INTPs who are hyper sensitive vs. INTPs who are not hyper sensitive

Doesn't everyone just love these fashionable conditions? In any case, as long as I can remember I've known I'm more sensitive than most people. I have concentration and sleeping issues, I can be very observant of other people's feelings / thoughts, I don't like to be touched and so on. On the other hand I'm not emotionally that sensitive. I hardly ever get offended and even if I can often easily see what a person is feeling, I don't have a clue how to act on it.

I'm interested in how this relates to INTPness. At first glance I probably seem more INFP. People tend to interpret these things in a certain way and lump all "shy" people into one category. Everyone who doesn't know me seems to assume I need to be treated with kid gloves. I hate that, but that's not really what I'm after here (not entirely sure what it is I'm after, though). It's just that to me there seems, roughly, to be two kinds of INTPs: Those who are more in tune with their emotions, who are not always as blunt as could be expected, who value aesthetic issues and who over all don't appear like INTP unless you know them very well. And then there are the more stereotypical INTPs who seem more confident and aloof.

Of course this isn't an "either or" thing, but I wonder who very highly sensitive and not at all sensitive INTPs view this. Have any of you more sensitive learned to gain more confidence? I always struggle with the two conflicting views about me: my own and other people's. When they assume I'm fragile I want to show more confidence, but it makes me over self-conscious, more quiet, less self-confident and just overall something that enforces the wrong views.

lightbox said:

Doesn't everyone just love these fashionable conditions? In any case, as long as I can remember I've known I'm more sensitive than most people. I have concentration and sleeping issues, I can be very observant of other people's feelings / thoughts, I don't like to be touched and so on. On the other hand I'm not emotionally that sensitive. I hardly ever get offended and even if I can often easily see what a person is feeling, I don't have a clue how to act on it.

I'm interested in how this relates to INTPness. At first glance I probably seem more INFP. People tend to interpret these things in a certain way and lump all "shy" people into one category. Everyone who doesn't know me seems to assume I need to be treated with kid gloves. I hate that, but that's not really what I'm after here (not entirely sure what it is I'm after, though). It's just that to me there seems, roughly, to be two kinds of INTPs: Those who are more in tune with their emotions, who are not always as blunt as could be expected, who value aesthetic issues and who over all don't appear like INTP unless you know them very well. And then there are the more stereotypical INTPs who seem more confident and aloof.

Of course this isn't an "either or" thing, but I wonder who very highly sensitive and not at all sensitive INTPs view this. Have any of you more sensitive learned to gain more confidence? I always struggle with the two conflicting views about me: my own and other people's. When they assume I'm fragile I want to show more confidence, but it makes me over self-conscious, more quiet, less self-confident and just overall something that enforces the wrong views.

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I can relate to the first paragraph. But I have been told by others that I might possibly have AS? So that would explain a lot of my hypersensitivities, especially when it comes to sensory issues (touching, hearing, smells, etc.). I rarely get offended because I can reason out most things and I don't take things seriously nor am I overemotional on most topics for me to get offended by (but this is not to say I never get offended!).

Hmm. I've never gotten labelled as an INFP. However, I've been called more as an INFJ with a really developed Ti because I'm so nice to other people and they don't see me as being the "stereotypical INTP." Well, I try to be nice to others (within reason), but I don't think I should be stripped of my INTP title just because of that. I seem to do the social chameleon thing really well, and I'm the type that is really hard for other people to type unless they get to know me really well.

I'm not sure what you mean by "shy," because I'll say what's on my mind if I feel like it. However, if I see that someone is having a bad day or a hard time, I'll probably back off a little and not say anything - is this where you think the "shyness" comes in, because I see this more as being a considerate/nice thing.

Also, I'm very confident on my being as an individual. I'm not sure why you correlate confidence with being sensitive. I can be confident in my strengths, outgoing, knowledgable, and a humorous individual, while remain sensitive (and mature) to other people's feelings or thoughts. I think it's a matter of being considerate and mature.

I could relate to most of what was written. I think I tend to feel like I'm sensitive to people, but when reality hits, I learn that I'm not. It's something of a curse actually, because I think we often wish we could help, but we can't. I see a lot of feeling types on here talking about how, as they get older, they're sick and tired of being the giving ones and that they're starting to cut people out of their lives and give them the treatment so to speak. I think we go in somewhat opposite directions, we start out cold and not caring much, but we start to want to develop that feeling side which always manifests in an odd or futile way.

For a good while, I thought I was an "INFP with a well-developed thinking function and a lot of Ti traits". The stereotype going around is that INTPs are aloof and out of touch with others while I fit almost every criteria of a "highly sensitive person" and am actually quite empathetic (at least when someone tells me their feelings since I'm still oblivious sometimes). There's also the stereotype that everyone who is depressed, quiet, anxious, insecure, and sensitive must be an INFP. I have those hyper-emotional moments that come with inferior Fe (which I initially mistook for Fi) but I think my illness makes those moments happen more often.

