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Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys, I only just joined today, but I've already had the usual (expected) in-depth discussion with one of your lovely INFJ brothers. Much appreciation!

To briefly explain, I've had an odd relationship with an INFJ man, and we've got that profound soul connection. We also still have such longing for each other, but since I told him that we need some time and space (we'd both unintentionally been hurting each other through misunderstandings), we haven't taken that step to get back together.

As the same aforementioned lovely INFJ member suggested earlier, it can be a good idea to step back and work on ourselves before trying to get back together, and that is indeed what I have been doing. Though my INFJ guy is always there in the back of my mind, and I miss and love him immensely. I intend to re-connect, and I want to do so with fresh understanding.

That being said, I'd love to be aware of what aspects of INFPs in ROMANTIC relationships with INFJs is hurtful, disturbing, hard to understand, or just all-around not good for INFJs?

Is there anything you've felt or noticed that didn't work for you or upset you?

I don't intend to "change" so much as adapt and find patience through understanding, and having such ideas in mind will, I feel sure, make me more in tune with how better to communicate with him and avoid old hurts.

Many thanks, guys! I'm looking forward to any input you can give me! :heart: I know our dreaminess levels can probably make even the best people want to run headlong into a brick wall.
 

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@DTsuDTsu

I would write a book about it but it would be futile because INFPs usually only care for their own subjective sense of right and wrong like they are enlightened individuals about the truth of the reality we live in and they are stubborn about their own "rights" until they realize they were wrong (if they ever realize of course) therefore I personally don't prefer any kind of relationship with anyone who is Fi user and/or type 4, especially INFPs. Self-centered behavior of Fi users and type 4s feels like cancer to those who are a Fe user therefore Fe users may be involved in a relationship with such cancerous types and hoping for something else but in the end their heart will be torn apart probably unless such people are decent and experienced enough to be considered about those they "love", willing to compromise and not be cancerous. I especially think; any INFP who doesn't have high EQ is good for nothing. 'Nuff said.

I hope the poor INFJ guy will find someone who is Fe user and type 2 or something.
 

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One thing that comes to mind is just don't send mixed messages that are either catch 22 or are simple impossible to determine which is which. Another would be any kind of entitlement even if it be the little things that are normally never given any thought as those things can be very annoying sometimes.
 

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Some INFPs, just like people of any other type, can have such a rigid sense of right and wrong that it can be alienating to feel like nothing you do is right around them unless it's what they would do. That is how many INFPs I have been in relationships with have made me feel. Like their way is the only right way of being a good person. But I think some of it stems from immaturity and that's something one can grow out of, if they acknowledge it is a problem.

Sometimes I find INFPs overwhelmingly-emotional company. At times this a pleasant experience if we're indulging in a passion we share like art or theatre etc. But there can be times with INFPs can be self-centred and get stuck on talking about themselves and not really being interested to ask questions or listen.

INFPs can also project a lot of idealism. Many INFJs, including myself, report feeling a major and intense spark upon meeting an INFP for the first time who they have become fast friends or lovers with. Only for that relationship's spark to explode in an argument or fizzle out dramatically because we can struggle to see eye-to-eye. INFPs (and sometimes INFJs too) might suffer from a sudden narrow fantasy for the future they that project onto their friends and family. It can make an INFJ feel like nothing they do around their INFP is good enough to match up to the fantasy they are reaching for.

And as INFJs primarily use Fe and INFP's use Fi, immature INFPs might annoy INFJs with self-focused interests.

That being said I'm sure (I know) there are plenty of things INFJs do that must annoy INFPs. So that must be acknowledged too.
 

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One thing that comes to mind is just don't send mixed messages that are either catch 22 or are simple impossible to determine which is which.
Oh fuck! Very fucking good advice. I really dislike the emotional game some INFPs play to make you feel like shit by attacking your sense of morality (the game they play only works on Fi users lol) like you are to blame so they can feel they were right to get rid of the regret that torturing themselves. Because they use Ne and Te that is powered by Fi and Si, they can bring your past "sins" (every "sins" of yours in detail) and fuck you over from every corner and try to make you feel like shit with the information storm they shit like they are right. You try to figure out what the fuck is wrong in their head and try to understand the situation, then, they obviously lie to get rid of you but they think they were not obvious LOL. I'll tell you what the fuck is wrong in some INFPs head; sometimes they imagine things and they fight with your imagination in their head and they blame you for something you will never do. WTF, man.

