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"Nice Guys" Meme

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This is a discussion on "Nice Guys" Meme within the Trends Forum forums, part of the Topics of Interest category; No, I think you're missing the point. In this tumblr, the guys describe themselves as being "nice", that they're worth ...

  1. #21

    No, I think you're missing the point. In this tumblr, the guys describe themselves as being "nice", that they're worth going out with, etc. but when you look at the rest of their profile, they're either misogynist, homophobe, so maybe not what we usually understand when we hear the word "nice". For instance, there's one profile where a guy says about himself that he respects women, that he doesn't understand why women don't date him, but later in his profile you'll read that "there are circumstances where women are obligated to have sex with him" or that "men should have the lead in the relationship". So basically the tumblr points out the contrast between what the guys want to show and what they're actually showing.
    kiskadee, skycloud86, Kanerou and 26 others thanked this post.

  2. #22

    Arrogus, I think I love you. Thank you for not only being a voice of reason, but so eloquently explaining things. turtleducks, I love you too! Thank you for being so rational in your explanations, despite your strong feelings on the subject. I've learned a lot from you in this thread. Seriously. Much appreciated. *hugs*

    What had originally offended me about this meme, as a demisexual was that our dating style is often misinterpreted as just friendship because friendship is the first step of it. Once we establish that, we then move into a romantic relationship that looks a lot like friendship to sexuals - especially if the person we're in this relationship with doesn't seem interested in being especially sexual (which we're usually fine with as long as our friendship / love needs are being met). But, here's the problem. As far as our demisexual hearts are concerned, we're not wanting a relationship or feel entitled to a relationship - we are actually in a relationship, and the people we are in them with are showing us all the required signs (friendship, bonding, love, etc.) to validate this.

    When the person we've bonded with then tells us they're not interested, as far as our hearts are concerned we just got dumped. It hurts just the same as any other break up and in proportion to how long we felt we were in a relationship. If we had a bond with someone for a year, we feel like we just got dumped from a year long relationship. It causes pain, and if the reason given was because the person that we had bonded with wants someone else, it causes frustration and resentment (even if only temporarily as break ups are want to do if you are dumped for someone else). Worst of all, there is an element of "What?! No, I never wanted you."

    If this becomes a pattern, then the pattern ends up being something we complain about, especially if our needs aren't getting met and /or we keep being shown that the people we loved never loved us or wanted us in return. I've never intended to make anyone feel guilty for not wanting to be with me when this happened to me, but eventually yes, I've voiced my opinion on the pattern in general. I'm complaining about not getting my needs met, not trying to leverage someone or invalidate our friendship because from my perspective they've already invalidated our relationship. By the way, I'm still friends with everyone that will let me be friends with them after we've had one of these incidents. I really do value the friendships. I'm just butthurt because from my perspective, I got dumped for no valid reason... and I have to find one. That reason often boils down to other people making poor decisions and being attracted to people who are bad for them.

    Here's why.

    It is really difficult for us to understand how anyone could not want the ideal that our hearts want, so we have a lot of trouble understanding how someone could enjoy a relationship that wasn't based in friendship. We see that we make the person we've bonded with very happy. If the person we've bonded with is attracted to someone else, we rarely see them together so we don't see how that person makes them happy. (Side note, demisexuals rarely see sexual relationships as competition because we don't tend to see sex as especially important, but instead just another way to enjoy life, like a back rub, a good meal, or conversation. This is why we have no trouble bonding with people who also have sexual relationships with others.)

    What we most often experience with respect to the other woman (or the other man) is the person we've bonded with venting about them. We end up in this situation where it looks like their other man / woman is a bitch or asshole that they have next to nothing in common with other than sex, which as demisexuals we don't value nearly as much as sexuals, so even if that was the only thing holding them together we can't rationalize that as enough to be worth the 'abuse' we hear about. We often know the other man / woman, and they're usually jealous of our relationship (understandably), so we often only see the worst side of them when we interact with them. Or, it is just as likely that we've never met them and have been consoling the person we've bonded with after a bad break up.

    But, this is actually understandable because while we've entered into a relationship based on friendship, the person we've bonded with sees us as their best friend. Of course they're going to vent to us when they need to vent about something they can't vent to the one they're attracted to. However, it creates a situation where the person we've bonded with is doubly painting a bad picture of the one they're attracted to because the bulk of what we are told is negative, and we have trouble rationalizing the untold positive, especially when a solution is right in front of them and obvious to us. Because we're also friends, we begin to resent the one they're attracted to not only because they appear to be the reason our needs aren't being met, but because all we see is the venting and we're sharing their frustrations. We clearly love the people we've bonded with enough to let them make their own choices and be with someone else. We certainly aren't feeling entitled to anything.