I definitely see what you mean about feeling as though there are two opposing personalities within. Some people think I'm this sweet shy sensitive little girl. Then they get to know me better and realize that I'm quite stoic and analytical. Then they get to know me even better and realize that there are indeed signs of emotional life and even love in my head. I've had people tell me I'm one of the nicest people they know but that I can be too brutally honest at times and initially seem cold on the outside. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think INTPs are generally well-meaning. The insensitivity isn't just because we're assholes. It's because we don't always understand the appropriate emotional response to many situations. For instance, we may not realize that our honesty can hurt someone's feelings or we may not understand how so many people can get upset over something we find trivial.

Mind you, my mother is an ESFP and a lot of my friends were oversensitive Fi users so I had to get used to being more receptive to the needs and feelings of others (and they had to get used to occasionally being offended or having their feelings disregarded). So I think I am more in touch with my Fe function than other INTPs.

I'm hypersensitive, at least. I'm heavily suspecting AS, which would relegate the former to a characteristic of the latter.

I'm not sure where you want to go exactly with this topic, @lightbox. I'll let my thoughts come out starting there : Correlation between HSP and INTP ?

Not so much. Correlation between HSP and introversion seems more likely already. N, T, and P don't really have to do with sensitivity, I don't think. Maybe functions are related to how one handles this sensitivity, but other than that, I don't know what would be the link.

I get mostly sensory sensitivity. Anything unpleasant for any of my senses is highly unpleasant for me. I don't like to be touched when I didn't get a warning, and I often don't like it either when I get a warning. Just… personal space, people, respect it. I select my clothes (pullovers specifically) based on how pleasant they are to touch, because when they're not, it gets annoying, nearly painful depending on the texture. Perfumes are mostly painful for me, so I don't wear any, and I know when someone is wearing one 15m around me. As for food… I've been called "difficult" for most of my life, less often nowadays but still a bit. The reason is I need the taste to be pleasant, like everyone else, but also the texture. If the texture is unpleasant, the food makes me want to puke. Onions, shrimps, mushrooms, melted cheese, pear, banana, beef tongue… a lot of stuff is filtered out.

The upside is, well, everything heightened. I have a very good vision, hearing, touch, and decent smell and taste when I appreciate them. I'm very aware of my surroundings when I pay attention to them (when I'm not daydreaming), and I'm not clumsy. It's very handy to be honest.

Then there's the emotional sensitivity. This one is weird. I don't get hurt a lot, because of this shell of logic, which I have a hard time losing around people. However, when I'm hurt, it's like the senses. It's intense, it's long, and it gets not only emotionally painful, but physically painful, too. Stomach ache, headache, cramps, difficulty to get enough air (even though I breathe perfectly well), stuff like that. That's how I know there's something wrong, I usually have a hard time knowing how I feel, and the physical pain is the clue.
I've said before (maybe ?) that I've been slightly bullied when I was a child. Looking back at it, it was neither mean or a lot. It just felt more intense, and I couldn't make sense of it ("why ?"). The defense I adopted was apparently a change of character, where I just morphed into who I am today, hidden under a number of layers that act as shells. I realized when two different people around me told me a few years ago.
As a consequence, I get hurt only if I open up.

I think it's for that reason that I compartmentalize my acquaintances into groups, that I try to not mix. Because it's nice when they get along, but I feel like a total failure when they don't. It has happened a few times. I know I endure some friends that I know some of my friends from a different group would not. When I get tired because of how my best friend is acting, some other people would have given up a long time ago and would be surprised at how long I can bear having him around. It has worked a few times, but it didn't once, and I realized that mixing up groups of friends was not a safe thing to do at all for my mental state.
Other example : my best friend would like my sister to hang out with us, like his mother and sisters hang out with us (the more the merrier I suppose). But my sister finds him over-the-top (which he kinda is), and doesn't want to hang out with him. Once he asked why she didn't come with us to some evenings, I sneakily said : "uhm, I don't know". But I did know, and it's not happening haha.
So I suppose the defense mechanism I'm describing here is the chameleon syndrome. I do actually get along with different people, that wouldn't like each other, and that's ok. I just don't have to be judged for those people being different and me accepting their presence. We all do the chameleon quite a bit here, but I think that's a necessity, even more for HSPs, when things go wrong, when things are doing full damage to us instead of having a mitigated kind of effect on a non-HSP. People are judgmental, so that's the way to avoid their judgment.

