INTP or INFJ ...or...

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  1. #1
    Unknown

    INTP or INFJ ...or...

    Hello,
    I made a fairly discombobulated post on here a while back which never went anywhere, then I gave up on this whole MBTI thing, and now I'm giving it another shot, trying to type myself and hopefully being more coherent in the process. Feel free to reference my other post, but this one will be much more lucid and organized.

    So: long story short, I am INxx, and whenever I take any test, the last two letters are neck-and-neck. By answering a single question differently, I could come out as F vs T or vise versa, and the same goes for P and J. The only exception to this is that on the IDRlabs test (formerly CelebrityTypes), I come out with a strong J.

    As far as the dichotomies go, I really feel split between T and F, and for most of my life I have been much more stereotypically P than J. Especially in contrast to my family (mom, dad and sister are all SJs), I am chronically late, messy, disorganized, absent-minded, forgetful, and have a long history of procrastination. My default mode is to put things off as long as possible, and to make any decisions as late as possible.

    As far as the cognitive functions go, the ones I most strongly relate to are Ni and Ti. I've made similar posts on other forums, and when I've described myself, the vast majority of people tell me I sound like an Ni dominant. From the reading I've done, Ni absolutely fits me. However, Ti fits me just as much, and I also strongly relate to Ne. I would more easily accept INxJ if it weren't for the fact that I am SO stereotypically P. I've been working on overcoming this for my whole adult life, trying to become more organized, scheduled, time-conscious, decisive, etc., and have been largely successful, but it definitely goes against my nature.

    I were to list the functions I relate to most strongly, it would probably go Ni -> Ne -> Ti -> Fe -> Fi -> Te -> Se -> Si. I have absolutely no grasp of Si and actually react quite violently against it. My mother is an ISFJ and we are just such opposites.

    I am almost positive I am Ti/Fe rather than Te/Fi. I'm open to differing opinions on this, but I'll stick with this as a given for now, unless the conversation goes in the direction of questioning this.

    So, I'm down to INTP or INFJ. If I'm an INTP, I also use quite a bit of Ni, and my Fe is relatively well-developed. If I'm an INFJ, I have very malnourished Fe, abnormally high Ti, and strong use of Ne. Basically, I feel as if I relate strongly to both types.

    Rather than going into a long-winded description of myself, I'm hoping that you all can ask me specific questions that might clarify my type, as sort of a dialogue. What should I be asking myself to determine between these two types? What further information could I give to help clarify things?

    Thanks!!



  2. #2
    INFJ

    1. You are with a group of people in a car, heading to a different town to see your favourite band/artist/musician. Suddenly, the car breaks down for an unknown reason in the middle of nowhere. What are your initial thoughts? What are your outward reactions?

    2. You somehow make it to the concert. The driver wants to go to the afterparty that was announced (and assure you they won't drink so they can drive back later). How do you feel about this party? What do you do?

    3. On the drive back, your friends are talking. A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward reaction? What do you outwardly say?

    4. What would you do if you actually saw/experienced something that clashes with your previous beliefs, experiences, and habits?

    5. What are some of your most important values? How did you come about determining them? How can they change?

    6. a) What about your personality most distinguishes you from everyone else? b) If you could change one thing about you personality, what would it be? Why?

    7. How do you treat hunches or gut feelings? In what situations are they most often triggered?

    8. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?

    9. What do you repress about your outward behavior or internal thought process when around others? Why?

    I would also like to point out that for myself, my outer world is quite disorganized, absent-minded, and I am the worst at procrastinating, however, my inner world (thoughts, ideas) are more organized. Don't get too caught up on only P's being messy and J's being orderly. That is a common stereotype as either can be expressed in different ways.

    Here is a good explanation of the J/P differences: https://www.psychologyjunkie.com/201...-really-means/
    Last edited by mizz; 11-09-2018 at 06:48 PM.

  3. #3
    Unknown

    1. You are with a group of people in a car, heading to a different town to see your favourite band/artist/musician. Suddenly, the car breaks down for an unknown reason in the middle of nowhere. What are your initial thoughts? What are your outward reactions?

