[Enneagram Type 5] 5w4 MISTYPES AS 9!! - Page 2

5w4 MISTYPES AS 9!!

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This is a discussion on 5w4 MISTYPES AS 9!! within the Type 5 Forum - The Investigator forums, part of the Head Triad - Types 5,6,7 category; @Dursie, if you left my name in one of the quotes when you responded to me it'd be easier for ...

  1. #11
    Type 5w4

    @Dursie, if you left my name in one of the quotes when you responded to me it'd be easier for me to see that you responded, it sends me a notification whereas simple quotes don't.
    @Flatlander Sorry I was aware of that but didn't know how to link you in

    Do you see personality as an intrinsic or an extrinsic part of a person?
    Well I consider that part of my personality completely intrinsic/ or at least in no way connected to gratification or anyone else's judgement.. It's just that I want my actions to be a full reflection of my own values.

    What exactly drives your vanity? What are you vain about, in particular?
    What do you like to be admired for?
    Generally I'm vain about my competency in everything I think I'm good at... (all areas but particularly intellectual, artistic or sporting stuff).. Probably driven by a fear of my underlying incompetence. I like to be admired for everything but it's not a huge part of my personality-- I mainly only care about impressing my own inner critic. I'd like to be the best in the world at something just to finally not worry about the areas in which I'm not competent-but I still would. I really at the deepest level just want to donate all my guts to saving everything in the world and solving every problem and that comes without any need to be admired for. That's what's most important de moi.

    Why did you bring abuse up if it doesn't really happen to you?

    What do you think makes people think you're freaky/weird/creepy?
    Well it used to all the time but it's eased off now. Ahahha It's probably because I am weird socially (i dont know why... Sometimes it's on purpose sometimes not). I'm quiet about my actual personality but invasively intense when joking around and I don't know maybe i'm scary when you don't actually know me, at least people act like that's the case.

    How do you determine if they're in the right or the wrong?

    Why does it matter whether they are in the right or the wrong in order to present an alternative?
    Well there's not going to normally be one clear right or wrong because of the complex nature of stuff, however it's not hard to recognise (in my experience) when people stop acting appropriately or unnecessarily in a situation due to their misunderstanding of what happened. Obviously this is just one tiny situational example and there are countless different approaches needing to be taken depending on the situation. Well it doesn't matter but then again I don't really feel any need to present an alternative if the situation doesn't seem to require it.

    I get how it may be healthy but it may also not be, depending on what kind of social influence they actually have over you.
    Very true. But I'm blessed with too much independence to be influence by them anyway, lovely as they are.

    Type 5s combine a central avarice with their presence in the mind triad, so a type 5 style mentality tends to lead to a focus on mind in the sense of one's capacity being one's mental content and use, which is what I don't particularly sense in you.
    I've read every source I can access and none of the core issues of the 9 actually ever hit home. Every 5 source I've been able to access has entirely described both my surface knowledge of myself and deeper knowledge. I'm just trying to avoid overly classifying my behavioural patterns into the stereotypes of a 5w4 sx/sp at the moment because I've only just surfaced from a very long stint of drowning in my own enneagram-centered avarice. Beyond that, I entirely don't belong in the body triad- the types I'm most likely to mistype as on a deeper level are 4 or 3. BUT even those two don't explain my behaviour and emotional patterns through life so far as the 5 type. However, it's clear that whatever breadth and depth the enneagram system occupies, there's far too much breadth and depth in human personality and reasons for emotions which the system cannot account for. It's a worthwhile means of accessing the deeper issues and potential pathologies of your core type but the fact (this reeeeeally happened) that I could fulyl believe I was a 9 when I'm actually a 5 shows every type can just be an aspect of our personality. . .
    Meh...
    But yes according to the system I am a 5 but in real life I'm just me .


  2. #12
    Type 9w1


    I have kind of low key wondered about this, seeing as I type as 9 but I can relate to 5 descriptions in some ways... I don't think it really fits at all though, for a number of reasons... I think it's mainly this thing about 9's wanting to merge with the world while 5's want to detach from it... Like I couldn't relate to The Power of Now when I tried to read it, because Eckhart Tolle is a pretty obvious 5 and there was so much emphasis on stopping thinking and becoming aware of the world around you, like how it feels even to brush your teeth or on a larger scale how beautiful a sunrise is... I mean I am highly, highly attuned to that stuff, I love feeling comfortable in the material world and it's hard for me to think sometimes, it comes more naturally to take things in kind of sensuously and then start contemplating things when I feel comfortable enough.

    So yeah I can relate to the descriptions for the emphasis on withdrawal and contemplation but ultimately I don't relate to them on a really deep level... I don't turn to my mind because I feel like my life depends on it, or my sense of identity or security or anything. And for that matter I'm not really all that afraid of anything, aside from my social anxiety but that feels more...well it doesn't feel like a genuine paranoid concern, it's just a general feeling of inadequacy as though nobody wants me around, nobody likes me much. Big difference.

    I don't know if it's true what they say that 5's never type as 9's and it's always the reverse... I wouldn't know. But it is true in my case anyway.

  3. #13
    Type 5w6

    Quote Originally Posted by Dursie View Post
    @Flatlander Sorry I was aware of that but didn't know how to link you in
    NP

    Well I consider that part of my personality completely intrinsic/ or at least in no way connected to gratification or anyone else's judgement.. It's just that I want my actions to be a full reflection of my own values.
    The reason I asked is because "being" nice and generous implies that you are externally that way, connected to an extrinsic rather than an intrinsic view on personality. Intrinsic traits are what you are, rather than how you control yourself to be.