There's no upside for that emotional sensitivity. One could say that "when it's good, it's even better", but no. It's overwhelming when it's good. The loss of control is not necessarily pleasant. Sometimes, but not always. Or maybe, yes, but I can't compare to other people. It's not something visible. The only upside comes from the defense mechanisms I had to put up over two decades. I notice when something's wrong with someone, but I can't tell what, and I can't relate. I don't know what to say, I don't know how to comfort. I notice when the mood of a room changes, or is off, but I can't tell what it is, I can't tell why. I don't know why people are letting things reach them when they have no business with them. Why that police dog who died during a police assault is getting so much attention, and why it'll receive an award post mortem given by the UK. What the fuck ? I don't get why people still have those fucking French flag filters on Facebook. A thousandth of the population in Paris+suburbs died in those attacks, and I don't know why we should be worried for our lives, or why we should wear those stupid filters. I don't know why they make a difference (they don't). It could have been my cousin at that concert, it could have been my sister in one of those bars. Odds made it so that wasn't either of them. We're not risking our lives each time we go out. It doesn't work that way. The way it works, is : those — now dead — people were extremely unlucky and there's no reason to fear other attacks.
People seem to be deliberately letting things hurt them by letting them get to them. That's the only way to get hurt, to let things get to you.

Back on topic : I suppose, too, that being hypersensitive somehow prevents me to do things. I don't think I'm just trying to find excuses, but I don't put myself out there on the work market because I'm terrified of putting myself out there. The way it works is you put yourself out there so you get judged by some more or less professional person, so you can work for a company that is gracious enough to give you money to be their slave. Have the slightest hesitation, and the person judging you will see it, and can discard you on a simple arbitrary call, on a whim.

I'm rambling right now, and I'm realizing where I am going with this. I'll stop before I get there, that's off topic. So that was an insight into how I process things. Now that I think about it, maybe being HSP influences, not MBTI, but Enneagram (6w5 Sp/Sx here). Since I'm suspecting myself to be Aspie, too, maybe all of this is mixed up and it's all a fucking mess.

I'm definitely hyper sensitive lol my job requires social skills (gasp) so I analyze every facial expression, tone of voice, things being unsaid/said, body language etc to determine how to react lol
It sometimes comes off as creepy like esp because I'm able to tune into people and read them so well now.
I don't particularly get really dragged into emotions it's more like I anticipate the proper reaction.

RedPandas said:

Hmm. I've never gotten labelled as an INFP. However, I've been called more as an INFJ with a really developed Ti because I'm so nice to other people and they don't see me as being the "stereotypical INTP." Well, I try to be nice to others (within reason), but I don't think I should be stripped of my INTP title just because of that. I seem to do the social chameleon thing really well, and I'm the type that is really hard for other people to type unless they get to know me really well.

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I'm not sure anyone has actually labelled me as INFP (hardly anyone knows that much about MBTI), but they treat me in a way that would suggest they see me in certain light. Like my mother-in-law who refuses to accept I'm not afraid to be alone in our big house when my husband is away. She has this image of me and it sticks no matter what. I know probably most people make assumptions about others and refuse to change their views, but in my case it's nearly always the same thing: they see me as a fragile person who needs reassurance. Quiet, artistic, small figure, easily disturbed my noises etc. = fragile, and what's worse, not logical.

I'm not sure what you mean by "shy," because I'll say what's on my mind if I feel like it. However, if I see that someone is having a bad day or a hard time, I'll probably back off a little and not say anything - is this where you think the "shyness" comes in, because I see this more as being a considerate/nice thing.

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"Shy" is a very general word and I'm not sure it should be used at all. These days, I'm not blunt with most people because I've learned they don't take it well. In fact I can really speak my mind only with my husband and one friend. With everyone else I make my views softer. If someone asks my opinion about how their clothes look, I might say "not my style" instead of "horrible". I always try to find a way to tell the truth even if it means expressing things in a very rounded way. But I am shy in the traditional sense that I don't easily speak up unless I'm directly asked something, and even then I can't normally think of anything smart to say because I'm too preoccupied with coping with the social situation.

Also, I'm very confident on my being as an individual. I'm not sure why you correlate confidence with being sensitive. I can be confident in my strengths, outgoing, knowledgable, and a humorous individual, while remain sensitive (and mature) to other people's feelings or thoughts. I think it's a matter of being considerate and mature.