Another problem is; some INFPs really don't know what they really want and quickly change their choices just because they feel like it at the moment like why they chose it in the first place and somehow they think you are agreeing to what they were thinking (somehow they talk with your imagination in their head and they conclude you are agree but you have no idea about this imaginary conversation, you are lucky if they didn't fight with your imagination because you are the one who really have to deal with this imaginary BS) therefore they are indecisive. Again; WTF, man.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
@DTsuDTsu

I would write a book about it but it would be futile because INFPs usually only care for their own subjective sense of right and wrong like they are enlightened individuals about the truth of the reality we live in and they are stubborn about their own "rights" until they realize they were wrong (if they ever realize of course) therefore I personally don't prefer any kind of relationship with anyone who is Fi user and/or type 4, especially INFPs. Self-centered behavior of Fi users and type 4s feels like cancer to those who are a Fe user therefore Fe users may be involved in a relationship with such cancerous types and hoping for something else but in the end their heart will be torn apart probably unless such people are decent and experienced enough to be considered about those they "love", willing to compromise and not be cancerous. I especially think; any INFP who doesn't have high EQ is good for nothing. 'Nuff said.

I hope the poor INFJ guy will find someone who is Fe user and type 2 or something.
Woo! Someone's angry! :shocked: I mean, I knew to expect upset answers, but you've clearly had either many bad experiences or just one or a few really, really bad ones. Have you ever considered that maybe you're too closed off? Or that that kind of generalized character assassination (or focus on the worst possible traits of INFPs) could have put INFPs off you? (We do tend to lash out if people hurt us. Would you like the same to be said of your type, though? How would you react if you were generalized and referred to as "cancerous" and innately selfish?) You've also made a lot of assumptions about INFP people being totally wrong in their ways no matter what, which kind of makes it seem like you're also suffering from the "I'm right, everyone else is wrong" bit....

I say this seriously, because there are INFP people out there, and while you don't necessarily have to deal with them, assuming that you should run the other way no matter what is a bit............well, you fill in the blanks.

Anyway, thanks for opening my eyes to how some INFJ people think. If the INFJ I'm with ever thought like you, though, I doubt we'd be in the position we're in. I'll try to take what I can from your post, though.

(For the record, with the INFJ guy I'm referring to, I was always the one compromising. I was always the one listening, even though I know he is a good listener. I made myself vulnerable for him even when he could not give me the same in return, but still I didn't expect anything back. I was the one who recognized that we were hurting each other and took a step back to give us time. It's very likely he's not a mature INFJ yet, and that's also something I can respect and wait for. I'm not saying I'm the most considerate person in the world, but I know for sure that this man is someone I would do anything for and have often known that I would lay my life on the line to protect his. I can't explain it - I just know it. His soul is that beautiful and precious to me. I want nothing more than to understand and compromise. To be completely honest, by your insistence, not feelings about INFPS, but insistence that we are all as nasty as you say, everything I've felt and done the in the relationship couldn't be possible. But you're wrong there.)

I do wish you luck. Again, thanks for the rant.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
One thing that comes to mind is just don't send mixed messages that are either catch 22 or are simple impossible to determine which is which. Another would be any kind of entitlement even if it be the little things that are normally never given any thought as those things can be very annoying sometimes.
The mixed messages thing is a great point! It's hard for us, too. We don't always know how to show what we feel, though, so it's not completely intentional! I know sometimes I worry if I'm being clear enough, and even when I think I am, I'm not. It's tough! It's all a bit of a whirlwind for us.

Could you be elaborate on what you mean about entitlement? That's a new one to me, and I'd love to hear about it!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Some INFPs, just like people of any other type, can have such a rigid sense of right and wrong that it can be alienating to feel like nothing you do is right around them unless it's what they would do. That is how many INFPs I have been in relationships with have made me feel. Like their way is the only right way of being a good person. But I think some of it stems from immaturity and that's something one can grow out of, if they acknowledge it is a problem.

