[mistakenforstranger]

I'd say an ENFJ or INFJ. Her top function seems like Fe. I mean, can she seriously write a song that isn't about a relationship?! But she doesn't seem extraverted. Her quotes read like something a very immature NF would want to believe in, one who hasn't seriously been burned by life (or developed their thinking function). Her ideas are pretty conventional and trite, which makes me doubt Ni as her top function, or even as one of her functions, but maybe that's more to do with lack of experience. She thinks her two month flings with guys are true love, and then gets disappointed when her expectations aren't met, which leads her to feel justified in tearing up said fling in a song so she can feel better about herself (and make tons of $$$ along the way from hormonal teenage girls who feel they can just sooo relate bc their high-school boyfriends don't worship the ground these pretty princesses walk on.). She's incapable of seeing that she could be just as responsible for it not working out. No matter, though, I'll let the media know those guys were "JERKS," and then write a song about it, move on, and find someone who truly appreciates me and my unrealistic notions of true love. :frustrating: God, I've known someone like this and they were an extremely immature NF type. I just don't have the patience to listen to the shallow, self-indulgent, self-righteous diary entries (i.e. her songs) of a 22-year-old woman who still has the mindset of a 13-year-old girl, but damn are they catchy!

 

[mistakenforstranger]

I'm now thinking ISFJ or INFJ. She doesn't seem extraverted to me, and in the earlier post above, I argued for her NF-ness, but I have a hard time seeing Ni at all in her lyrics. When Ni expresses something it is more often than not very vague. Ni likes to set up things so there are multiple interpretations built into the lyrics. It could mean anything, and no matter how hard you try, you never can fully grasp it. Ni-doms like it that way. It keeps their art "alive" in a sense. Lyrics from Ni-doms are always pointing to something beyond (and sometimes beyond the beyond...Huh?!) what they're actually saying. I don't get that sense with Taylor. She's very clear in her songwriting. It's always about relationships, love, heartbreak, ad nauseam, and you can work out an interpretation pretty easily; it only means that one thing that she's trying to convey. She says she wants her fans to connect to the lyrics (Fe), which would put a limit on what and how she expresses herself. Even so, I would think INFJs would want to muddy the waters a little bit for their listeners. And she's always referring to experiences and relationships from the past. Lots of past tense in her lyrics. I just saw her new video for Trouble, and in the opening monologue, she talks about a "kaleidoscope of memories" (Si). The only thing that seems Ni in her is exploring the dichotomy between her fantasies (Ni) and the harsh reality (Se), like in the song, White Horse, and even that seems like I'm stretching things a bit. If Taylor is an INFJ, then her N isn't that prominent (F all the way), or she's really an ISFJ. E-type has to be taken into account, too.

@fourtines, I'm a closet Taylor Swift fan too, but her recent album is overproduced trash!

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Loving him is like driving a new Maserati down a dead end street
Faster than the wind
Passionate as sin, ended so suddenly
Loving him is like trying to change your mind
Once you’re already flying through the free fall
Like the colors in autumn
So bright just before they lose it all

Losing him was blue like I’d never known
Missing him was dark grey all alone
Forgetting him was like trying to know somebody you've never met
But loving him was red
Loving him was red

Touching him is like realizing all you ever wanted was right there in front of you
Memorizing him was as easy as knowing all the words to your old favorite song
Fighting with him was like trying to solve a crossword and realizing there’s no right answer
Regretting him was like wishing you never found out love could be that strong

Losing him was blue like I’d never known
Missing him was dark grey all alone
Forgetting him was like trying to know somebody you've never met
But loving him was red
Oh red burning red

Remembering him comes in flashbacks and echoes
Tell myself it’s time now, gotta let go
But moving on from him is impossible
When I still see it all in my head

Burning red!
Darling it was red!

Oh, losing him was blue like I’d never known
Missing him was dark grey all alone
Forgetting him was like trying to know somebody you've never met
Cause loving him was red yeah yeah red
We're burning red

And that's why he's spinning round in my head
Comes back to me burning red
Yeah yeah

Cause love was like driving a new Maserati down a dead end street

-This song seems a little bit more Ni maybe. There is more metaphors and similes. And she doesn't have any Si or detail-oriented lyrics like she usually does. It's interesting too that this song is what she chose to be her new album title. Maybe she connects with it more because it is a little bit more intuitive? I am starting to see INFJ more and more, but I think her Fe is strong and to re-iterate what I thought before, maybe she is a type 2 which further strengthens her Fe.

