[Enneagram Type 1] Why Type 1 has no connection to 8?

Why Type 1 has no connection to 8?

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This is a discussion on Why Type 1 has no connection to 8? within the Type 1 Forum - The Reformer forums, part of the Body Triad - Types 8,9,1 category; Not sure if this has been thought out earlier: In Heart-triad, twos over-express their feelings in the form of expressing ...

  1. #1
    Unknown

    Why Type 1 has no connection to 8?

    Not sure if this has been thought out earlier: In Heart-triad, twos over-express their feelings in the form of expressing positive emotions only and repressing the negative ones, fours under-express their feelings and turn inwards to find their identity. Twos and fours have connection to each others through integration/disintegration line, meaning fours under stress tend to move toward average/unhealthy twos by over-expressing whatever they are feeling (by being dramatic, hysterical, etc.), twos on the other hand when feeling secure move toward fours in the sense of getting touch with their sincere feelings, or put it in other words, both fours and twos have capabilities for under/over expressing feelings. In Head-triad, fives over-express their thinking and trust their thoughts, sevens under-express their thinking and turn outside for gratification, similar to fours and twos, they have connection to each others, except in this case, fives who over-express their thinking start under-expressing in the form of contacting with outer-world when stressed, sevens who under-express their thinking get in touch with 5's over-expression by being concentrated/focused, meaning both have capabilities for under/over expressing thinking.

    In the Belly/Gut-Triad, eights over-express their instinctual energy/anger, ones under-express it by turning inwards and applying judgment to anger. Wouldn't it make sense for Type 1 to over-express their instinctual energy like type 8, and same for type 8 under-expressing their anger in certain cases? Why this whole connection "over-express<->under-express" is applied only to Heart/Head triad and not Gut-triad?

    According to this link: "The more they repress this energy, the more it backs up and builds pressure in the system which inevitably leads to some sort of release. The healthier Ones are, the more comfortable they become with their own Belly energy and the more likely they are to express it in healthy ways. However, the less healthy they are, the more likely this energy is to be expressed in unhealthy ways that the One either justifies or refuses to be conscious of."

    It seems to suggest ones are supposed to get in touch with their instinctual energies and find ways to express it in constructive ways rather than under-expressing it and releasing the energy in destructive ways. It is superficially implying that ones have connection to eights and that they should find balance between under-expression and over-expression (similar to type two connection to four, type seven connection to five). However, ones have no connection to eights in theory.

    What are your thoughts?
    FlaviaGemina, grumpytiger and Skeletalz thanked this post.



  2. #2

    Aw, from your title I thought you had the answer!

    I always thought the internal lines between 2 & 4 and between 7 & 5 were weird. Your integration/disintegration is within your own triad. That's stranger to me than not having a connection between 1 and 8, but I guess it works.

    I'm not sure what else to say except the "energy release" of the 1-integration happens at point 7... with gluttony etc... which makes sense, no?

  3. #3
    Type 8w9

    The answer lies in mathematics and the law of 7.

  4. #4

    I was thinking about this lately, since 8s and 1s are kind of similar to each other. One finding was that Lust is denied to me as an emotion. I've tried feeling lust for something, anything, and every time I get stuck and have no idea what it is I'm supposed to feel. It's not anywhere in my emotional vocabulary or expression. Instead I tend to look down on people who are too lusty, too thirsty for life, and who cannot control themselves. To have some connection to 8 you need to have that kind of forward drive and desire, and in case of type 1 there is kind of a void there.

    It's like the extroversion and introversion dichotomy. For the 8s the center of power is located outside of themselves, in the world that surrounds them. While for 1s the center of power is located inside so 1s turns into passionate pressure cookers.
    seriousguy, piscesfish, drizzy lake and 1 others thanked this post.

  5. #5

    I know this is simple, but isn't the idea just that one adopts opposite yet helpful traits from another type when moving towards integration? A type 8 grows by caring about other people's opinion (which resembles what a type 2 does). A type 1 grows by letting go and have something else in life than just his/her mission (which resembles what a type 7 does). A type 8 adopting type 1 traits just isn't as helpful. I think that's the idea in a nutshell.

  6. #6
    Unknown

    Quote Originally Posted by charlie.elliot View Post
    I always thought the internal lines between 2 & 4 and between 7 & 5 were weird. Your integration/disintegration is within your own triad. That's stranger to me than not having a connection between 1 and 8, but I guess it works.

    I'm not sure what else to say except the "energy release" of the 1-integration happens at point 7... with gluttony etc... which makes sense, no?
    You can say 1s finally release their "controlled" energy in the form of gluttony (i.e., I have seen 1s using swearing a lot in a playful aggressive manner when relaxed), but I was pondering over under-expressing/over-expressing dichotomy (as in expressing "triad energy"), even though 1s don't have connection to 8 in Enneagram figure/lines, 1s do report expressing anger openly and erupting once it builds up enough -> over-expression!

