Based on how you describe yourself, to me you sound like an ISTP 5w4 sp/so.
Thanks so much, but after talking with Brightflashes, she noticed I had Se in the PoLR position (according to Socionics), and I noticed that I prefer Si over Se. ISFP could be a possibility, but Ne/Si seemed more obvious, if that makes sense.@danthemanklein
I think i said you might be INFx before. This time i see more Fi than anything, also some Se and some Ni, which is why i would also say IxFP with ISFP as the more probable answer.
The reason i saw INFJ in you was because i saw some Ni, but i used to lean more towards INFP because Fi was stronger and it seemed supported by some sort of intuition. And after reading this post, i have found a few answers from you that really stand out as ISFP:
1. Answer to 9. a) What activities energize you most?
You seem to like daydreaming and imagining things, but you also seem to have a few Se hobbies: Listening to music while doing chores (i love that too!), doing individual activities outside (typically ISxP), sport stacking and other types of physical exercise, video games (if there's any hobby the average Se type shares with N types, it's that), and drawing (common among ISFPs).
ISFP, from my experience, is the S type that daydreams the most. N types tend to daydream more than S types, especially the introverts, but ISFPs really like to daydream as well, it seems.
Also, Lady Gaga said it pretty well: "I'm half living my life between reality and fantasy at all times." She's a verified ISFP and you can find a list of famous ISFPs here. IDRlabs isn't perfect but i find Gaga's typing accurate.
2. "Inspiration and dedication to my passions...[purpose in life] would be to find my passion and stick with it because it’ll lead to my happiness."
IxFP types are all about that passion! The second part of what you said is just so Fi-Ni. You're reflective of your present self, your preferences and feelings, and the positive future you are determined to set for yourself.
3. "Agree to disagree"
Some people have suggested Fe for you, which is a possible explanation for your desire to avoid arguments/conflict. But i think your methodology of "agree to disagree" is more Fi, as Fi is a function that emphasizes individuality and Fe is more like "let's all agree and let's all be happy". Fe peeps would be less happy than you are to see people agree to disagree, they value unity more.
(Fe example: I try to tell myself to deal with conflict the way you do, but my tertiary Fe keeps getting annoyed and insecure about disagreements inside groups that are supposed to be TOGETHER and a TEAM, etc. etc.)
4. Just daydreaming, whether I’m a character in a show or book...I also think about my interests a lot as well. I tend to think if I can write down my daydreams, then I might be able to start my stories and creative writing, but am too lazy to do that.
Here, have this quote from https://www.16personalities.com/isfp-personality.
5. I can also look at the brighter side of things and become optimistic. Then again, I can also be pessimistic when something terrible has happened and I don’t know how to handle it.
Have some more 16personalities:
I don't like the gnashing teeth part, i never saw it as an ISFP thing. But i think what they mean is that you can, at times, get annoyed and forget how to deal with things calmly and positively when you get caught up in the moment. However, ISFPs are generally seen as positive and peaceful people, which is the "charm and creativity" part.
You could still be INFP, but i would be more sure about ISFP :tongue:
What is the PoLR position, could you explain?Thanks so much, but after talking with Brightflashes, she noticed I had Se in the PoLR position (according to Socionics), and I noticed that I prefer Si over Se. ISFP could be a possibility, but Ne/Si seemed more obvious, if that makes sense.
Not sure if I agree with that, as I already crossed out the xSTP types as an option (definitely not a T type, lol). Plus, I released that 5 didn’t seem to resonate with me at all, but if it sounds different to you, then I guess that makes sense.Based on how you describe yourself, to me you sound like an ISTP 5w4 sp/so.
In Socionics, the PoLR function stands for “Point of Least Resistance,” meaning it is your weakest function and you don’t know how to use it, as far as I can understand. It’s the function you don’t trust whatsoever. I’m sure @brightflashes will explain it better than I can, since she really knows a lot more than I do, lol.What is the PoLR position, could you explain?
Ohh wow i guess i was pretty far off, i used more of a general ISFP description than a Se description. I'll go back through this thread and read it, i never quite understood Socionics.In Socionics, the PoLR function stands for “Point of Least Resistance,” meaning it is your weakest function and you don’t know how to use it, as far as I can understand. It’s the function you don’t trust whatsoever. I’m sure @brightflashes will explain it better than I can, since she really knows a lot more than I do, lol.
