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I'm an ENFP type 8w7.
I have tested as a 7, 8, and 9 but recently, I realized that enneagram type is defined by your biggest fear.
My biggest fear is being powerless.
How do I know this is my biggest fear?
Even if at times my motives are different: 2 (female persona) or 9 (when I want to relax or get along with people that I have to get along with for work), the fear of being powerless trumps them all.
Power (strength, freedom, wealth, surrounding myself with those who I trust) is at the heart of it all. The only way to be safe (6), happy/free (7), take care of others (2), achieve (3), have inner peace (9), is to have power. If you have power you can have all the justice you like (1) and freedom to say what you think and be an individual (4).

Kind of strange being an NF and type 8.
Perhaps thinking types who have type 8 motives are more likely to have had hard childhoods. For me, my childhood was a little rough but the feeling of helplessness was not totally about me.
My step dad was an ex-marine and kind of scary/rough and my step-mother was definitely a type 8. Everyone of my four parents was depressed/bipolar/angry with flashes of violence. But the first time I remember feeling helpless was when my cousin tried to murder my little brother.

They say type 8's don't like to admit vulnerabilities. For me, admitting that I was a type 8 in the first place required me to admit I was vulnerable by admitting I am afraid of being vulnerable.

Question for you all: What is power?
Do you lose power by admitting you have a weakness?
Can you only trust people when you feel you have more power than them or power over them?
Do you ever feel self-disgust when you notice you are controlling others or have a need to have power over others?
 

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They say type 8's don't like to admit vulnerabilities. For me, admitting that I was a type 8 in the first place required me to admit I was vulnerable by admitting I am afraid of being vulnerable.
I feel you summoned it up well, marzipan01. I could probably write a book long answer to the question of "Where 'Type-8' Motive Comes from?" ...but to say it all in one sentence, I'm challenging myself, and I am at war against my own weaknesses.

Question for you all: What is power?
On a personal level, personal power is a lack of weakness; or more accurately, the will and drive to overcome one's own weaknesses.

Do you lose power by admitting you have a weakness?
No, you must know you're enemy's vulnerable points to destroy them effectively.

Self-knowledge is required if your greatest enemy is your own weak shadow.

Can you only trust people when you feel you have more power than them or power over them?

Short answer, yes.

Longer answer, I think this has more to do with Enneagram stacking. I'm an sx/sp and I require 1on1 intimacy and security for my own defensive reasons before I can fully trust them. I have difficulty trusting anyone without touching these bases my sx/sp requires from them.

I lack and struggle with so (the social stacking). So I seek to overcome my deficiencies in this area.

Do you ever feel self-disgust when you notice you are controlling others or have a need to have power over others?
No remorse, unless I've done something wrong. I see it as being helpful.
 

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Question for you all: What is power?
Do you lose power by admitting you have a weakness?
Can you only trust people when you feel you have more power than them or power over them?
Do you ever feel self-disgust when you notice you are controlling others or have a need to have power over others?
What is power?
Power is influence, and control. These concepts can be called many different things, some nice and some not... but at the end of the day I act or speak a certain way and I'm responded to. Controlling/influencing a person's responses is power. Not being a position of need, is power. When people need things they can be made to give up some of their control to meet those needs... by keeping myself in a position where I have wants instead of needs I maintain my power.

Meeting needs for other people is power. Answering questions for people is power. People will come back to you... and it becomes habit forming. You become a source for them. Setting people free from burdens is a power. Creating indebtedness in a person toward you is power... especially if you don't throw it in their face. Magnanimous generosity creates power.

Do you lose power by admitting you have a weakness?

Admitting you have a weakness is not the same as showing weakness. An 8 isn't going to make it easy for people to find his or her Achilles Heel. To show a moment of weakness at the right time can be a strength. Letting people see that you're human can go a long way.