    And then, once we've agreed with their resentment and frustrations, and agreed that they deserve better, and know that we're more than capable of providing it - we get dumped. This says only one thing to us (because we've been a venting post not a bragging post). They're effectively saying "I'd rather be with someone who makes me unhappy than you, and I've never wanted you." It hurts. Bad. In order to heal our wounded hearts, we have to vent and better ourselves, and stand up for what we know is right (for us). It's not entitlement on our part. It's disappointment and healing and trying to offer what the people we love tell us they want (inadvertently because they don't realize that when they're with us they aren't painting good pictures of the ones they actually want).

    Lastly, sexuals tend to abuse their relationships with demisexuals. They take us for granted and use the hell out of us for friendship, affection, advice, favors, and even sex knowing full well that we want to be with them, or already consider ourselves in a relationship with them (though from what I'm gathering these guys aren't especially good at expressing that). The point at which it becomes a problem is if we put our foot down and insist that we need to be primary or we're not going to let ourselves be used any longer. And all of a sudden it's entitlement that is worthy of being mocked. We're not insisting that someone meet our needs or are forcing them to do so. We're simply taking back something that was ours to give once we realize we're never going to get what we need. People getting upset about that might be the most selfish and cruel thing I've ever seen. Most importantly, that is the definition of entitlement.

    Another thing that really bugs me about this meme is mocking people for their opinions, especially when the questions are worded like "is there ever a case where such and such should be the case?" Logically, unless it's a flat out technical impossibility, there will be cases where something should be the case. I get really annoyed by hypersensitive reactionary people who refuse to consider options. Maybe these guys are being typically over logical. "Is a woman obligated to shave her legs?" "If she works at a stuffy place of business where everyone is expected to be business formal and impeccably groomed, yes." The question didn't ask "Would you obligate your significant other to shave her legs?" People should consider the possibilities before they react with public mockery. Because honestly, *I* would have answered that question as yes for the above stated reason - even if it was asking if a man is obligated to be clean shaven. Same reason. I do think married people are obligated to have sex with each other now and then (especially on their honeymoon), so yeah, I'd answer yes to that too. I do not under any circumstances believe that a woman is obligated to perform at the snap of a man's fingers, but I'd technically have to answer that question 'yes'. The reason I'm going on about this is that demisexuals don't place the importance on sex that sexuals do, and therefore we're likely to interpret those questions differently. The 'obligated to have sex' question would be an obvious area demisexuals would look at things different, but it goes much deeper... into questions like 'shaving' because we just don't consider the sexual implications of grooming. It's subconscious associative and implied stuff like that which really puts us out of step with sexuals more than the obvious - we're not especially horny people and want to be friends first. Mocking us for our answers is mocking us for a perspective that probably wasn't considered. Again, that's wrong, and honestly stepping into the realm of unintentional bigotry.

    Demisexual men are not going to be immediately assertive about being in a relationship with you because of the way demisexuals approach relationships via friendship first. The term "friend zone" means that for some reason that is difficult for us to understand, we established the first step of developing a romantic relationship, but hit the wall that will not allow it to progress. It's really difficult for demisexuals to understand that sexuals need sexual attraction and passion before they can become friends in a relationship. That's entirely backward to us. It's so difficult for us to understand that it seems like an invisible barrier we keep hitting, and that's really frustrating. Over and over, we establish relationships, and over and over they fail.

    What annoys me more than anything are guys (and lesbians) who have no interest in being friends first, yet so many of my girlfriends get swept off their feet by the clear sexual interest these guys have for them. It makes no sense to me. I can't begin to express my frustration with men who have no interest in being friends first. I'm sure this is part of the reason for being so defensive on behalf of the guys out there who are trying to be friends first, and are trying to be respectful of women, even if they're doing it to a self defeating degree, and especially if they're being old fashioned about approaching romance. If everyone was the same, the world would be an awfully boring place. That's one of many reasons it's so important not to mock people who are different from yourself. Another one is simple human decency, tolerance, and respect - especially for these poor guys who have good intentions, even if you don't like (or simply don't understand) their approach, or might have been emotionally inconvenienced by it.