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I can be very confident with certain issues and people (okay, mostly just my husband), but I believe being sensitive has indirectly made me less confident. Being highly sensitive is most often associated with shyness which isn't a trait school, friends or my parents encouraged. I've always been a slow thinker, and my dad used to mock me for it. He's very witty and fast. I also learned that my sensitivity issues were because of being spoiled. Maybe this is something that can make anyone less confident, but INTPness seems to often come with certain slowness of thinking (in groups) and expressing difficulties. I'm still not sure where I'm trying to go with this :wink:

Catpowered said:

I definitely see what you mean about feeling as though there are two opposing personalities within. Some people think I'm this sweet shy sensitive little girl. Then they get to know me better and realize that I'm quite stoic and analytical. Then they get to know me even better and realize that there are indeed signs of emotional life and even love in my head. I've had people tell me I'm one of the nicest people they know but that I can be too brutally honest at times and initially seem cold on the outside. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think INTPs are generally well-meaning. The insensitivity isn't just because we're assholes. It's because we don't always understand the appropriate emotional response to many situations. For instance, we may not realize that our honesty can hurt someone's feelings or we may not understand how so many people can get upset over something we find trivial.

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That describes it well, apart from the first sentence: I really don't feel there are two persons within me. In my own mind my personality is mostly very consistent (if certain medical issues don't count).

Mind you, my mother is an ESFP and a lot of my friends were oversensitive Fi users so I had to get used to being more receptive to the needs and feelings of others (and they had to get used to occasionally being offended or having their feelings disregarded). So I think I am more in touch with my Fe function than other INTPs.

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My dad is ENFP and he is a very difficult person to live with. When I still lived at home I was always on my toes, trying to predict his emotional outbursts. I can't say if this has made me quite decent at reading people or if it's from being overall sensitive. Probably both (+ something else), as usual.

Lonewaer said:

I'm not sure where you want to go exactly with this topic, @lightbox. I'll let my thoughts come out starting there : Correlation between HSP and INTP ?

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No, I'm not suggesting there's a correlation. I'm more interested in how being hyper sensitive affects personality (in INTPs). It was also partially ranting since I dislike how all quiet / sensitive people get labelled the same.

RestlessCryptid said:

The unemotional part is one of the major defining factors of being an INTP. To be blunt, if you're a person that breaks down at work, or throws a temper tantrum when they don't get enough sleep, you're not an INTP, because having an inferior Fe means having a uniquely strong set of emotions that are controlled and refined behind a mask of Ti logic.

INTPs are sensitive but unemotional. It's as plain as that. I've yet to observe one that wasn't this way.

Don't anyone tell me that being INTP simply means that you prefer Ti and Ne use and that I can't pick one out based off of simple actions because I can. All cognitive functions result in specific auras because cognitive functions affect human decision making.

I'm a diagnosed highly sensitive person, according a doctor's analysis of multiple EEG scans, and I'm being treated for alexithemia right now since the amount of emotion I express doesn't correlate at all with what's going on inside of my brain.

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I disagree with this. I think a person can break down at work regardless of being INTP. It can happen to most people under right conditions. Many INTPs here tell that when they do reach a breaking point it can be very intense experience because of the inability to cope with strong emotions - it just doesn't happen easily. About 99,9 % of the time I am a very stoic person. For example, the past year has been very difficult for me because of my own serious illness and because the illness of a close person. I've cried once over it and even then it was after not sleeping for 24 hours. But that moment, when I did cry, was horrible. I went into pieces for about ten to fifteen minutes before I was able to collect myself. Then I continued dealing with the issues as I normally do; I tried to find solutions. (This isn't to say I lack emotions all the rest of time, but just that they aren't so intense.)

Edit. I should have combined at least the last two messages...

Kiriae said:

You are forgetting "usually".

There are situations where Ti is helpless. For me the trigger is sensory overload(lack of sleep=more prone to sensory overload) combined with a lot of demands with no way out(stressing work). Basically Si and Fe in tandem.
I can usually deal with emotions even during that times but there were a few situations when I just couldn't stand it anymore and had to literally escape to a silent, isolated place where I melted down. I knew during that time I am being unreasonable and nothing bad is actually happening but my body was in fight or flight state and wouldn't listen to reason. All I could do was leave before others could see my tears or get hurt by an angry fist(which could happen if someone suddenly touched me, although it is possible I would control it by forcing my body to freeze). "Fun" part of having Asperger Syndrome.

Usually I am calm and collected. Some people even say I "lack emotion" because I hide them too well, even from myself - I have alexithemia too. And even when I am aware of my emotions I have no idea how to express them in socially acceptable way so I choose not to.

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Meltdown at work is different from meltdown in the shower or behind locked doors.

I meant sobbing in a corner in front of co-workers.

I can definitely relate to the hypersensitivity issues. In particular audio and touch sensitivity. Every erratic small sound can irk me (especially if I'm trying to sleep, I'm an incredibly light sleeper) and I don't like people touching me in any way. Combine those two and I can get sensory overload easily.

People that don't know me and pick up on my sensory issues do think that I need to be treated in gloves for sure. But I'm a very blunt person in general so eventually they just know not to get too close to me physically, but can be extremely blunt with me too. I don't like walking on eggshells around people nor do I like people doing that for me.