I was going to ask for examples but then i read what you wrote for music. Ever since i was little i've been exposed to lots of music, and i have perfect pitch - i can hear a melody and instantly add harmony to it, i can improvise a melody if somebody gives me chords or if there are no chords my mind creates them for me. And i'm unaware of it, too, i'm just so...in the moment, i guess. Is that similar to what you're describing?It doesn't however gift me the ability. The closest I would describe "ability" to is FLOW. Where some sort of chemical reaction happens that allows me to transcend my average ability into greatness for a short period of time. This however, appears to others as natural ability -- but to me it's just my body and mind melding as one as I engage myself with a task relating to objects in the external world. I think in those moments all of S/T/F/N are in some sort of a harmony ... Like an orchestra of finely tuned instruments with Sensation leading the way.
The thing I will say is that when it comes to improv and manipulation of sound and music I do have natural ability. I have often wondered how much it's type related and how little, but I doubt that it is. One thing I will say though is that I can "do" music without thinking about music and the harmony creates/plays itself.
For the longest time I thought that every musician could do improv, but it took me a long time to realize that this isn't something that comes easy to a lot of people -- and so I have started thinking about it in terms of Jungian functions, but I don't really have many answers for it.
Learn as I go yes. Learning by trying yes. Yeah, I pick up new things very quickly. I didn't know cooking three years ago. Now we eat mostly home cooked meals. I learnt photography in less than a year and went from amateur to people asking that I do their weddings... Not a preferred career choice tbh.I was going to ask for examples but then i read what you wrote for music. Ever since i was little i've been exposed to lots of music, and i have perfect pitch - i can hear a melody and instantly add harmony to it, i can improvise a melody if somebody gives me chords or if there are no chords my mind creates them for me. And i'm unaware of it, too, i'm just so...in the moment, i guess. Is that similar to what you're describing?
The "flow" you describe, is it a way of learning things quickly? Because i definitely can quickly catch on to the best way to do things in a new environment. Except in math, i missed my window of opportunity to be brilliant in mathematic problem-solving when i got super lazy 3 years ago and still kind of am.
Lately i've been thinking about that - does Se or any other cognitive function give us certain abilities in certain areas? Or are people just saying that i'm surprisingly good for a beginner to make me feel better? :dry: (I don't see myself as "good" at football, i mess up all the time and wish i was better, but i would like to investigate this further.) There are things i suck at, but do you think functions are related to our general talents (or things people aren't good at) like learning quickly, mastery, being good/bad with language or STEM?
Wow, that gives me hope to finally learn to cook my own meals! Also the possibility of playing decent football in a year or so. Thanks i guess XDLearn as I go yes. Learning by trying yes. Yeah, I pick up new things very quickly. I didn't know cooking three years ago. Now we eat mostly home cooked meals. I learnt photography in less than a year and went from amateur to people asking that I do their weddings... Not a preferred career choice tbh.
But I believe that that particular penchant of quick learning combined with quick to boredom gives my skills a plateau. To gain mastery I need patience that I don't have so I end up doing just enough to be very good but never quite great.
Yes. Yes. Give me the chords and I will create the melody around it and I'm not even thinking. It's happening on the fly because there's basic logic to music rythm and of course there's that feeling involved. You just know which keys to hit and sometimes you don't even think and it's happening. I'm not thinking or anything at all. It's just happening.
Here's an example of how I use a combination of improv and just fiddling around with stuff to create music.
Yep, I did because I figured it was the right thing to do after some self reflection and what not. The only thing I don’t get in your comment is the “tyrant” part under your description of inferior Te. I figured that could just be another word too controlling or something, I just thought it seemed a bit dramatic is all, but that’s just me.Yes, that sounds like Te inf. As long as it's sth. you do for a longer period (at least hours, most likely days, even weeks) and not the "snapping" thing that has nothing to do with functions but with anger management or with the nervous system's lability (calm vs limbic dichotomy). People who are like that also usually regret their actions; the difference is Te inf is more bossing people around as opposed to the Fi dom's normal caring behaviour.