    But, for all the guys out there who are genuinely faking being friends so they can get in a girl's pants, then getting bent because it didn't work... All I can say is they're definitely not demisexuals, and repeat what I've stated in another post. My indignation is in no way shape or form a defense of these assholes. Those sorts of people are opportunists, and will likely move on quickly if they don't get what they want (though I can't understand why people chase after opportunists who move on, but I suppose that's a sexual thing). One of the primary reasons demisexuals are so defensive about their friends getting burned from this sort of behavior is that we have a natural defense against it - be friends first. This is obvious to us, and honestly seems emotionally self destructive when the people we care about don't become friends with someone before they're intimate with them. If anyone takes the time to invest in a friendship, the friendship was / is likely real. If your friend is upset about the people you date, they're likely genuinely and sincerely concerned for your emotional well being - likely in proportion to their frustration. If they're butthurt because you don't want them, consider the novel I've just written, and give them some time to get over it and most importantly some understanding if you want to salvage the relationship you inadvertently damaged (not placing blame but instead explaining everyone's part in a situation like this) by 'dumping' them without realizing it.

    The reason for this meme may well boil down to not understanding, and most importantly, not respecting the demisexual perspective. Mocking them for it is honestly wrong.



    Phew... okay, thanks for letting me vent that, and thanks for reading all of that if you did, and my apologies if I seem like I'm trying to invalidate anyone else's opinion on the subject. I'm just expressing mine. I respect yours even if you disagree, and am thankful for perspectives I hadn't considered.
    Last edited by Nobleheart; 12-30-2012 at 10:26 AM. Reason: There was still more to vent about, so I wrote a novel.

  3. #23

    I wanted to write what I think about that blog, but turtleducks explained everything so well.

    Nobleheart, interesting perspective, I've never heard of demisexuals before.

    I'll try to add something from myself:
    A lot of people hates friendzoning. But in general, a lot of people puts themselves in great risk of friendzoning by their own behaviour, which I don't think is anything evil per se, it's just relationships in general are risky. Unrequited feelings, broken trust.

    I wanted to say there are various and complicated reasons why it happens. Some people (both men and women) are like those 'nice guys' which means not being fair with person they try to woo. Especially belief that somebody owes you something, even if they never agreed, more - you never let them know how you see your relationship. Some of them are too shy to express their feeling clearly or too much in love to give ultimatums or cut object of their affection off.

    What about friend-zoners? Some of them are manipulative, needy people who love to have a circle of adorers to use as servants (again, both sexes), some of them just want to be nice and really believes that being friends is a perfect solution. This often happens because people are raised up to be nice and friendly. So again, a 'nice guy' hating a girl because she actually tried to act nice is double standards. Also happens with women thinking if they're nice to guy and he's nice back, he's theirs.

    And last thing - what about people who don't friendzone? I am a one. I don't even acquittance-zone wannabe friends. If you think it's appreciated you're wrong. But I'd rather be a cold-hearted bitch than let someone believe they have chance when they haven't. I also appreciate a similar attitude from people I'm interested in.
    Nobleheart, Cephalonimbus, Bat and 1 others thanked this post.

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  5. #24

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    What had originally offended me about this meme, as a demisexual was that our dating style is often misinterpreted as just friendship because friendship is the first step of it. Once we establish that, we then move into a romantic relationship that looks a lot like friendship to sexuals - especially if the person we're in this relationship with doesn't seem interested in being especially sexual (which we're usually fine with as long as our friendship / love needs are being met). But, here's the problem. As far as our demisexual hearts are concerned, we're not wanting a relationship or feel entitled to a relationship - we are actually in a relationship, and the people we are in them with are showing us all the required signs (friendship, bonding, love, etc.) to validate this.
    But you can see where the problem lays, right? Do they know how you see it? There's a difference between dear and deeply caring friend and a non-sexual boyfriend.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    It is really difficult for us to understand how anyone could not want the ideal that our hearts want, so we have a lot of trouble understanding how someone could enjoy a relationship that wasn't based in friendship. We see that we make the person we've bonded with very happy. If the person we've bonded with is attracted to someone else, we rarely see them together so we don't see how that person makes them happy. (Side note, demisexuals rarely see sexual relationships as competition because we don't tend to see sex as especially important, but instead just another way to enjoy life, like a back rub, a good meal, or conversation. This is why we have no trouble bonding with people who also have sexual relationships with others.)
    Oh, boy, that's risky as hell.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    What we most often experience with respect to the other woman (or the other man) is the person we've bonded with venting about them. We end up in this situation where it looks like their other man / woman is a bitch or asshole that they have next to nothing in common with other than sex, which as demisexuals we don't value nearly as much as sexuals, so even if that was the only thing holding them together we can't rationalize that as enough to be worth the 'abuse' we hear about. We often know the other man / woman, and they're usually jealous of our relationship (understandably), so we often only see the worst side of them when we interact with them. Or, it is just as likely that we've never met them and have been consoling the person we've bonded with after a bad break up.

