[Lost in Oblivion]

I'm sorry but I find an IxTJ 7 highly doubtful. Maybe an ExTJ but not an IxTJ.

I have an INTJ friend whom I gave the enneagram test and she tested as a 7w6 (without prior knowledge of the enneagram). Actually, I'd really love for her to start posting here, but I feel like she gets too distracted. I don't really expect an answer from this mention, and she hates when I do this, but screw you @catvoncool and come out of your hiding!

@Spades, if she doesn't answer then I can try to help confirm it for you.

 

[LibertyPrime]

@fourtines

Spades isn't exactly introverted. More like ambivert. You know about this from experience imo. Judging by what I have seen she isn't "socially introverted" shy or anything like that <.<....from an outside look I'd say extrovert, however considering Jung's functions I'd say Ni-Ne-Fi-Te and some Se.

There are introverted 7s, hell I'm an introverted primary social variant ( I find this one quite strange).

I also think 5w4 may fit Spades quite well from my perspective, but I lack all the details and can't make that decision .....not enough conclusive data.

Ever since I was wrong about being a 4 when others said I was a 6....I stopped supporting the idea that people know better then others about their own type. I certainly didn't.

 

[Sign of the Times]

An ISTJ 7? Really? You have to be constantly stimulated and excited and go on spontaneous adventures? An ISTJ who places fun and pleasure before all other things? How many times have you changed jobs or moved around?

Are you sure you aren't a 6w7?

I'm sorry, I generally think people know themselves better than I do (especially better than acquaintances on an Internet forum) but ISTJ 7 is a ridiculously unlikely possibility that could result from not quite understanding enneagram.

I like fun, pleasure and adventures. But I'm also not stupid. Being a 7 doesn't automatically mean you are an average to low-health 7 who has no impulse control or rationality. What about high-health 7s who are highly focused? Do they stop being 7s just because they grew up and matured? What about 7s who don't have the means to party, or don't find parties fun and find more intense pleasures in other things, or who are born disabled and can't walk, so they escape mentally because physically they are trapped. Because you don't see them party they're not a 7?

And actually yes, I have made a radical career change in my past and lived in about 7 different countries across 3 continents not to mention additional travels to other countries where I didn't actually live, etc. I speak several languages, play different musical instruments, have danced competitively, etc. I'm a 7. But I can prioritise and I'm not out of control and am very disciplined and focused when it comes to my work, like an ISTJ typically is. I take care of myself and am not on the road to self-destruction. Don't forget that the 7 connects to 1 and 5 on its lines of integration and disintegration, which are both highly focused, logical types. The 1 and 5 energies will be present somehow to some degree in any 7, and when that presence is positive, it gives self-control, principles, discipline and discernment. You still live a rich life, but a more meaningful one and not a shallow, impulsive, tortured one.

 

[Sina]

@Sign of the Times
Thanks for another useful post; it helps emphasize the idiocy of stereotyping and 'mbti-enneagram' correlations.

 

[Owfin]

I also don't think 7s thirst for more has to be physical, either. 7s can be hungry for more mental fuel and more experience, which would be highly advantageous to an ISTJ, don'tcha think?

 

[Sign of the Times]

I also don't think 7s thirst for more has to be physical, either. 7s can be hungry for more mental fuel and more experience, which would be highly advantageous to an ISTJ, don'tcha think?

No, it is not necessarily always physical. 7s like to learn, also intellectually, because they are very curious. The party-animal stereotype I think often makes people forget that the 7 is in the mental triad after all, so of the three gut centres they have a special talent in the mind/thinking centre (agility, quick thinking and processing, synthesis, creative reframing and solutions, etc.) They are most of touch with the feeling centre, not clearly in touch with their own true feelings and desires nor those of others. 7s are notoriously egotistical and narcissistic when unhealthy, and even when relatively healthy they are still primarily focused on themselves, and we all know how much people complain about ISTJs being unempathetic robots don't we?! In terms of imagination, the sx-first 7 especially has a vivid dream world.

I was just about to post this actually from Typewatch Enneagram:

Sevens have addictive personalities. They tend to be adventurous, impulsive, exciting, and enthusiastic. The more common sensing-perceiving sevens tend to be focused on more physical gluttony and are the typical party animals. The less common intuitive seven is no less addictive but has as much a need for mental stimulation as a need for physical stimulation. All sevens need the potential for a more fulfulling life more than anything. They need something better in their future to look forward to. The one thing a seven wouldn't relate to in a million years is contentment and a lack of wants.

 

[JungyesMBTIno]

I'm pretty sure that I know a type 7 INTJ female from my high school. She was very adventurous and an active participant in a lot of diverse activities, liked to party (probably the most in-touch with her ESFP shadow I've ever seen in my own type, hence she was hard to type for a while, but definitely seemed to be an Ni dom (her Te wasn't always obvious at first glance, so to speak) - I clicked with her stunningly well, although I can't relate to the party-girl aspirations, haha), liked interesting people, was interested in a lot of academic subjects, particularly cultures and art, seemed to look at life as an adventure, very open to new experiences, upbeat usually, not afraid to voice strong opinions around others, etc. (basically, an "enthusiast"). I wonder if @Spades can relate to this, because I'm sort of thinking yes...