    I am not arguing against their integration line or suggesting that they disintegrate to 8 (because our observations of types suggest the otherwise), but just that it makes sense they do have connection to 8 somewhere in them (apart from the fact we all have nine types in us anyway), at least this "over-expression" gut/anger energy thing, after all, if a type one (who is heavily fixated) can't hold it back and it has become too much for them, then they may have mentality of an eight (so find over-expression justified), and Enneagram is what makes us driven, therefore it makes sense that in those cases a type one has moved to an eight point and so has it in connecting lines (because "connection" implies inherent tendencies/personality patterns of other types in us, albeit within a framework of a core type, i.e., type eight becoming generous and caring in an eight manner). It also opens the possibility of other types having a connection with other types that are not in their integration/disintegration line (i.e., in some literature, 4s are defined to have a connection with 7s due to belonging to frustration triad, 5s are defined to have connection with 2s due to belonging to rejection triad and so on).

  7. #7
    Unknown

    Quote Originally Posted by Entropic View Post
    The answer lies in mathematics and the law of 7.
    It explains the connecting lines (142857) or how the Enneagram structure is built. Doesn't explain why over-expressing - under-expressing dichotomy is downplayed in gut triad and not in heart/head triad.

  8. #8
    Unknown

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylas View Post
    I was thinking about this lately, since 8s and 1s are kind of similar to each other. One finding was that Lust is denied to me as an emotion. I've tried feeling lust for something, anything, and every time I get stuck and have no idea what it is I'm supposed to feel. It's not anywhere in my emotional vocabulary or expression. Instead I tend to look down on people who are too lusty, too thirsty for life, and who cannot control themselves. To have some connection to 8 you need to have that kind of forward drive and desire, and in case of type 1 there is kind of a void there.
    That's an interesting finding. When you said "too lusty, too thirsty for life, and who cannot control themselves" for eights, it could be equally applied to sevens as well (i.e., having as much candy as you can). Actually, I have seen 1s "restricting" the fun and desires and "self-punishing" (if they are parents, then it means restricting their children to go outside the home, not allowing certain activities, etc.), and as you put it, looking down at people who want a lot in some situation, it seems pretty much rejection/denial of 7. How do you define gluttony vs lust?

    It's like the extroversion and introversion dichotomy. For the 8s the center of power is located outside of themselves, in the world that surrounds them. While for 1s the center of power is located inside so 1s turns into passionate pressure cookers.
    That's only partially true. 1s also seek some control outside. so/sx 1w2s I know are very controlling of people. I used the word "control" not "power", wherein "control" implies controlling the circumstances, allowing/restricting certain activities, criticizing/condemning people, advising them, etc. "power" implies having an edge over others, so 8s take revenge to keep power-equilibrium. I wonder if 1s seek "power" inside of themselves? i.e., "if I understand my weakness and flaws, then I can work on it and even manipulate it (fear of vulnerability)". 1s I know indirectly lead the situations in a direction as to make others either rely on them (could be wing 2 influence) or not come towards them for getting their needs met (i.e., 1s stop talking to someone if they feel their internal boundaries are violated)
    fawning thanked this post.

  9. #9
    Unknown

    Quote Originally Posted by UnicornRainbowLove View Post
    I know this is simple, but isn't the idea just that one adopts opposite yet helpful traits from another type when moving towards integration? A type 8 grows by caring about other people's opinion (which resembles what a type 2 does). A type 1 grows by letting go and have something else in life than just his/her mission (which resembles what a type 7 does). A type 8 adopting type 1 traits just isn't as helpful. I think that's the idea in a nutshell.
    That is our observations of types (i.e., integration to opposite trait-type). If you read the link I mentioned, they talk about expressing anger in healthy way for ones. Do you interpret the sentence as ones becoming healthy version of ones rather than embodying eight's energy/expressions?

  10. #10
    Type 8w7

    This is kind of splitting hairs. 8s and 7s are similar, and 1s and 2s are similar. The anger of the 8 and the 1 is different, which is why the healthy expression of the anger is different. As an 8 married to a 1, even when we get mad about the same thing, it's for different reasons, and so the "healthy expression" of the anger is going to be different.

    The outright restraint of a one hasn't worked for me as an 8. Restraining my anger because it's the right thing to do is a non starter. And my wife is so disconnected from anything visceral that it isn't practical for her to move towards the instinctual reactivity that seems to be my thing. For an 8 moving to a 2 and a 1 moving to a 7, it's a more indirect expression, and it's the indirect expression of anger that is helpful for us all-or-nothing types.

    The anger of us body types is different than the anger of the other types, it seems, because it is so all-consuming. When I get angry, everyone in the room basically stops breathing, and when my wife gets angry, her whole world stops , and I suspect that she stops breathing. For me, direct expression of that anger has disastrous consequences, and direct repression just isn't happening. For my wife, direct expression of personal anger isn't happening, as it immediately becomes righteous anger on behalf of some cause or other people.

    For me, the only way to gauge the appropriate expression of my anger is to force myself to see the impact that it has on other people, and moderate my response accordingly, because I'm sure as hell not going to back down or walk away. For my wife, a key strategy is simply doing something else, using the anger in a productive way towards her own personal goals, rather than the "greater good," which in the end, is usually for an even "greater" good.

    I think the key is the indirect expression. 8s learn to open their hearts, and 1s learn to use their head to acknowledge the complexity of the situation, which allows them to still be right, but acknowledge that other people can be right, too.
    Daeva, Animal, Stawker and 3 others thanked this post.


     
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