I suppose so, but it's not what I would see as Ni-songwriting. They are intentionally vague at times. I can work out what she's saying in this song. I just wouldn't think Ni-doms would make comparisons so explicit like that throughout the whole structure of the song, but I guess even Morrissey (INFJ) sings "Everyday is like Sunday." She could be INFJ, and it's just bad songwriting. I mean, it's worked so far for her, right? So why change it? And it has to be digestible to her audience, hence the use of cliches that every girl can relate to. Still, I hear some of her other songs and it's thematically about "remembering when" of this moment/time/place (See: All Too Well for a perfect example) that I don't ever see lyrically explored by Ni-lyricists. They want to explore ideas in their songs not memories. Some examples would be Thom Yorke and Sufjan Stevens, which I realize are on independent labels, giving them absolute freedom, and probably different enneagram types as well, but now it's starting to feel like I'm making excuses.

I agree! It's kind of pathetic how much these newer songs pale in comparison to the ones she wrote as a child and teenager. I know it's not that she's not writing good songs -- it's just that she's not putting them on her album anymore because she's so much more afraid of being intimate about her life now. That's why she co-wrote so much for this album. Shame. Looks like she's sold out for now.

I find Red catchy and maybe one other song is heartfelt, but her voice doesn't even sound natural on a lot of them. And I'm not just speaking about ones like Trouble where they actually distort her voice just that her natural voice throughout sounds so overpolished by the studio. And what about 22?

 

[mistakenforstranger]

I read your comment after reading a recent interview of hers and felt like posting something she said in it, lol...
“Rigatoni makes me feel weird. It’s like a wheel, and what’s it trying to do? It’s like an unfinished ravioli.”

From Personality Types by Lenore Thomson, pg 180:

"ISJs tend to believe that others don't "get" their sense of humor, but this isn't necessarily true. When ISJs feel comfortable, they make all sorts of observations about perceived discontinuities, some of which are dead serious. But they aren't the kinds of observations that everyone would make. So it's not always clear what kind of reaction the type is looking for."

And another, pg 178:
"But in truth, the inner worldof an ISJ is often delightfully unconventional, even whimsical, and the type's private interests can be decidedly offbeat."

I'm not saying this is conclusive of her type, but it is interesting to consider in relation to her.

Is this the song that is heartfelt? I like this one a lot.

Also, could Ni manifest itself in the way she composes the songs and melody? She always seems to know exactly what tune she needs to create to get her songs catchy and stuck in our heads!

Nah, it's this one. The emotion she conveys feels real to me.

I wouldn't say that "knowing the tune" would be indicative of Ni, or even those "A-ha!" moments, which everyone seems to attribute to Ni. That's just creativity at work. What could be interpreted as Ni are the little "hidden" messages she puts in her songs, but even those are decipherable. She wants people to guess who it's about and even wants that person who it's about to know it's for them. She thinks she'll probably get a response from whichever ex it's about. Ni puts layers in their lyrics, so it's paradoxical. You think it's one thing, but if you shift your perspective, it means something else. How do I come to any one interpretation when it really could mean anything? I can guess, but I'll never really know for sure. It all comes down to on your own perspective. Each person will have their own way of seeing the same thing. Ni likes to set things up in this way because it potentially gives their art more meaning than originally intended, while also giving listeners a lot of freedom. They aren't intentionally being misleading. It's just that what they are trying to communicate can be too ethereal to put into terms people can understand.

Here's a lyrically Ni song off the top of my head:

Ni could be seen, though, in the way she talks about her album, like with Speak Now, where each song is a reflection of some concept, one based on the wedding vow, "speak now..." I see some intuition in that, but why would Ni-types shape their life story around such a traditional event?

