[Enneagram Type 4] Envy and Desire for the intense - Page 2

Envy and Desire for the intense

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This is a discussion on Envy and Desire for the intense within the Type 4 Forum - The Individualist forums, part of the Heart Triad - Types 2,3,4 category; I was a bit like that throughout my teens. I'd constantly hear stories about people being kicked out of their ...

  1. #11

    I was a bit like that throughout my teens. I'd constantly hear stories about people being kicked out of their homes with these excessively dramatic families, some having to sleep in their cars or go to a backpackers because their mother was a drug addict, and deep down, as unsympathetic as it sounds, I had that inner thought of: "I wish I had a life like that". Of course, I never at heart wanted that life at all, and I really felt for these boys and girls my age and in my class, that I devoted myself to keeping them well, sometimes making them sandwiches for lunch and whatnot; but, there was a level of intensity of which they had and I did not, and I wanted that in my life, or to at least have experienced it. If we talk about integrations, I probably had that 1-ness that drew a principled behaviour as a form of protection that enabled my curiosity about their lives to actually help them.

    It feels very peculiar trying to think about it, because it's almost paradoxical, or a cognitive dissonance, of believing what I don't believe, wanting what I don't want, needing what I don't need. Sometimes I'd try to enhance my own dissatisfaction or miseries merely to maybe feel something that others hadn't felt before, but I'd keep it all internalised so nobody else would hear or know about it. Like a secret only I know. It's quite pathetic, if I'm honest, but I think there comes a following sense of empathy towards those who naturally are feeling those emotions, and if I - or anybody who does this - can control it for the good, I think that can be quite a powerful tool.

    Anyway, I think this just falls into the infamous 'grass is always greener on the other side'; simultaneously, or this might be a 4w5 concept, there comes not only a desire to feel and experience others' intensities due to an underlying envy that they have something we don't, but a further hoarding of the emotions we possess because we don't want others to experience them. Having a long think about it now, it's no wonder this gets labelled at 'Daunting'.
    Kuroi and Vikka thanked this post.

  2. #12
    Type 4

    I always feel that desire. As Morrissey put it "I want to live and I want to love, I want to catch something that I might be ashamed of"

  3. #13

    No you just seem depressed

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  5. #14
    Type 4w5

    I can kind of relate, but differently I supposed, I envy people who have no limbs and that caused them to do awesome things in life, but I also do secretly envy people who have lost a loved one and have this intensely horrible but important and life changing moment that happens to them in life, they do tend to seem more alive in that moment. But if you try and experience that you are just sort of creating it and forcing intensity for the sake of stimulation. And I have learned that witnessing something like that and envying what the person is going through because it's so intense and beautiful can sometimes be you just idolizing what they are going through because I lost my mother when I was 10 years old, went through the horrible life changing emotionally intense grief and I still see it in movies and "envy" the intense emotions the people are experiencing as if never have felt that before.
    Kuroi and Vikka thanked this post.

  6. #15

    No I don’t envy that

  7. #16

    woah no not for me. i think once you go through mental illness, you no longer see it as glamorous. the consequences of emotional and psychological distress are too devastating.

    but i do envy those who are able to express their emotions so intensely and fluidly. i may feel a lot of things, but i have a blockade from the outside world sometimes...

  8. #17
    Type 4

    Yes, yes, yes. Except for me I don't envy mental issues that causes intense emotions, I envy physical injury. I'm fully aware that this is very messed up and wrong but I can't stop feeling this way.

    There are multiple reasons why I think I desire to get injured:
    1) I have been lucky in life so a bad injury to me would "balance" me, it would be what I need somehow, 2) Other people are better than me so I should be injured not them, 3) I want to feel like I'm suffering and noble, 4) Intense emotions have always appealed to me. For many years I have daydreamed, and most all of my daydreams center on deep feelings. Emotions are totally absorbing. 5) It would make me feel Real because I think of myself as not Real whereas everyone else is, an injury would connect me to others in a way (feeling lack is a Type 4 thing in general).

    As others have said, "the grass is always greener."
    Last edited by Vikka; 05-05-2018 at 02:16 PM.
    Kuroi thanked this post.

  9. #18
    Type 4w5


    Quote Originally Posted by Vikka View Post
    Yes, yes, yes. Except for me I don't envy mental issues that causes intense emotions, I envy physical injury. I'm fully aware that this is very messed up and wrong but I can't stop feeling this way.

    There are multiple reasons why I think I desire to get injured:
    1) I have been lucky in life so a bad injury to me would "balance" me, it would be what I need somehow, 2) Other people are better than me so I should be injured not them, 3) I want to feel like I'm suffering and noble, 4) Intense emotions have always appealed to me. For many years I have daydreamed, and most all of my daydreams center on deep feelings. Emotions are totally absorbing. 5) It would make me feel Real because I think of myself as not Real whereas everyone else is, an injury would connect me to others in a way (feeling lack is a Type 4 thing in general).

    As others have said, "the grass is always greener."
    I agree with you especially in point 3,4,5.
    As for point 1: I'm probably not that lucky like you, but I also had fairly few injures, exepct when I self harming myself.
    (Mostly becouse I'm bored, and I feel really down , Also I quite like injures. I find them aesthetic very much.)
    As for point 2: While I get it where is this from ,I think everyone should suffer. Not because it's good, but because I dont like people.
    Most of them are pretty much the same, They dont know about themselves and thinking and feeling like their parents and society told to them, not even questioning anything. Zero individualism. Also they are boring too. So the "everyone is different" cliche is probably the biggest lie in the world.

  10. #19
    Type 4

    I don't envy other peoples' suffering whatsoever. I long for and now quantify as higher the simple minded happiness of others. (I think it can be simple-minded and deep at the same time. I would like to enjoy simple happiness as a result of having deeply let go.) If I am having a flat empty day then I might envy others or the idea of others who are experiencing something real and alive, whether mentally or emotionally. That is true. I don't like feeling flat. I fear it means I'm not living the right way.

    Quote Originally Posted by purpleSage View Post
    I wouldn't say that I feel envy towards such people, more like approval towards them, like "they're suffering - that's great, they're on the right path" in comparison how annoyed I get when I see someone that's happy all of the time "oh, they're happy - that's bad, because it means that they're defenseless".
    They're defenseless in that if they were to experience strong (presumably mental) pain they wouldn't know how to handle it? Or do you mean defenseless in some other way -- like from the truths of life or something (ignorance is bliss sort of idea)? Just curious.
    wums thanked this post.

  11. #20

    I never really felt envy for someone else's situation. However, I have lived vicariously through friends who have had it worse off than me.


     
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