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They're suckers for a sob story.
 

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I guess if a INFJ would run solely on Ni+Fe, while neglecting Ti, that sort of behavior could be expected. They feel a connection with Fe and then make that connection into an elaborate fantasy using Ni, kind of creating a whole story that explains away any fault the guy has. The relationship and the guy become a idealistic cause, and there you have it.

Ni is very good at making elaborate fantasies (read: untruths), and it can sometimes be easier to actually believe them.
 

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They're suckers for a sob story.
:dry:

I would appreciate it if you INFJs can shed some light/comment on why these women behaved as they did.
I had a very similar experience.

I truly cared for her... even though she had chosen someone else...

The reason I did it, is because I cared for her and I wanted the best for her. How can I claim to love someone if I base that love on my own selfishness? It looks like, according to ENTPreneur and some other types that love only applies when their own selfish interests are being served.

How shallow.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
:dry:



I had a very similar experience.

I truly cared for her... even though she had chosen someone else...

The reason I did it, is because I cared for her and I wanted the best for her. How can I claim to love someone if I base that love on my own selfishness? It looks like, according to ENTPreneur and some other types that love only applies when their own selfish interests are being served.

How shallow.
That is really, really sweet. Awww! Would you mind elaborating on the "How can I claim to love someone if I base that love on my own selfishness?" comment? Admittedly, its a little hard for me to understand but I would love to do so! I think I could learn a thing or two from you. As an INFP, we are "inward focused". If someone is causing me this much pain it tells me that they don't love me, so why stick around and suffer for someone who doesn't love you back? It doesn't erase my love for that person, but I will turn and run from the relationship to avoid being "used and abused" if you will. Example:

I fell madly in love with someone and thought that I had found my soulmate for life. I was on top of the world! But after a while I began to get suspicious of his behavior. Sure enough, I got phone call at the wee hours of the morning and it was his "other woman". I found out that they were engaged and some other god-awful things better left unsaid. It was very painful, obviously. It hurt to high hell because I was still in love with him, but I knew I had to let him go. If I was not number one in his life and he was lying and playing games...being unfaithful, then to me that clearly said "he doesn't love you. It was all a lie". So I left him and didn't take his calls. He tried to apologize, and my heart broke into a million pieces every time I saw his name on my caller ID, but I forced myself to not answer. Eventually he stopped calling and three years later, I finally stopped loving him.

That is how I see things. I would love to understand the INFJ perspective.
 

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Like I said.
Suckers for a sob story. It's very hard for them to see when they are being played and in fact take offense to it.


That's just life people will play you if you let them.
The worst part is the fact that they volunteer to be played more often than not, leaving them at the mercy of some of the jerkiest types entp/estp.
 

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The reason I did it, is because I cared for her and I wanted the best for her. How can I claim to love someone if I base that love on my own selfishness? It looks like, according to ENTPreneur and some other types that love only applies when their own selfish interests are being served.
With the average INFJ, it's not about us being happy, it's about them being happy.

And from my experience, this is the main area where Fi and Fe have a hard time seeing face-to-face.
 

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When I choice to love someone It stays like that for life (doesn't mean I can't detach If i have to) However how they handled it was foolish.
 

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...What possesses an INFJ to continue in a relationship with someone that they love but is hurting and using them so horribly? As for INFJ #2, why was she so into the new girl? I understand being in love completely, but isn't there a line that one should draw? I would appreciate it if you INFJs can shed some light/comment on why these women behaved as they did.
iceyroses,

In a nutshell I would describe this situation as having no control over the emotions and desires -- even to the point of self harm. Lack of control over attachment and detachment also. I think most INFJs love passionately, and when lost in the beauty of their ideals, they don't want to let go, regardless of what realities are facing them directly under their noses.

The #2 INFJ is likely obsessed with the new girl, because she may suffer from too much comparison, and is wanting to understand to painful extents why she was left for this 'other woman'. All of this detracts from healing and getting back on the path of finding the right person. There is maybe some issues with self-esteem happening here also, and desperation. Perhaps these women feel they don't have a choice, or they would rather be in their situations, than be alone. Many people go through that. I just go at life alone, rather than have poor company.

I always end saying the same thing, in these types of posts...Destiny is a factor also, perhaps they haven't worked out or learned the lesson they needed to from that partner treating them poorly -- or in reverse, them understanding that they don't need to be treated that way. These types of INFJs seem very negative, at times INFJs can be stubborn too. I would just state your case clearly (in trying to help them), and leave it and them alone after that if they continue this destructive behavior.