Believe me, my instinct says xNFJ, but the more I've looked into it, she has a lot of Si that's hard to deny. Based on functions, I'd be more willing to say she's an IsFJ or possibly an eNFJ (eNFJ because the Fe connecting message seems more important than the Ni expression, but what do we make of Si, then?)

Any feedback is welcome!

 

[mistakenforstranger]

I find Red catchy and maybe one other song is heartfelt, but her voice doesn't even sound natural on a lot of them. And I'm not just speaking about ones like Trouble where they actually distort her voice just that her natural voice throughout sounds so overpolished by the studio. And what about 22?

:blushed: Oops, I should've actually listened to the real thing and not the bootleg version on youtube before I said this. Her voice sounds A LOT better, but still stick to your country story-telling roots, Taylor!

@mistakenforstranger Taylor has actually said she doesn't want people to know who she's singing about. She says she loves reading people's guesses and laughs to herself when they're wrong, because she's the only person who'll ever truly know. The secret messages in many of her songs are completely false, to mislead fans into thinking she dated certain people that she didn't date at all. She's actually only dated like 3 or 4 people in the past 7 years -- she just does so many PR stunts that lead people to think otherwise. And I've said this before in this thread, but half of Taylor's songs aren't even based on things that happened to her -- they're just complete fantasies, stories she made up.

Right, but she doesn't make it too hard for certain people to figure out it's about them. Dear John? She denies it's about him, but c'mon, really?!

It makes no difference to me what Taylor's type is, I just want people to be clear on the difference between Si and Ni. Anyone can make up stories, fantasize, that's not what introverted intuition is about; N's in general are more likely to do those things, but those behaviors aren't necessarily indicative of a preference for intuition, at least in terms of cognitive function theory.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Isn't this Si?

All Too Well

I walked through the door with you, the air was cold
But something about it felt like home somehow
And I left my scarf there at your sister's house
And you still got it in your drawer, even now

Oh, your sweet disposition and my wide eyed gaze
We're singing in the car getting lost upstate
Autumn leaves falling down like pieces into place
And I can picture it after all these days

And I know it's long gone
And that magic's not here no more
And I might be okay
But I'm not fine at all

'Cause there we are again, on that little town street
You almost ran the red 'cause you were looking over me
Wind in my hair, I was there, I remember it all too well

Photo album on the counter, your cheeks were turning red
You used to be a little kid with glasses in a twin size bed
Your mother's telling stories about you on the tee ball team
You tell me about your past, thinking your future was me

And I know it's long gone
And there's nothing else I could do
And I forget about you long enough
To forget why I needed to

'Cause there we are again, in the middle of the night
We're dancing around the kitchen in the refrigerator light
Down the stairs, I was there, I remember it all to well

And maybe we got lost in translation, maybe I asked for too much
But maybe this thing was a masterpiece 'til you tore it all up
Running scared, I was there, I remember it all too well

And you call me up again just to break me like a promise
So casually cruel in the name of being honest
I'm a crumpled up piece of paper lying here
'Cause I remember it all, all, all to well

Time won't fly, it's like I'm paralyzed by it
I'd like to be my old self again, but I'm still trying to find it
After plaid shirt days and nights when you made me your own
Now you mail back my things and I walk home alone

But you keep my old scarf from that very first week
'Cause it reminds you of innocence and it smells like me
You can't get rid of it 'cause you remember it all to well, yeah

'Cause there we are again, when I loved you so
Back before you lost the one real thing you've ever known
It was rare, I was there, I remember it all to well

Wind in my hair, you were there, you remember it all
Down the stairs, you were there, you remember it all
It was rare, I was there, I remember it all to well
​

 

[mistakenforstranger]

@letmeknowwhenitworks, thank you. I've tried to make a fair case for her intuition (Ni, specifically), but I just don't see it at all, at least not in the persona she constructs and lyrical content. I have to believe that she has at least some control over what she writes and puts out, though. Everything seems to fall on deaf ears here.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Taylor Swift is the epitome of Fe. The speeches she gave every night during her concerts all this year are one of the most Fe things I've ever seen. I also saw a video last year where she gave some of her fans elaborate personalized gifts for Christmas. So much Fe. I even remember hearing about how she would bring a batch of cookies to each radio station she spoke at before she became a star. I think it's on the Fearless tour video. Fe has to be her dominant or auxiliary function, so definitely not an ESTP.