Sometimes I find INFPs overwhelmingly-emotional company. At times this a pleasant experience if we're indulging in a passion we share like art or theatre etc. But there can be times with INFPs can be self-centred and get stuck on talking about themselves and not really being interested to ask questions or listen.

INFPs can also project a lot of idealism. Many INFJs, including myself, report feeling a major and intense spark upon meeting an INFP for the first time who they have become fast friends or lovers with. Only for that relationship's spark to explode in an argument or fizzle out dramatically because we can struggle to see eye-to-eye. INFPs (and sometimes INFJs too) might suffer from a sudden narrow fantasy for the future they that project onto their friends and family. It can make an INFJ feel like nothing they do around their INFP is good enough to match up to the fantasy they are reaching for.

And as INFJs primarily use Fe and INFP's use Fi, immature INFPs might annoy INFJs with self-focused interests.

That being said I'm sure (I know) there are plenty of things INFJs do that must annoy INFPs. So that must be acknowledged too.
I do know some INFPs like this! I might also be one at times. I tend to try to compromise first and foremost (I came from an abusive family, so I learned that compromise was essential in relationships of any kind), but there are also points where I'll do something if I believe it's really right and best for me or the people around me. On the positive side of that, we're not likely to do what we think is wrong for ourselves or others? But I can understand why it could be alienating, especially if you're not feeling heard!

For the second part, I also agree. I know we can be very emotional! I think INFPs tend to listen very patiently and carefully to others. We don't tend to give advice because we don't feel that's our right to. Although if we do, it's coming from a place where we genuinely believe that it's going to help or soothe the other person. But what happens is that we listen patiently and offer comfort and never tend to get the same back, which builds resentment! Then when we finally meet someone who listens to us, we probably pour all of that built up need onto them (you guys especially, I'd think). I can imagine it's overwhelming, although I promise you that the INFPs in your life (assuming they are not unhealthy) are extremely grateful to you for listening to them and supporting them like that. We so often feel that we never get in return what we give when it comes to listening, being patient, and offering comfort.

Oddly enough, with my INFJ friends, I feel the same, though! I always listen and ask them questions, and while they do often listen to me, it's hard to get them to ask questions and often they revert back to themselves. I always feel like a huge bore and never heard. :( Not true of the INFJ guy I was mentioning in the initial post, though. He's a very good listener, just doesn't open up as much when asked questions about himself.

I can see why the idealism could be off-putting, too. That's something I'm not sure how we can work on, as it's an innate part of our characters. I do try to stay realistic while incorporating all the beauty and joys of idealism...but I'm positive I can slip into either side more drastically depending on the situation.

And yes, there are absolutely things INFJs do that annoy the be-jezus out of me, but no need to hash it out here, hahaha! If anyone ever makes a thread, I'll go for it. But I think being able to understand to some degree and feel endearment over those annoyances is a good thing!

Thanks so much for the helpful reply!
 

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Oh fuck! Very fucking good advice. I really dislike the emotional game some INFPs play to make you feel like shit by attacking your sense of morality (the game they play only works on Fi users lol) like you are to blame so they can feel they were right to get rid of the regret that torturing themselves. Because they use Ne and Te that is powered by Fi and Si, they can bring your past "sins" (every "sins" of yours in detail) and fuck you over from every corner and try to make you feel like shit with the information storm they shit like they are right. You try to figure out what the fuck is wrong in their head and try to understand the situation, then, they obviously lie to get rid of you but they think they were not obvious LOL. I'll tell you what the fuck is wrong in some INFPs head; sometimes they imagine things and they fight with your imagination in their head and they blame you for something you will never do. WTF, man.

Another problem is; some INFPs really don't know what they really want and quickly change their choices just because they feel like it at the moment like why they chose it in the first place and somehow they think you are agreeing to what they were thinking (somehow they talk with your imagination in their head and they conclude you are agree but you have no idea about this imaginary conversation, you are lucky if they didn't fight with your imagination because you are the one who really have to deal with this imaginary BS) therefore they are indecisive. Again; WTF, man.
I really don't know what to say except that you clearly have a special brand of hatred for INFPs, sir. And that you clearly think you know every single one of them innately - which is odd, because if you did, surely you wouldn't have had such problems with them in the first place?

