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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Basically, I feel that a lot of the questionnaires have too many leading questions. While many try to deal with the self-image and personal projections and outwards appearance, none seem to quite touch on the problem profoundly enough. Furthermore, many questions lack depth (e.g. leading questions). I feel the various divides between functions are not AS simple, especially if you toss enneagram into play. This is an attempt to merge many of the better questions from each questionnaire, but also to try to qualitatively improve the standards of the answers provided. This is subject to change and the first draft posted here is a pilot study. Inspiration go to previous questionnaire providers such as @Spades.

Please do not respond to the questionnaire in this thread!

1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.

2. Study these two images here and here. Which one do you prefer and why? How would you describe it?

3. Please describe yourself as a person if you were to introduce yourself to someone else like in a cover letter. What kind of person are you and why?

4. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?

5. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two that are you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?

6. What in life do you find to be of importance? Why? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.

7. How do you react to new situations in your life? Can you describe an event in your life where you were in an unknown situation? How did you deal with it?

8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?

11. Describe your relationship to society. What are the elements of it you hold important or unimportant (e.g. social norms, values, customs, traditions)? How do you see people as a whole?

12. Describe your relationship to authority. How do you perceive authority? What does it mean to you, and how do you deal with it?

13. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?

14. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest to you both in how you think and how you act?

15. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?

16. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?

17. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know your enneagram, please post this here. If you have done any online function tests such as the Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here as well.

18. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of relevance when helping to type you?
@FacelessBeauty @Acerbusvenator @Brainfreeze_237 @Crono91 @Flatlander
 

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1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.
Blah blah blah. Scientific precision, meticulousness, taking relevant factors into account; fine fine fine, moving on.

2. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know your enneagram, please post this as well. If you have done any online function tests such as the Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here as well.
Addendum: The purpose of which is to make the user aware of internal illusory bias, and the possibility of its existence.

3. Please describe yourself as a person. What kind of person are you like and why?
Short but broad. I like it.

4. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself in question 3 and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two, as far as you know, are you aware of why exactly that is?
I believe this addition could lead to relevant data that may otherwise not always be given, even though people are prone to rationalizing discrepancies away automatically, and will in almost all probability stumble over themselves to tell you why the above is as it is... IF it is.

5. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?
Fine as it is.

6. What in life do you find to be of importance and of value? Why?
Perhaps it should be merged with 7. Then again, I can certainly see some pros of keeping them separate, too. Undecided; leaving it an open question. Not very important anyway; mentioned purely for the sake of minimalism.

7. Are there any values you find to be important? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.
As is; see above.

8. Please described yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act like and why?
"8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act like and why?"

There, I fixed it.

9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act like and why?
No change, moving on.

10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?
Good enough.

11. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?
Very important question; We like :D no worthwhile suggestion for change. Moving on.

12. What is it that you fear in life? Why?
This question could be reformulated to be clearer, and better guiding rather than overly broad, but I sense the broadness has a point. Regardless, I still think it's a bit too expansive.

13. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why?
I instantly had an idea to add another question: "where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?" but that's possibly a bit too psychoanalytical, digging perhaps a bit too deep, and not necessarily relevant to the questionnaire. Still thought I'd mention it: the mechanism behind it could be relevant for the analysis.

14. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?
As is.

15. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of importance when helping to type you?
Double use of "importance"; substitute second recurring word with "relevance".

Who's next?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Blah blah blah. Scientific precision, meticulousness, taking relevant factors into account; fine fine fine, moving on.



Addendum: The purpose of which is to make the user aware of internal illusory bias, and the possibility of its existence.



Short but broad. I like it.



I believe this addition could lead to relevant data that may otherwise not always be given, even though people are prone to rationalizing discrepancies away automatically, and will in almost all probability stumble over themselves to tell you why the above is as it is... IF it is.



Fine as it is.



Perhaps it should be merged with 7. Then again, I can certainly see some pros of keeping them separate, too. Undecided; leaving it an open question. Not very important anyway; mentioned purely for the sake of minimalism.



