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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I know that i'm going to get a lot of slack for saying this but wow i really, really, really hate when Fe teams up. It's the worst thing on God's green earth. People who i didn't say anything to suddenly have a huge grudge against me because i tampered with the harmony within a group or i offended someone and they are butthurt on their behalf, even as a Fi user i can get annoyed when someone gets butthurt on their own behalf, but it makes way more sense to me than being butthurt on someone else's behalf, even if it's someone they just met. Most women are SFJs so i can see why it's such a common occurrence now, MBTI really cleared that up. In general ExFJs tend to think they know what's 'best' for everyone which i find to be arrogant. I admit that i do prefer the IxFJs cause they are less full-on but then they remind me that they are just like them when i see how they deal with conflict. It's like this Fe circlejerk, it's painful to watch and even more painful when you are in the middle of it. It's like they are poking my Fi with a needle and they're just waiting for me to retaliate and when i do, then it's all my selfish Fi's fault. I have noticed that FJ's don't really get the concept of 'retaliation' cause they are overly thinking about other's feels, they tend to get theatrical and use words like ''you're always like this'' or ''nobody likes you'' such absolutes. They don't understand that you can't offend Fi in the way that Fe would be offended.

Fe users please understand that attempting to alienate a Fi user will only make their case more stronger and don't attempt to guilt-trip us by saying how we are making other's feel, it's ineffective and it will make you look like a d*** in their eyes they won't second guess themselves like how Fe will or burst into tears because everyone feels this way about them.
 

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I know that i'm going to get a lot of slack for saying this but wow i really, really, really hate when Fe teams up. It's the worst thing on god's green earth. People who i didn't say anything to suddenly have a huge grudge against me because i tampered with the harmony within a group or i offended someone and they are butthurt on their behalf, even as a Fi user i can get annoyed when someone gets butthurt on their own behalf, but it makes way more sense to me than being butthurt on someone else's behalf, even if it's someone they just met. Most women are SFJs so i can see why it's such a common occurrence now, MBTI really cleared that up. In general ExFJs tend to think they know what's 'best' for everyone which i find to be arrogant. I admit that i do prefer the IxFJs cause they are less full-on but then they remind me that they are just like them when i see how they deal with conflict. It's like this Fe circlejerk, it's painful to watch and even more painful when you are in the middle of it. It's like they are poking my Fi with a needle and they're just waiting for me to retaliate and when i do, then it's all my selfish Fi's fault. I have noticed that FJ's don't really get the concept of 'retaliation' cause they are overly thinking about other's feels, they tend to get theatrical and use words like ''you're always like this'' or ''nobody likes you'' such absolutes. They don't understand that you can't offend Fi in the way that Fe would be offended.

Fe users please understand that attempting to alienate a Fi user will only make their case more stronger and don't attempt to guilt-trip us by saying how we are making other's feel, it's ineffective and it will make you look like a d*** in their eyes they won't second guess themselves like how Fe will or burst into tears because everyone feels this way about them.
I'm sorry to hear you were ganged up on. There are many ironic statements in your post, however. You might find value in studying it and considering them for future reference. It may help you understand and mitigate if not prevent future incidents.






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They usually just line up with what's popular; their tribe of useful idiots. You clearly have a bone to pick, but refrain from going head to head with them because they'll beat you. Either go with it or stfu. Divide et impera.
 

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Charge'n Thru The Night
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They usually just line up with what's popular; their tribe of useful idiots. You clearly have a bone to pick, but refrain from going head to head with them because they'll beat you. Either go with it or stfu. Divide et impera.
going against whats popular is how millions of hipsters are born. lmao
 