I hoped to hear about how INFPs actions makes you feel (although I guess, reading between the lines, I got that too), not a grand assumption about what you think they are doing. I don't think this is the place for a character assassination of INFPs as a whole. If you need to rant, please do it elsewhere. It's not what I'm looking for here.
 

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@DTsuDTsu

You tried to defend your point of view unnecessarily and I'd a deju vu because of it. Lovely. lmao

Let's make this clear; I don't hate, INFPs. Well, our subject is "What things about INFP people upset INFJ people?", right? Upset means; "to make someone worried, unhappy, or angry" (source). So, what did you expect?

If I'd a purpose of expressing how I really hate INFPs then I would write a long message about why and how I beat the shit out of an INFP with a guitar but I'll skip it because it's unnecessary.

I really love the pure soul that INFPs has. And I have many other reasons for what I like about INFPs but our subject isn't what INFJs like about INFPs, is it?: Nope. If you have doubt I'll answer again: Nope. Okay? If you want answer, I'll give you your answer but of course not all truth is pleasant to know, isn't it?
 

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@DTsuDTsu

You tried to defend your point of view unnecessarily and I'd a deju vu because of it. Lovely. lmao

Let's make this clear; I don't hate, INFPs. Well, our subject is "What things about INFP people upset INFJ people?", right? Upset means; "to make someone worried, unhappy, or angry" . So, what did you expect?

If I'd a purpose of expressing how I really hate INFPs then I would write a long message about why and how I beat the shit out of an INFP with a guitar but I'll skip it because it's unnecessary.

I really love the pure soul that INFPs has. And I have many other reasons for what I like about INFPs but our subject isn't what INFJs like about INFPs, is it?: Nope. If you have doubt I'll answer again: Nope. Okay? If you want answer, I'll give you your answer but of course not all truth is pleasant to know, isn't it?
Oh, I'm very sorry that my hopes for a sensible discussion and reply to your aggressive message causes you so much pain. You put a lot of your problems on others, don't you? It's their fault, not mine. Sheesh. Well, I'm not addressing that anymore. Please take responsibility for your own words and actions and what they might bring about. It's the adult thing to do.

I'd also rather you didn't go ahead and assume that the only question being asked is the title. You clearly read the post, since you had the gall to say that you hoped my INFJ partner found someone else (also unwarranted), so did you selectively read what you wanted to read, or did you not see the part about feelings and whatnot?

If I'd a purpose of expressing how I really hate INFPs then I would write a long message about why and how I beat the shit out of an INFP with a guitar but I'll skip it because it's unnecessary.
Well, you already said in your first post that you could write a book about it, so I guess that means you really do hate INFPs? Or are you just throwing words out there? Let's be consistent now.

Also, honestly, you're not helping your case. It's looking more and more like INFPs should be wary of you as a terrible person, not them.

And this comment of yours earlier:

It's impossible to not annoy INFPs. Unfortunately, it's impossible for some INFPs to not annoy themselves too, therefore they may suicide for stupid reasons.
Wildly inappropriate. Suicide and depression are never topics worthy of a joke.

Let me ask you a question. (Rhetorical, as I actually don't want to know.) How many INFPs do you know personally who have committed suicide, and how many of them did it because of your incessant raging about them all being terrible people?

Jesus. You're the first INFJ person I have encountered who makes it understandable to me why Adolf Hitler was classified as INFJ, too.

Good luck with that rage, sir. I don't want it here, so I won't be replying to you any longer.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Shadowbroker, this is also for you - right there in the Forum Rules:

11. No Discriminatory Remarks
Discriminatory remarks are unacceptable. This includes racism, sexism, offensive remarks about (or against) religion* or gender identity, physical attributes (size, height, etc.), and homophobic remarks. We also prohibit typism: We will not tolerate broad generalizations and/or individual attacks that are meant to degrade by personality type. (Joking is acceptable; but if a member asks that a particular line of joking stop and it persists anyway, staff will take corrective action.)