 

[Thalassa]

I like fun, pleasure and adventures. But I'm also not stupid. Being a 7 doesn't automatically mean you are an average to low-health 7 who has no impulse control or rationality. What about high-health 7s who are highly focused? Do they stop being 7s just because they grew up and matured? What about 7s who don't have the means to party, or don't find parties fun and find more intense pleasures in other things, or who are born disabled and can't walk, so they escape mentally because physically they are trapped. Because you don't see them party they're not a 7?

And actually yes, I have made a radical career change in my past and lived in about 7 different countries across 3 continents not to mention additional travels to other countries where I didn't actually live, etc. I speak several languages, play different musical instruments, have danced competitively, etc. I'm a 7. But I can prioritise and I'm not out of control and am very disciplined and focused when it comes to my work, like an ISTJ typically is. I take care of myself and am not on the road to self-destruction. Don't forget that the 7 connects to 1 and 5 on its lines of integration and disintegration, which are both highly focused, logical types. The 1 and 5 energies will be present somehow to some degree in any 7, and when that presence is positive, it gives self-control, principles, discipline and discernment. You still live a rich life, but a more meaningful one and not a shallow, impulsive, tortured one.

I never said that all 7s are self-destructive. However, they tend to be extroverted and spontaneous people. They seek experiences. THEY ARE THE MOST EXTROVERTED ENNEAGRAM TYPE, EVEN AT HIGH HEALTH LEVELS.

It is one of the least common types for both ISTJ and INTJ, and highly common for ExxPs, ESTJs, and ISTPs. Somewhat medium occurrence in ISFP...the ISxP correlation is probably due to Se, and in ESTJs because of Te-Ne.

I don't know you though, and I'm not telling you your type, however, I was questioning it based on what I know about enneagram.

 

[Sign of the Times]

On a general note regarding extraversion and 7s, the kind of extraversion going on in a 7 is not exactly the same kind of energy as what is measured by MBTI. The defining vice of 7 is more precisely gluttony, which is not the same as extraversion per se, although this manifests most of the time as something that looks like extraversion.

Extraversion according to MBTI is psychic energy being focused outwardly. There is an implication of an active putting out of one's psychic force. Whereas gluttony is a passive consumption of external objects, it is not productive or active. The gluttonous consumption of the external world of people, experiences, objects, etc. appears active though, but from a spiritual point of view it is an empty activity, this is not real self-investment of one's energy into the world. I think this is what is meant when it is said that 7s have a problem with commitment. In MBTI terms the gluttonous physical consumption of objects is most obvious in E--P types particularly where the 7 has the self-preservation instinct dominant.

Introverted 7s are still gluttonous but requiring more external objects to feed their inner worlds of the mind intellectually or imaginatively. These would be I--Js or INFPs, for example. The rigidity of J might mean that I--Js are just more picky about what they like and more withdrawing from what they don't like.

Thus, whether I or E the central issue is still "extraverted" in nature in the sense that there is a high dependency on and responsiveness to the external environment, whether that manifests in plunging into it (E) or withdrawing from it (I).

 

[JungyesMBTIno]

I'm sorry but I find an IxTJ 7 highly doubtful. Maybe an ExTJ but not an IxTJ.

I have a feeling that IXTJ 7s are probably among the most extroverted introverts out there, based on one I'm pretty confident that I know.

 

[Spades]

@fourtines, I didn't mean to sound defensive in my last posts. I was in a rush to get the last of my assignments for the week done so I could start my reading week (1 week break from school). When I checked PerC, I was taken by surprise at your response, as it seemed to come out of nowhere and was unsubstantiated. Hopefully I can clarify a few things with this post here.

@Sign of the Times, thanks for elaborating on what it means to be a 7, as opposed to the ridiculous stereotypes that exist out there. Why is it that people always think of drunk college kids? How about Richard Feynman, Benjamin Franklin, or Thomas Edison? (Source: one of the best 7 descriptions I've seen). Type 7 is a head type. They have a quick mental energy and this drives them to sample and experience new things. Physical energy is in the realm of Type 8, and I was mistyped as one at first, not realizing the huge difference.

I have no doubts of being a Seven now.

I'm planning to write a personal description of what being a Seven means to me, especially Sp/Sx. And seriously, what's wrong with having fun if you're responsible? We live in a culture that discourages feeling good and promotes feeling guilty and/or complaining about things. Those who seek to fulfill their lives are seen as gluttons, and struggle is seen as something required. I simply choose not to follow that idea.

As for MBTI, I agree, ISTJ is really unlikely, and INTJ quite so. Does that mean a misunderstanding of the system? No. It's possible though. But for example, I always test INTJ. I'm taking an official MBTI next week so we'll see what comes out of that. However, after observing myself closely just this weekend, I concluded that I might be an extrovert after all (@Rim), in the shallow definition of the word. In terms of functions, who knows anymore, but I do believe Rim got the order I suspect quite well, though we both agree that there is no physical way to verify this at the moment, so it's really just speculation. I've temporarily changed my label to see how that goes (for the lolz!)