Can you only trust people when you feel you have more power than them or power over them?
Trust isnt an issue. What I have going on for myself and how I protect myself on a daily basis has nothing to do with someone else's level of trustworthiness or a concern for if I can trust people or not. I handle my affairs. I don't have to trust or not trust people.

Do you ever feel self-disgust when you notice you are controlling others or have a need to have power over others?
No, because it's natural human interaction. I'm not clamping a collar on anyone. I don't threaten, or yell. I don't blackmail. I just ask. People just naturally tend to do what I ask because it's me asking. It comes from being respected.

Needing to have power over others feels wrong. That's on the other side of the fence. 8s use power dynamics to keep from being controlled. 8w7s are more likely to do this by pushing your buttons. 8w9s are more likely to mind their own business and expect you to do the same. (keeping themselves out of a position to be bothered) Both place a high value on being respected. You're not going to be respected if you actively try to control people; that might buy you fear in the short term... but not respect.
 

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Question for you all: What is power?
Do you lose power by admitting you have a weakness?
Can you only trust people when you feel you have more power than them or power over them?
Do you ever feel self-disgust when you notice you are controlling others or have a need to have power over others?
1. the unevolved brutish form of strength.

2. i think that would depend on whom you're admitting it to and in what circumstances. to myself - not at all. i'd rather know the inglorious truth any day than glorifying bullshit.

3. i wouldn't trust people i can control. if i can dominate them, i won't respect them. with no respect- no trust. a person who can see through and call me on my BS when i'm being aggressive - total respect and liking. and yes, trust.

4. disgust no. complete disdain for the situation in which even i would subvert other people's freewill (when i love it so much myself).

i suppose my whole life's motive is to make my ideals manifest. - that's purely for myself of course. i couldn't give a damn about whether someone else thought it a good idea/ wanted to participate or whatever. i think how you live is a form of self expression.

vulnerability is, yes, an issue. but i think wearing your vulnerability openly is a huge source of strength. to stand forth without shields is incredibly courageous, not to mention freeing because you're no longer letting fear of hurt paralyse you. agreed, while i think that, IRL i also always adopt the tough bitchy facade. (and squirm when people realise i'm not that hard inside!) being in love is when it's easier for me to openly and consciously accept being vulnerable.
 

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What is power?

Power is influence and the ability to control resources and expand them. This includes the ability to control your environment (may include people). Power also includes decision making and agenda setting. Controlling/directing people can be positive or negative depending on the manner it is done and the aims at hand. And, the exercise of power does not necessarily imply coercion.


Do you lose power by admitting you have a weakness?

You could definitely lose some control by admitting you have a weakness. I don't believe that I can lose my personal power (ability to decide, control resources, influence outcomes, make changes) in a substantial sense, ever. Personally, I have no interest in admitting a weakness unless it gives me a strategic advantage. In close interpersonal relationships, admitting a weakness can be a profound moment, a beautiful one. I don't do this often at all, but doing it is no where as bad as I had imagined. I just felt very human. It's not very often that I feel human. Ok. Next.


Can you only trust people when you feel you have more power than them or power over them?

No, this sounds like incredibly unhealthy behaviour. Trust doesn't have anything to do with this. But since you frame your questions in terms of trust, I trust people who stand up to me and whom I consider my equals.


Do you ever feel self-disgust when you notice you are controlling others or have a need to have power over others?

No, not at all. I direct people like I eat food or breathe. I don't feel disgusted by that. :p I don't have a "need" to have power over others. I control people (direct them, while still giving them freedom, respect and appropriate wiggle room) because I know what I am doing, and I am an effective leader. They listen because they respect my authority. Do I go around telling people how to dress, how to fuck, how to bathe, what to do with their toilet seats? No. I couldn't be bothered. They live their life, and I do my own thing. You don't mess with me, and I will let you be. Peace prevails, just how I like it. You cross the line with me and provoke me again and again, then it gets very nasty. I get enraged, and you get very regretful.
 
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