As is; see above.



"8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act like and why?"

There, I fixed it.



No change, moving on.



Good enough.



Very important question; We like :D no worthwhile suggestion for change. Moving on.



This question could be reformulated to be clearer, and better guiding rather than overly broad, but I sense the broadness has a point. Regardless, I still think it's a bit too expansive.



I instantly had an idea to add another question: "where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?" but that's possibly a bit too psychoanalytical, digging perhaps a bit too deep, and not necessarily relevant to the questionnaire. Still thought I'd mention it: the mechanism behind it could be relevant for the analysis.



As is.



Double use of "importance"; substitute second recurring word with "relevance".

Who's next?
Yesyes, I fixed the typo while you were still analyzing ;)

Criticism taken. I am as undecided for 6 and 7. I see a point keeping them separate since what you find important is not always your values. Perhaps the value portion could simply be removed from 6 to keep the answers more separate while touching on a similar issue.

And psychoanalysis is good. The deeper we get into an individual I think the easier it is to find answers. A large portion of not knowing one's type comes from lack of self-knowledge in one or several areas. This may be in the form of a defense mechanism that is hidden so deep down you're not aware you're having it at all. For instance feeler types wanting to be thinkers because they dislike being controlled by their emotions.

I already changed 12 to be more specific. I agree, it was a bit too broad and general:
12. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest itself?
The point of this question is part to try to get a grip of the inferior function, part to get a grip of the enneagram. I am thinking of expanding this questionnaire to ALSO include more specific enneagram questions that for instance deal with anger, fear and shame as well. Overlap is nice.
 

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Yesyes, I fixed the typo while you were still analyzing ;)
Sorry! :D

Criticism taken. I am as undecided for 6 and 7. I see a point keeping them separate since what you find important is not always your values. Perhaps the value portion could simply be removed from 6 to keep the answers more separate while touching on a similar issue.
Differentiate them? Yes, I like that. Different enough to warrant separate questions, yet still flowing together. Elegant solution.

And psychoanalysis is good. The deeper we get into an individual I think the easier it is to find answers. A large portion of not knowing one's type comes from lack of self-knowledge in one or several areas. This may be in the form of a defense mechanism that is hidden so deep down you're not aware you're having it at all. For instance feeler types wanting to be thinkers because they dislike being controlled by their emotions.
Good point. I was drawing from an experience on this thread, where I was told my questions were too personal, and people might not be willing to answer them. Then again, psychoanalysis and self-discovery are the entire point of this questionnaire. The soundness of your point is superior to my doubt :)

I already changed 12 to be more specific. I agree, it was a bit too broad and general:

12. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest itself?
Much better :D

The point of this question is part to try to get a grip of the inferior function, part to get a grip of the enneagram. I am thinking of expanding this questionnaire to ALSO include more specific enneagram questions that for instance deal with anger, fear and shame as well. Overlap is nice.
That's interesting. You'd need to expand it quite a bit for that, though. We'll merge and whittle it down later; expand first. Ditto on overlap.

Gods, what is the point of a mirror mind? Gah.

Well, at least I got 1+ post xD
 

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I love #s 5, 6/7, 11, 15, and the part of #2 that asks why type appeals to you and why.

I think #3 is a bit vague. I wouldn't be sure how to answer it. Maybe putting a length limit on it would help give it some guidance: like, "describe yourself in a few sentences" or "describe yourself in 50 words or less."

I'm not sure I understand how #s 6 and 7 are distinct and not repetitive. Is 6 is asking for a description and 7 for a list? Maybe these could be clarified?

Can I suggest grammatical improvements? #s 8 and 9 should be "How do you act and why?" or "What do you act like and why?". (The first one is more correct.) Oh: the same thing in #3: I'd drop the "like".

I think #10 could be phrased better. For someone who doesn't like big words and phrases it could be confusing. Maybe something like "Describe your preferred style of socializing."