Like, if you read an ESTJ stereotypical description on the net, all the negative parts of it coming out in you. Actually, that is a good test: see if you identify you in these periods of time when you lash out with all the bad things you can find in some end-of-test-given description of ESTJ (micromanaging, bossing people around, tyrant). After a state like that you don't just regret the way you treated others, but feel that you were acting like another person with totally different personality traits, traits you would like to have if you were to handle them well, but you didn't, you handled them horribly, turning them into the worst behaviour possible.
This part, not necessarily Te inf: Any type can be a procrastinator, even the ExTJs (they may be frustrated and unmotivated). But it's more common among Ps than among Js. ENFPs are also big procrastinators, so it's not a differentiator.
I see you chose INFP above your picture. I agree, it was the most likely.
Hey @Owl . It's really nice to see you on since I haven't seen you in such a long time (unless you're an imposter owl and in that case, nice to meet you).Based on how you describe yourself, to me you sound like an ISTP 5w4 sp/so.
Yeah to me, whenever someone says Ti, I get a little confused because I can't see myself as a T type at all, much less an E one, lol. I could see ISFP, but that would lead to Ne PoLR as opposed to Se PoLR. Plus, there are at least a few people in the typology community that pointed out my tertiary Si, leading to Se PoLR. Not only that, but I figured that Ne in the auxiliary position is very different compared to Ne in dominant position. I've read somewhere that your aux is like a "switch," so I can turn on/off Ne whenever, so I've wondered if I turn on my Ne whenever I talk because it's the function I'm extraverting. Although, I've also heard that Ne could also happen in the head as well, such as this: bananas are yellow like the sun > the sun > hot stars in space > collapsing into black holes > how scary/painful it would be to fall into one > that one scene in Interstellar > multiple universes? > what if's? > comparing TV shows to different timelines and universes, like what if these characters are actually real in another universe?Hey @Owl . It's really nice to see you on since I haven't seen you in such a long time (unless you're an imposter owl and in that case, nice to meet you).
I'm curious what the indicators you're getting for Ti/Fi and Se? I'm particularly interested in where you see Ti, as you said ISXP which inclueds ISTP.
I'd suggest the instinctual variants could either be sx/so or sp/so, but I'm much less schooled in Enneagram and the variants. I do agree with 5w4 or 4w5; whichever resonates more.
Yes, that's what it is.Yep, I did because I figured it was the right thing to do after some self reflection and what not. The only thing I don’t get in your comment is the “tyrant” part under your description of inferior Te. I figured that could just be another word too controlling or something, I just thought it seemed a bit dramatic is all, but that’s just me.
Damn, that sucks that you had to go through that. I would go nuts if someone tried to control me like that. You'd think that she, being an INFP, wouldn't be so over controlling about wanting to change who you are as a person and would encourage to embrace your authentic self. However, it does seem to make sense she may be like that because of past trauma, and over use her inferior Te in an unhealthy manner.Yes, that's what it is.
I had a close relative who was an INFP in chronic inferior grip and tyrant is the best word to describe her. Due to the complications in my family I would spend 1-2 weeks per year living with her when I was a teenager, so I got a fair share of that. She wanted to have the last word on everything about me: what I ate, what I wore, how I was spending my time, even how I expressed my sexuality. I started trying to avoid being with her as much as possible (the situation was such that I could be absent the whole day, fortunately) and it worked; when I wasn't around she was forgetting I even existed. But as soon as we were in the same room together, the nagging would start again.
Even when she would ask me which I want, x, y or z (to eat, wear, go to etc.) it was a false question: there was a right answer (what she wanted me to do) and a wrong one. If I would pick the wrong one she would harass me to no end with arguments why it's inferior to the other option, then pass on to insults if I didn't give in, raise her voice etc, until I would pick the "right" one.
She was elegant, into fashion, had been a girly girl when she was my age, you know, that kind of woman. I was the complete opposite: a tomboy interested in science, literature and sports, zero make up, zero interest or knowledge of fashion etc. so she decided I was "abnormal" and I needed to be "fixed". When the right/wrong option questions about what I would wear/do with my body didn't work she started nagging/humiliating me about my looks in front of her friends or even strangers.
There was a "right" way to be, and a "wrong" one, and by god, she was going to fix things (= unhealthy Te).