They will remember a voice of reason, when their heads are our of the clouds, and will be so grateful to the people who tried to help them. I think at some point, INFJs of grand passion have to deal with attachments (this relates to my Sig; I'm working on this too). I wish best of luck to your friends, I know the pain of love and attachment, it sucks. But in the end, all persons are responsible for their own emotions and actions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
iceyroses,

In a nutshell I would describe this situation as having no control over the emotions and desires -- even to the point of self harm. Lack of control over attachment and detachment also. I think most INFJs love passionately, and when lost in the beauty of their ideals, they don't want to let go, regardless of what realities are facing them directly.

The #2 INFJ is likely obsessed with the new girl, because she may suffer from too much comparison, and is wanting to understand to painful extents why she was left for this 'other woman'. All of this detracts from healing and getting back on the path of finding the right person. There is maybe some issues with self-esteem happening here also, and desperation. Perhaps these women feel they don't have a choice, or they would rather be in their situations, than be alone. Many people go through that. I just go at life alone, rather than have poor company.

I always end saying the same thing, in these types of posts...Destiny is a factor also, perhaps they haven't worked out or learned the lesson they needed to from that partner treating them poorly -- or in reverse, them understanding that they don't need to be treated that way. These types of INFJs seem very negative, at times INFJs can be stubborn too. I would just state your case clearly (in trying to help them), and leave it and them alone after that if they continue this destructive behavior.

They will remember a voice of reason, when their heads are our of the clouds, and will be so grateful to the people who tried to help them. I think at some point, INFJs of grand passion have to deal with attachments (this relates to my Sig; I'm working on this too). I wish best of luck to your friends, I know the pain of love and attachment, it sucks. But in the end, all persons are responsible for their own emotions and actions.
Very, very insightful!! Thank you so much for your reply. It is very helpful.:happy:
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
By the way, I hope none of the INFJs reading this are offended. I am by no means judging or trying to offend anyone here! I just want to understand the mindset behind the decisions.
 

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That is really, really sweet. Awww!
We really can be :D When this all happened, I told her that she deeply touched my life, that she made me very happy for the short time we'd been intimate, and that she'd allowed me to share myself with her and that she'd done the same, and that while I was sad to see it go, I was happy for having experienced it... Just because I had been spurned didn't mean that the love I had for her just up and vanished. I still cared for her. And I only stuck around because she still cared for me. If she wanted me gone, I would have walked away with no regrets.

She was still going through some emotionally trying times, so I supported her emotionally and I encouraged her to enter a trusting and loving relationship with another man, because I truly wished what was best for her.

Of course, when she no longer needed me, I dropped out of contact, because it was a very hard emotional thing for me to do.

Would you mind elaborating on the "How can I claim to love someone if I base that love on my own selfishness?" comment? Admittedly, its a little hard for me to understand but I would love to do so!
Of course. In order to understand my position you need to understand that INFJs are very much driven by ethical codes of behavior. (The Greeks call it "Virtue Ethics"... or the Ethics of being virtuous)

We hold ourselves to very high standards, and do our best to force ourselves to do the right thing. Sometimes doing the right thing hurts.

For me... when I fall in love with someone. And that person decides they don't want to pursue a future with me (But still needs my support)... I feel that it would be selfish for me to abandon or further hurt that person I loved.

I am committed to being virtuous... and the virtuous thing to do is to support the one you love. Running away from them just because they don't do what you wanted them just seems selfish and cowardly to me.
 

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Yeah, Entrepreneur is right.

I'll admit, I'm a sucker for a sob story.. among other things.

I think around a half dozen of my past girlfriends, including my ex-fiance, were manic depressive. It took one shooting herself in the head and another randomly aborting my baby to realize that it's probably a bad way to go - that reveling in the drama is a recipe for disaster, that love-hate relationships are destructive, and that co-dependence never ends well.

But in a way it was very intoxicating. It's so hard to find someone who's exciting, interesting, and stable. But plenty of interesting nut jobs out there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
We really can be :D When this all happened, I told her that she deeply touched my life, that she made me very happy for the short time we'd been intimate, and that she'd allowed me to share myself with her and that she'd done the same, and that while I was sad to see it go, I was happy for having experienced it... Just because I had been spurned didn't mean that the love I had for her just up and vanished. I still cared for her. And I only stuck around because she still cared for me. If she wanted me gone, I would have walked away with no regrets.

She was still going through some emotionally trying times, so I supported her emotionally and I encouraged her to enter a trusting and loving relationship with another man, because I truly wished what was best for her.

Of course, when she no longer needed me, I dropped out of contact, because it was a very hard emotional thing for me to do.



Of course. In order to understand my position you need to understand that INFJs are very much driven by ethical codes of behavior. (The Greeks call it "Virtue Ethics"... or the Ethics of being virtuous)

We hold ourselves to very high standards, and do our best to force ourselves to do the right thing. Sometimes doing the right thing hurts.