    But, this is actually understandable because while we've entered into a relationship based on friendship, the person we've bonded with sees us as their best friend. Of course they're going to vent to us when they need to vent about something they can't vent to the one they're attracted to. However, it creates a situation where the person we've bonded with is doubly painting a bad picture of the one they're attracted to because the bulk of what we are told is negative, and we have trouble rationalizing the untold positive, especially when a solution is right in front of them and obvious to us. Because we're also friends, we begin to resent the one they're attracted to not only because they appear to be the reason our needs aren't being met, but because all we see is the venting and we're sharing their frustrations. We clearly love the people we've bonded with enough to let them make their own choices and be with someone else. We certainly aren't feeling entitled to anything.
    Actually you do, if you expect them to follow your idea of relationship while knowing they see you just as a friend. But yes, I can see the trap and I know it's easy to say what I say as an outsider, but not as a person in love.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    Lastly, sexuals tend to abuse their relationships with demisexuals. They take us for granted and use the hell out of us for friendship, affection, advice, favors, and even sex knowing full well that we want to be with them, or already consider ourselves in a relationship with them (though from what I'm gathering these guys aren't especially good at expressing that). The point at which it becomes a problem is if we put our foot down and insist that we need to be primary or we're not going to let ourselves be used any longer. And all of a sudden it's entitlement that is worthy of being mocked. We're not insisting that someone meet our needs or are forcing them to do so. We're simply taking back something that was ours to give once we realize we're never going to get what we need. People getting upset about that might be the most selfish and cruel thing I've ever seen. Most importantly, that is the definition of entitlement.
    Yes, there is such problem, basically in every relationship, first of all people like to excuse their actions as fair to deny they mistreated somebody. Second thing is, a lot of people think that if they didn't say something clearly it means they never gave a signal, never made anyone believe in something falsely (so basically, they lied). Actually it needs some guts to say no when someone offers you what you need in the moment, because you know you won't be able to pay back.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    Another thing that really bugs me about this meme is mocking people for their opinions, especially when the questions are worded like "is there ever a case where such and such should be the case?" Logically, unless it's a flat out technical impossibility, there will be cases where something should be the case. I get really annoyed by hypersensitive reactionary people who refuse to consider options. Maybe these guys are being typically over logical. "Is a woman obligated to shave her legs?" "If she works at a stuffy place of business where everyone is expected to be business formal and impeccably groomed, yes." The question didn't ask "Would you obligate your significant other to shave her legs?" People should consider the possibilities before they react with public mockery. Because honestly, *I* would have answered that question as yes for the above stated reason - even if it was asking if a man is obligated to be clean shaven. Same reason. I do think married people are obligated to have sex with each other now and then (especially on their honeymoon), so yeah, I'd answer yes to that too. I do not under any circumstances believe that a woman is obligated to perform at the snap of a man's fingers, but I'd technically have to answer that question 'yes'. The reason I'm going on about this is that demisexuals don't place the importance on sex that sexuals do, and therefore we're likely to interpret those questions differently. Mocking us for our answers is mocking us for a perspective that probably wasn't considered. Again, that's wrong, and honestly stepping into the realm of unintentional bigotry.
    You know you're stretching it now? It's rather clear what those guys mean. Most guys I meet claim women should do this and that(grooming) or they're disgusting. While at the same time they often don't bother shave their faces or even comb their hair.
    When it comes to sex, well that's the thing. I know a lot of people justify such things and that they don't even mean anything wrong, but hell no. Nobody owes sex to anybody, ever. That's my opinion and I would never date anybody who think otherwise. So, not saying that people don't have right to their opinions, but the quotes from their profiles actually show where their real problems may lay. Most likely targeting wrong women - if they for example are very traditional etc. they should go for a girl with similar beliefs, not trying to convert a woman to their ideas.
    Some other guys are simply delusional for claiming they respect women, are chivalrous old-fashioned gentlemen etc., then calling women worst names and boasting how they like to f***.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    Demisexual men are not going to be immediately assertive about being in a relationship with you because of the way demisexuals approach relationships via friendship first. The term "friend zone" means that for some reason that is difficult for us to understand, we established the first step of developing a romantic relationship, but hit the wall that will not allow it to progress. It's really difficult for demisexuals to understand that sexuals need sexual attraction and passion before they can become friends. It's so difficult for us to understand that it seems like an invisible barrier we keep hitting, and that's really frustrating. Over and over, we establish relationships, and over and over they fail.
    This must be very hard, but I guess you can see how it's actually a demisexual men's problem, not women being evil, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    But, for all the guys out there who are genuinely faking being friends so they can get in a girl's pants, then getting bent because it didn't work... All I can say is they're definitely not demisexuals, and repeat what I've stated in another post. My indignation is in no way shape or form a defense of these assholes. Those sorts of people are opportunists, and will likely move on quickly if they don't get what they want (though I can't understand why people chase after opportunists who move on, but I suppose that's a sexual thing). One of the primary reasons demisexuals are so defensive about their friends getting burned from this sort of behavior is that we have a natural defense against it - be friends first. This is obvious to us, and honestly seems emotionally self destructive when the people we care about don't become friends with someone before they're intimate with them. If anyone takes the time to invest in a friendship, the friendship was / is likely real. If your friend is upset about the people you date, they're likely genuinely and sincerely concerned for your emotional well being - likely in proportion to their frustration. If they're butthurt because you don't want them, consider the novel I've just written, and give them some time to get over it and most importantly some understanding if you want to salvage the relationship you inadvertently damaged (not placing blame but instead explaining everyone's part in a situation like this) by 'dumping' them without realizing it.
    I agree with that. But also take into account many people (both sexes) realise that when they're already friends with a demixesual (or simply a shy sexual) and they really don't know what to do, so they just try to be friends in hope the other person will 'shake off' unwanted feelings. They're afraid of hurting them by cutting them off and also they're most likely feel strong friendship and started to need that person in their life as a friend. On the other hand somebody who didn't suspect any romantic feelings from their friend may feel betrayed.
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  6. #25
  7. #26