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I know that i'm going to get a lot of slack for saying this but wow i really, really, really hate when Fe teams up. It's the worst thing on God's green earth. People who i didn't say anything to suddenly have a huge grudge against me because i tampered with the harmony within a group or i offended someone and they are butthurt on their behalf, even as a Fi user i can get annoyed when someone gets butthurt on their own behalf, but it makes way more sense to me than being butthurt on someone else's behalf, even if it's someone they just met. Most women are SFJs so i can see why it's such a common occurrence now, MBTI really cleared that up. In general ExFJs tend to think they know what's 'best' for everyone which i find to be arrogant. I admit that i do prefer the IxFJs cause they are less full-on but then they remind me that they are just like them when i see how they deal with conflict. It's like this Fe circlejerk, it's painful to watch and even more painful when you are in the middle of it. It's like they are poking my Fi with a needle and they're just waiting for me to retaliate and when i do, then it's all my selfish Fi's fault. I have noticed that FJ's don't really get the concept of 'retaliation' cause they are overly thinking about other's feels, they tend to get theatrical and use words like ''you're always like this'' or ''nobody likes you'' such absolutes. They don't understand that you can't offend Fi in the way that Fe would be offended.

Fe users please understand that attempting to alienate a Fi user will only make their case more stronger and don't attempt to guilt-trip us by saying how we are making other's feel, it's ineffective and it will make you look like a d*** in their eyes they won't second guess themselves like how Fe will or burst into tears because everyone feels this way about them.
I might get a lot of FLACK for thanking this, but I totally feel you.

Keep in mind, though, that a lot of the problem is mutual. Conflicting interests, well, conflict. And at least in Western culture, the patriarchy doesn't exactly encourage women to support each other's differences. I imagine that a different sort of culture could foster more Fe-Fi appreciation the way other functions often appreciate other functions. But I guess I don't know that for a fact.

Also, I think the problem is exacerbated intergenerationally. When a Fe-user raises a Fi-user, OR when a Fi-user raises a Fe-user, there is a great possibility for wounding in the form of smothering or neglect. And any wounding can get projected onto other people later in life who resemble that parent.

So yeah, it sucks, but try to keep all this in mind.
 

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I understand and empathize. I have been there too. It is very painful to feel ganged up on and silenced. I think Fe users tend to perceive it differently than we do, though - I think they are typically wondering why we are inconveniencing everyone to harp on a matter that neither has bearing on everyone nor improves the current situation.

My touchstone for this has been this incident: following a family member's funeral, a group of about 15 family members went to a restaurant. We chose one that seemed mutually agreeable and was meaningful because it had been a favorite of the deceased. A probably also INFP (e4w3) family member, in her late teens like me, and perhaps especially sensitive due to the death, refused to eat because she didn't like the restaurant, threw a fit, and sulked outside for the remainder of the time because she felt left out and neglected. To be fair, in a way, she had been. The restaurant was preferable to 14 or so other people and it was close by and sentimental. Yet she made everyone uncomfortable and refused to even attempt to cooperate. My Fe-dom mother actually gave her money to get food to eat somewhere else, which she refused to use. It seemed like a situation where she could have "taken one for the team", so to speak.

So now I try to flex my Te and judge Fe-Fi situations like this: what is the end goal in this situation? How can I speak out in a way that will further the end goal of this situation for everyone present? Can I address my personal issues later in a way that will be more conducive to my goal? What can I change in this situation while having the least amount of negative impact on everyone else?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
I understand and empathize. I have been there too. It is very painful to feel ganged up on and silenced.
the worst thing is they seem to get off on ostracizing you because it's for your own good and they have told me multiple times that i could have 'prevented' this from happening. Fe doesn't mean empathy per se, it means empathy for the majority of the people in he room and if they all have an issue with you then 9 times out of 10 they will too.

I think they are typically wondering why we are inconveniencing everyone to harp on a matter that neither has bearing on everyone nor improves the current situation.
I've actually noticed this in TPs too, they tend to see Fi as being really illogical and have often mistyped TJs as feelers because they might go into Fi mode every now and then like how they might go into Fe mode which is what TJ's see as illogical, it's interesting that it all fits.
 

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Birdie Borracho
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Most women are SFJs so i can see why it's such a common occurrence now, MBTI really cleared that up.
Different sites I see suggest 20-25%, a significant number. I'm not sure if I can give you any advice here, as I like them, except find other people to hang out with?