I think #11 is an awesome question! But I might phrase it differently, like maybe "What things give you a sense of chaos? What things give you a sense of order?", "What things in your life do you like to have in order?", "What things in your life seem chaotic to other people but don't bother you?", etc. Just some thoughts. I'm not sure what the best way to phrase it would be.
 
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Discussion Starter #11
Sorry! :D



Differentiate them? Yes, I like that. Different enough to warrant separate questions, yet still flowing together. Elegant solution.



Good point. I was drawing from an experience on this thread, where I was told my questions were too personal, and people might not be willing to answer them. Then again, psychoanalysis and self-discovery are the entire point of this questionnaire. The soundness of your point is superior to my doubt :)



Much better :D



That's interesting. You'd need to expand it quite a bit for that, though. We'll merge and whittle it down later; expand first. Ditto on overlap.

Gods, what is the point of a mirror mind? Gah.

Well, at least I got 1+ post xD
Can you check the new question and comment on its possible validity?

That is true that if a question is too personal they may not want to answer, but no one forces them to answer so if a question is too uncomfortable they can just say so and move on. The fact they wrote that at all is also useful information in my opinion.

Basically, enneagram and MBTI cover two different aspects of personality that often overlap in various ways. People are the most confused when they have an enneagram that so fundamentally changes their MBTI type appearance that it does not fit current descriptions that are often biased towards a certain enneagram i.e. INTP and 5w6.

Proper assessment of any type therefore requires to take all these aspects into consideration in my opinion, because looking at one aspect only (MBTI OR enneagram or something else) creates a blind-siding effect due to the one-size-fits-all application of both theories. I think this is very different to discovering the TRUE type, or rather, the TRUE personality that you are trying to discover using both these models.

Self-discovery does not come from idealization but realization. While both theories are still incomplete and simplistic, covering both creates a bit more complicated model of human cognition. Since a person is not JUST the MBTI or JUST an enneagram, both models should therefore in my opinion have to be accounted for in order to even begin to touch upon the complexity of the human psyche.
 

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Changed it according to Brainfreeze's suggestions, and added another question:

12. Describe you relationship to societal structures and authority. What do they mean to you and how do you deal with them?
Add in "norms" between structures and authority. And we're good to go.
 

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@LeaT my gift to you. :kitteh:
1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.

2. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? If you know your enneagram, please post this as well. If you have done any online function tests such as theKeys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here too.
I like the inclusion of enneagram and the cognitive functions test results. It gives us more to consider when trying to discern an individuals type. But if they want more enneagram typing help, we will redirect them to the enneagram typing forum for the typers there to deal with.

3. Please describe yourself as a person. What kind of person are you like and why?
4. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself in question 3 and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you?[

5. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?
These are all good questions to have together. I think that depending upon how each question is answered, we can somehow differentiate the idealized type and the actual type that we're seeing.

6. What in life do you find to be of importance and of value? Why?

7. Are there any values you find to be important? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.
I'm kind of iffy on this one. What are we looking for with values? People of different types can share the same values. I think this question should be altered to consider how one determines values or utilizes their value systems.

8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act like and why?

9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act like and why?
Good for seeing characteristics of the inferior function during stress.

10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?
I suppose this could capture introversion vs. extraverison.

11. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?
I suppose this could determine whether one is a J (Fe or Te dominant/auxiliary) or a P (Fi or Ti dominant/auxiliary).

12. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest itself?

13. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why?
Ah more things that can help with enneagram, and be used to determine whether enneagram motivations could cause a mistype.

14. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?
The response to this question could be interpreted in a multitude of ways. I like.

15. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of importance when helping to type you?
Good for any other details that might be of good use.

Overall it's a good questionnaire. Could you throw in a question for picture analysis and descriptions? That always helps.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I love #s 5, 6/7, 11, 15, and the part of #2 that asks why type appeals to you and why.

I think #3 is a bit vague. I wouldn't be sure how to answer it. Maybe putting a length limit on it would help give it some guidance: like, "describe yourself in a few sentences" or "describe yourself in 50 words or less."