I saw/found out from others that she was overcontrolling and micromanaging with more or less everybody, she just was more intensely/found it easier to do it to me because of me being a teen and her being the adult responsible for me.
When I got into MBTI, it was clear to me that she was an INFP as strange as it may seem to you after the things I wrote above. She was rejecting reality (the facts & probability) (overuse of Fi and Ne, underuse of Si and Te); if you would talk to her at length, she was basically the INFP stereotype, believing in pink unicorns and all.
Then I read about inferior functions and things only made more sense. She was a textbook INFP chronically inf. Te gripped; this can happen, be stuck in a grip for decades, in a pseudo-functioning state. She was like that (because of trauma or ???) and the result was she just had to have her way in other peoples' lives.
I knew her better so I had no doubt about INFP, but someone who just worked with her or knew her briefly would probably consider her an ESTJ who overused tert. Ne.
Skeptical about her type? She was definitely an INFP.Also, this sentence stood out to me: I saw/found out from others that she was overcontrolling and micromanaging with more or less everybody, she just was more intensely/found it easier to do it to me because of me being a teen and her being the adult responsible for me. - That really rubs me the wrong way and makes me very skeptical, since just because someone is an adult and I happen to be a younger adult, which means the older one has to be in charge. I happen to think about the trust I'm going to put into this person, and if they're trustworthy enough not going to be over controlling and guide me through the right path because you never really know if they are trustworthy, if that makes sense.
Well I’m not saying that she isn’t an INFP. I’m saying if she were a healthy person, she wouldn’t have any desire to control you or change you, and just let you be. I’m also saying that just because someone is an adult, that they are capable of being in charge, when you don’t know whether to trust them enough if they’re going to control you or not, and I can sympathize with your situation. But yes, I do see your point.Skeptical about her type? She was definitely an INFP.
In her case, she had some mental/psychological issues, too. She was later diagnosed with ADD; she had had it for a long while, so in that period she had it and no medication for it. Might have had other stuff too. She couldn't keep focus on one thing to the end: she would raise her voice and make a big scandal, leave, then minutes after she would come back into the room and want to be affectionate with me or want to do sth. fun together. This made me confused; I couldn't "do fun stuff" or hug somebody after a fight like that, I was still angry/upset, she was acting like nothing had happened. ADD (I think) was involved here, maybe emotional lability too.
In recent years (and after some discussions with her) I realised that a big part of what was going on was her trying to make me into "her, version 2.0". The fact that I looked almost exactly like her when she was my age didn't help. And in this trauma is involved: some shits went down in her life when she was in her 20s. She wanted me to be her minus her failures. All of this was irrational, frustrations boiling over from her subconscious, it only has to do with MBTI in the sense that if she were an INTJ or some other T type maybe, just maybe, she would have thought "I'm not treating this person fairly" and she would have wondered why. But she was into "what you feel is the most important; follow it", she never questioned her feelings and, if she felt strongly it was for my own good to be changed, she did everything she could.
This is a phenomenon I found in other F types, (especially Fi doms - or maybe just because I payed more attention to them). The (theoretically) most equality oriented of types become, in certain cases, the worst aggressors. It seems paradoxical, but it's not. They put feelings on a very high place, so when they "feel" sth. is wrong they react brutally to fix it (me, in that example).
Look at so many celebrities who go on stage and say you should feel good about your body no matter what it looks like, while they themselves are half naked and gorgeous, thus reinforcing a culture that requires being judged by your body and exposing a lot of it = less able than ever to hide flaws. Or the same celebrities being anti-bullying, when the exact industry they are part of reinforces a certain kind of look and personality as "right", thus leaving the "wrong" ones to be ostracised. Look at John Lennon who raised his voice about women being treated like slaves while himself was a wife beater. (many of those celebrities are Fi dom/aux, Lennon was an INFP). They say what they feel, but don't realise they themselves are contributing to the problem.
It's a problem of not going to the root cause of the problem, of wanting idealistically to fix things, which is impossible IRL, because "the problem" is an effect of some causes that were not yet removed. In this area IxFPs have a lot in common with ExTJs, both J doms may go to extremes to create a better life without realising it's an utopia in the given circumstances.