For me... when I fall in love with someone. And that person decides they don't want to pursue a future with me... I feel that it would be selfish for me to abandon or further hurt that person I loved.

I am committed to being virtuous... and the virtuous thing to do is to support the one you love. Running away from them just because they don't do what you wanted them just seems selfish and cowardly to me.
Absolutely beautiful!:crazy: My heart is melting!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Yeah, Entrepreneur is right.

I'll admit, I'm a sucker for a sob story.. among other things.

I think around a half dozen of my past girlfriends, including my ex-fiance, were manic depressive. It took one shooting herself in the head and another randomly aborting my baby to realize that it's probably a bad way to go - that reveling in the drama is a recipe for disaster, that love-hate relationships are destructive, and that co-dependence never ends well.

But in a way it was very intoxicating. It's so hard to find someone who's exciting, interesting, and stable. But plenty of interesting nut jobs out there.
Wow! :sad: What horrible experiences, I'm so sorry that you had to deal with that. :frustrating: I'm glad that you decided to go a new and better route. I wish you the best in your future relationship(s).
 

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:dry:



I had a very similar experience.

I truly cared for her... even though she had chosen someone else...

The reason I did it, is because I cared for her and I wanted the best for her. How can I claim to love someone if I base that love on my own selfishness? It looks like, according to ENTPreneur and some other types that love only applies when their own selfish interests are being served.

How shallow.
There is no such thing as selflessness unless it damages yourself. And no one ever works hard enough to damage themself, its always natural, emotional, or logical. Everyone is selfish, even if that means trying to satisfy your love for another person regardless of the circumstances... even if that means helping the homeless because it makes you happier... if you gain energy by doing these things, then good on ya. Some of us are physically incapable 2 out of 3 days in the week unless we have some caffeine and fruit for breakfast.

As for me I'm going to continue my contributions to the art of retarded dance moves and one liners where I can be at my most useful.
 

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When you truly love someone, you will make sacrifices to ensure their happiness and well being. Love does not die. Nobody is perfect and when you love someone, you love the whole person even their flaws, even if it hurts you. It is impossible for someone to be close to someone else and never get hurt by that person.

This is what makes it so hard for me. It is torcher to not be able to actively love the one you love, but something I have learned is that I must respect the other persons choices, even if it is not what I want, and I must make the choice to leave someone I love when they are destroying me.

Edit: (and by destroying me I mean keeping me from increasing the amount of love in the world. For example, an ex of mine kept braking up and getting back together with me for three years. I could not show love to anyone even my self during that time because I was so drained trying to love him. He was not willing to love himself or me. I decided after a very long time, that I could not wait around for him to change when I could actually make a difference elsewhere if I left him. I had hoped that he would change for so long and did everything I could think of to help, but he would not stop. Now I hope that I find someone that wants to love and is not as neglectful to the point of suppressing my love, as he was.)

By the way, I know an INFP who did the same thing you are talking about. :wink:
 

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I agree INFJs try to be moral and virtuous...but what is virtuous about sleeping with a married man or someone otherwise committed to another person?

It's selfish...they want and love this person entirely, and to be with them they don't care who gets hurt, that person's partners or children, even their own. They’ve bought into a dream, and probably see themselves as martyrs, bravely suffering for love...their highest ideal. They see the situation as no ones fault, an unstoppable force comples them...

In truth they are delusional bitches, helping a bastard screw up his kids.

I don't understand why people are making them out to be innocents who are simply being used by men. I have little sympathy for them. Pity yes, sympathy, no.

Sleeping with married man=selfish...not romantic or an act of selflessness. It hurts everyone involved. I understand you can't always help who you love, but as adults we have choices about how we conduct ourselves based on the affects our actions will have. Being virtuous is giving up the person you love to protect the innocent spouse and children from the pain of a potential affair, protecting yourself and your own loved ones and dependants, friemds ect. from the pain it will course you. It's not screwing some pregnant girls boyfriend and asking friendly questions about them...that is creepy.

I should think they have serious issues with their self worth and self respect as well. It may even be dependent on these relationships.

I value love and friendship highly, but love is not and should not be unconditional. If your boyfriend or partner mistreats you, hits you, cheats on you ect...then you have every right to be angry, and to stop loving them. It is unhealthy not to.

Life is not a Disney movie. Love is not all you need.

I simply cannot relate to this...I like to think it is beyond the realms of things I would ever consider doing. But then I've seen what these sort of women and their partners do to families, especially children. I could not do that to people, or let myself be used in that way. I could not love someone who would do that to people.

If a guy tried this on with me I’d smack him round the face...go cry in my room afterwards and listen to soppy love songs maybe, but the important thing is the smacking. *sage nod*

I prescribe a strong dose of reality. :dry:

Or you know, counciling.
 
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