I'm not sure I understand how #s 6 and 7 are distinct and not repetitive. Is 6 is asking for a description and 7 for a list? Maybe these could be clarified?

Can I suggest grammatical improvements? #s 8 and 9 should be "How do you act and why?" or "What do you act like and why?". (The first one is more correct.) Oh: the same thing in #3: I'd drop the "like".

I think #10 could be phrased better. For someone who doesn't like big words and phrases it could be confusing. Maybe something like "Describe your preferred style of socializing."

I think #11 is an awesome question! But I might phrase it differently, like maybe "What things give you a sense of chaos? What things give you a sense of order?", "What things in your life do you like to have in order?", "What things in your life seem chaotic to other people but don't bother you?", etc. Just some thoughts. I'm not sure what the best way to phrase it would be.
As for 3, I found that when people are allowed to write freely about themselves their true type shines through much more clearly then if they just fill in a form that by default is more aligned with Te-ness. That alone creates some bias. I could create some lead questions to support it such as interests, hobbies, other activities, outlook on life etc. but that's a bit of the problem of the question itself - the more you lead the more you peg someone to show their idealized type rather than their actual type. It's about dealing with the illusory bias.

I am aware that my Ne-ness makes me very much idealize some of these questions by abstracting them too much, so I very much appreciate the input of a sensor! I understand your question about 6 and 7. The former is more about finding out a life goal whereas the latter is more about finding out a part of the core personality, but most importantly to differentiate between T and F.

Grammar improvements are welcome. English is not my native language.

Good point about 10. On the other hand, making it general partly misses the point since I am actually not interested in necessarily trying to find the preferred style (that's a lead question), but general attitudes towards socialization that helps to infer whether I or E (and to a degree the other functions). Is there a way to reformulate without making it too leading? Perhaps "How do you view one-on-one interaction compared to group interaction?"

Yes, 11 is tough. It's good because it really touches upon J/P without right-out asking if a person finds him/herself structured or messy. Again, lead questions and people are more likely to provide with their idealized type than their actual type. By having them describe their relationship to both concepts it is easier to get a sense of whether they are internally structured/chaotic (introverted judging vs perception) and how this truly manifests. I am for example ordered in the physical world but only in some areas that relate to my mind such as sorting my books quite meticulously.

What we should probably do now is to do some test runs with this questionnaire and see how people respond to the more diffuse or possibly confusing questions.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
@LeaT my gift to you. :kitteh:


I like the inclusion of enneagram and the cognitive functions test results. It gives us more to consider when trying to discern an individuals type. But if they want more enneagram typing help, we will redirect them to the enneagram typing forum for the typers there to deal with.



These are all good questions to have together. I think that depending upon how each question is answered, we can somehow differentiate the idealized type and the actual type that we're seeing.



I'm kind of iffy on this one. What are we looking for with values? People of different types can share the same values. I think this question should be altered to consider how one determines values or utilizes their value systems.



Good for seeing characteristics of the inferior function during stress.



I suppose this could capture introversion vs. extraverison.



I suppose this could determine whether one is a J (Fe or Te dominant/auxiliary) or a P (Fi or Ti dominant/auxiliary).



Ah more things that can help with enneagram, and be used to determine whether enneagram motivations could cause a mistype.



The response to this question could be interpreted in a multitude of ways. I like.



Good for any other details that might be of good use.

Overall it's a good questionnaire. Could you throw in a question for picture analysis and descriptions? That always helps.


I liked the picture thing that Spades got.
Might not always work well, but it shows us how they go about things.

Also funny to laugh at bad attempts to describe a picture. :laughing: *trollface*
My problem with the picture analysis of the Spades questionnaire is that many posters have too low post count to link it here, which I think is somewhat important when assessing what they are actually describing. Perhpas we could just direct them to one picture that is not random but static? I was also thinking about perhaps adding a Youtube video instead to capture both the auditory and visual. Due to the of the internet kineasthetic learning is not possible. The reason why I think all three styles are important is because it affects our answers. I think I would have it much easier to describe a song than a picture for example. I find it hard to really get in tune with visuals due to my poor visual and spatial intelligence. Auditory elements are much easier for me.
 