So the question becomes, is she Si or Ni? In my view, it's Si. Just look at part of her recent acceptance speech at the VMAs:
"This was such a collaborative effort. (Fe) These women helped create their parts...I love them so much, and the fact that the fans, the fact that you would vote and give us this bonding experience that we will have forever (Si), thank you from the bottom of my heart." It has Fe-Si written all over it. ENFJs/INFJs, which are other contested typings for her, do not think of the present moment as being made into a memory because they have Se, which experiences the moment as it is. This isn't to say that ENFJs/INFJs don't hold onto memories or aren't nostalgic from time to time, because everyone does, but this isn't a conscious decision as it clearly is for Taylor.

Furthermore, I think if people understood Ni better, they would see that Taylor uses Si. Ni does not have the same mass appeal that Taylor's work has received (which has to do with Fe, too). In fact, their ideas are usually so radical (Nietzsche, Freud as Ni-doms, for example) that they are not appreciated, or in some cases, completely scorned, by the larger society at the time of their inception. It is only over time that the insights Ni offered years before come to be seen as valuable. Taylor is clearly in step with the times, as most artists who are sensing are, because we live in a sensation-oriented culture. Her vision (if one can even call it that) unlike an Ni-dom, and to a lesser extent an Ni-aux, is not as far-reaching or as overturning of established norms.

ESFJ

 

[mistakenforstranger]

She always struck me as ENFJ, I don't know why. And I think she's a 7.

I had considered that type as well, but how do you explain the glaring use of Si? Just look at this quote from a fairly recent interview about her 1989 tour: "Thinking outside the box is more difficult than doing the same thing you've done over and over again, but l think it has better results."

She's an ESFJ who is developing her tertiary Ne, thinking "outside the box" and changing her direction in music. This shows she is not an intuitive type because these types are already inherently outside the box, especially Ne/Ni-dom.


An example of an ENFJ is Oprah. They're similar in the sense of their mass appeal (Fe) and commercial empires, but Oprah is more open to ideas (Ni-aux), some of which is a lot of new age hogwash that she accepts as truth based on feeling rather than critical thinking (Ti-inf).


Also, look at Taylor's letters to Spotify and Apple explaining her decision to not share her music. She's doing it on behalf of other artists out there struggling to make album sales (Fe):


"This is not about me. Thankfully I am on my fifth album and can support myself, my band, crew, and entire management team by playing live shows. This is about the new artist or band that has just released their first single and will not be paid for its success. This is about the young songwriter who just got his or her first cut and thought that the royalties from that would get them out of debt. This is about the producer who works tirelessly to innovate and create, just like the innovators and creators at Apple are pioneering in their field…but will not get paid for a quarter of a year’s worth of plays on his or her songs."


Oprah acted in a similar though more self-righteous way when she found out James Frey fabricated most of his memoir, which she had endorsed as part of her book club. So what did she do? She brought him on her show to publicly shame him for his dishonesty, and did it all on behalf of everyone who read his book (Fe). If anyone is doing anything on another's behalf, think Fe, especially Fe-dom. Also, don't get on their bad side.


And Taylor is not a type 7. She is more likely to be found in the heart triad (types 2, 3, or 4). I'd say a 2w3 or 3w2.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Isn't being more open to new age hogwash more of a low-Ne thing?

In other words, Oprah is called an ENFJ everywhere online, but IS SHE?

When you compare her to Obama, the real deal, she seems more naive / impressionable and straightforward. In other words, potentially ESFJ.

I'm not exactly sure, but I think we can all agree Oprah is Fe-dom. I still would argue that she is ENFJ, though. I think her embracing of new age ideas is more attributed to Ni-aux, as she seems to be seeking a life transformation for her and her viewers/readers, but she embraces the more preposterous ideas wholeheartedly because she lacks the ability to see its logical shortcomings (Ti-inf). I would think Fe-doms (and Fi-doms) are more inclined to believe their feelings first and foremost regardless of outside evidence (Te-inf for Fi) or logical reasoning (Ti-inf for Fe).

