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ENFP vs. ENFJ

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shoot4thestars

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Were you ever mis-typed as an ENFJ? Have you ever tested as both when taking the test multiple times?


What have you noticed with differences between how these two types present if you have interacted with both? Feel free to explain in terms of cognitive functions as well as personal experiences.
 
#2 · (Edited)
shoot4thestars said:
Were you ever mis-typed as an ENFJ? Have you ever tested as both when taking the test multiple times?
Click to expand...
I tested as INFP or INTP mostly. I still test as INTP tbh.

What have you noticed with differences between how these two types present if you have interacted with both? Feel free to explain in terms of cognitive functions as well as personal experiences.
Click to expand...
The external observable difference is that ENFPs are a combination Sanguine and Phlegmatic while ENFJs are Choleric - Sanguine mix. Basically they are your friendlier more emotional variation of Choleric, you'd say they are naturally "charismatic". ESFJs on the other hand are Sanguine like ENFPs, so from a external behaviour perspective, it is easier to confuse an ESFJ with an ENFP.

As a example, I express myself like a phlegmatic, while I have many Sanguine traits and under the right circumstances (a debate for example) my inner talkative Sanguine will emerge.

Functional difference is HUGE.

ENFPs value Fi & Ne while ENFJs value Fe & Ni. ENFJs are rational dominant, which means they are more rigid mentally then ENFPs who tend to be extremely open minded and flexible in comparison. ENFPs also prefer Fi aux to ENFJs Fe dom, which basically means ENFPs are interpersonally less engaging and they express less emotion then even IXFJs. ENFPs can be confused with ENTPs for this very reason.

This is most problematic with older ENFPs who have well developed Ne-Te.

ENFJs will also be more interested in group interaction and the other people in the group, while ENFPs will be more interested in ideas and interact with those who can talk with them about ideas, they are not directly interested in the group interaction or the other people themselves.

Overall ENFPs are lesser feelers in comparison to ENFJs.

ENFJ - Charlie Chaplin his Fe brings tears to mine eyes


ENFJ - Martin Luther King

 
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#4 ·
I test as ENFJ because I like structure and organization. But I don't relate to their functions. I definitely have inferior Si and dom Ne.

I'm not the best at explaining the difference between the two. I'll probably give an answer like, "they use those functions and I use these other functions." That won't help you much ;)
 
#5 ·
Ok, i'll say first up that I have tested as ENFJ (most likely because I don't mind structure I'd imagine), a box is ok as long as it has room (is that reference to another thread? :eek:) <---looks like a chubby chin, ok pump those breaks, let me just activate some sort of tact for a second... I've also tested as INFP (because i'm not standard in my extraversion). However I don't believe those tests considered mental functions very well, but instead the 'traits' which can be defined as too narrow anyways. I think people would have trouble typing me, it would be due my E and F for the most part. However understanding the mental functions a bit more ENFP is just it, no treble.

Alright so, differences, mental functions tell a large part of the picture http://www.typeinmind.com/feni/ e.g I would use Te wayyy wayyy wayyyyyyy before Se. On differences I've observed (to be fair this could be anything), the like organisation and like to create structure, I've also noticed them to be more set in their ways; thinking wise, straight off the bat. So if I'm explaining a new idea, they'll more likely come back with a strong previously held view (i'll usually only do that if it represents an internal value), where they'll do it for what seems to be a regular thought. They also seem to be a bit more dominant, don't mind leading and confident (but again that could just be differences between me vs them). As an example I think a pretty good ENFJ is leslie knope from parks and rec, they love to champion for other people (a few types do) but they;ll really take the lead on that, like real strong. @FreeBeer put it pretty well too.
 
Discussion starter · #6 ·
gritglossandrainbows said:
I test as ENFJ because I like structure and organization. But I don't relate to their functions. I definitely have inferior Si and dom Ne.

I'm not the best at explaining the difference between the two. I'll probably give an answer like, "they use those functions and I use these other functions." That won't help you much ;)
Click to expand...
Haha, it's ok! Your answer actually helped quite a bit! I feel that the MBTI tests are pretty superficial and over simplified in that regard. Just because you like structure and organization doesn't make you any less of an ENFP. I was asking based on experience with someone I know who first tested ENFP, then ENFJ. However, looking at functions, I see definite ENFP. I don't know, it seems as ENFPs grow older they start to value structure and organization a bit more than they normally would've? A bit of speculation.
 
Discussion starter · #7 · (Edited)
@FreeBeer
Very interesting post!

I looked into the temperament example you listed ( the ENFP leaning towards phlegmatic vs. ENFJ's friendly choleric ) and I can definitely see that applying looking at it from an observational point of view in terms of decisiveness. I found it helpful that you broke it down that way.
Also, the video posts of "known" ENFPs and ENFJs helps to further distinguish and make the differences much clearer!