Definition typism (adj. n.):

1. A pejorative where a person is denied a service or opportunity based on their personality type.
2. A form of discrimination and an attempt to explain, validate and excuse their negative behavior.
3. Assigning negative or insulting stereotypes based on typology with little to no verification.

* - This refers specifically to insults or degradation against groups or specific members of any religion or non-believers (or those who do not subscribe to any label). This rule does not apply to the ideas of any religion or non-belief; and as such, debating with or even speaking against those ideas is fair game.
Best of luck.
 

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Whoa. Leave DTsuDtsu alone, @shadowbroker. Your posts are unnecessarily rude and they aren't contributing to the discussion; I reported them to the mods.
@DTsuDTsu, I haven't been in a romantic relationship with any INFPs, so I can't give you any advice, but my very dear cousin and her daughter are INFPs, and although it's hard to understand them sometimes, I love them a lot and like many of their quirks. I read your other post about your INFJ friend, and I'm sorry things aren't working out; the only advice I can give is to be true to yourself (an INFP strength) and to perhaps explain to him some of the differences in your personalities (but in layman's terms, not MBTI terms) and how they contributed to your relationship problems and how you two can work them out. Sorry if that isn't very clear; it's late and I'm not at my best. But I do wish you the best of luck.
 

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I do know some INFPs like this! I might also be one at times. I tend to try to compromise first and foremost (I came from an abusive family, so I learned that compromise was essential in relationships of any kind), but there are also points where I'll do something if I believe it's really right and best for me or the people around me. On the positive side of that, we're not likely to do what we think is wrong for ourselves or others? But I can understand why it could be alienating, especially if you're not feeling heard!

For the second part, I also agree. I know we can be very emotional! I think INFPs tend to listen very patiently and carefully to others. We don't tend to give advice because we don't feel that's our right to. Although if we do, it's coming from a place where we genuinely believe that it's going to help or soothe the other person. But what happens is that we listen patiently and offer comfort and never tend to get the same back, which builds resentment! Then when we finally meet someone who listens to us, we probably pour all of that built up need onto them (you guys especially, I'd think). I can imagine it's overwhelming, although I promise you that the INFPs in your life (assuming they are not unhealthy) are extremely grateful to you for listening to them and supporting them like that. We so often feel that we never get in return what we give when it comes to listening, being patient, and offering comfort.

Oddly enough, with my INFJ friends, I feel the same, though! I always listen and ask them questions, and while they do often listen to me, it's hard to get them to ask questions and often they revert back to themselves. I always feel like a huge bore and never heard. :( Not true of the INFJ guy I was mentioning in the initial post, though. He's a very good listener, just doesn't open up as much when asked questions about himself.

I can see why the idealism could be off-putting, too. That's something I'm not sure how we can work on, as it's an innate part of our characters. I do try to stay realistic while incorporating all the beauty and joys of idealism...but I'm positive I can slip into either side more drastically depending on the situation.

And yes, there are absolutely things INFJs do that annoy the be-jezus out of me, but no need to hash it out here, hahaha! If anyone ever makes a thread, I'll go for it. But I think being able to understand to some degree and feel endearment over those annoyances is a good thing!

Thanks so much for the helpful reply!
I think abuse tends to exacerbate certain personality traits. I grew up in an emotionally abusive family and it has made my traits about trusting people even more warped. As INFJs tend to have trust issues regardless.

And I agree with what you have said. INFJs aren't often as naturally sharing as INFPs. So while on the inside I might be listening to an INFP talk thinking "I wish you'd care to hear what I'm thinking sometimes and not just talk about yourself" when put on the spot we might actually prefer the listening over the sharing. Sharing can be daunting because we are often private people, even more than INFPs are. So that might be partially our fault. No one can wait all day for an INFJ to open their mouth if they're apprehensive in the first place.

I definitely think what you've said about sharing information is true. INFJs can do it too. Anyone is capable of it. For example, my mother is that person for almost everyone in her life. She is a very straight-laced, forward thinking and realistic ISFJ and she is generally good at giving advice. Unfortunately, like me she often garners one-sided attention. People go to her to rant and be listened to but don't really stick around for her to open up too and it makes her feel used and unloved. Sadly, I know all of this because she uses me to listen to all of her problems the same way she is used by all of these friends and co-workers she has.