I find it interesting that you type Obama as ENFJ, because I view him as an introvert. I don't know that much about Obama personally, but he seems to be a Fe-user, at least from his speeches I've heard.

Back to Taylor, what is your opinion on her type? I find it interesting that Katy Perry slyly compared her to Regina George, who I would type as a manipulative ESFJ. I don't think the comparison is too far off either, especially seeing as she appears to be the Queen Bee among her posse. I immediately thought of the Mean Girls when I see them all together. Not to say that they're mean, but then, how would I know? I do like Tay Tay, though, but I think this new phase has gone to her head.

Here's the video with the quote in my last post, Fe-Si moving toward Ne: "Thinking outside the box is more difficult than doing the same thing you've done over and over again, but I think it has better results."

 

[mistakenforstranger]

But is this 'life transformation' that Oprah seeks for one and all (Fe) based on her own inner vision of things, or external ideas from outside sources (Ne)?

I have no dog in this race, and very little knowledge of Oprah, but I'm not sure she's a visionary, so much as a raging Fe-dom.

Taylor Swift? SFJ for sure. She could be Fe-dom, or she could be Si-dom, but she's one or the other. =)

You could be right about Oprah. I also don't know that much about her. It seems that she comes across ideas that inspire her in some way (The Secret, The Power of Now, etc.), and pushes them onto her viewing audience: "Today...This will change your life!" She comes to her own insights through them as well, as I've seen her say in a few shows/interviews, "I just had an epiphany!", but it seems the impetus comes from other peoples' ideas.

I'm glad you agree with SFJ for Taylor. If I had to choose one, I'd go with ESFJ because of how aware she is of her fans and how she strives to make a difference in their lives through her music and other ways. I don't know how there's been so much debate about her type, though. I think everyone's made an argument for each type for her. It's kind of ridiculous that we've reached 100 pages!

 

[mistakenforstranger]

What do we make of Taylor's new video??

Her lyrics are still Si/Fe/Ne as ever; it's all real, personal experience:

Looking at it now
It all seems so simple
We were lying on your couch
I remember
You took a Polaroid of us
Then discovered (then discovered)
The rest of the world was black and white
But we were in screaming color
And I remember thinking…

[Chorus 2x:]
Are we out of the woods yet?
Are we out of the woods yet?
Are we out of the woods yet?
Are we out of the woods?
Are we in the clear yet?
Are we in the clear yet?
Are we in the clear yet?
In the clear yet?
Good

Are we out of the woods?

Looking at it now
Last December (last December)
We were built to fall apart
Then fall back together (back together)
Your necklace hanging from my neck
The night we couldn't quite forget
When we decided (we decided)
To move the furniture so we could dance,
Baby, like we stood a chance
Two paper airplanes flying, flying, flying
And I remember thinkin'

[Chorus 2x]

(Are we out of the woods?!)

Remember when you hit the brakes too soon?
Twenty stitches in the hospital room
When you started cryin', baby, I did, too
But when the sun came up, I was lookin' at you
Remember when we couldn't take the heat
I walked out and said, "I'm settin' you free,"
But the monsters turned out to be just trees
And when the sun came up, you were lookin' at me
You were lookin' at me
You were lookin' at me,
I remember, oh, I remember

 

[mistakenforstranger]

I see a lot of Fi. I'd say ESFP.
Or actually.. maybe ESTJ.
Edit: nah not ESTJ

I think you mean a lot of Fe.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Nope.

"I write from a place of my personal feelings about things. It's funny when you write a song and you don't expect it to turn into what it turns into when it goes out in the world. I wrote a song called "Mean" about a critic who hated me. I put it out, and all of a sudden, it became an anthem against bullies in schools, which is a refreshing and new take on it. When people say things about me empowering women, that's an amazing compliment. It's not necessarily what I thought I was doing, because I write songs about what I feel. I think there's strength when you're baring your emotions."

What's Fe about that video? That shes wrapping christmas presents for other people?

She is not an Fe dom or auxilliary, might be ESTP like i said.

All that quote says to me is that she's definitely a feeler, so not an ESTP.