I feel like in person, it's hard to distinguish whether they are being rigid in their views due to Fi or due to having a dominant rational function, but I guess an ENFJ will be more noticeably firm.
You say ENFPs normally express less emotion and are less engaging but aren't ENFPs *normally* touchy-feely though? When does an ENFP choose to divulge in intense emotional expression compared to an ENFJ?
Also in regard to sensitivity, is it that ENFJs are generally more sensitive to the emotions of others and careful with their wording (due to Fe dom) than ENFPs, who are more apt to speak their mind and be a bit less emotionally sensitive, especially with ENFPs with well developed Te?

Also, in friendship, would an ENFP prefer a few close friends compared to an ENFJ who may be more apt to have many acquaintances?

Thanks for the reply!
 
Discussion starter · #8 ·
JMurph said:
Ok, i'll say first up that I have tested as ENFJ (most likely because I don't mind structure I'd imagine), a box is ok as long as it has room (is that reference to another thread? :eek:) <---looks like a chubby chin, ok pump those breaks, let me just activate some sort of tact for a second... I've also tested as INFP (because i'm not standard in my extraversion). However I don't believe those tests considered mental functions very well, but instead the 'traits' which can be defined as too narrow anyways. I think people would have trouble typing me, it would be due my E and F for the most part. However understanding the mental functions a bit more ENFP is just it, no treble.

Alright so, differences, mental functions tell a large part of the picture FeNi (ENFJ) — Type in Mind e.g I would use Te wayyy wayyy wayyyyyyy before Se. On differences I've observed (to be fair this could be anything), the like organisation and like to create structure, I've also noticed them to be more set in their ways; thinking wise, straight off the bat. So if I'm explaining a new idea, they'll more likely come back with a strong previously held view (i'll usually only do that if it represents an internal value), where they'll do it for what seems to be a regular thought. They also seem to be a bit more dominant, don't mind leading and confident (but again that could just be differences between me vs them). As an example I think a pretty good ENFJ is leslie knope from parks and rec, they love to champion for other people (a few types do) but they;ll really take the lead on that, like real strong. @FreeBeer put it pretty well too.
Click to expand...
I agree, the tests are basically E vs. I S vs. N F vs. T and P vs. J. It's very limited. I guess dominant Fe vs dominant Ne would explain why ENFJs normally present as more set in their ways.
Thanks for the helpful input!
 
#9 ·
shoot4thestars said:
Haha, it's ok! Your answer actually helped quite a bit! I feel that the MBTI tests are pretty superficial and over simplified in that regard. Just because you like structure and organization doesn't make you any less of an ENFP. I was asking based on experience with someone I know who first tested ENFP, then ENFJ. However, looking at functions, I see definite ENFP. I don't know, it seems as ENFPs grow older they start to value structure and organization a bit more than they normally would've? A bit of speculation.
Click to expand...
I'm glad it helped :smile:

The more I grew into my Te, the more I realized I had to be practical about stuff. Which requires planning, structure and organization (Te+Si?). Without that, it's harder to do things well or to do it quickly. I'm still very open and flexible in ways that freak out some Js :biggrin:

One difference I noticed is that some ENFJs are much better at sympathizing and they're baffled when some ENFPs start throwing solutions at the problem. We like to listen too, but I think the "why" varies.
 
#10 · (Edited)
shoot4thestars said:
Very interesting post!

I looked into the temperament example you listed ( the ENFP leaning towards phlegmatic vs. ENFJ's friendly choleric ) and I can definitely see that applying looking at it from an observational point of view in terms of decisiveness. I found it helpful that you broke it down that way.
Also, the video posts of "known" ENFPs and ENFJs helps to further distinguish and make the differences much clearer!

I feel like in person, it's hard to distinguish whether they are being rigid in their views due to Fi or due to having a dominant rational function, but I guess an ENFJ will be more noticeably firm.
You say ENFPs normally express less emotion and are less engaging but aren't ENFPs *normally* touchy-feely though? When does an ENFP choose to divulge in intense emotional expression compared to an ENFJ?
Also in regard to sensitivity, is it that ENFJs are generally more sensitive to the emotions of others and careful with their wording (due to Fe dom) than ENFPs, who are more apt to speak their mind and be a bit less emotionally sensitive, especially with ENFPs with well developed Te?

Also, in friendship, would an ENFP prefer a few close friends compared to an ENFJ who may be more apt to have many acquaintances?

Thanks for the reply!
Click to expand...
Idk about other ENFPs, but I'm not touchy feely. I'd go as far as saying that I'm easy to be around and that I'm friendly, but I'm neither emotive or "touchy feely". I do get intimate with girlfriends, but that is different.

I base my F side on the understanding that Fi is "subjective ethics".