Similarly, Sign of the Times, you may test ISTJ every time, but be open to the possibility of it not being correct. My brother tests ISTJ every time, and he is very clearly an ISTP.

I had a lot more to say actually, but this is getting kind of lengthy. I will elaborate some other time.

 

[Sign of the Times]

Similarly, Sign of the Times, you may test ISTJ every time, but be open to the possibility of it not being correct. My brother tests ISTJ every time, and he is very clearly an ISTP.

I had a lot more to say actually, but this is getting kind of lengthy. I will elaborate some other time.

I have considered that I might have made a mistake with my MBTI since I realised I'm a 7, but I really don't think so, and I really don't identify with ISTP. I'm not very physical in the way they are supposed to be.

If I were any other type than an ISTJ, it would be INFP. I relate to a lot of things said about INFPs but I do think I have a bias toward ISTJ overall, especially in how I function in most external situations. Maybe I'm an INFP who learned to deal with the world? I don't know. ISTJ skills such as concentration, dealing with details, etc. are more natural and stronger for me than deep empathy and mediating.

I think that is one problem with MBTI, that it doesn't allow for the issue of conscious choice once you start to become less identified with your default mode and more aware of alternative ways of dealing with and approaching things. But in any case, I'm pretty sure I was always a 7 since I was a child. Looking back, I was naturally friendly, loud and curious about people and active with lots of things on the go. It was just later that I became more withdrawn and more of an introvert. And even that was in a very 7-ish way of reaction.

It's my belief that you can't develop your E-type, that it's innate. But perhaps MBTI is more influenced by adaptation to your environment? Who knows, I don't. I know that ISTJ-ness got me through my childhood better than INFP-ness would have. But my 7 sure was cooking its plans... haha.

I stick with ISTJ 7, whatever that means.

 

[Swordsman of Mana]

@Spades

Ren Maaka: INTJ 7w8 Sx/Sp

 

[Swordsman of Mana]

@Spades
I don't know if I've mentioned king Solomon of Israel yet in this thread, but the guy was clearly INTJ and even more clearly 7(w8 Sx/Sp). he is THE archetypal example of a 7 who's indulgence, lust and lack of moderation ultimately were his undoing.

 

[Spades]

Something INTJ 7ish I realized about myself this weekend:

I love anything new and fascinating! I love science. I see life as a giant science experiment: we can ponder the theories all we want, but the real gain is from performing the experiments! Hypothesis --> Design experiment --> Perform experiment --> Analyze data --> Draw conclusions --> Repeat! I probably spend more time on the design/plan than a typical Seven but I can't possibly imagine myself drawing any accurate conclusions without constantly collecting as much data (experience) as I can.

Knowing something ≠ Experiencing it.
I'd like a textbook on sex, please. *Roll eyes*

 

[Laura C]

INTJ 7w8 Sp/Sx/So here.

Totally INTJ at work - things need to make sense, be logical, planned and executed. Typical complaints about me include not taking other people's feelings into consideration; something I am working on. Usually perceived as an Extrovert due to the high level of interactions required at work - frequent show of Te. I don't hang out with my coworkers outside work that often so they only get to see that part of me (the one with lots of things to say = extroverted) but then again, I am a workaholic.

In personal life, I am more mischievous, adventurous, hyperactive, scattered, easily bored, given to high level of optimism. I attribute this to relaxing the Te muscles and allowing my Ni, Fi and Se to roam free. I do have a habit of turning into a spontaneous, fun-loving ESFP when in the company of friends (I don't know why this happens, lol!) but bring up an interesting/serious topic, the INTJ will return with scrutinizing eyes and logical inputs, etc. And yes, I do need my timeout from social activities once every 3 - 4 weeks to recharge.

Personally, I feel right at home being INTJ 7w8 with 7 = Ni and 8 = Te.

@ Spades

So did you take the official MBTI? I gather from your last post above, you've been confirmed as INTJ?

 

[Spades]

@ Spades

So did you take the official MBTI? I gather from your last post above, you've been confirmed as INTJ?

Wow, I just saw this post now. Yes, I took it and my Best-Fit was INTJ. I don't really see myself in any of the other types. I still relate to Type 5 (and less so 8 and other) descriptions, but I just got Claudio Naranjo's "Character and Neurosis" and I found it funny he actually used INTJ as an example of Type 7. I relate to his description of 7 as a "Narcissist" much more than Riso and Hudson's (which seems very Se-dom). I'd have to read the rest to know for sure though

 

[Lotan]

ENTJ 7w8 sp/sx here...high five to another J and sp 7.

 

[Aquamarine]

You're the only other INTJ type 7 whom I've met in the forums.

The other one is me.

 

[boynamedsue]

I'm an INTJ type 7w6....