And she doesn't use Fi. That becomes quite clear when you compare her to Fi-aux Katy Perry, who's certainly an ExFP, probably ENFP.

"Sometimes you can be blinded by your extreme emotions."

"I wanted to share that side of my story because I know there's so many people out there that have gone through things like that, and you always feel like you're the only one going through that. (Fi) You know you walk out the door, you see someone that you know and they ask you how you are, and you just have to say that you're fine, when you're not really fine, but you just can't get into it, because they would never understand. (Fi) Well then comes along a song that speaks to you, that makes you feel like, "Gosh, I can get through this. If she can get through this, I can get through this."

Katy's connecting with individuals who have gone through similar experiences as her.

Taylor uses Fe. ESFJ 2w3 (w/ connection to 4) who has shown strong tert-Ne with her latest album. (w/ only other possible types being ISFJ, ENFJ, or INFJ; younger interviews show her being quite extroverted, but she's become more introverted in her personal life with all the fame)

"I think it says different things than anything I've ever said before on my albums. (Si + Ne) They have tended to be a little boy-centric and dating-centric and things like that, because when you're in your late teens and early twenties, navigating love is the most enthralling thing to you. But for me, the last two years of my life, I've been more fascinated with discovering who I actually am, and what I actually want, and living my life on my own terms and defining what I want my world to be with no outside input. That's a new statement to make."

Breaking away from Fe-Si, starting to see the benefit of her lower functions, Ne-Ti, which at her age is a natural progression.

"I don't think anyone actually ever really gets to a place where they do not care what anyone thinks. (Fe) I just have learned how to write off the opinions of people who don't matter to me. One thing I wanted with that song is I wanted to write a song that would help people deal with just the stuff humans put other humans through on a daily basis. It's not just me. Everyone's online. Everyone has a profile, everyone has a way to be criticized by other people. Everybody hears gossip about themselves that isn't true. It's not just me." (Fe)

Taylor's writing for everyone. She assumes her experience is applicable to everyone not just specific individuals who've gone through similar things, as in the case of Katy Perry.

I also think it's worth noting that she's had to learn how to, "write off the opinions of people who don't matter to me," which in this case, is using an introverted subjective function, which I think is her inferior function, Ti.

I'm at least convinced she's an ExFJ 2w3, but most likely ESFJ.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Katy Perry being ENFP? where the hell do you se Ne? I think Katy Perry is a really good actor, and an ESTJ. You can see it in her face when she does interviews, i dont really know how to explain.


That sentence has no good indicator of ANY function in particular hahaha anyone can say that.


Thats pretty much the same thing.

None of your quotes indicate Fe to me. Idk. Maybe you have a different idea of Fe than me.

"I don't really know how to explain."

You should work on that.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Although this is off-topic, here's why Katy Perry is ENFP, which was merely used as way to compare her use of Fi to Taylor Swift's Fe. It's obvious within the first minute of this video. That description of herself pretty much sums up an ENFP.

"Of course I love being goofy and silly and hilarious and crazy and wild and unpredictable and spontaneous, but I think the people that know me hopefully they would say that I have a big heart."

"I wanted to involve kids that have a spark, that are buzzing and fizzing, and never say a commonplace thing, and that they have the potential to become fireworks."

 

[mistakenforstranger]

...no it doesnt.

Do you still really believe ESTJ? Although I don't really like these descriptions, they are adjectives one would generally use to describe the types.

ENFP

outgoing, social, disorganized, easily talked into doing silly things, spontaneous, wild and crazy, acts without thinking, good at getting people to have fun, pleasure seeking, irresponsible, physically affectionate, risk taker, thrill seeker, likely to have or want a tattoo, adventurous, unprepared, attention seeking, hyperactive, irrational, loves crowds, rule breaker, prone to losing things, seductive, easily distracted, open, revealing, comfortable in unfamiliar situations, attracted to strange things, non punctual, likes to stand out, likes to try new things, fun seeker, unconventional, energetic, impulsive, empathetic, dangerous, loving, attachment prone, prone to fantasy