Ethics or moral philosophy is the branch of philosophy that involves systematizing, defending, and recommending concepts of right and wrong conduct. The term ethics derives from the Ancient Greek word ἠθικός ethikos, which is derived from the word ἦθος ethos (habit, "custom").

This is where Fi user individualism and selfishness stems from. We generally care about our own subjective values / Fi preference and prefer a live and let live approach, but I don't really care about what a group of people or society may value unless I value it as well :p... this is why ENFPs are more often eccentric and tend to cause trouble. INFPs are similar in this, but I think XSFPs are even worse as they are more forceful and direct about it.

A Fe user does care more about what others feel and value, then their own values and they derive their values from the collective, in stead of it being internal. They prefer to get along and be in group, even if it is a counter culture group for example. Due to Fe, they value group harmony.

In comparison a Fi user will just antagonize group members, because said members went against the Fi user's values. Fi preference translates into a need for internal ethical consistency, much like how Ti preference translates into a need for internal logical consistency.

Imo you should try to imagine Fi as intrapersonal and Fe as interpersonal. Makes it easier.
 
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Discussion starter · #11 ·
FreeBeer said:
Idk about other ENFPs, but I'm not touchy feely. I'd go as far as saying that I'm easy to be around and that I'm friendly, but I'm neither emotive or "touchy feely". I do get intimate with girlfriends, but that is different.

I base my F side on the understanding that Fi is "subjective ethics".

Ethics or moral philosophy is the branch of philosophy that involves systematizing, defending, and recommending concepts of right and wrong conduct. The term ethics derives from the Ancient Greek word ἠθικός ethikos, which is derived from the word ἦθος ethos (habit, "custom").

This is where Fi user individualism and selfishness stems from. We generally care about our own subjective values / Fi preference and prefer a live and let live approach, but I don't really care about what a group of people or society may value unless I value it as well :p... this is why ENFPs are more often eccentric and tend to cause trouble. INFPs are similar in this, but I think XSFPs are even worse as they are more forceful and direct about it.

A Fe user does care more about what others feel and value, then their own values and they derive their values from the collective, in stead of it being internal. They prefer to get along and be in group, even if it is a counter culture group for example. Due to Fe, they value group harmony.

In comparison a Fi user will just antagonize group members, because said members went against the Fi user's values.

Imo you should try to imagine Fi as intrapersonal and Fe as interpersonal. Makes it easier.
Click to expand...
Descriptive post! I actually understand the difference between Fe vs Fi.
I guess I was focusing more on how these types present in person, since ENFJs are known for being more rigid and "judging" "choleric" as you say, but ENFPs can be rigid as well if something goes against their Fi and also, since some ENFPs have mis-typed as ENFJs it makes me question how "laid-back" ENFPs actually are. I feel like circumstances and outside influences can effect this in an ENFP, especially if their friends and loved ones are counting on them to meet deadlines and get things done. And in my experience, ENFPs can present as "feel good" people as well since they are very observant and receptive of others around them and optimistic due to the Ne-Si. In person, you get a much more limited view, especially if you are unaware of the motivations behind their actions.

Enneagrams probably come into play somewhere.
 
#12 · (Edited)
shoot4thestars said:
Descriptive post! I actually understand the difference between Fe vs Fi.
I guess I was focusing more on how these types present in person, since ENFJs are known for being more rigid and "judging" "choleric" as you say, but ENFPs can be rigid as well if something goes against their Fi and also, since some ENFPs have mis-typed as ENFJs it makes me question how "laid-back" ENFPs actually are. I feel like circumstances and outside influences can effect this in an ENFP, especially if their friends and loved ones are counting on them to meet deadlines and get things done. And in my experience, ENFPs can present as "feel good" people as well since they are very observant and receptive of others around them and optimistic due to the Ne-Si. In person, you get a much more limited view, especially if you are unaware of the motivations behind their actions.

Enneagrams probably come into play somewhere.
Click to expand...
I was gonna say that it's super tricky to figure without knowing other facets of personality (e.g enneagram and well everything), but your last sentence summed that up. I always find it quite difficult to come to grips with another persons personality when just looking at the brigg (especially comparisons), typing can be a great starting point or snapshot but alone I find it's just not enough, I try to picture the differences between types and often I just can't do it. Been plenty a time when I've seen an INFJ and thought ENFP for example, but then you figure they actually are INFJ and your heart explodes, haha.

Like look at me and @FreeBeer he says he's not that touchy feely, while I can be very much that way, I find myself to be always validating other people in terms of their emotional response (and because of that I'm decent at recognising them), at the same time I can validate too hard to avoid conflict/upsetting people (9), FreeBeer may not have any such problem and uses logic efficiently to navigate such situations (don't mean to speak for you dude, trying to make the point, haha).