    That brings up an interesting question, though. What is it you value?
    Do you typically experience a high ability to moderate your own behavior?
    Do you pay a lot of attention to that factor in your life?

    Generally I'm vain about my competency in everything I think I'm good at... (all areas but particularly intellectual, artistic or sporting stuff).. Probably driven by a fear of my underlying incompetence. I like to be admired for everything but it's not a huge part of my personality-- I mainly only care about impressing my own inner critic. I'd like to be the best in the world at something just to finally not worry about the areas in which I'm not competent-but I still would. I really at the deepest level just want to donate all my guts to saving everything in the world and solving every problem and that comes without any need to be admired for. That's what's most important de moi.
    Why are you afraid of being incompetent? What is it about the idea of your own incompetence that gets you worried?

    In what areas do you view yourself as incompetent that you would like to improve, and why?

    What would (or do) you do to save everything in the world, and what kind of problems do you typically find yourself working to solve?

    Out of curiosity, do you have a career plan for yourself? What do you do or intend to pursue? Does it fit into your self-concept -- if so, how?

    Well it used to all the time but it's eased off now. Ahahha It's probably because I am weird socially (i dont know why... Sometimes it's on purpose sometimes not). I'm quiet about my actual personality but invasively intense when joking around and I don't know maybe i'm scary when you don't actually know me, at least people act like that's the case.
    I don't see why that would lead to abuse, that's an odd disconnect right there. I'd think that would typically do more like scare people off than make them abusive, though I can't rightly speak to the types of people you've met across your life.

    Well there's not going to normally be one clear right or wrong because of the complex nature of stuff, however it's not hard to recognise (in my experience) when people stop acting appropriately or unnecessarily in a situation due to their misunderstanding of what happened. Obviously this is just one tiny situational example and there are countless different approaches needing to be taken depending on the situation. Well it doesn't matter but then again I don't really feel any need to present an alternative if the situation doesn't seem to require it.
    What, to you, makes an action appropriate or necessary (vs the alternative) in a situation?

    Very true. But I'm blessed with too much independence to be influence by them anyway, lovely as they are.



    I've read every source I can access and none of the core issues of the 9 actually ever hit home. Every 5 source I've been able to access has entirely described both my surface knowledge of myself and deeper knowledge. I'm just trying to avoid overly classifying my behavioural patterns into the stereotypes of a 5w4 sx/sp at the moment because I've only just surfaced from a very long stint of drowning in my own enneagram-centered avarice. Beyond that, I entirely don't belong in the body triad- the types I'm most likely to mistype as on a deeper level are 4 or 3. BUT even those two don't explain my behaviour and emotional patterns through life so far as the 5 type. However, it's clear that whatever breadth and depth the enneagram system occupies, there's far too much breadth and depth in human personality and reasons for emotions which the system cannot account for. It's a worthwhile means of accessing the deeper issues and potential pathologies of your core type but the fact (this reeeeeally happened) that I could fulyl believe I was a 9 when I'm actually a 5 shows every type can just be an aspect of our personality. . .
    Meh...
    But yes according to the system I am a 5 but in real life I'm just me .

    The system can account for a lot. Some of that especially holds when people are themselves locked into the pattern of their type more so, however, you can also strip down the useless or peripheral details to find the core of a person, what makes them really burn. That can take a lot to do with a person who doesn't really know themself, or gets lost in complexity or detail, but when it comes out it becomes a really direct, basic expression (sometimes admission) of true core.

    I just still see highlights of too much else going on with you and little that actually says type 5 on a deeper level. For example, the stuff you wrote about competence -- I find it speaks more to the typical concerns of 3 rather than 5, though I asked you those questions above to try to differentiate better and confirm or deny my conclusion. The mention of envy and the way you consider that was also.. interesting.

    Further curiosity 1: What do you see as the relationship between competence and avarice?
    Further curiosity 2: How do you see the distinction between mind and heart types in general?
    Further curiosity 3: Do you relate at all to type 6? If so, how; if not, why not? (Not an attempt to type you, as I don't see 6 in you)
    Further curiosity 4: Who are your primary sources? You might have stated it earlier in the thread but if so, I lost hold of what you said.
    Last edited by Flatlander; 09-09-2017 at 03:57 PM.

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  5. #14

    I have also mistyped as a 9 in the past. I had a very hard time typing myself because actually none of the core motivations were right. I could sense what my core motivation was but had trouble finding the right words for it, it was something like a need for autonomy and fear of being controlled, suffocated, or trapped. Ultimately, it turned out to be a fear of engulfment, of losing my ability to be separate and essentially being locked out of my own mind and existence. Fives may believe they're separate observers, but they actually have difficulty separating from the environment because they're afraid of it, and this creates the fear that if the environment demands too much of them they might lose themselves completely.

    Anyways, the way that my 9 fix interacts with core 5 is that I adopt a strategy of appeasement, not to avoid conflict and separation but because if I make the world angry enough, the world will try to take over or destroy me. So appeasement becomes a way of keeping the world at bay, maintaining separation rather than preventing it.
    YellowCat thanked this post.

  6. #15
    Type 9w8

    Well both are usually there, it seems to me, to become a attention battle,
    where the more I focus on one the more confirmation bias hits in.
    Cause then all these traits come to the forefront that verify it.
    But they are there all along, sure one of them is probably more active on average,
    but that is no easy feat to tease apart, unless you are majorly unhealty.
    Perhaps the one with the lowest healthlevel is the actual fixation?
    Then if you integrates the fix would kinda switch?
    These words is of course heresy, but as an 5w4, I kinda hope it is.



    Couldn't help myself


     
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