Fe users please understand that attempting to alienate a Fi user will only make their case more stronger and don't attempt to guilt-trip us by saying how we are making other's feel, it's ineffective and it will make you look like a d*** in their eyes they won't second guess themselves like how Fe will or burst into tears because everyone feels this way about them.
I might be out of my mind to think I can change your opinion, but who are you preaching to? By studying functions, you can learn to appreciate them. Any war between Fe & Fi only exists in people's minds. Most people don't care about your feelings but your own feelings should convince yourself that their judgment will not hurt you. My INFP friends (In our mid 20s) have grown a backbone. They generally hang out with other Fi users or other NPs.

I have noticed that FJ's don't really get the concept of 'retaliation' cause they are overly thinking about other's feels, they tend to get theatrical and use words like ''you're always like this'' or ''nobody likes you'' such absolutes. They don't understand that you can't offend Fi in the way that Fe would be offended.
Seriously, all types get offended, with 'F' types more than others.
 
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I am only surprised that they were actually up front with you, Fe circles I know usually operate on tons of -gossip- They are all nice when someone is around then whenever that person is missing they are always gossiping about them which makes me -really- uncomfortable. Not even real problems but I think, and as they support this with their words actually, they think they are part of something and so cool and others are basically either weird or banal. I swear these people have no idea of checking themselves in the mirror either. My INFJ circle seems to feel inferior to sensors and thinkers a great deal, so if you take one of them out to be with such group, they feel awkward and inferior but whenever they return to their group they are like, oh they are such banal people, I know I am being arrogant but I have no interest in talking to them, I find them very simple. while in fact what happened is noone gave a single damn about them and they were actually pretty much invisible in the group. I love how they interpret things and how much they -need- each other, lol. and their group, I don't know what is in their head but is pretty much normaloid and very banal as well, especially my INFJ group loves to talk about pricetags, expensive and shiny stuff and take mac filter photos as opposed to what is portrayed to be in the MBTI book, they don't even seem to know each other that well and it doesn't take much to get them talk from each other's behind when they are trying to get close to you or you make them question their ties with people. Which I absolutely dislike. I think it is also the fact that many Fe users are social first or second. Ugh. Worst thing is they never leave their circle and it is cute that they can't anyway so they live in their bubble thinking they are super important while in fact noone may care about them at all.
 

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Fe teams up, yeah, but that is more observable on younger, more immature persons who do not dare to say their own opinion (Ti) out loud. All Fe users still have Ti, which is very much non-conformal and invidualistic. High-Fe users might still have trouble to overcome Fe even when they mature.

The key in those situations is not trying to get him/her to understand in a "feeling" way, but to try to reason logically or intellectually. Fe/Ti users rarely care how you invidually feel about the situation, but might accept you better if you have some kind of explanation for it.

When Fe/Ti gangs up on you, don't try to get them emotionally understand. Try to make them logically understand. It's kind of the reverse of Fi/Te.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
When Fe/Ti gangs up on you, don't try to get them emotionally understand. Try to make them logically understand. It's kind of the reverse of Fi/Te.
You've got a point because the more I try to get them to emotionally understand the more they just see it as someone whining in the corner when I had legitimate reasons for feeling the way I did.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
Different sites I see suggest 20-25%, a significant number. I'm not sure if I can give you any advice here, as I like them, except find other people to hang out with?
did you really think that i would choose to hang out with them? they're my relatives and classmates.

I might be out of my mind to think I can change your opinion
well when you put it that way

but who are you preaching to?
Fe users.

Any war between Fe & Fi only exists in people's minds.
denying a Fi user's experience isn't the way to go.

Seriously, all types get offended
I didn't say they didn't just that Fi and Fe gets offended by different things, being ostracized won't make us want to align with the Status Quo.
 

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Birdie Borracho
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did you really think that i would choose to hang out with them? they're my relatives and classmates.


well when you put it that way


Fe users.


denying a Fi user's experience isn't the way to go.


I didn't say they didn't just that Fi and Fe gets offended by different things, being ostracized won't make us want to align with the Status Quo.
I'm not suggesting your personal experience cannot play any role in your subjective perception. However, if you are a teenager in high/secondary/prep school just know that teenagers suck in general. Weather the storm, now, and you'll find it much easier to get along with Fe users. Until then, 12-17 is when I experienced the most lonely times in my life as well as some great times with friends. Eventually it stabilizes.