    Initial thoughts: shit!
    Outward reactions: I stay calm & collected. Is someone competently handling it? Then I just chill out while inwardly stressing about not getting there on time. If someone isn't competently handling it, I try to figure out a solution -- call AAA, whatever.

    2. You somehow make it to the concert. The driver wants to go to the afterparty that was announced (and assure you they won't drink so they can drive back later). How do you feel about this party? What do you do?

    How do I feel: depends on whether I trust that the driver actually won't drink. Also depends on if I have to do anything the next morning. Also depends on what kind of party it is. If I have the next morning free, and I trust the driver, and it seems like the kind of party I'd enjoy, I'll gladly go to the party and have fun, but probably worry that I'll want to leave before the driver wants to and will be stuck there too long.

    3. On the drive back, your friends are talking. A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward reaction? What do you outwardly say?

    If I think it's worth the energy, I would readily speak out and debate the idea.

    4. What would you do if you actually saw/experienced something that clashes with your previous beliefs, experiences, and habits?

    This question is kind of vague. Actually it's too broad to answer, really.

    5. What are some of your most important values? How did you come about determining them? How can they change?

    Honesty, integrity, reliability, autonomy, truthfulness (both in the sense of telling the truth, and seeking the truth). I didn't "determine" them; I've always valued these things. They won't change.

    6. a) What about your personality most distinguishes you from everyone else? b) If you could change one thing about you personality, what would it be? Why?

    Oy, this would be a really long answer. To narrow it down and just pick a few: I feel like I value the "existential" things more than most people -- really living live to the fullest, not in a hedonistic sense, but in the sense of finding my true path, doing what is really important to me, not wasting time on mundane pointless things, living a life of meaning and beauty. I feel like I value (and experience) deep human connection more than others. Most people seem content to live on the surface. I feel like I value honesty and authenticity more than others. What else? I don't know, I'm just weird. For most of my life, until my mid-20s, I felt much older and more mature than my peers, and I didn't fit in for that reason. Now (age 30), I feel younger than my peers, because I still have childlike enthusiasm, wonder, energy, and love for life; everyone my age seems tired, jaded, beaten down, resigned. I relate best to teenagers and old people.

    If I could change one thing about my personality, it would be to remove social anxiety.

    7. How do you treat hunches or gut feelings? In what situations are they most often triggered?

    I definitely pay attention to them, but I see them as unverified data. I have trouble trusting them. I question and doubt myself. My "hunches" relate to other people and my relationships with them. I can tell how people feel, but I can't always tell why they feel that way. Often, someone will ask me what my gut is telling me in regards to an "unknown," and I may have a gut feeling, but I don't see it as necessarily trustworthy.

    8. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?

    What energizes me: good company, meaningful interactions with people, traveling, playing music, listening to music, going to concerts, etc... what drains me: large crowds, lots of noise/sensory stimulation, emotionally-charged environments. Listening to other people's emotional/psychological problems drains me. Social interaction with strangers or people I'm not comfortable with drains me.

    9. What do you repress about your outward behavior or internal thought process when around others? Why?

    I repress a lot in front of others. I can be very judgmental and critical, so I obviously have to repress that. I keep my emotions to myself. I see my emotions as very personal. I freely share my ideas, and often take conversations in philosophical directions, but I definitely keep personal things under wraps.

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  5. #4

    I am not sure about your Se-Ni, Ne-Si but you are a clear Fi dom. Your description is all about how you feel and what you value. And you keep emotions to yourself, consider them very personal.

    You are repressing your judgmental and critical - which is inferior Te. "I am SO stereotypically P. I've been working on overcoming this for my whole adult life, trying to become more organized, scheduled, time-conscious, decisive, etc., and have been largely successful, but it definitely goes against my nature." also sounds like a life task of a someone with inferior Te.

    You could be INFP or ISFP. Short answers and interest in music indicate Se-Ni but it isn't anything sure so lets dig some more.
    Do you prefer to spend time in imaginary world (books, stories, daydreams) or real world (nature, beautiful stuff, music)?
    What sounds more like you: intuitive hunches (unexplainable feelings that something is going to happen, someone is up to something) or awareness of your inner body (hunger, cold etc).