    Quote Originally Posted by VamPie View Post
    But you can see where the problem lays, right? Do they know how you see it? There's a difference between dear and deeply caring friend and a non-sexual boyfriend.

    This must be very hard, but I guess you can see how it's actually a demisexual men's problem, not women being evil, right?

    I agree with that. But also take into account many people (both sexes) realise that when they're already friends with a demixesual (or simply a shy sexual) and they really don't know what to do, so they just try to be friends in hope the other person will 'shake off' unwanted feelings. They're afraid of hurting them by cutting them off and also they're most likely feel strong friendship and started to need that person in their life as a friend. On the other hand somebody who didn't suspect any romantic feelings from their friend may feel betrayed.
    Yes, this does boil down to a lack of communication and understanding on all parts. I'm not placing the blame on any one group... other than the one doing the mockery in that meme. I can certainly see how people who thought they were just friends could feel betrayed, deceived, or otherwise. That's why I'm still friends with most of the people I've been in these sorts of situations with (if they will let us be friends). My vent was an explanation of the (my) demisexual perspective in the communication problem, and why the mockery was wrong when applied to demisexuals. Love doesn't often tell you when it's happening to you until it has. It just happens, and it's not within our control (as far as I've experienced). People take for granted that the process of falling in love is more often than not an unspoken thing based on signals and instincts. Demisexuals fall in love differently than sexuals, and therefore have different signals. It isn't until we've fallen in love with a friend (without intending to) that it becomes a problem. I have a great deal of friends I've never fallen in love with. It isn't something we set out toward. We don't meet someone and create a plan to become friends so we can then fall in love. It doesn't work like that for us. We meet people we like, and either the relationship grows deeper and deeper, or it stops at some point. The main problem for us is that some people accept the signals that we are giving (inadvertently) and respond in kind (I'm assuming out of genuine fondness for us and the 'mirror' effect in friendships, or simply because they want to maintain what they're getting from us, or both). It's a complicated issue that deserves a whole lot more than mockery.

    To address something else you mentioned, I've never understood why people try to demonize men for wanting sex, liking sex, and being made happy about sex. Men are through natural selection predisposed to want sex. All of the males of any species came from other males who wanted sex. It's genetic and instinctive. What I really don't understand is mocking the men who want sex -and- a relationship and are up front about their ideals, while being attracted to the men who clearly want sex and could care less about a relationship so long as they're getting sex and are willing to give lip service to whatever will get them sex. It makes less than sense to me, but then I've never really understood sexuals. The majority of my friends are demi or asexual. We can't believe that the sexuals we know can't see through this and most importantly chase after this as if it is some manner of strength on the guy's part. When I read these "nice guys" complaints about women who do this, it sounds just like my own (and my friends) confusion. This is why I'm pretty sure a lot of these guys are demisexuals - and probably aren't aware of it since this is a relatively obscure term, and our society tells us that in order to be masculine and attractive, you have to be very sexual... and it's just not working for them. It's like when everyone knows someone is gay but the person who is gay because they don't want to admit it to themselves because of societal pressures.