EDIT: @shoot4thestars I've been reading this article to try grasp the Fi vs Fe difference I find it pretty helpful. Even if you're comfortable with the difference yourself it is very detailed and gives some clear examples (I wonder what that's like). http://personalityjunkie.com/12/introverted-feeling-fi-vs-ti-ni-fe/ Outside of that feeling difference it might just be to look for that Ne used first compared to Fe first, the former being more like likely to be all 'Ok how about this/these options', while an Fe will more likely more likely lay out a value drawn from others 'no because my dad taught me this was the right way'. Sorry for the spam, but once those dominos start...
 
#14 · (Edited)
JMurph said:
Like look at me and FreeBeer he says he's not that touchy feely, while I can be very much that way, I find myself to be always validating other people in terms of their emotional response (and because of that I'm decent at recognising them), at the same time I can validate too hard to avoid conflict/upsetting people (9), FreeBeer may not have any such problem and uses logic efficiently to navigate such situations (don't mean to speak for you dude, trying to make the point, haha).
Click to expand...
& @shoot4thestars

Its not like I have logic preference or anything, I do basically go on other people's emotional responses and I have very high emotional IQ, however my subjective perspective on the issue trumps other people's.

As Jung put it, Fi's function is to determine the relationship between subject and object from the subject's perspective, meaning how you relate to everything around you. If a Fi user considers someone's emotional reaction unjustified or alien to his or her relationship with what triggered the other person's emotional reaction, then they will simply disagree. Attempts may be made at empathy which is why we don't exactly go around enforcing such values on other ppl: "its cool, so that is what you feel, but here is what I value *insert explanation*.

This is why ppl say Fi preference is selfish :p, it should be understood in terms of the self, we basically consider things based on how we relate. Do I agree, disagree, like, dislike, is this right or wrong imo..etc..

I'm probably less conflict avoidant, because I'm not type 9 :p.
 
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#15 ·
I've tested as everything from INFP to ENFJ to INFJ. I don't really relate to the functions though.
 
#16 ·
shoot4thestars said:
Were you ever mis-typed as an ENFJ? Have you ever tested as both when taking the test multiple times?


What have you noticed with differences between how these two types present if you have interacted with both? Feel free to explain in terms of cognitive functions as well as personal experiences.
Click to expand...
No...I usually test as an INFP or INTP.
 
#17 ·
Just from my personal encounter..

I have a good friend that is ENFJ and co-worker that is also ENFJ.

What i could say about them, they always strive for perfection. I have to wait patiently if i want them to do something and if i cannot tolerate to wait. I will interfere and they don't like it. They will need some time to see that your interference is good for them.

Negative type... hahaha.. When i have an idea or doing something that is big to me. They will always negative remarks about it. Hate this the most.

And they love sarcasm.

But in term of reliability, they are good as team player.

They put importance on their appearances and fashionable, from the hair and down to the shoes. :)

With them, its like love hate relation.
 
#18 ·
For me the main difference with an ENFJ and ENFP is the feeling I get from them. The ENFJ feels like rich dark chocolate and the ENFP feels like Cotten candy/soda bubbles.

The Fe around an ENFJ feels like heavy thick velvet due to their Se. Emotional energy rolls off them like waves with a physical element to them as well. I want to say that they feel dangerous to me as an INFJ. Their Fe-Ni-Se is warm and engaging but I find myself always bracing for a sharp strike to my Fe from the ENFJ, (which isn't unwarranted). ENFJ will strike out with their Fe first and foremost as it is their most potent extroverted function, like a silk cloaked dagger.

ENFP go in the opposite direction of ENFJ as far as feeling goes. An ENFP's Ne and Fi make for a light uplifting feeling which is a big contrast to the ENFJ. Where an ENFJ makes you feel like you're sinking into heavy velvet drapes, an ENFP makes you feel like you're floating in air among clouds. ENFP make good friends for INFJ as the they form a function feed back loop which brings up their energy and mood. The only thing I fear from an ENXP is them canceling plans because they found another more exciting activity, (Ne).
 
#19 ·
A close friend of mine has taken the test twice and gotten ENFJ and ENFP. She's not nearly as into MBTI as I am, so she hasn't really said if she thinks she's an ENFP or ENFJ. I get major ENFJ vibes from her a lot of the time. She's this beautiful bleeding heart and is all about hugs and hand-holding ALL THE TIME, with everyone and anyone. While I am just as much of a hugger, it's much more selective. There are people I care about and trust, and those are the ones I hug. But that totally could a personal thing and less related to MBTI.

She's private with her feelings, but I can't tell if that's out of consideration for others and past experience or a natural built-in Fi kinda thing. Other than her privacy, she screams Fe to me, but that could just be really healthy Fi. She's much more organized than me, but that really could be interpreted any way. I'd have to have an in-depth conversation with her about her personality to truly get a sense if she's an ENFP or ENFJ.
 
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