ENFP - Jung Type Descriptions

ESTJ

organized, group oriented, focused, conventional, leader, emotionally stable, anal, attention seeking, planner, realistic, fearless, responsible, finisher, decisive, norm following, respects authority, punctual, hard working, stiff, self confident, thinks rules and regulations are important, follows the rules, clean, outgoing, social, content, does not like being alone, normal, regular, does not like weird or strange people / things - intolerant of differences, strict, disciplined, aggressive, assertive, content, happy, proper, formal, strict with self, meticulous, strong sense of purpose

ESTJ - Jung Type Descriptions

 

[mistakenforstranger]

Yep, Taylor is 2w3 with a healthy connection to 4. The song and the video "Blank Space," while being a parody of how the media portrays her, always seemed to me like an unhealthy 2 going to 8.

"Hostility toward others can be extremely strong and all-consuming: beneath their apparant charm lies viciousness."

"...cause darling I'm a nightmare dressed like a daydream"

"They are potentially psychopathic in the destructiveness they are capable of wreaking on others. In them we find elements of malice and the tendency to ruin what they cannot have, especially relationships. Twos with a Three-wing are capable of pathological jealousy and violent crimes of passion."

"I get drunk on jealousy"

"Got a long list of ex-lovers, they'll tell you I'm insane."

two with a three wing

general description

Average 2/3 is more outward than 2/1. The ambitious vanity of three combines with two's desire to be loved, and the result is someone who is not afraid to step into the spotlight. 2/3s usually have a seductive, playful side, unlike the more serious 2/1s. The three-wing gives them a showy, mainstream kind of appearance-consciousness. The twoish desire to please others is stronger than the threeish desire to be admired, although both desires are present.

balanced and transcendent states

Healthy 2/3s get beyond the immediate desire to please. Image-consciousness and pride drop away and they become able to experience real, heartfelt love. They no longer need the constant reassurance of someone else's admiring gratitude. Two integrates to four, opening up new realms of creative expression, while the three goes to six, bringing in a deeper appreciation of the value of belonging to a real community of friends. They become genuine, loving companions.

An extremely awake 2/3 is someone whose generosity is so continuous and so genuine that it seems to be an inseparable part of the personality. Never is there even the tiniest hint that anything is expected in return -- in fact, extremely advanced 2/3 sometimes becomes so good at giving that the recipient never finds out where the help came from (or even that it has happened). 2/3 saints somehow encourage the universe to shower gifts on others. Generosity comes through them, not from them.

unbalanced and unhealthy states

Unhealthy 2/3 becomes less able to restrain repressed desires. In a misguided attempt to get others to meet their (unspoken) needs, they manufacture more and more imaginary needs to fill for others. Their intrusive, self-satisfied help causes others to move away. 2/3 may hide the resulting loneliness and anger behind an outwardly carefree appearance, but others can usually see that there is hypocrisy involved.

In the end, very unbalanced 2/3 may break down under the stress. Suddenly the truth will pop out from under the increasingly strained wrappings of self-delusion, and in a desperate effort to paste over the uncomfortable vision, they may fly into an eightish homicidal hysteria or sink into nineish psychotic withdrawal. The repressed feelings of a lifetime might spew out in days or weeks. Relationships that have lasted for years might be discarded like used tissue, leaving others desolate and grief-stricken.

physical appearance

2/3s put a lot of energy into looking good. Many American females wear makeup in almost every public situation, and the males take care to be well-dressed and groomed. Their clothing is usually quite attractive, but not necessarily unique. They like a well-dressed, socially approved kind of sexiness. Some of the most attractive people are young 2/3s, of both sexes. Many 2/3 females, and a good many of the men as well, seem to become rather heavy as they get into their thirties, and some become large well before that time. It is common to see older 2/3 women whose weight is concentrated below their waist. Maybe it has to do with the way twos like to feed others (and thus, themselves as well).

callings

Some 2/3s find work that puts them in the spotlight while allowing them to help others. Restaurant headwaiters, hotel managers, executive secretaries, clothing designers. Others build families of close friends and cater to their needs. Massage therapists, cosmetologists, florists, prostitutes, and thousands of career housewives. They might become media stars. Singers, dancers, sex-stars. There are 2/3 retail managers, business leaders, physical therapists, celebrity interviewers, and spouses of powerful people. Of course, 2/3s can also be found doing many other kinds of work.