Honestly, @misfortuneteller, your experience is common. If you are 40 years old, however, and still feel this way, I would suggest you must have a personality disorder. Just hold your head high and you can make through the nightmare known as adolescence.
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I'm not suggesting your personal experience cannot play any role in your subjective perception. However, if you are a teenager in high/secondary/prep school just know that teenagers suck in general. Weather the storm, now, and you'll find it much easier to get along with Fe users. Until then, 12-17 is when I experienced the most lonely times in my life as well as some great times with friends. Eventually it stabilizes.

Honestly, @misfortuneteller, your experience is common. If you are 40 years old, however, and still feel this way, I would suggest you must have a personality disorder. Just hold your head high and you can make through the nightmare known as adolescence.
I'm 23 and I meant my college classmates.
 

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Birdie Borracho
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I'm 23 and I meant my college classmates.
Do you go to a small school? I will be more critical, though, as you should be past that 16 year old emo stage. Both Fe & Te 'syncs' with other types. Fe establishes mutual values and Te establishes mutual thoughts. These Je dominant users exist and it's something you just have to get over. As an ENTP, I side with the Fe doms because *spoiler alert* it is my tertiary function. Similar to you, I don't like it when an ExTJ makes a heavy Te statement and expects everyone to accept their opinion as fact. The same way that you may not like it when an Fe dom shows annoyance to you not wanting to change your feelings. There is nothing wrong with either, but it's important to adapt and be flexible. Most people have no idea what cognitive functions are so how could they change what is natural? So here's what I do with my ExTJ friends/colleagues who make Te-heavy statements: I nod my head, and ignore what they said. If they want to verbally spar, I will, and they will lose. You may not feel the desire to verbally spar, but you must accept Fe exists, it will never change, but individual people will become more enlightened. But instead of preaching to them, focus on yourself. By accepting that all types are equal, I no longer have these problems which is why I say the problem of acceptance is you, right now, @misfortuneteller.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
Do you go to a small school? @misfortuneteller.
it's a college... and it's a small class.

I will be more critical, though, as you should be past that 16 year old emo stage.
but i'm an INFP lol

These Je dominant users exist and it's something you just have to get over.
I don't remember stating that i had any issues with ExTJs....

Similar to you, I don't like it when an ExTJ makes a heavy Te statement and expects everyone to accept their opinion as fact.
when did i say that...

it's important to adapt and be flexible.
^ is giving me Fe advice.

Most people have no idea what cognitive functions are so how could they change what is natural?
when did i say that they should change? most of us just want to be left alone, asking someone to change is more of what a Fe user does as you have proved above.

focus on yourself.
that's what i mostly do...
 

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Birdie Borracho
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it's an college... and it's a small class.


but i'm an INFP lol


I don't remember stating that i had any issues with ExTJs....


when did i say that...


^ is giving me Fe advice.


when did i say that they should change? most of us just want to be left alone, asking someone to change is more of what a Fe user does as you have proved above.


that's what i mostly do...
I was using an analogy. Te vs Ti is similar to Fe vs Fi. I've had to deal with same conflicts except mine are conflicts of thought as opposed to conflicts of value. Telling you to learn to adapt to others is universal. If you want to read it and say "I'm Fi, I do what I want, it's all about me." just know that people of all types, learn to work with others, the same way Fe doms, learn to understand that other values are important than group values. Hopefully, you haven't convinced yourself that you are the mature one in that class.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
@sah6635 so... let me get this straight, you don't want me to expect others to change but at the same time you want me to try to change, even when i explain to Fe that isn't the way to go about it, they still can't comprehend it smh.
 

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misfortuneteller said:
They don't understand that you can't offend Fi in the way that Fe would be offended.

Fe users please understand that attempting to alienate a Fi user will only make their case more stronger and don't attempt to guilt-trip us by saying how we are making other's feel, it's ineffective and it will make you look like a d*** in their eyes they won't second guess themselves like how Fe will or burst into tears because everyone feels this way about them.
And you have written this very emotional post because...?
 
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