    Regardless, I love you guys. Thanks for the thoughts and responses.
    VamPie thanked this post.

  8. #27

    Doesn't seem like a genuine nice guy at all... Seems more like bribing and perhaps even inserting guilt and demanding and shit

    It's like saying as you stand before the gates of Heaven 'But I donated millions of dollars to help the poor! I belong!'
    Did you? Or were you just buying a ticket to feel-good land? Quite a difference about actually caring and just 'Here, now stfu!'

    (not saying donating isn't good, but you get the idea)

  9. #28

    i haven't really been reading this post, but i believe this applies here.
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  10. #29

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    To address something else you mentioned, I've never understood why people try to demonize men for wanting sex, liking sex, and being made happy about sex. Men are through natural selection predisposed to want sex. All of the males of any species came from other males who wanted sex. It's genetic and instinctive. What I really don't understand is mocking the men who want sex -and- a relationship and are up front about their ideals, while being attracted to the men who clearly want sex and could care less about a relationship so long as they're getting sex and are willing to give lip service to whatever will get them sex. It makes less than sense to me, but then I've never really understood sexuals.
    Basically you say, you want to build up the relationship from friendship. It's not really clear to me why that is, or whether you suggest that friendship is something exclusively belonging to the realm of demi-sexuality.

    Consider me a sexual, and quite a horny one, but I don't think that friendship is something exclusive. It's a false dilemma to make it seem like an option between either a nice guy, or a jerk who abuses her. I actually don't think a long-term relationship has much of a chance without any friendship/partnership that is based on equality. It's a different kind of friendship, though. I had a relationship for over 10 years with a woman. We were best mates AND had great sex, and a lot, especially the first year. And after our breakup, we are still mates. But it's not that you just downgrade to a friendship by leaving out the juicy bits.

    It doesn't work that way, and I doubt it can work the other way round, as you would like to. Because my ex-gf mate is free to have sex or even start a new romance if she feels like it, and I doubt whether you and all the other (demi-sexual) nice-guys would wholeheartedly allow their 'friend' to have sex with others or be open for romantic opportunities in this 'buildup phase of friendship' (in which case you would already 'claim' her without formally being a romantic relationship).

    What you say is that you expect this woman to understand that you rather not have sex and meet her needs, say the first year. But you also say that a man is entitled to her body when they are married. This blows my mind, and makes me wonder what you mean when you say 'heart', 'bonding', 'respect', 'friendship', and what your vision on Love, Friendship and Womanhood is, because as gentle and polite as your demi-sexual plea may sound, bottom line it merely seems to come down to your wishes, to have it your way, when you want it, and as often or as rarely as you like, which strikes me as rather egocentric or at least one-sided. I may be wrong, but I just don't feel the love, understanding and respect for women in your words.
    Last edited by mimesis; 12-30-2012 at 01:13 PM.
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  11. #30

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleheart View Post
    Lastly, sexuals tend to abuse their relationship with demisexuals. They take us for granted and use the hell out of us for friendship, affection, advice, favors, and even sex knowing full well that we want to be with them, or already consider ourselves in a relationship with them (though from what I'm gathering these guys aren't especially good at expressing that).
    I think many people have this sense that their emotions are on display like big blinking neon signs. The truth is that others don't usually pay as much attention to us as we think. People can be oblivious to indirect cues for a variety of reasons, and the more indirect, the more likely the cues are to be overlooked or misinterpreted.

    Quote Originally Posted by VamPie View Post
    I wanted to write what I think about that blog, but turtleducks explained everything so well.
    Some people (both men and women) are like those 'nice guys' which means not being fair with person they try to woo. Especially belief that somebody owes you something, even if they never agreed, more - you never let them know how you see your relationship.
    Agreed. The indirect courtship can feel like a bait-and-switch. A person who thought he or she bought one type of relationship is now being billed for a different kind of relationship and payment is due.
    Last edited by Bat; 12-30-2012 at 02:57 PM.
    Nobleheart and VamPie thanked this post.


     
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