And another description:

The Two with a Three-Wing

The Two's traits and those of the Three-wing tend to reinforce each other: both types relate easily to people. Noteworthy examples of this subtypeinclude Luciano Pavarotti, Sammy Davis, Jur., Leo Buscaglia, Doug Henning, Tommy Tune, John Denver, Pat Boone, and Lillian Carter.

Healthy people of this subtype are charming, friendly, and outgoing. They enjoy the attention of others, are self-assured, and exude an aura of well-being and wholesome self-enjoyment. There is genuine warmth in people of this subtype, and the ability to communicate that warmth to others. They also tend to be more physically attractive than Twos with a One-wing. Social qualitites are valued more than moral or intellecutal ones.

In average persons of this subtype, we see elements of competitiveness and the desire of success and prestige mixed with the traits of the Two. Twos use others to validate their goodness, Threes to validate their desirability, particularly their sexual desirability. Hence, we finda calculating self-consciouness in persons of the subtype. They are also highly aware of what others think of them and how they come across to others. Having the right friends, dropping names, and cultivating people is typical. We also find the tendency to be self-important and narcissistic, although the Three's calculation of his or her image and the Two's self-sacrificial persona will mask this to some degree. Persons of this subtype fear being humiliated and losing status rather than feeling guilty over the violation of moral ideals.

If people of this subtype become unhealthy, they can be emotionally devastating to others since they become both manipulative and exploitative, deceptive and self-deceptive, opportunistic and neurotically entitled to get whatever they want from others. Hostility toward others can be extremely strong and all-consuming: beneath their apparant charm lies viciousness. They are potentially psychopathic in the destructiveness they are capable of wreaking on others. In them we find elements of malice and the tendency to ruin what they cannot have, especially relationships. Twos with a Three-wing are capable of pathological jealousy and violent crimes of passion.

 

[mistakenforstranger]

^those are just stereotypes and not based on functions.
Someone saying they like to be silly and goofy does not equal enfp. What the hell. You know celebrities just say things relatable things like that to attract fans right?

Yes, but does it equal ESTJ as you claim to be her type?

 

[mistakenforstranger]

The bit I quoted conclusively rules out ESTP for Taylor. She tried (and failed) to get to a place where she doesn't care what anyone thinks? Tertiary Fe types have to get to a place where they care what others think, lol. That is the timeline for tertiary Fe development in ExTPs. Early 20s. Forget learning to write off others' opinions of you-- we have to learn NOT to write them off. ;D

Taylor, though, is coming at this from the opposite direction-- she started at a place where she cared immensely what everyone thought of her, and is only now, at age 26, able to care a little less and discern which opinions don't matter. This indicates her Fe was always there, and with age is being counterweighed by Si/Ne/Ti. If she were a tertiary Fe type, she'd just be getting to that place of caring what other people think.

Exactly! A real ExTP, and I'm inclined to say ESTP, is Chelsea Handler. Controversial Se + tertiary Fe at large. Very different from Taylor.

From this link: Socionics - the16types.info - Lenore Thomson's MBTI Wiki Explanation of Functions

As an Inferior Function, Ti typically causes EFJs to aspire to behavioural standards that aren't defined by typical social norms. EFJs with low confidence may reject or even demonize Ti, preferring to instead go along with the observable expectations that others place on them. Because it is so adverse to the standpoint of Extraverted Feeling, Ti may sometimes seem too cold or emotionally detached, and thus EFJs might avoid it out of fear of losing their sense of self in the community. EFJs who can accept an introverted stance will realize that things don't have to be determined by what can be observed, and that they don't always have to agree with others just to get along; they can introduce their own ideas, think with their own minds, and determine how the world works through their own subjective perceptions.

As a mode of ego-orientation, Extraverted Feeling leads you to understand yourself as having a personal stake in the role that others in your community cast you in. By the role they cast you in and that you play--the role that emerges from the sort of negotiation described above--you exist. If that role is bad, then it's a loss to your very self. If that role is good, then your very self has increased.

ExFJ (likely ESFJ) 2w3