And that, need to share and explosion of it - I've done it to at least one person in all my life because of the reasons you mentioned.

I was so used to being everyone's shoulder to cry on, and the go to person people went to to talk about their feelings and what was going on in their life that it was almost never returned - I couldn't get a word in without seemingly destroying this bond I'd unwittingly created with others. And when I finally met someone (a non-INFP, can't remember their type but they were an extrovert, probably an EXFP) who wanted to know more about me more than they wanted to share and wasn't overwhelming to talk to, I think I quickly went overboard.

And later I had a moment where I thought, "Fuck, I hope I haven't alienated them or given them the impression I'm a self-centred person! I'm not! It's just I never get to talk about myself and once I started, it was like word vomit and I couldn't stop!".

And don't worry, there are always, "What annoys you about INFJ threads?" that pop up. Always. So you'll get the opportunity, I promise.
 

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I can only speak what I've heard from my INFJ SO how she sees similar question. We have couple of male INFP friends whom we both know well thus just speculated once about that - according to her they are too dreamy, slow in their actions and don't have that bit of aggression which could keep her lively if she had to be with that kind of person longer. That's not to say there would be anything upsetting about them, just maybe they're too calm and quiet persons for INFJ who is already quiet enough too thus it could become a bit boring in long term for both :)
 

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I'll only answer to one thing:

Wildly inappropriate. Suicide and depression are never topics worthy of a joke.
It wasn't a joke. 'Nuff said.

About other stuff you wrote about me: Unfortunately, some INFPs misunderstands therefore as you continue to communicate with them, they drag you down and blame you stuff for you didn't even intended. Perhaps this is a fundamental reason why there is a communication problem with INFJ guy and you. And I don't really think now that the INFJ guy is to blame. I accept that I'm a terrible person but ask yourself if you are terrible too or not, I hope you are not a terrible person. You really didn't have to defend yourself like how you did. Even though I think you are very annoying, I don't even dislike you for it.

Perhaps you thought I dislike INFPs because of my bad experience with them. Nope, I don't dislike INFPs for it, I dislike some of their behavior. There is a lot of difference. Because I dislike some of their behaviors, I couldn't form a proper relationship (at least a relationship I want) with them even though they are a very valuable person for me.

If you can pay attention to what I wrote and writing, I hope you will realize I wasn't looking for a fight. I accept I did wrong to express my emotion and I'm sorry for it. I'm not a robot, I'm a human. Of course, sometimes I will express my emotions but it doesn't mean I did no wrong. I'm really sorry about it. It was silly of me to be unnecessarily negative about it and wrote rude stuff.

Actually, I should have banned by now even though all the reporting but it didn't happen for some reason. If I get banned for it then I want to write; I really don't care about a ban from a website (do people really care about bans on the internet?) therefore what I wrote is my honest thought. People, who know me here probably know I'm honest, right guys? But unfortunately some people will even misunderstand this message too. Shame on them then. It's not my problem.

If I'm really going to get banned for it then:



No hard feelings. You guys did what seems right therefore there is nothing to blame for. Life is too short to waste time hating anyone. Always forgive and love one another.
 

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Generally the fault lines run along the Fi/Fe
I really want to know why.

Especially that's why I don't prefer any relationship with Fi users, man. Not that they are fundamentally unworthy for a relationship, just because they are most likely to misunderstand and therefore blame me. Even though I've some decades of experience, I couldn't find any way to avoid misunderstanding except being silent and let them think they are right. Some Fe users misunderstands too but at least they don't go that far like some Fi users. When I state this kind of opinion people think I'm being typist. They probably think; anyone who wrote articles about the pros and cons of the relationship between types is a typist and generalize their opinions too LMAO. Some people doesn't realize what "some" means and they have no idea what "could", "probably", "perhaps", "may", etc. means. SMH, I really don't know what to say to some Fi user. Unfortunately, sometimes damned if I do, damned if I don't.

If I remember correctly, your ex-wife was an INFP and there was no way to deal with her. Perhaps there is really no way to deal with some INFPs without ruining your own soul.
 
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