    BTW. How does it work? Going to concerts energizes you but large crowds and lots of noise/sensory stimulation drain you. Aren't concerts full of noise, sensory stimulation and large crowds? (I have an idea but I want you to tell me.)
    Last edited by Kiriae; 11-16-2018 at 03:49 AM.

  6. #5
    Unknown

    I'm not dismissing what you said, but in replies to other posts I've made, I've gotten people saying that I'm a "clear"/"obvious" Ti-dom, and many more that say I'm a clear/obvious Ni-dom. I can't be all three 🙂 See why this is confusing?

    Concerts energize me because it's music. Also I mostly go to classical or jazz concerts, which is a bunch of people being still and quiet watching the show. I like rock concerts too but those are much more overstimulating for me. Definitely not a mosh pit or dance club person.

  7. #6

    Quote Originally Posted by shosty8 View Post
    Hello,
    I made a fairly discombobulated post on here a while back which never went anywhere, then I gave up on this whole MBTI thing, and now I'm giving it another shot, trying to type myself and hopefully being more coherent in the process. Feel free to reference my other post, but this one will be much more lucid and organized.

    So: long story short, I am INxx, and whenever I take any test, the last two letters are neck-and-neck. By answering a single question differently, I could come out as F vs T or vise versa, and the same goes for P and J. The only exception to this is that on the IDRlabs test (formerly CelebrityTypes), I come out with a strong J.

    As far as the dichotomies go, I really feel split between T and F, and for most of my life I have been much more stereotypically P than J. Especially in contrast to my family (mom, dad and sister are all SJs), I am chronically late, messy, disorganized, absent-minded, forgetful, and have a long history of procrastination. My default mode is to put things off as long as possible, and to make any decisions as late as possible.

    As far as the cognitive functions go, the ones I most strongly relate to are Ni and Ti. I've made similar posts on other forums, and when I've described myself, the vast majority of people tell me I sound like an Ni dominant. From the reading I've done, Ni absolutely fits me. However, Ti fits me just as much, and I also strongly relate to Ne. I would more easily accept INxJ if it weren't for the fact that I am SO stereotypically P. I've been working on overcoming this for my whole adult life, trying to become more organized, scheduled, time-conscious, decisive, etc., and have been largely successful, but it definitely goes against my nature.

    I were to list the functions I relate to most strongly, it would probably go Ni -> Ne -> Ti -> Fe -> Fi -> Te -> Se -> Si. I have absolutely no grasp of Si and actually react quite violently against it. My mother is an ISFJ and we are just such opposites.

    I am almost positive I am Ti/Fe rather than Te/Fi. I'm open to differing opinions on this, but I'll stick with this as a given for now, unless the conversation goes in the direction of questioning this.

    So, I'm down to INTP or INFJ. If I'm an INTP, I also use quite a bit of Ni, and my Fe is relatively well-developed. If I'm an INFJ, I have very malnourished Fe, abnormally high Ti, and strong use of Ne. Basically, I feel as if I relate strongly to both types.

    Rather than going into a long-winded description of myself, I'm hoping that you all can ask me specific questions that might clarify my type, as sort of a dialogue. What should I be asking myself to determine between these two types? What further information could I give to help clarify things?

    Thanks!!
    I constantly tested as INTP when in fact I'm INFJ... they can easily be confused in the online tests... especially for a really introverted INFJ. for a very introverted INFJ they tend to use their introverted functions more than a slightly more extraverted version of an INFJ. meaning... They present to themselves and generally to the world as highly perceiving, since there is such a high preference for their 3rd function... Ti. so a highly introverted INFJ has extremely high Ni a perciving function... making them test as a thinker and perceiver on the online tests. I finally realized the truth when I looked at the stackings and also realized how much I really did care about how others felt... but being so highly introverted I didn't feel like I had much power over others feelings... so even though my first extraverted function is Fe I mostly made decisions of retreat and hiding out so I wouldn't be a bother to people (at least in my early age) so my Ti was constantly judging me for failing at positively effecting the Fe in the outside world... meaning that I used inner Ti to control myself which also made me present as a perciever to the outside world even though what I cared about was the Fe, I felt like such a failure at it that I relied on Ti to not make waves or upset people.

