have not answered, though I have ideas, because I’m not INTJ. But your question above is my thought too.

I was reading some of the ENFP threads and was surprised at what a difference the I and E make. NFPs start out with similar types of topics. But ENFP then seems to go into ask and ask again mode where INFP is more “ok, now it’s time to listen to what you are ok revealing.”

I found some of the ENFP questions what I would think of as intrusive, even in a relationship. It puts me in “Why do you want to know” territory.

This thread is coming across as if they want specific actions to perform on someone they know in real life.

If that's the case, then the answer, OP, is to be yourself. If they don't like you as is, then that's that.

 

[lilysocks]

Therefore, to me, the two states are likely to be very different, especially for INTJs.

they aren't to me. they both have the same gamut from 'leave me alone' to the other extreme. i don't think i understand the question.

and the possibility that 'intimacy' is being used as a euphemism for sex/touch in some of the references isn't helping me to figure out what you're trying to get at.

 

[middle_aged_enfp]

Therefore, to me, the two states are likely to be very different, especially for INTJs.

they aren't to me. they both have the same gamut from 'leave me alone' to the other extreme. i don't think i understand the question.

and the possibility that 'intimacy' is being used as a euphemism for sex/touch in some of the references isn't helping me to figure out what you're trying to get at.

Ok. Glad this was pointed out. May be because I am not a native English speaker, my words aren't coming through as they should.

Let me try to clarify:
1. To me, there is no difference between physical intimacy, sex etc. I think the sentiment is expressed by different people differently. For some, the act of cuddling and being warm bodies for each other on a sofa in front of the hearth on a winter evening might be enough physical intimacy to convey the deepest forms of love.

For someone else, unless it's outright sex, it's not intimate enough.

I wouldn't judge either choice. Just asking what INTJs wish for in return for all the hard work they put into perfecting their actions - be that in acts of service, words of affirmation or physical touch. What do they want in return typically? (Yes, I know that quality time also includes being gladly allowed quality solitude!) 🙂

2. Oh! All this speculation of why I ask! LoL! 😄 Sorry to disappoint, but no such salacious story coming your way. At my ripe old age and steady state of life, I'm very clear about not being interested in any side-relationships. They aren't my idea of fun at all.

The genesis of this qn. was a conversation with an INTJ girl about how her partner can please her. She had only answered, "Enough to assure me I've done a good job with him!" That was vague. So, just assuring them with words is all it takes for fulfilling intimacy needs of INTJ? That seemed off. Hence I'm asking you all.

 

[EyesOpen]

It's not really something I think about. I don't sit around and think about the give and take. If I'm getting what I need, then I stay in the relationship. If not, then I don't. I suppose there's times where I may ask for something: need more affection, need more conversation, or something like that but...*shrug* I don't go into a relationship knowing in my head that I need this or that out of it explicitly. So, it's hard for me to even really answer this in concrete terms.

I suppose it's...reciprocal engagement. My time and energy to connect are precious to me. I appreciate when a person I care for spends their time and energy on me and I hope they would also appreciate my spending time and energy on them. When we are both spending nice time and energy with each other in somewhat similar amounts, I am pleased.

I dunno, I don't really have a list. Maybe because I haven't really been in many relationships nor a poor one that I can point out and say "NOT that". The one I'm in right now is good. It just works. I don't sit around thinking about why and what I'm getting and what he's getting and what I'm giving and what he's giving. *shrug* That sounds tedious

 

[EyesOpen]

I wouldn't judge either choice. Just asking what INTJs wish for in return for all the hard work they put into perfecting their actions

I also don't view it this way. So, that makes it hard to answer your question as well. I don't see it as "oh I'm doing all this work. Now what do you owe me?" It's...not like that at all. I'm not rooting around trying to provide my partner a perfect experience or something lol

Truly, I am not thoughtful and purposeful in the way you are proposing as the baseline for your questioning.

It might be, funnily enough, that you are overthinking it and your INTJ is trying to tell you to just be. And that might be why she doesn't really have a specific answer.

 

[freud]

Therefore, to me, the two states are likely to be very different, especially for INTJs.

they aren't to me. they both have the same gamut from 'leave me alone' to the other extreme. i don't think i understand the question.

and the possibility that 'intimacy' is being used as a euphemism for sex/touch in some of the references isn't helping me to figure out what you're trying to get at.

Ok. Glad this was pointed out. May be because I am not a native English speaker, my words aren't coming through as they should.

Let me try to clarify:
1. To me, there is no difference between physical intimacy, sex etc. I think the sentiment is expressed by different people differently. For some, the act of cuddling and being warm bodies for each other on a sofa in front of the hearth on a winter evening might be enough physical intimacy to convey the deepest forms of love.

For someone else, unless it's outright sex, it's not intimate enough.

I wouldn't judge either choice. Just asking what INTJs wish for in return for all the hard work they put into perfecting their actions - be that in acts of service, words of affirmation or physical touch. What do they want in return typically? (Yes, I know that quality time also includes being gladly allowed quality solitude!) 🙂

2. Oh! All this speculation of why I ask! LoL! 😄 Sorry to disappoint, but no such salacious story coming your way. At my ripe old age and steady state of life, I'm very clear about not being interested in any side-relationships. They aren't my idea of fun at all.

The genesis of this qn. was a conversation with an INTJ girl about how her partner can please her. She had only answered, "Enough to assure me I've done a good job with him!" That was vague. So, just assuring them with words is all it takes for fulfilling intimacy needs of INTJ? That seemed off. Hence I'm asking you all.

I wouldn't judge either choice. Just asking what INTJs wish for in return for all the hard work they put into perfecting their actions

I also don't view it this way. So, that makes it hard to answer your question as well. I don't see it as "oh I'm doing all this work. Now what do you owe me?" It's...not like that at all. I'm not rooting around trying to provide my partner a perfect experience or something lol

Truly, I am not thoughtful and purposeful in the way you are proposing as the baseline for your questioning.

It might be, funnily enough, that you are overthinking it and your INTJ is trying to tell you to just be. And that might be why she doesn't really have a specific answer.

Hm yea. I'm guessing the questioner is an NFJ of some sort. I'm an INTP who dated INTJs and in my opinion their cuteness lies precisely in their ability to calculate and give and structure stuff, but then just enjoy the process rather than focusing on the outcome. Weird b/c they automatically do efficiency calculation in almost all other things, and I do that too as an analytic INTP, but they never felt calculative in relationships. They are very cute and simple and child-like in that way. I trust them, loved their predictability, we admired certain things about each other and it just worked. I felt like there was no "price tag" in their actions, with a decent range of what they can accept in terms of their SO's qualities. As long as our values line up and we appreciate each other to a similar degree, I didn't have any problem with my ex's and they seemed pretty satisfied too.