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My problem with the picture analysis of the Spades questionnaire is that many posters have too low post count to link it here, which I think is somewhat important when assessing what they are actually describing. Perhpas we could just direct them to one picture that is not random but static? I was also thinking about perhaps adding a Youtube video instead to capture both the auditory and visual. Due to the of the internet kineasthetic learning is not possible. The reason why I think all three styles are important is because it affects our answers. I think I would have it much easier to describe a song than a picture for example. I find it hard to really get in tune with visuals due to my poor visual and spatial intelligence. Auditory elements are much easier for me.
True. Do you think we could just post the picture in the thread for them to comment on so we can see what they're talking about a lot more clearly? Also the auditory idea is something I never thought of. If you get the chance to incorporate that, it might be interesting to see what someone does with that.
 

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True. Do you think we could just post the picture in the thread for them to comment on so we can see what they're talking about a lot more clearly? Also the auditory idea is something I never thought of. If you get the chance to incorporate that, it might be interesting to see what someone does with that.
@LeaT does have a point with the picture link problem. We could agree to use this as a secondary tactic, if we require more information for the person's type - then the typer can give them a link or picture and ask for a description.

I don't know about audio either. It is probably harder for most people to describe and really "get" than a picture; unfortunately for outliers, most of our race is relatively visual.
 

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True. Do you think we could just post the picture in the thread for them to comment on so we can see what they're talking about a lot more clearly? Also the auditory idea is something I never thought of. If you get the chance to incorporate that, it might be interesting to see what someone does with that.
@LeaT does have a point with the picture link problem. We could agree to use this as a secondary tactic, if we require more information for the person's type - then the typer can give them a link or picture and ask for a description.

I don't know about audio either. It is probably harder for most people to describe and really "get" than a picture; unfortunately for outliers, most of our race is relatively visual.
Yes, including a picture in the questionnaire is a possibility. Then we need to really think of what kind of picture we want though. Perhaps we could simply give an option of 5 images and the person chooses the one they like and describes that one?

Flatlander has a point about auditory content. Most people are indeed visual, not auditory. I notice this in the INTP subforum where I apparently am one of few auditory people. This is why my spatial and visual intelligence is so poor because I abstract in sounds, not images.
 

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1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.

2. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know your enneagram, please post this here. If you have done any online function tests such as the Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here as well.
It might be prudent to include this at the end rather than toward the beginning. Otherwise, idealist thinking may color the person's mind for the rest of the questionnaire.

3. Please describe yourself as a person. What kind of person are you like and why?
Take out "like"; redundancy. Alternatively, ask "What are you like and why?".

4. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself in question 3 and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two that are you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?
-exactly

5. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?
This looks like it connects to question 3. Putting this before 4 might be better for formatting/clearer contrast.

6. What in life do you find to be of importance? Why?

7. What are your values if you have any? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.
It strikes me that if someone finds their values important, they will probably bring the topic and even its specifics up themselves. I don't know that 7 is necessary.

What we could do is have a links addendum for the questionnaire, with the link to the test in it and a note that it can be valuable for sorting out your values.

8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.
Good.

10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?

11. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?
Haha, I love 11. It's a creative question, and I like that I have the same answer to it now as when I was a newbie to personality typing.

12. Describe you relationship to societal structures and authority. What do they mean to you and how do you deal with them?
For topicality, I might put it before 11.

13. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest itself?
The last part of that needs some kind of rewording, I think.. "How does this fear manifest to you?" might be more like it.

14. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?
"What do you think inspired your drives and desires? Where do they stem from?"

An interesting question. Someone depressed might not be in a state to answer.

15. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?

16. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of relevance when helping to type you?
My comments are all above. Overall, I like it and would use it.
 
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