  8. #7

    I guess in order to unpack it for yourself... what are your definitions of the stackings? for instance... Ni is highly convergent... I have highly abstracted memory and connect everything together to understand something and then "solve it". Ne is more looking outward and is considered divergent... it is also objective, Ni is subjective. I don't really understand Ne, but I definitely can spot it having lived with an ENFP for a long time. Fe uses feelings to worry about, take joy in etc other people and what they are feeling and how things are going etc. Fi reacts to the internal feeling and makes decisions based on that, following more closely the own internal guide.... in that way Fe, especially when modulated first by Ni can seem like a perceiving function because Fe acts as more of a prospector in this case take in the feelings of the others, use the perceiving function to decide what to do about it, then judge and act in the world... as in perceive internally... then judge externally. For an Non-confident INFJ a lot of Ni can happen before ever using Fe. for me I was so highly introverted for such a long time that I probably refused to use my judinging function except under extreme stress. I also believe this is where the Myers briggs falls short of actual personalities. there are 16 main presentations, but it could be said for me at least the Ni and Ti were prefered. as in I was 1. Ni, 2. Ti, 3. Fe, 4. Se. after doing a lot of therapy my stacking is much more like the traditional stacking of 1. Ni, 2. Fe, 3. Ti, 4. Se. Note that "perverted stackings" aren't actually in the myers briggs system (to my knowledge).

  9. #8

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiriae View Post
    I am not sure about your Se-Ni, Ne-Si but you are a clear Fi dom. Your description is all about how you feel and what you value. And you keep emotions to yourself, consider them very personal.

    You are repressing your judgmental and critical - which is inferior Te. "I am SO stereotypically P. I've been working on overcoming this for my whole adult life, trying to become more organized, scheduled, time-conscious, decisive, etc., and have been largely successful, but it definitely goes against my nature." also sounds like a life task of a someone with inferior Te.

    You could be INFP or ISFP. Short answers and interest in music indicate Se-Ni but it isn't anything sure so lets dig some more.
    Do you prefer to spend time in imaginary world (books, stories, daydreams) or real world (nature, beautiful stuff, music)?
    What sounds more like you: intuitive hunches (unexplainable feelings that something is going to happen, someone is up to something) or awareness of your inner body (hunger, cold etc).

    BTW. How does it work? Going to concerts energizes you but large crowds and lots of noise/sensory stimulation drain you. Aren't concerts full of noise, sensory stimulation and large crowds? (I have an idea but I want you to tell me.)
    I disagree. though he mentioned his emotions, it was often outward focused... Ie I keep my emotions to myself because I don't want to hurt others. I'm repressing them so that I won't be critical. highly introverted person using Fe. If things are going well in an emergency doesn't want to intervene because things seem copacetic (se last) but will intervene if needed Fe. He's whole discription sounds very INFJ.

    Edit: ALso the questions asked about his feelings, emotions and values... From my perspective what you're describing is typical ENFP Ne noise.
    Last edited by Nicholasjh1; 11-16-2018 at 09:40 AM.

  10. #9

    Also Aspirational Se (Se 4th) :
    "Oy, this would be a really long answer. To narrow it down and just pick a few: I feel like I value the "existential" things more than most people -- really living live to the fullest, not in a hedonistic sense, but in the sense of finding my true path, doing what is really important to me, not wasting time on mundane pointless things, living a life of meaning and beauty. I feel like I value (and experience) deep human connection more than others. Most people seem content to live on the surface. I feel like I value honesty and authenticity more than others. What else? I don't know, I'm just weird. For most of my life, until my mid-20s, I felt much older and more mature than my peers, and I didn't fit in for that reason. Now (age 30), I feel younger than my peers, because I still have childlike enthusiasm, wonder, energy, and love for life; everyone my age seems tired, jaded, beaten down, resigned. I relate best to teenagers and old people."


     

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